18 réponses à ce sujet

[painofdungeoneternal]

I am getting a lot of PM's from various individuals about helping me with this, and I kind of thought it best if i kept the discussion where everyone can see it, about how I see this working. There are definite offers of support, but then my thoughts in this area are both complex and wordy, being the nerd that I am.

You can continue previous discussion in PM or via email, but this seems the best way to get out where I am headed to everyone who seems interested. Pardon my wordiness.

First of all I don't want to control this. I do not intend on setting up my own website, this is intentially decentralized, and community led, and technically I think i can design it so it works in a decentralized manner effectively. At some point I can rethink that, but i want to do things now with the resources that I have, and work with the content we have out there already.

Second, I am posting here in NWN2 forums just because i had to choose one spot, nothing intended by it. Quite a bit of my focus is actually on getting the NWN1 features in parity, or when possible exceeding what I have in NWN2. This is for both games, perhaps other bioware games that use similar file formats eventually.


My program Never Launcher, it's already listing MP modules, and because I want to be inclusive, I went ahead and took the module list from 8-12 months ago ( yes it's that old ), and reformated it into data form, I even chose the 2da format because I am a bit nuts, and that works well with excel ( tab delimited ), as well as the toolset, and I figure that this is the most inclusive format. ( Note this is the exact same listing found here somewhere on the forums and it works the same way )

I have a file for NWN2 with lots of entries, and I made the same listing for NWN1 as a file with a single dummy listing. Before release I will get at least the current version of the NWN1 modules into 2da form, just so I can have a complete program, but that is time consuming, and takes away my time which can be spent on other things.

Actual data files just need to be in the data folder, and are here. These are what I need maintained.
CompleteModulesNWN1.2da
CompleteModulesNWN1.2da

This 8 month old version of NeverLauncher has not been changed --> Download Never Launcher Still prepping the next release so it's more polished and seems complete.

Note the features are all still there as found in this http://social.biowar...18848/1#8617967 but I am trying to focus the interface and add new interfaces for different types of users.

I do not want to be in control of this list, I am not really a SP player, I even want to retire from maintaining the NWN2 PW list. I want to focus on making tools so this sort of thing is easier, and really get closer to crowd sourcing this information, with volunteers who really focus on this managing the list to prevent some abuse.

I also want to keep my distance - I want to coordinate the format, provide the tools and such, but I don't want to have to update my program every single time a new SP module comes out. I also want the option for there to be 10 competing lists and for the players to be able to choose which they prefer. My program will just be one method of using these lists. As such I want each list owner to maintain the lists on the Vault, Nexus, or their own websites, and further I want a URL from them where they maintain the current version. When a player hits update, or periodically, I want to check for new versions and download them automatically. This is in reality the first iteration of my patching system which I want to use for many other things.

In addition this ensures the maintainer gets full credit, and should get hall of fame status, I will be able to inform the player where the list is coming from, and even let the player choose another source. ( if a player think they can do it better, let them do a competing version, or they can contribute, if they are indeed better or the original maintainer is AFK, then they should be able to take over )

Further, if another project wants to use the lists, assuming the creator and maintainer does not mind, that is great. I can see nwnlist posting the data, as well as even a scripter putting the data in game. I could even see it being moved to some API - we have a crazily creative community.

As for the maintainer and ease of their use. I intend on making a method in my program to edit this list with a full wizard type interface - similar to my spell editor, after discussing what additional fields could be added. I already can create a patch file from a given known version which includes all your edits, you can use this to collaborate changes. ( bit hard to understand but it works ). Further I can provide mysql dump files, bbcode formatted, sorted in multiple ways, so a single list can easily be posted on the forums or used in other programs.

Really I am thinking thru how it can benefit the maintainer because if what I am asking them to do makes what they are doing now easier, well it's more likely they will suport it.

I would like additional fields. I have the vault URL now, probably need the Nexus URL as well if it's available. Tags and the like for sorting and searching of course. This will need discussion.

