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I kinda liked the Mako but I don't miss it, never had problems driving it I found it rather easy I wish there were more to the planets to make them interesting to want to drive around on. I wish the side quests had more depth to them but they were fun and let you level up your character more for the tougher stuff
The decline of the Bioware RPG
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Obitim
, janv. 14 2013 11:40
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#552
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 12:49
xsdob
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I'm just glad I apparently got the worst times with the mako on here. I remember I would be making it up a mountain to get to the other side, holding down the analog stick button as hard as I could, and than I would slide over a section of the mountain that wasn't meant to be traveled on and go front over wheels tumbling down the side and need to heal up. And if I was luckly I could just slowly climb my way back out, and if I was unlucky geth would be on the other side while my mako was still damaged and I had sold all my extra item clutter for cash and a new set of duelist VI light armor for kaidan.
But if they were to bring back the mako, and make sure it could drive well and had some of the planets we got to explore that 1. Have interesting things to find and do, 2. Were not composed of mountains, cliff faces, or glaciers. Than I would be pretty happy with that.
But if they were to bring back the mako, and make sure it could drive well and had some of the planets we got to explore that 1. Have interesting things to find and do, 2. Were not composed of mountains, cliff faces, or glaciers. Than I would be pretty happy with that.
Modifié par xsdob, 17 janvier 2013 - 12:49 .
#553
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 12:51
AlanC9
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xsdob wrote...
@iakus, the only problem with your post is my assessment is not an overgeneralization on anything. The mako's constant flipping over, skidding off of roads, long omnigel repair cycles, and it's needs requiring that every planet be composed entirely of mountain ranges and requiring there to be masses of duplicate items so omnigel supplies could be continuously feed, make it a broken system to me. And I was only speaking for myself.
Way OT, but how'd you take that many hits through your shields? And doesn't the Mako have a radar on consoles?
Modifié par AlanC9, 17 janvier 2013 - 12:53 .
#554
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 12:56
KotorEffect3
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IMNOTCRAZYiminsane wrote...
Brovikk Rasputin wrote...
You know what's bad for gaming? Gamers.:lol:
Truer words have never been spoken. The changes from ME 1 to ME 2 and then to ME 3 were a result of the complaints so bioware addresses them and people complain about the changes that were made even though their complaints initially lead to those changes in the first place.
#555
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:00
xsdob
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Never saw the radar cause my peripheral vision blocked it out completely while I was driving. Never could hit the colussus's becasue I didn't have enough health to take charge them and run them over without the rocket troopers taking me down and I hadn't known I had a scope, and even than the scope would miss because I or the enemy moved out of position and my powerful cannon shot was an inch off target. Didn't know tali and garrus and kaidan would boost the mako's strength when brought along. And generally by the time I found an area to camp down and heal, I was damaged to where omnigel didn't heal me all the way. Later things got better, but always and everytime, in the early half of the game pre-second main quest planet, I always got my ass kicked in the mako hard.
But I am apparently the only one who had this problem, so meh, must be something wrong with my 20/20 vision eyesight.
But I am apparently the only one who had this problem, so meh, must be something wrong with my 20/20 vision eyesight.
Modifié par xsdob, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:02 .
#556
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:04
Meltemph
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
IMNOTCRAZYiminsane wrote...
Brovikk Rasputin wrote...
You know what's bad for gaming? Gamers.
Truer words have never been spoken. The changes from ME 1 to ME 2 and then to ME 3 were a result of the complaints so bioware addresses them and people complain about the changes that were made even though their complaints initially lead to those changes in the first place.
...So you think bioware designed their game around fan feedback? Aren't you being a bit insulting to them(bioware) or atleast highly overestimating fan input?
Modifié par Meltemph, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:05 .
#557
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:10
KotorEffect3
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Meltemph wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
IMNOTCRAZYiminsane wrote...
Brovikk Rasputin wrote...
You know what's bad for gaming? Gamers.
Truer words have never been spoken. The changes from ME 1 to ME 2 and then to ME 3 were a result of the complaints so bioware addresses them and people complain about the changes that were made even though their complaints initially lead to those changes in the first place.
...So you think bioware designed their game around fan feedback? Aren't you being a bit insulting to them(bioware) or atleast highly overestimating fan input?
