177 réponses à ce sujet

[schebobo]

Just saw this article on eurogamer about David Gaider's thoughts on romance in bioware games (well dragon age mostly).

http://www.eurogamer...riter-discusses

Makes some very interesting points, particularly about every character being romancable and bi.

Thoughts??

[thats1evildude]

Nice article, and I'm in agreement. Romances are good where they are right now, ie. optional and limited to a handful of party members.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 14 janvier 2013 - 10:00 .

[LPPrince]

It was a nice article. And as far as more varied romances, such as one where your partner cheats on you, or the other examples given, would be a hell of thing to try out.

[Emzamination]

Adding different types of romance:  romances where your
partner cheats on you, romances where the character is already involved
in another relationship

Gimme, Gaider.

[LPPrince]

Emzamination wrote...

Adding different types of romance:  romances where your
partner cheats on you, romances where the character is already involved
in another relationship

Gimme, Gaider.

Could you imagine.

You want to romance someone, they're up for it, but they're already committed to someone else either in marriage or not.

The dialogue, the sneakiness, the intrigue, the inevitable eruption, oh hot damn.

[Emzamination]

LPPrince wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Adding different types of romance:  romances where your
partner cheats on you, romances where the character is already involved
in another relationship

Gimme, Gaider.

Could you imagine.

You want to romance someone, they're up for it, but they're already committed to someone else either in marriage or not.

The dialogue, the sneakiness, the intrigue, the inevitable eruption, oh hot damn.

Right? I'm getting butterflies just thinking about it.

[LPPrince]

I'd probably do it just to see what its like, since I would never in an infinite amount of years ever do that to someone in real life. And I'd still think whoever involved in-game was a scumbag.

hahaha

[Blackrising]

Emzamination wrote...

Adding different types of romance:  romances where your
partner cheats on you, romances where the character is already involved
in another relationship

Gimme, Gaider.

LI is already involved in another relationship?
Gimme gimme gimme.

LI cheats on you? OH GOD NO. WHY. NO.
(That would break my fragile little heart! ;_

[LPPrince]

Thats the POINT rising. It would hurt.

Kinda like how Morrigan leaving me in DAO hurt so goddamned bad. But I looked for her years later and went through the Eluvian with her, so its all good.

/Morrigan's Ring, oh God THE FEELS

[ReallyRue]

BSN has romance threads coming out the wazoo!

It's an interesting article though, and I see some of those elements already at work in DA2. You can attempt to pursue a romance with Aveline, but she's oblivious, interested in someone else, and potentially not even attracted to Hawke. I like that. The fact that the PC isn't some unstoppable romancing machine, and the unusual dynamic. There was a slight flavouring of that with Varric, where femHawke could show a teasing interest, but he politely brushes her off.

Then there's the tragic romance. The Anders romance screams tragedy like I don't know what. As does the Merrill one, if indirectly. As for the Thane romance - I'm pretty sure what bothered people wasn't as much the fact he died, but the way it happened, with little/no mention afterwards from Shepard or your squad, or anyone. The game continues like you never had a romance. Being able to talk to Kolyat about him or something later in the game might have been interesting.

As for exploring non-romantic relationships, I'd love to have more familial bonds again. I loved the sibling aspect. Perhaps having a 'best friend' this time would be good too, where you can somehow reach a higher level of friendship with one of your followers without having to have a romance with them. In the past two games, that was only really possible if you neglected the other companions - and therefore their extra quests and such.

Modifié par ReallyRue, 14 janvier 2013 - 10:17 .

[thats1evildude]

Blackrising wrote...

LI cheats on you? OH GOD NO. WHY. NO.
(That would break my fragile little heart! ;_

They will never do that. The uproar would be deafening. I mean, there were people driven insane by Alistair's dumping in DAO; you still see them post threads from time to time ranting about "Altair's betrayal" or some other nonsense.

Can you imagine the backlash from a love interest who cheats on you? There'd be mass suicides.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 14 janvier 2013 - 10:16 .

[LPPrince]

Well, I imagine Bioware could get away with a cheating love interest if it was established pre-romance that they don't like to be held down(at least, not in that fashion ).

If it came completely out of left field from someone who seemed loyal as ever, THEN I think the forums would explode.