I want to add a CRC for the actual module ( I can make that drag and drop actually ), as well as a list of separate files or packages required to play it. With a CRC and module name I can match it up to the in game content. Eventually I can do version checking so it can download modules packages and all required files, and if the author fixes something or has a complicated setup, this can do it for the user preventing user error.

Right now I just have the entry open the vault page, and the user can download the files from there, then hit play, and that to me is a worthy first step, as the list will be searchable and sortable.

Eventually, I want to allow the user eventually to be able to also download the module and if it's on their system to hit play. If it's out of date, I want to be able to update it. If it requires a package in my future package management system ( CEP or Kaedrins for example ) to work, I want that listed and to automatically download and install that just for usage with this modue. If it's incompatible with something, i want to list that too and remove just that. If there are conflicts, well I merge 2da and tlk files already. But this is all the future, and it begins with this first step of getting a listing in data form.

So in summary, what I am looking for from the community and myself

• 2 Generals, each representing either NWN1 or NWN2 respectively and willing to maintain such a list, with full responsibility and credit for it's quality. I also need to hear what features would make the work of these maintainers easier.
• A means to send additions and edits to those generals in a format they can just approve and drop in easily, and for the rest of the community to support those generals.
• A vault page storing the current list, and a forum post here ( probably with the bbcode version of the list underneath ) showing the current list version.
• Discussion on adding additional fields, to help players search ( tags ), package requirements, etc.
• Discussion on features in my program ( filters and how it works and what is displayed )
• Eventually addition of all the module download URL's, as well as other required files. ( which technically should be usable to create a working backup of the vault and nexus, especially of the popular files )
• Opportunity for others to come up with innovative uses for these lists
• Another 2 generals, Similar lists for NWN2 PW's showing data not provided by the game client, with their own 2 generals, and synced somehow with the skywing data. Listing of any PW's that refuse to use the API.
• Methods to send parameters to NWN1 and NWN2 to specify the module and bic to launch. Methods to launch a NWNx server and connect player to that module, while still making it work like single player (private) for all intents and purposes. ( allowing you to play on 2 cores and not just one, and use the improved resource loader and improved script execution. )

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 17 janvier 2013 - 07:06 .

[OldTimeRadio]

What about just popping it up on SourceForge?  Among other things, it cuts out the gateway aspect of the "Generals" without diminishing the positive impact of their service.  It also allows stake holders (like PW maintainers) and casual helpers to pick up the slack as well.

You're an architect/engineer and from that point of view, 2 "Generals" and then ultimately 2 more each with their own two generals makes perfect sense, schematically.  But what works best schematically doesn't always work pragmatically, especially in gaming communities where real life events regularly interrupt earnestly-made commitments.

[kamal_]

There already is a list. How about getting the information from that to start with?
http://social.biowar...index/3122312/1

[Lugaid of the Red Stripes]

This is only a half-thought out idea, but would it be possible to list the modules on a stickyed thread here on the forums? I know we already got a basic list up, but maybe each builder can post a response on a thread for each module, with not only a basic description, but with all the necessary information tagged out in the post, so it's easy to transfer the info into whatever form the launcher needs, maybe even automatically.

The idea would be to post everything in a form where random players can browse through it, and where builders can control their own module descriptions. We'd have to go through and create posts for builders who've moved on, though.

The first post, though, should be a clear description of all the fields. I'm still not sure what min/max level means, whether it's starting level or start-to-finish.

[painofdungeoneternal]

kamal_ wrote...

There already is a list. How about getting the information from that to start with?
http://social.biowar...index/3122312/1

That is the current list you see there. ( out of date by a bit, but should be a good head start )

The NWN1 list would match it.

Has to be manual, good luck making users format things a certain precise way.

[painofdungeoneternal]

OldTimeRadio wrote...

