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Bioware, don't create extra work for yourselves; use what you already have / New class idea.


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#1
Vortex13

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Warning: Big Wall-o-text to follow.

So I have posted about a playable Geth Hopper, and how much I would like to see it added to the MP roster. But I recently read an interview about the MP and the part that struck me the most was how difficult a brand new character was to create.

I believe the article mentioned that adding the Hanar or Elcor (for example) would require something like 50 times the amount of work it took to add the Volus. 

Now, while the Geth Hopper I had in mind would still 'fit' as a humanoid kit, I'm not sure the MP team wants to spend an entire DLC cycle working on one brand new kit (Volus in Retaliation). That type of demand would not only be incredibly taxing to the MP staff for little reward (only one new kit), but it would also be unfair to the community if the Geth Hopper kit allocated all of the resources of the DLC and left all the other kits as simple 'redoes' of existing models using existing powers.

Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that Bioware gives us the MP DLC free of charge, and that they listen to fan feedback (Collectors, Platinum difficulty, Turian mobility, gear/consumables, ect.). But, I would be lying if I said I wasn't a little disappointed in the fact that all the new Retaliation character kits (with the exclusion of the Volus, and new Turian) reused the same existing models, and that only a few new powers were included. 

The roster needs some 'new blood' IMO, something along the lines of Earth DLC (minus the human exclusivity); but how to do this without bogging down the rest of the DLC?

The answer is, of course use the assets already present in the SP side of the game. Granted, this point has been used ad nauseum in the forums, but it is true; why create work for yourself when the work is already done? There exists several models/powers (complete with texture and animation work) in the SP game that would be excellent additions to the MP side. Powers like: Flare and Dominate for example; models such as: Female Krogans, and Female Turians. Bioware devs have mentioned the legal ramifications of adding fan concepts in the past, so why not use the assets you already have access to?

Now I am sure everybody has their own take on the female Krogans and Turians, but I (being a big fan of robots in general) would like to see some new synthetic kits join the fray as well; something like a Rampart Mech.

These Cerberus upgraded, VI controlled robots, would make the perfect addition to the synthetic lineup (IMO), and best of all, would require minimal work to bring over. Now some people might say: "But Rampart Mechs are slow (speed and intelligence-wise) and don't take cover." We'll if you you will indulge me; allow me to explain (lore wise) how these mechs could fit into the current MP format and then let me explain the powers I envision these things having.

Now, simply because the Rampart Mechs are VI and not AI controlled doesn't automatically mean that it would have to be stupid and/or lack tactical awareness (using cover, reviving allies ect). Sure the Rampart Mechs in Omega, and the Loki mechs of ME 2 would march in a straight line at Shepard, but both of those cases were either:

1.  Repurposed civilian level security VIs (as indicated by ME 2 codex) pressed into military use.

2. Jury rigged civilian level VIs with new toys added on in order to provide a quick solution to hold enemy territory.

Look at Avina, or Glyph; while not combat VIs, both of these entities were capable of functioning with new data and (in Glyph's case) able to help resolve logistical issues that the Shadow Broker had. In every case of the Alliance obtaining Cerberus tech, they were able to repurpose it and/or improve upon the design. 

Who's to say that several recovered Rampart Mechs couldn't be upgraded with military grade VI software to compliment the improved chassis? Actions such as flanking attacks, using cover, squad cohesion, ect. are all things that can be programmed into a VI's code; essentially if one can write a book about warfare tactics then one can program a computer to operate around those tactics.

Now that I have gotten, the lore explanation out of the way I can now give you my vision of a new playable kit.

RAMPART MECH

Posted Image

Description: After the Cerberus occupation of Omega, several upgraded security mechs were recovered.  In conjunction with the mini-fabrication technology, improved shielding and additional ablative armor Alliance engineers were able to adapt high end military grade VIs to the robotic platform. The second generation 'Rampart Mech' not only utilizes deadly combat functions, but is also able to access warfare tactics suites allowing it to operate alone or in small groups.

class: (Full Tech) Sentinel or Engineer (whichever works best with this power set). 

Powers (Active): Emergency Shielding, Over-Clocking (Hunter-Killer mode), and Overload.

Powers (Passive): Military VI, and Repurposed Systems

Emergency Shielding: Just like the Omega DLC version, this shield functions similar to tech armor, but with greatly improved damage resistance, and has a cool down period after usage.

Over-Clocking (Hunter Killer Mode): This is just like the Omega DLC version. When used, the Rampart Mech gains the 'enraged' animation it had in SP, and receives increased melee/weapon damage; with melee attacks stunning and inflicting a flame based DoT attack; for a short time.

Overload: Same as it always was; would be able to cause fire explosions off of enemies affected by Over-Clocking's melee attacks.

Military VI: Same as other kits; increase weight capacity, power/weapon damage.

Repurposed Systems: Would be similar to the Shadow's and Paladin's versions of Fitness, in that besides offering increased health/melee damage, the Rampart Mech would get a trait called Fail Safe. This trait will cause a small, localized explosion upon being downed, the blast will damage and knock back enemies as well as inflict a fire based DoT to those affected.