I am saying no matter what they do the online gaming community will hate it even if they do it to try and appease them. Personaly I loved most of the changes made to the sequels and felt they were vastly superior games to ME 1. Now I will concede there are a few minor things I liked more about ME 1 but the sequels were overall better games. My point is that they should not even bother listening to most fan feedback or take it with a huge grain of salt. Because more often than not fans don't know what they want. During ME 1 "we hate the mako", during sequels "we miss the mako", during ME 1 "we hate elevators", during sequels "we miss elevators", during ME 1 "too much time sifting through inventory", during ME 2 "I miss my inventory", during ME 2 "we hate harbinger he is cheesy", during ME 3 "what happened to Harbinger?'.
#558
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:14
Faust1979
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
Meltemph wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
IMNOTCRAZYiminsane wrote...
Brovikk Rasputin wrote...
You know what's bad for gaming? Gamers.
Truer words have never been spoken. The changes from ME 1 to ME 2 and then to ME 3 were a result of the complaints so bioware addresses them and people complain about the changes that were made even though their complaints initially lead to those changes in the first place.
...So you think bioware designed their game around fan feedback? Aren't you being a bit insulting to them(bioware) or atleast highly overestimating fan input?
I am saying no matter what they do the online gaming community will hate it even if they do it to try and appease them. Personaly I loved most of the changes made to the sequels and felt they were vastly superior games to ME 1. Now I will concede there are a few minor things I liked more about ME 1 but the sequels were overall better games. My point is that they should not even bother listening to most fan feedback or take it with a huge grain of salt. Because more often than not fans don't know what they want. During ME 1 "we hate the mako", during sequels "we miss the mako", during ME 1 "we hate elevators", during sequels "we miss elevators", during ME 1 "too much time sifting through inventory", during ME 2 "I miss my inventory", during ME 2 "we hate harbinger he is cheesy", during ME 3 "what happened to Harbinger?'.
That's hilarious because it's so true! never make games with player feedback just make the game you want it to be
#559
Guest_Paulomedi_*
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:15
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thefallen2far wrote...
Chris Priestly wrote...
Now we're arguing about "art" (as a methapor, stick with me here). Is the Mona Lisa art? Sure, it's awesome, historic, beautiful, etc. Is Warhol's Soup art? No! It's simple, childish, ugly, etc. This is the mind of the person perceiving it. They are both art, just different art. BG2 is an RPG, so is ME3. They are different, but they are also the same.
The first part is a bad arguement. Andy Warhol and da Vinci are artists producing a piece of art. The artists of ME 1 and 2 aren't the same as the artists of 3. Drew and Chris as well as others were the biggest contributors the plotting in the writing in the first 2 and it was obvious it was replaced with people that just weren't as good. That's not an insult, that's just the critique. Michelangelo was the artist who painted most of the sistene chapel, pope Julius was the patron. Now, parts of the sistene chapel was painted by othr artists like perugino and botticelli, but an artist creates the art, not the patron or the company paying for the artist's servces. If the artist is changed out, it's judged independently critiqued seperately. The overall product is judged seperately.
to say ME3 is art in the same context as paintings or novels are if they're the same artists... the company changed the artists, so it's not subject to the same art standard. Bioware can take credit for the art of the earlier games in the same sense the Catholic church can take credit for knowing who to pay for the sistine chapel, but the actual art is from the individual making the art.
You used the example of da Vinci and Warhol, imagine the backlash the church would get if Andy Warhol was commissioned to finish the last Supper. that's kinda the same level here. Mac is not Drew. You can't even compare the 2. I'm sure both can be respected in their own right, but if the product is crap because the replacement isn't as good. We're just comparing artists. The product was so much better with the critical, well thought out mind of the artist Drew than the pop-contrivance thematic idea of an idea art of Mac.
It's not meant to be an insult. It's praise of another artist. Perugino is not as good as Michelangelo, that's not an insult, that's just a critique. And if andy warhol was commisioned to modernize the Last Supper, the product is not as good and the audience of da Vinci would not want to visit that product. And they'd complain, they'd protest, they'd not to church etc.... basically, the church looses money to do this. That's why the church knows to not do that, it's bad buisness. The church knows it's a company making a product and they don= want to loose buisness.