[SilentK]

I think that the romances are good as they are. And I agree, it shouldn't always be a guaranteed thing that it works out. First time playing DAII blind I really thought that Fenris had dumped my FemHawke, it made for a very interesting PT.

Jacob leaving FemShep was dealt with in a poor way, some really strange combos between friendly-material and dumped material which didn't flow very well. Had the situation felt more real, not having half the convo "I'm-here-saving-you" and the other half "The dumping of FemShep and Brynn being catty" it would have been much better. Jacob leaving FemShep would have been ok if there had been conversations that support it. I would not be sad if there were things like this in the future games as well, unexpected things happening makes life interesting. Jacob surprised me, my FemShep got really drunk, ended up on the sofa with Aria. Turned down Kaidan because it was too soon afterwards and was quite angry for the next few missions. In that sense it was fun. Role playing that you have been let down by someone you love at such a crucial time. The one person you thought would be your rock when life falls apart ended up leaving you in a really painful way. In that sense I like it, it was a very different and I don't know if BroShep is able to have that experience. But pretty please spread out the being dumped and having dead LI:s between both BroHero and FemHero next time.

edit: added a little that I forgot...  and fixing the formating... *sigh*

Modifié par SilentK, 14 janvier 2013 - 10:50 .

[Maria Caliban]

MAOR.

If I like it, I want more of it.

If I don't like it, it should have never been in the game to begin with and was obviously placed in there to appeal to the CoD crowd.

[LPPrince]

SilentK wrote...

I think that the romances are good as they are. And I agree, it shouldn't always be a guaranteed thing that it works out. First time playing DAII blind I really thought that Fenris had dumped my FemHawke, it made for a very interesting PT.

Jacob leaving FemShep was dealt with in a poor way, some really strange combos between friendly-material and dumped material which didn't flow very well. Had the situation felt more real, not having half the convo "I'm-here-saving-you" and the other half "The dumping of FemShep and Brynn being catty" it would have been much better. Jacob leaving FemShep would have been ok if there had been conversations that support it. I would not be sad if there were things like this in the future games as well, unexpected things happening makes life interesting. But pretty please spread out the being dumped and having dead LI:s between both BroHero and FemHero next time.

I think the Jacob thing stung FemShep players more because the abandonment of Shepard happened off screen between games. I don't believe that will ever happen in Dragon Age.

If it happens in DA, it'll happen in the game the character appears in.

[Kidd]

I got really sad reading the comments. So many requests for things that already were in Dragon Age 2. But it seems the general public was too upset with Anders giving them rivalry for them to figure out what was actually in the game.

*grumpy*

[Krypplingz]

Emzamination wrote...

Adding different types of romance:  romances where your
partner cheats on you, romances where the character is already involved
in another relationship

Gimme, Gaider.

I had a LI cheat on me, he knocked the other gal up and they named the baby in my honor. 
It's an interesting experience, but if they do it again, Bioware should have an option to knock their lights out. Or atleast a good slap. 
Being the mistress in another relationship doesn't sound fun to me, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

As for the article, I usually play the Bioware games for the romance. Reason I tried out the Mass Effect series was because of the Kaidan Romance thread on the BSN (I had seen the game before but chalked it up as a boring alien shooter. Boy was I wrong.) I tried Kotor for Carth, NWN for the modules and Baldurs gate for Gavin.
I usually end up liking the games as a whole, but I don't feel inclined to try them (or any other game for that matter) if there is no romantic sub plot. 
I don't think they should make all of the companions romanceable, but one or two would make me happy. 

[Fast Jimmy]

Not in relation to the DG article linked, but my vote is "less."

I'd rather the game acknowledge and give content to my character making big chocked hat would affect the lives of others rather than have those choices be flat and slightly railroaded in order to have more or juicier romances

The fact that most of the custom content in DA2 came from choices in how you interacted with your companions (Friendship/Rivalry differences, romances) and not in how elements of the main plot play out tells me that the balance was on the wrong side for my personal tastes.

[SilentK]

LPPrince wrote...

I think the Jacob thing stung FemShep players more because the abandonment of Shepard happened off screen between games. I don't believe that will ever happen in Dragon Age.

If it happens in DA, it'll happen in the game the character appears in.