And this is just one class that could be added from the myriad of ingame assets. classes that could provide both a new look with very little effort on Bioware's part, but also can help extend the life of the MP. I mean who doesn't want to see:

Krogan Female Shaman

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FEMALE TURIAN ADEPT

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COLLECTOR THRALL (Thanks to Robosexual for reminding me)

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TL;DR Version: Bioware please add existing SP assets to MP, so that we can have 'new' character kits. One of those kits that I would like to see is a playable Rampart Mech.

Modifié par Vortex13, 19 janvier 2013 - 01:46 .


#2
DeadeyeCYclops

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a plea to OP please stop the blood flowing from my eyes from trying to read this

#3
Tiamatshade

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Not to skip to the reply box, but a few returns and formatting might make this more readable.

As well as some editing and cuts. If you can say it in fewer words, people will usually read it. And understand it.

#4
Vortex13

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Sorry about the formatting. Fixed.

#5
oO Stryfe Oo

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Yeah, I'm all for reading long posts, but this has serious formatting issues that need to be addressed.

Edit: Posted Image'd

Modifié par oO Stryfe Oo, 17 janvier 2013 - 07:44 .


#6
Happy Shepard

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I would love this. And since those Mechs were designed for the frontlines, they'd be perfect for a class in MP.

But unfortunately, it doesn't break lore. Therefore it's a bad idea.

#7
ndw542

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One of the very few "please add this" posts I've ever actually liked. Bonus points for the fact that you're just asking BioWare to reuse their own assets, so there's no legal barrier to implementation (devs have stated in the past that they can't/won't ever implement any fan concepts due to legal IP constraints, which is why I find most of the DLC-suggestion threads to be futile and silly). Still unlikely to happen, but not impossible.

Semantic point: why a Sentinel? What you've described is an Engineer. There's no reason to create another Paladin-esque misclassification here.

#8
Vortex13

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ndw542 wrote...

One of the very few "please add this" posts I've ever actually liked. Bonus points for the fact that you're just asking BioWare to reuse their own assets, so there's no legal barrier to implementation (devs have stated in the past that they can't/won't ever implement any fan concepts due to legal IP constraints, which is why I find most of the DLC-suggestion threads to be futile and silly). Still unlikely to happen, but not impossible.

Semantic point: why a Sentinel? What you've described is an Engineer. There's no reason to create another Paladin-esque misclassification here.


Thanks for the compliment. 

As far as class choice, I'm fine with it either way. I just figured increased damage protection would lend itself more towards a Sentinel, but as long as the class gets added I wouldn't mind it being an Engineer.

#9
Vortex13

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I've made a few changes to the OP, mostly dealing with the class the Rampart Mech would fit into. Engineer or Sentinal is fine with me, I would just really like to see this class added.

I mean this is approch to new MP classes is the best of both worlds. The class remains lore freindly, and Bioware doesn't have to run themselves ragged in generating new assets (and for me, we will get a new synthetic class).

Rampart Mechs, Female Turians, and Female Krogans, there's half of the classes right there.

#10
Vortex13

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Please make this happen Bioware, if not for this DLC then at least the next one!

#11
Benjamin Lavos

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I'd like to try it. Good thinking.

#12
Pyth the Bull

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wtfl;dr

#13
Vortex13

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Benjamin Lavos wrote...

I'd like to try it. Good thinking.


Thanks.

Really, lore wise, I was surprised that we didn't see any mechs earlier. I mean with all the explanation in ME 2 and the desire to keep soldier casualties to a minimum you would think the Alliance would have been clamoring for a replaceable frontline combat unit. 

But it's not to late Bioware! You can still help the forces of the Galaxy in the fight against the Reapers!

#14
Vortex13

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Modified the op a little bit.

#15
Clayless

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And Collector Thralls, don't forget them.

#16
Vortex13

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Robosexual wrote...

And Collector Thralls, don't forget them.


It would fit within the lore (Leviathian) so I'm all for it.

I mean we already have collector models/animations, and powers so it wouldn't be as taxing to implement as creating something from scratch, and best of all there would be no legal ramifications for Bioware to include them. 

A four man team consisting of: a Femal Turian, a Female Krogan, Rampart Mech, and a Collector Thrall. Bioware PLEASE make this happen!

Modifié par Vortex13, 18 janvier 2013 - 04:16 .


#17
Vortex13

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It would be most welcome to hear if Bioware intended to use the ingame (SP) assets in some form or another in MP.

After reading all the tweets from the SP team about how they just finished their last Mass Effect meeting made me sad. I really hope the MP team can bring these things over, it would be a tremendous waste (IMO) if all of this existing potential was left by the wayside.

#18
Vortex13

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Made another update to the OP. Now with nice pretty pictures!

#19
Vortex13

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With the upcoming MP DLC I would love a Rampart Mech class, in addition to the often requested Female Turians. Us synthetics need some love too.

#20
Sabbatine

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Vortex13 wrote...