What about just popping it up on SourceForge?  Among other things, it cuts out the gateway aspect of the "Generals" without diminishing the positive impact of their service.  It also allows stake holders (like PW maintainers) and casual helpers to pick up the slack as well.

You're an architect/engineer and from that point of view, 2 "Generals" and then ultimately 2 more each with their own two generals makes perfect sense, schematically.  But what works best schematically doesn't always work pragmatically, especially in gaming communities where real life events regularly interrupt earnestly-made commitments.

From what I've seen we've tended to have a main mover and shaker doing it, at least for the forum posts where Ive done a similar task - mainly done the NWN2 PW stuff. I know this community, and yes people will do it for 3 months then stop, but then my thought is that another user can just post an updated version - and I can keep an official download URL on nwn2wikia ( where anyone can adjust it to point to the new version. )

I think it's up to those people where it's shared. I do need a direct link though - the vault or dropbox, or I think the nexus all are good at this. ( the nexus lets you delegate who can upload or edit an entry, so that might make it a good candidate for this as well, the old general would just have to be willing to assign a new person )

I don't see source forge adding a lot of value for two reasons, first of all it's just a single file, merging is a lot easier with lots of files, and if we get 2 versions of the same file it can get complicated. ( I have developed my own merging system for 2da files due to this. ) Probably would need to separate out the files, but then downloading it becomes an issue if it's suddenly a lot of files. If It's just me getting it, but my goal is to make it so the programs actually checks and downloads it when there is a new version without the user having to grab it - the user can of course download it manually.

Second, everyone is going to have the file on their hard drive, so it's by definition open. I am thinking anyone can edit it, and save those edits as a patch. ( people can actually distribute just patches even and i can merge them )

The main benefit is anyone can upload it. But then they need some technical skill to do svn, or do tortoise, to check in the changes. The people who are most comfortable with this, well they should be coding up new toys.

( a good option though is NWN2Wikia, but I am thinking that gets complicated to parse it's text, it's kind of slow to load, and they tend to make sweeping changes to how content is displayed, it almost need a custom website to manage it, which is probably where we will be a year from now )

I don't really see it as a hierarchy, I see it more as needing specific expertise and we've got divisions in the community between NWN1 and NWN2, and between MP and SP ( don't even bring up action vs roleplay ). Since this features targets SP, I just need two, but I am thinking I can replicate this for MP as well assuming I cannot find another way to get extra meta data.

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 18 janvier 2013 - 02:21 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<sticking his big...>

Just tossing in that this set of projects will have the attention & support of the Vault as far as I can push it.

Also *cough* that I will not be one of those er, coordinators. Between the Ccc & the Vault I have enough to keep me busy :-P

Edit: If the projects are maintained on the Vault, you could pull the metadata from there (which will be even easier on the VPP if I ever get it migrated :- P ). I've done this with my ACDs perl harvesting scripts. Or am I misunderstanding this issue?

<...nose in>

Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 18 janvier 2013 - 03:16 .

[painofdungeoneternal]

Rolo Kipp wrote...

<sticking his big...>

Just tossing in that this set of projects will have the attention & support of the Vault as far as I can push it.

Also *cough* that I will not be one of those er, coordinators. Between the Ccc & the Vault I have enough to keep me busy :-P

Edit: If the projects are maintained on the Vault, you could pull the metadata from there (which will be even easier on the VPP if I ever get it migrated :- P ). I've done this with my ACDs perl harvesting scripts. Or am I misunderstanding this issue?

<...nose in>

I am thinking the vault would work well, as will the nexus. The Nexus or planned VPP, if they have an API ( nexus does but it's only for other games ) would negate the need for most of this, and they are proven parts of the community.

I am trying to come up with a system where it's hosted just does not matter, some will be hosted on drop box, but most will go where players are used to uploading it. I am assuming not every player can put up a $10 a month server. I am hoping my program can actually support content whereever the community decides to put it.

I am far more concerned with the data, and how that data is managed and flows.