Well yes, it did hurt quite a bit. But after getting over the first initial chock. But the worst for me was that there was quite a strange mix of neutral Shepard here to save the day stuff inbetween the getting dumped part. And he wasn't really the smoothest guy at that point.
Jacob:"I'm important to these people. I want a life. I want a family. Shepard -- if it could have been with you... I think we both know the Normancy was your real love." So for moving on after hearing that the Normandy was your true love, must be a little cringewhorty if you have EDI with you you move on in the conversation by chosing "Glad we had a chance to talk". Ha ha, well, I can assure you that I was not glad at that moment. FemShep says "If one of us dies here today, I want to know that we said all there was to say". And we move on to another intersting point in the conversation.


Jacob:"Come on Shepard. Did you want me to wait forever". Your choices as FemShep at that point is either "I understand" or "Kiss me, Jacob". I wonder where my renegade interrupt went  


Now I am pretty much laughing at this absurd situation. FemShep getting dumped is not bad per see, but it just does not flow at all. Your are either meek and understanding or trying to get in his pants again. Not calling him out on putting the blame on FemShep. Would have been nice if it was you, but hey, you love that ship so much anyways. And the little thing in the end. One bit of banter that you get on the citadel that I don't think that a romanced and dumped FemShep was supposed to get but it slips in. "Brynn wants to name the baby after you Shepard, but I'm going to talk her out of it".

I think being dumped can be an excellent bit of story, you feel sad and betrayed. But I would follow up a little on it. Someone coming by if it was an important relationship. No one commented on it, it happened in a vaccum in ME3. Think it can be used very well if they look at it carefully. Would be interesting if they used it in DA3.

[ejoslin]

People did not react well to Alistair marrying another woman, or at least keeping that option open while having the warden be the one on the side. Some were okay with it, but most complained and quite a few seemed to think he never would actually marry anyone else. Or that he would never have sex with Anora (those were the ones who hated that he tried to hold Anora's hand and Anora was the one who rebuffed him).

Bah, and I can just picture the forums if a LI turned out to be a cheater. All sorts of gaming going on (how can we avoid him/her doing this etc.).

I loved LOVED how the LIs would dump the warden in DAO in various circumstances. My first unspoiled DAO playthrough was just amazing when Alistair dumped my poor warden -- still one of the most memorable gaming experiences ever, in a good way.

If the romance pulls on my heartstrings, I'm happy. However, if it just feels like an achievement, it's pointless.

[LPPrince]

Though I wonder how the gender of a cheating squadmate would affect the response from the fans.

If its a woman, we all know what insulting words would be used against her, but if it was a dude, would the reaction be the same?

There are still more straight male gamers than any other sexuality/gender demographic, but what if the cheating love interest fit outside of the typical straight male gamer's choice?

What if the cheating LI was a bisexual option for all? What if they were purely a romance for men to experience or purely for women to experience?

I wonder how the permutations would change the response.

[SilentK]

Yes, I agree. Pulling on heartstrings is great, my first blind DAII-PT was wonderful. Dumped by Fenris, having a rebound with Anders. I completely missed all signals that Anders would do something so drastic in the end so when everything went "Kaboom" I was dumbstruck in front of the computer. My poor little Hawke saw the man she had come to love fall apart and then tried to scramble out of the city. It wasn't until I went back to the forum that I understood that if she had waited for Fenris he would have come back.

Excellent story! My Warden had her heart broken repeatedly in that PT. They hurt me and I just keep coming back for more.

[Sir George Parr]

As long as there is balance between the male and female protagonist getting dumped. As it would have helped if male shepard had Ashley dump him for another woman for example. Instead of female Shepard getting the raw deal from Jacob. So having made sure that eveyone survived the SM in ME2 up till now. I find my approach changes and i go out of my way to make sure that he doesn't make it.You want to do your personal quest Jacob? well tough its not happening!
It was a slap in the face to find you had wasted your time in ME2, when my female shepard should have pursued Garrus or had fling with Kelly.
But at least in DA it will happen in a single game and i won't have to wait for sequel as there won't be one for that particular protagonist, to learn that it was a wasted effort. So if its done well it will be an interesting change of pace. But if done poorly like ME3 not so good.

[Oberkaiser]

"I could, in fact, happily have a game without any romances at all..."

Oh no he di'int.

Modifié par Oberkaiser, 14 janvier 2013 - 11:17 .