RAMPART MECH

Description: After the Cerberus occupation of Omega, several upgraded security mechs were recovered.  In conjunction with the mini-fabrication technology, improved shielding and additional ablative armor Alliance engineers were able to adapt high end military grade VIs to the robotic platform. The second generation 'Rampart Mech' not only utilizes deadly combat functions, but is also able to access warfare tactics suites allowing it to operate alone or in small groups.


I think this is probably the coolest concept I've seen anyone propose on these forums.  I'm not normally one to comment on threads like this but I felt compelled because I liked this concept so much... but there is one problem.

The characters we play are meant to be sentient, even the Geth.  A VI is not sentient which takes something away from the concept as a whole.  Because this is highly illegal Cerberus tech and we already know that Cerberus is willing and able to create full blown AI's you might as well go in that direction with this class concept.

Rather than installing high end VI's perhaps they instead remove corrupting/limiting reaper/cerberus influences allowing free will.  Reliance on highly illegal AI's would only reinforce how desperate the situation is and their willingness to rely on absolutely anything that might give them an advantage in the war.

Modifié par Sabbatine, 19 janvier 2013 - 08:05 .


#21
Blarg

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Thank you so much for that TL;DR at the end. Usually I'll go through long posts, but damn...

#22
Vortex13

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blaaaaaaaaaarg wrote...

Thank you so much for that TL;DR at the end. Usually I'll go through long posts, but damn...


Yeah sorry about that I tend to ramble and over explain things.

#23
stysiaq

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Would require SP DLC.

#24
Vortex13

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stysiaq wrote...

Would require SP DLC.


I don't think it would.

The Collectors (Shown in cutscenses of From Ashes) and Javik's Dark Channel power were both added to the game without requiring DLC.

#25
Vortex13

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Sabbatine wrote...

Vortex13 wrote...

RAMPART MECH

Description: After the Cerberus occupation of Omega, several upgraded security mechs were recovered.  In conjunction with the mini-fabrication technology, improved shielding and additional ablative armor Alliance engineers were able to adapt high end military grade VIs to the robotic platform. The second generation 'Rampart Mech' not only utilizes deadly combat functions, but is also able to access warfare tactics suites allowing it to operate alone or in small groups.


I think this is probably the coolest concept I've seen anyone propose on these forums.  I'm not normally one to comment on threads like this but I felt compelled because I liked this concept so much... but there is one problem.

The characters we play are meant to be sentient, even the Geth.  A VI is not sentient which takes something away from the concept as a whole.  Because this is highly illegal Cerberus tech and we already know that Cerberus is willing and able to create full blown AI's you might as well go in that direction with this class concept.

Rather than installing high end VI's perhaps they instead remove corrupting/limiting reaper/cerberus influences allowing free will.  Reliance on highly illegal AI's would only reinforce how desperate the situation is and their willingness to rely on absolutely anything that might give them an advantage in the war.



Thanks glad you like the idea.

Really, it is Bioware's call on how they (lorewise) want to implement this class; I just want to get a playable Rampart Mech. But as far as why I had the Rampart Mech operate under a Military grade VI rather than an AI; the reason is threefold.

1. AIs take time to 'grow' and develope. Giving a newly created AI a gun and saying: "Charge that Reaper." would (IMO) not end very well. The organics, EDI, and the Geth are fully developed beings that have made the decision to join in the battle. You wouldn't send a child to fight this war anymore then you would a 'baby' AI. Not only would you run into problems of wildly divergent personalites that AIs would develope (some might be pacifists, others would disagree with Alliance orders), but you would also run into the issues of limited numbers. Geth platforms, as long as within wireless network range, can transmit out of a platform should it become damaged. The Rampart Mechs; being essentially upgraded VI security mechs; would not have that built in funcionality. Really, a mass producable fighting unit would serve, the frontlines far better than a one-of-a-kind (Each AI is unique) "Geth 2.0"

2. Granted VIs cannot improvise, or create orignal ideas; but from a gameplay mechanics standpoint, they would fit the MP formula. If a VI is programed with a suite of warfare tactics (using cover, flanking attacks, assiting allies if they become incapacitated, ect.) it could operate in a 'believable' fashon on the battlefield. Obviously, within the lore such a program; even an adaptive one, would run into issues if the enemy started using unconventinal tactis. But when taken into the context of the current MP's survial 'rules' such a VI program could function effectively.

3. I am kinda partial to the VIs over the AIs (of ME 3). I loved the conclusion of the Geth and EDI story arcs, but I am personally tired of the Pinoccio "I want to be a real boy!" evolution of AIs in Sci-Fi settings. I miss the simplicity (and awesomeness) of 'pure' robots like HK-47, the Necrons or the Terminators; a single minded machine that will not stop in its programed mission (in this case 'kill the bad guys') until it or they were dead.

That is why I set up the Rampart Mech like I did, but like I said; I am fine with any lore backstory Bioware wants to go with, just as long as I can play as one.

Modifié par Vortex13, 19 janvier 2013 - 09:29 .