( I also totally understand your position, frankly I have very limited time, and I just won't be able to maintain this either. I would prefer to not fish, but to provide better fishing poles for the fishermen ( and radar, and nets ). )

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 18 janvier 2013 - 04:43 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<pulling out his lens...>

The Vault and Nexus are both resource repositories of a coarse-grained nature. I'm hoping for something to grow out of this that is a repository (and the package manager) of a much finer-grained nature. So an API would really only negate the "Gamespy" aspect. Or to say it another way, I'm far more interested in the path you are walking than the campsite you're fixing up at the moment :-P

A distributed wiki-ish contribution model sounds pretty damn worthwhile to me (at least, that's how I'm picturing your data consolidation working).

What I said about the "projects being maintained on the vault" was not referring to Never Launcher, but to the individual SP/MP mods. If the data is up to date on the Vault projects, the header table of the project and the files table contain most of the meta data we're looking for. ACD's perl harvester script pulls those tables for me and gets the files for the VPP. I've yet to start migrating the html into xml (with Meaglyn's script) so that I can migrate it into drupal. But the data should be there.

<...to examine points better>

[werelynx]

NWN2 romances list I just stumbled upon: NWN2 Romance Modules List
and NWN2 modules approved by the Dungeon Master Friendly Initiative (DMFI)

Rest of this is regarding NWN1 modules:

1. Obviously the placeholder list for NWN1 modules have wrong expansion criteria. There should be Vanilla, SoU, HotU, CEP - those are the basics, but see what you grab at the vault, anyway

2. Nwvault, modbb, nexus and others are the sites for hosting, maybe make 'alternative mirror" option and make the first mirror to be the first available from the list(if there is none at vault check modbb, if none at modbb then check nexus and so on..)

3. Maybe a new thread for NWN1 modules list or not?

4. Skeleton(starting point) should be what you grab at the vault(like level, class fields etc.). Then for some modules we would get a quite lengthy number of characteristics. Solution would be to show only a part of the characteristics, but make sure to make user be ablee to see and change what characteristics he would like to see. Resizing window for full screen would also be useful. Also I don't know if you have included that option, but you should make it possible for the list to be arranged alphabetiucally/numerically for each characteristic. I mean I want to play modules that start with 'A' I click on the 'Name' once or twice to segregate the list by the name. If then I want to play module with a 40 lvl character I click the 'Level' button atop of the column once or twice and bam the list is segregated with rising level.

5. Maybe make an option to somehow group modules in "campaigns" made by community(or by the same author as sometimes they have different names like the ones made by Chris Huntoon)

6. Tags should be explained somewhere in the program(for egzample when you pu your cursor ove them for long enough time)

7. Here I will list some other modules with locations other than nexus, vault and modbb:
a) projects on BSN forums: Solaufein by Celes
BSN forums: Sohlarious
c) thread at prc forums
d) The Heights of Bastion
e) 'A Call For Heroes' series modules: ask Rogue Dao Studios for it, as it was removed from the vault
f) Desert of Desolation Series: I3 - Pharaoh: though it is hosted online(on the vault), player is required to ask for download link at the forums
g) Mazama Township
h) Diabel w kamieniu
i) Game exe site with few Polish and few English modules
j) Dolina Neverwinter (Valley of Neverwinter) - few Polish and few English

Some thought about tags{keywords in dungeon's understanding} that would be needed with examples:

1. Kid friendly : NWN for kids or Arcade for kids or returnnig to building- kid's module

2. Obviously all class specific modules should get their respective tag along with premade character as well as custom class modules. Not all of them have class filed filled correctly. Especially the premade character ones. Here is the list: CSML