So as much as you want this "art" arguement to say "anything's good".... it's not. It's a product. Artists creates the art or is commissioned forthe art by the company. The company releases a product. The audence flocks to the art of the product because of the artist. The artist is responsible for generating the audience, the company is responsible for the upkeep of the product for the audience in case the artist goes away. If it's unsatisfying, then the company hired the wrong artist. The "it's our art" rguement reflects badly on tche company for forgetting it's responibility is the product. If you see it as art and someone says "it's crap" the company is seen as making a crappy product, not a "flawed piece" of art, a product that isn't good, and any future products for the company are the same negaetive conotation. That's why most companies don't use the "artistic integrity" arguement. Artists do, and they have to individually deal with those negative connotations. M Night Shyamalan uses artist integrity to defend his bad movies... steven spielburg uses it to defend crystal skull... but the production companies know that it has no dealings with artistic licenses they're responsible cor the product.
As for the second part, ME3 was an RPG by reputation alone at this point. It's fine if that's the direction of the company, but if Call of Duty starts adding more RPG elements than Mass Effect, you can't really clasify it as an RPG. It's an action game. Again, it's not a bad thing. Action games aremore profitable than survival horror games which is why RE6 isn't really a survival horror game, action games are more profitable than RPGs nowadays which is why it moved away fromRPG elements and replaced them with multiplayer, co op and SP action and autodialogue and a linear, shoehorned storyline, linear level up stats for characters, removing the individual character origins to be unimportant or standard and forced themes... at some point you have to realize you're not really making nor are you interested anymore in making RPGs. Saying that your game progressions are less RPG because people have said it for years isn't an arguement if it's true. When GTA San Andreas and Call of Duty are more RPG than your game, it's not BS, you're just whether you care to see it or not.
It's spelled da Vinci ( As Leonardo da Vinci).
Great., GREAT post.
As for x being less RPG than y, I think the problem is not with the gameplay or mechanics. It's just that ME3 feels less personal than ME2 and ME1, in my opinion.
Modifié par Paulomedi, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:21 .
#560
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:20
spirosz
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
snip*
And they also should keep hiring journalists for VAing and keep cutting out meaningful content with their priority budget!
Perfection!
Modifié par spirosz, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:21 .
#561
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:21
xsdob
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What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios being created directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make your inaccurate proclomations and declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make your inaccurate proclomations and declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Modifié par xsdob, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:23 .
#562
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:21
xsdob
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Kotoreffect3 is all up in this thread.
Incoming ninja stan to lock this derailed thread prediction starts now.
Incoming ninja stan to lock this derailed thread prediction starts now.
#563
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:22
spirosz
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xsdob wrote...
What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make you inaccurate declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Mass Effect, since it's an Action-RPG, haha.
#564
Guest_Catch This Fade_*
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:22
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My favorite poster is here?! What up KE3?
What up KE3?
#565
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:23
xsdob
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spirosz wrote...
xsdob wrote...
What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make you inaccurate declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Mass Effect, since it's an Action-RPG, haha.
Mass effect 3 as well. Also, what's so bad about a mixed game model?
#566
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:25
spirosz
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xsdob wrote...
spirosz wrote...
xsdob wrote...
What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make you inaccurate declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Mass Effect, since it's an Action-RPG, haha.
Mass effect 3 as well. Also, what's so bad about a mixed game model?
Where did I say it was bad?
#567
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:27
Faust1979
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xsdob wrote...
spirosz wrote...
xsdob wrote...
What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make you inaccurate declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Mass Effect, since it's an Action-RPG, haha.
Mass effect 3 as well. Also, what's so bad about a mixed game model?
It's weird how the board comes together and recognizes how great ME1 was now. but back in the day when it was first released you had a lot of people complaining they would never buy a Bioware game again because they thought it was to limited for an RPG and focused to much on the action.
#568
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:27
xsdob
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spirosz wrote...
xsdob wrote...
spirosz wrote...
xsdob wrote...
What action game allows you to pick the dialouge you say, Which squadmates you take with you, involves power leveling and skill management, an open map where you can go to different places in the game world (IE galaxy map and systems), and alternate scenarios directly from player decisions?
Because black ops 2 only has 2 of those in the game. Go ahead though, make you inaccurate declarations on what ME3 is or isn;t. I can't wait for the people so misinformed that they believe ME3 is a FPS. Those ones are always priceless.
Mass Effect, since it's an Action-RPG, haha.
Mass effect 3 as well. Also, what's so bad about a mixed game model?
Where did I say it was bad?
Sorry. Posting while working on college assaignments on spanish direct object pronouns. Got distracted.
#569
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:28
KotorEffect3
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xsdob wrote...