3. Play as a race/subrace tag:
a) drow: Stuff by Markus "Wayne" Schlegel and its Polish translation
orc: (A Quickie Adventure) To Be An Orc! or The Pillaging of Waycrest (Public Release Version)
c) ogre magi: Halfblood
d) undead: The Breach or Revenant or To cheat Death and its continuation The Dark Ride or Seppuku (hara-kiri) v1.02 (Espanol/English)
e) dwarf elf and all common races: there are such modules, see pregenerated characters in my class list
A) Dwarf: The Relbonian Chronicles - Chapter One
f) raised by orcs: Orcs 1 - The Awakening of Arak-Hur ///// L'Éveil d'Arak-Hur ///// Bilingual Version (English&French) and Orcs 2 - Return to Al-Dha ///// Retour a Al-Dha ///// Bilingual Version (English&French)
g) vampire: Science Macabre
h) doppelganger: in works
i) Amazon : Amazon Warrior note that it is also possible in Fallen Star (Final)
j) Githzerai, Githyanki, Tiefling or Aasimar: 3 modules(series) in French(First: Planescape : Les marionnettes, First newer veresion: Planescape : Les marionnettes (édition prestige), Second:Planescape : Le jeu des Puissances and third: Planescape : Le testament d'Aoskar)
k) Air Genasi, Water Genasi, Earth Genasi, Fire Genasi or Khaasta: the last module of j): Planescape : Le testament d'Aoskar

4. Sleepwalker tag: Sleepwalker series


5. Play as evil person tag: Advice: What are the best mods for evil characters? or or (A Quickie Adventure) To Be An Orc! or Single Player "Evil" Module Recommendations

6. Free-roam module tag: thread

7. Romance inside tag: thread and portfolio at nwvault(see comments as well) or this thread and Possible Romance Modules(portfolio) or Teen Romance List

8. Modules Listed By Prime Material Plane

9. No files tag: some modules are missing files, though Rolo tends to clean them up if it is reported to him. Also it would be neat to spread the word by thus tag that we(Rolo) is searching for the file. thread of misssing modules or any other I have sent to Rolo(ask him)

10. Unfinished campaign/series: Information needed: unfinished series which make sense to play

11. PRC compatible: PRC adds classes etc., but only small portion of modules can be played with it installed. PRC Module Collection or thread at prc forums or PWs using PRC or Revamped OC or LOTR - Finding Smeagol PRC 3.5 version

12. Horror/halloween tag, maybe they should be separate tags but whatever: Horror Module Collection(portfolio, see also comments below) or Survival Horror Collection(outdated portfolio) or Halloween Mods thread or this thread or A Night at the Old Druids Inn or Silent Horror or Friday the 13th Part One - The Tower

13. Short modules(less than an hour) tag, don't know if really needed, just a sugestion: portfolio or So You Want to be a Hero? or Uncovered! or Faith or A Contrivance, A Confession, A Corpse or Beauty and the Beholder - Heroes Need Not Apply or The Hermit's Chalice by angry yard gnome and other versions of it as well.

14. No combat/all combat avoidable tag: obviously all 'old bioware contest' submissions

15. DM Friendly/DMFI approval: list page 1 and Faerun Survival Course v1.4 also DMFI 101: So You Want To Be A DM or D20 Modern 1.3 or Firefly System (Nightfire)

16. Adult content tag, this still holds interest of many players, the new modules can gain HoF in manner of weeks if not days: Adult Content Modules or The Wink and Kiss v4 or The Princess who Fought for Sex(missing its file?) or Scion - Preview Module or Dragon Claw Inn v 0.8b or A life on the game or 'A Gate for the Silver Key' (NOT FOR CHILDREN) and its sequels 'A Dance with the Devil' (NOT FOR CHILDREN) & 'A Banshee In The Basement'(REALLY NOT FOR CHILDREN) or Quand Sapho lie sa folie aux faux lits(French version) and Miss Jones spirit(English version) or Enigma islands revisited or Demonheart - Prelude or Polish translation of Sex and Single Adventuress

17. Some themes from this: Re-post - Themed Campaigns of Community Modules

18. Official Campaign continuations: this thread

19. Low magic tag: thread or another thread

20. High Magic tag: Citadel

21. Sea/Island tag: thread or Island Adventures - The Horns of Craven v1.24 and its sequel Island Adventures - The Color of Light v. 1.07 or A Forgotten Evil - Chapter Two or The Ten Towers v1.04

22. Arabian/Desert tag: Arabian Adventure modules or sands of Fate series

23. Item strip modules: The Naked Campaign or Enigma Island 2 - Templars

24. SoU/HotU bridge modules(contest) tag: List of Bridge Modules or Shadohaunt's Polish translation

25. Detective/Investigation/Mystery tag: BSN thread

26. Post HotU (contest module or not) tag: After the End 1 - The Penumbra(not for contest) or official contest page

27. Modules that are in Hall of Fame should be specified: HoF

28. Remakes (of games, but not pnp): The Lord of Terror - The Diablo Campaign

29. Play as Necromancer:Necromancer, Part 1 - Allegiance (1.65) or Bone Kenning I: Art of the Thanaturge (v.1.04) and its "Teleportation fixed" version

30. Toolset tutorial remake: hermits chalice? anything with village of Fern?

Modifié par werelynx, 06 février 2013 - 09:12 .

[painofdungeoneternal]

I am interested in it, the more detail the better -- no idea if this is all reasonable, prefer that not even be considered as an issue as that tends to ensure perfectly good ideas are avoided by our prejudiced assumptions.

I want to do it so it's perfected from both NWN1 and NWN2 point of view. And further from the romance, action, or whatever point of view, the game is really made of many small communities, and often theses are divided - ie PVP folks and RP folks just don't get along as a big example, but I think this is happening with hundreds of similar axis of division. So hearing the two points of view, all the points of view, and understanding it, helps me tailor things so they can work across both sides of the aisle.

So what i am thinking, is if I have a person hit new module, paste in the vault URL, then have the information auto fill from the vault to a degree. The person would have to review it, adjust it, ensure it's not blindly putting in garbage, which ensures all content works. ( I am very good at doing string parsing via regex, and using delimiters, assuming the vault is not too hard to deal with. )

Some categories would have to be entered - perhaps by entering them right away, perhaps via after getting all the modules in, putting comparing to lists in the community.

I can further ( after i get this much more advanced ) have it parse the download urls, download the modules, do a checksum of them, inventory of the resources ( hak files downloaded and required by the files ). ( this is actually another system for building a package which is kind of a bundle setup for easy installation, and further preserves the information on the author. ) ( Further if we were to build a package manage system, then the Vault Preservation Project i would prefer have a complete package for each file. ) ( Further this content, if adjusted, and if you have your various account credentials, can be used to upload your files on the nexus, the vault, and the other locations either as an initial upload, or as a patch ) ( Further it allows builders to do simple adjustments to content sans toolset )

I am even further down the line thinking, that I will preserve the current download location - as I have no right to just repost content willy nilly. However if the vault does go down, I want to be able to easily resurrect it from these packages. An agreement for a team of folks, with large hard drives to preserve agreed on portions of the content, with some redundancy, well we could have everything safe before we get an actual safe spot.

I would need similar input from the NWN2 side of the tracks, probably using more of the current list as the start since it's filled in.

I also need to get these ideas organized, present them back in a manner I think i can implement, and get back an agreement in principle that if these were to exist as is, that they would allow some members ( besides me or Rolo, or Skywing, or the others doing amazing things ) to step up to the plate and run with it. This community is at it's best when we can stand on the shoulders of others, I am standing on the shoulders of countless others, and my goal is to make something others can stand on and take these 2 games each to the next level.

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 20 janvier 2013 - 05:53 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<stuffing and mounting...>

One thought on the taxonomy of resources, you might adopt a system similar to forums: A hierarchal taxonomy of category that follows the current (admittedly inconsistent) taxonomy of the Vault (both NwN1 & 2) and add a tag list.