Kotoreffect3 is all up in this thread.
Incoming ninja stan to lock this derailed thread prediction starts now.
What? I've stayed on topic. The OP alleges that bioware quality has gone down and they are no longer making RPGs. I am just pointing out that they are just giving fans what they want but fans keep changing what they want. So maybe bioware should just focus on doing what they are doing and stop trying to appease everybody.
#570
Guest_Paulomedi_*
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:30
Guest_Paulomedi_*
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Faust1979 wrote...
KotorEffect3 wrote...
I am saying no matter what they do the online gaming community will hate it even if they do it to try and appease them. Personaly I loved most of the changes made to the sequels and felt they were vastly superior games to ME 1. Now I will concede there are a few minor things I liked more about ME 1 but the sequels were overall better games. My point is that they should not even bother listening to most fan feedback or take it with a huge grain of salt. Because more often than not fans don't know what they want. During ME 1 "we hate the mako", during sequels "we miss the mako", during ME 1 "we hate elevators", during sequels "we miss elevators", during ME 1 "too much time sifting through inventory", during ME 2 "I miss my inventory", during ME 2 "we hate harbinger he is cheesy", during ME 3 "what happened to Harbinger?'.
That's hilarious because it's so true! never make games with player feedback just make the game you want it to be
People hated the Mako specially because of its difficult gameplay, aggravated by the hard terrain presented in ME1. The Hammerhead was a good improvement from that concept, and I didn't see many people complaining about it. So, it was a improvement, based on fan feedback plus Bioware's own ingenuity.
People hated how long the elevators ride took, not the elevators themselves.
About Harbinger....you don't make a huge enemy like that in the midquel to waste it altogether.
Your post, while funny, has some generalizations. Fan feedback can be harmful, of course, but I don't think it's ME's case.
edit: grammar, added some thoughts
Modifié par Paulomedi, 17 janvier 2013 - 01:46 .
#571
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:40
xsdob
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Also, I predict this thread will be locked, since we've been warned 4 times by stan to not go off topic, and we went off topic.
#572
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:42
SlottsMachine
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
xsdob wrote...
Kotoreffect3 is all up in this thread.
Incoming ninja stan to lock this derailed thread prediction starts now.
What? I've stayed on topic. The OP alleges that bioware quality has gone down and they are no longer making RPGs. I am just pointing out that they are just giving fans what they want but fans keep changing what they want. So maybe bioware should just focus on doing what they are doing and stop trying to appease everybody.
Good post.
#573
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:45
Meltemph
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
xsdob wrote...
Kotoreffect3 is all up in this thread.
Incoming ninja stan to lock this derailed thread prediction starts now.
What? I've stayed on topic. The OP alleges that bioware quality has gone down and they are no longer making RPGs. I am just pointing out that they are just giving fans what they want but fans keep changing what they want. So maybe bioware should just focus on doing what they are doing and stop trying to appease everybody.
Why do you think they are doing this? Because a mountain of fans have made comments, and some of these comments about the game have come true? Most of the changes they have made have been mentioned as issues from reviewers and ect. They made improvements on the game, based on what they thought were improvements. They wouldnt have just changed a certain part of the game just becuase a fan said so, again, that is being fairly insulting to them, whether you liked the game or not.
#574
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 01:55
AlanC9
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xsdob wrote...
Never saw the radar cause my peripheral vision blocked it out completely while I was driving. Never could hit the colussus's becasue I didn't have enough health to take charge them and run them over without the rocket troopers taking me down and I hadn't known I had a scope, and even than the scope would miss because I or the enemy moved out of position and my powerful cannon shot was an inch off target. Didn't know tali and garrus and kaidan would boost the mako's strength when brought along. And generally by the time I found an area to camp down and heal, I was damaged to where omnigel didn't heal me all the way. Later things got better, but always and everytime, in the early half of the game pre-second main quest planet, I always got my ass kicked in the mako hard.
But I am apparently the only one who had this problem, so meh, must be something wrong with my 20/20 vision eyesight.
I get the feeling it's not the eyes.
Sound like you were consistently engaging at short range. That's a mistake. Geth shots are very slow and easy to dodge, while Mako shots are quite fast.
#575
Posté 17 janvier 2013 - 02:35
Lunch Box1912
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[b]I got bored enjoy!
Modifié par Lunch Box1912, 17 janvier 2013 - 02:44 .