Edit: Implementation - I see the category being set by the repository (Vault or Nexus or wherever), and the tags culled from the community lists provided (i.e Werelynx's class-specifc modules, romantic modules, etc.) in addition to whatever tags the author adds.

Ex. A module designed for wizards to bop gremlins on the head with AD's pixel sword would be categorized with:
NwN1 -> Module -> SP. Then the author adds the tags Wizard, Parody, Melee.

Along comes a player interested in Parody modules, he does a search (or hits a tag cloud)...

This allows a much more fluid sorting mechanism, IMO.

I am doing something similar to this with the Tileset list on the Conservancy. The categories are rigid, but the tags can be anything I think appropriate.

<...gremlins>

Modifié par Rolo Kipp, 24 janvier 2013 - 03:25 .

[kamal_]

Rolo Kipp wrote...

<stuffing and mounting...>

One thought on the taxonomy of resources, you might adopt a system similar to forums: A hierarchal taxonomy of category that follows the current (admittedly inconsistent) taxonomy of the Vault (both NwN1 & 2) and add a tag list.

Edit: Implementation - I see the category being set by the repository (Vault or Nexus or wherever), and the tags culled from the community lists provided (i.e Werelynx's class-specifc modules, romantic modules, etc.) in addition to whatever tags the author adds.

The tags used on the Nexus are already the direct result of the owner of the Nexus asking us what tags and categories we wanted. social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/172/index/9196246/9#9695373

So the deciding of tags work is already completed unless there is a crying need for some tag that was missed.

[Arkalezth]

kamal_ wrote...

The tags used on the Nexus are already the direct result of the owner of the Nexus asking us what tags and categories we wanted. social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/172/index/9196246/9#9695373

And this is the "tag thread": http://social.biowar...7/index/9698802

[werelynx]

The problem with the Nexus is that it has only 13 NWN1 modules(that's just few promiles of total content) and 42 NWN2 ones. I also has a strong policy against reuploading stuff without author's permission. Many authors moved, changed mail or are not longer interested.

Besides painofdungeoneternal's solution would link to ALL the sites that have files, of course it would be mainly the vault.

I agree tough that we should copy the tags from nexus, but they are not sufficient, missing things like: "I would like to play stoopid barbarian" or "I am so evil, gimme module for evil ppl"

[painofdungeoneternal]

I was involved in that discussion. ( even almost used the Nexus as a backend, have source code and everything for their installer and discussed briefly with DarkOne, and implemented code to let my app logon to their website programmatically for example, but the API for NWN2 never got turned on, and there is the issue of the vault having everything, and that being in .Net which would require a lot of work still to implement to support macs and linux. If they ever do activate it, it really would not be that hard to recreate the Nexus installer, the real issue I have is something that installer does not support, which is merging and opening various NWN formats. The list here sidesteps the need for them turning on that API. )

My intention is for this to be in "addition" to the vault and nexus, not to replace them, and make something which can handle how things are in more than one place. I am not thinking it is going to be the perfect search tool either with every possible idea supported, but rather an extremely simple system that lets the user find content no matter where it's located. And my goal here is to make that content public, and shared, so it can show up in multiple apps, websites, all of which link to the vault/nexus for the user to download the files.

The real determinant factor in adding more tags, is whether there is going to be someone willing to go thru and do the menial work to check or uncheck them for every module on the vault, on the nexus and elsewhere, or they are just another things making things needlessly complex. ( I am hoping to put my time into far more advanced features instead of just maintaining a list. )

I also will be able to download that content for the user, and see some users taking on the task of downloading all of it soas to act as an emergency backup of the vault / nexus. ( something which i aim to make easy ). Then if the vault ever does go down, it would be an easy matter to re-upload a static version of it's content -- however I don't want to abandon the vault while it's working perfectly fine either - I am hammering nails not in it's coffin, but rather make it more powerful and protect it.

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 31 janvier 2013 - 05:47 .

[painofdungeoneternal]

This is kind of the interface I am looking at using, and for it to server multiple purposes, still very rough, not even hooked up to be able to store data yet.

• I am thinking it can work first of all as a means of some community members being able to edit, organize, and maintain a central server list. Buttons to download are meant to pull data from the vault and nexus. Certain members i will provide keys, and they can use it to update a central list, and all users will be able to download this central list periodically. Batch tools will be able to crawl vault and download new submissions.
• Authors can use it to manage their submissions. Built in code to log into their vault/nexus account and update their listings. Files locally stored will be uploaded, and if above a certain size will be put on a site where the vault admins can update them. Ability to fill out the data initially by downloading from the vault, then uploading to the nexus. One place to manage and it can make sure it's up to date on multiple sites. Hopefully this can help get modules/mods on multiple sites. Authors which don't use the vault or nexus can use this to list files where they might be held.
• API, Searchable list via web service, goal is to have an index of the vault and nexus's entire nwn and nwn2 content, which respectfully provides links to those 2 sites. Community members can use this list to develop new applications, and provide up to date lists like those we find on the forums to help users find content. Data will have more tags and keywords, but by design will be have complete support for both sites fields just to enable transferring content between the two sites.
• Package management system using my app - allowing vault users to have something similar to the nexus app. I am initially thinking of withholding the actual file download links from the API and reserving it for only my apps use, mainly to ensure this benefits the vault and nexus when third parties use this on a website. However those using my App will be able to auto download a given file and all dependencies. I will set it up so downloads can vary, include CRC checks and can use multiple mirrors if they exist besides the vault and nexus. Each download will cause at least 1k to be downloaded from both sites ( to ensure their download ratings stay accurate ).
• File inventory system. CRC, MD5, SHA1 of all files on the vault, and all the files inside containers. Work out the original version of each file in compilations, and determine actual original authors. Ability to then scan a folder in override, figure out what packages are installed, zap those files to nowhere, and then download the current version of all the content a user has installed. Ability to generate credit lists showing exactly where each specific file came from without the modder having to keep track.
• If we lose the vault, or lose the nexus, as long as we have among the entire community a downloaded version of those files, we will be able to restore that content to either, or to a new site. Organize people to purchase large hard drives and batch download the entire vault among them, or spend about $70 a month for something like amazon.

Full description just like what you expect.
Keywords are hand written keywords, comma delimited, this should cover anything players can come up with.
Tags, these are check boxes, have limited space, so just the main ones people use.
Files list the actual content data, will be stored on disk.

Dependencies, compatibilities - first makes it download the other packages as well, second notes what things it works with.

Modifié par painofdungeoneternal, 02 février 2013 - 09:55 .

[Rolo Kipp]

<googling...>

Oh! My! Pain! Run for president! I'll vote for you!

Seriously, that is *exactly* the foundation I've been griping for. You address, point by point the things I most want to see addressed.

Distributed resources - check
Central app for users managing content - make things *easy*
Central app for author managing content - a *must*!
Central app for admins managing content - inspired!
Package management with dependencies, credit continuity *and* verification - essential!
Non-partisan API (Nexus/Vault/private repository access) - Absolutely required for this crazy community!
Fine-grained granularity on resources - making my dream of a custom content library (with catalogs!) all that much closer =)

@ Kamal & Arkalezth: I missed that thread, so thank you very much :-)

That is a great set of tags! I think, however, we are using the word in two different ways. When I say 'Tag' I am speaking of author/user added random identifiers (Pain's 'keyword', I think), where I think you are meaning a non-heirarchal taxonomy or category definition.

I (geek that I am) like the impule-buy searching of tag-clouds. Something as simple as Lovelamb's implementation on her blog (under "Lanels") or as geeky-neat as the drupal cumulus implementation found here (lower right side-bar).

<...without googling>

[werelynx]

I kind of think of tags in Rolo's way(tag cloud). So when I use word 'tag' in the post I'm updating in my spare time, I mean this kind of tag.