151 réponses à ce sujet

[MikeDraws567]

Does the Omega DLC make you worry about the next ME game?

It depends on the person. Don't get me wrong, I love the RPG elements of Mass Effect, but I think the combat has improved so much since the very first game. I love that Shepard can do rolls and jumps and climb ladders and the like.

Omega isn't a story run DLC, it's run on gaming. The level design is superb, the combat is excellent and to be honest, I think this was what was lacking from ME3; more gaming and less cut scenes.

It's not going to be what everyone wants of course, but I found it very satisfying to play with my different classes of Shepard and seeing how the game pans out.

There were a few clumsy things (Aria spinning around during her speech to Omega, someone patch this please), the lifts (all those people who ironically asked for the lifts back? Guess what, you got 'em!), the Adjutants being a bit of a nothing enemy and not as much exploration (the Omega 4 relay).

But guys, Aria was on the team! Aria! The best character from Mass Effect 2! That and Nyreen was stunningly designed and subtly feminine.

So does this DLC worry me personally? Not as the piece itself, no, but it worries me what the whiny users that have ruined ME3 will say about it. When did this become a game that was okay to hate? That it was okay to spew all sorts of venom just because some small part of it didn't reach our expectations? This is my worry.

I love Omega and Leviathan as unique and very different pieces of DLC, as much as I loved Shadow Broker, Bring Down the Sky, Overlord and Arrival. Each piece of DLC brings originality to it, both in the sense of gameplay and story telling.

[Mcfly616]

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Nitrocuban wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

What plot holes?

Repaers cant find a new solution because they only use logic based on equations rather then emotional logic+ equations like organics do. This is why the reapers harvest every cycle because they see no other way.

However the reapers use indoctrination which means that they...WOULD...have access to OUR emotional logic(other wise they would not be able to indoctrinate at all)  to see that there is another solution if not many many more.

This is a huge plot and story breaking hole.

What other solution?

had they used logic based on emotions they would have found that there are more solutions other then a solution based only on equations.

lolol that's not a plothole at all. You're assuming that because they have access to our minds that they should agree with our own emotional view on things? You didnt name a single plot hole. You just listed a bunch of your assumptions and speculations as if they were cold hard facts.

It is a plot hole, here is how...

Do you see anything wrong with there "solution"? If yes then why?

If you answered both of those questions then they COULD have found a new solution.

Also that was only ONE plot hole, there are many many more.

its not a plothole. Lol its your own delusion. And the Catalyst is looking for a new solution. Shepard makes them possible. You must've missed the part where it said it had tried synthesis before. But that's neither here nor there. We're talking about plot holes. Which you have failed to list one. Keep trying.....I'll wait

[Maeson]

Half of page 2 is off-topic, so I won't touch that.

But as for the OP's question. I don't know, really. I like my games with GAMEplay. If it were just story driven in the sense that I go from one dialog to another... do you like "Heavy rain"? That's the most distilled form of this kind of game.

I found Omega very linear and the gameplay seemed to keep pushing me forward. I can't really fault that since the main plot of that DLC was to assault and recapture a strategic location. Speed is of the essence, You don't have time to settle marriage disputes or pat someone's back until they stop crying over something.
Leviathan on the other hand was the opposite, the gameplay was slower and emphasized exploration and investigative work. Both that are for the lack of a better term: time sinks. They take time, exploration and investigative tasks are by their nature slow and meticulous.

Bottom line: Do I prefer one style over the other? No, not really. I like BOTH. If ME4 provides both of these in ample supply I'd be rolling neck deep in happy. Why? Because constant combat, just fighting for hours on end becomes tiring, you burn out. While as constantly going from one cutscene and textbook's worth of dialog to the next gets very boring. Having both of these in proper places, in proper supply is a must.

Do I think ME4 will be good or bad? Not enough information. I don't follow this topic at all and as far as I know, we don't even have a timeframe for neither the release nor where the game will take place in the lore. As far as I know, there are no screenshots, no trailers, not a single mention of any smaller detail of the story or gameplay.

ME4 is securely in my "Wait and see." department. Once more media and information starts cropping up can anyone make any sort of a GUESS of what is in store.

[MegaSovereign]

Omega got mixed reception from me but I have to commend the Montreal team for the introduction of class-based interrupts and meaningful dialogue choices that affects the ending of the DLC.

They may have some innovative ideas for the franchise, at least from a game design perspective. The quality of the writing is something that is a little too early to judge at this point.

[KevShep]

Mcfly616 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Nitrocuban wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

What plot holes?

Repaers cant find a new solution because they only use logic based on equations rather then emotional logic+ equations like organics do. This is why the reapers harvest every cycle because they see no other way.

However the reapers use indoctrination which means that they...WOULD...have access to OUR emotional logic(other wise they would not be able to indoctrinate at all)  to see that there is another solution if not many many more.

This is a huge plot and story breaking hole.

What other solution?

had they used logic based on emotions they would have found that there are more solutions other then a solution based only on equations.

lolol that's not a plothole at all. You're assuming that because they have access to our minds that they should agree with our own emotional view on things? You didnt name a single plot hole. You just listed a bunch of your assumptions and speculations as if they were cold hard facts.

It is a plot hole, here is how...

Do you see anything wrong with there "solution"? If yes then why?

If you answered both of those questions then they COULD have found a new solution.

Also that was only ONE plot hole, there are many many more.

its not a plothole. Lol its your own delusion. And the Catalyst is looking for a new solution. Shepard makes them possible. You must've missed the part where it said it had tried synthesis before. But that's neither here nor there. We're talking about plot holes. Which you have failed to list one. Keep trying.....I'll wait

Your the one missing the point. This is not that hard to understand. I will spell it out for you...


The point is is that organics would NEVER do what the reapers are doing. Organics would find a new or other solution. The REASON that the reapers CANT find one is because there logic is based on equations. They have tried to use synthesis before but failed because they do not have the insight of an organic(pay attention to what he is saying). The organics made the crucible that..."CHANGED HIM"....! It was an organic device meaning that WE made it.

Had the reapers had the insight of our emotional logic along with logic based on equations then they would have stopped the cycles LONG ago.

Having said that the reapers use indoctrination which is REQUIRED to understand our emotions to use. If they have access to it then there would have been no problem that took millions of cycles to begin with!!!!!!!!!!!!!

btw Iam not going to list all the othe plot holes, as you can see just trying to explain this one is a pain.

Modifié par KevShep, 19 janvier 2013 - 11:47 .

[bayofangels]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MP is amazingly well done, so no.

good MP doesn't translate to good SP

Omega had very nice gameplay.

Also chances are the writers from Edmonton will be offered a chance to move to Team Montreal. Whether or not they'll take it, however, is another story.

If I was a writer at Edmonton I may see DA3 and the all-new franchise as being more attractive than putting my name to the inevitable half-retcon/canon backstory ME4 will cook up.

Modifié par bayofangels, 20 janvier 2013 - 12:19 .

[Festilence]

I was really disappointed by Omega, especially in comparison to Leviathan. I didn't find the story particularly interesting and to be honest it all felt very run of the mill.

I hope the next DLC is an improvement.

[Aaleel]

Bioware games were put on my no pre-order list after DA2.

What studio does what is really irrelevant at this point. It's obvious that the company is taking its games as a whole in a new direction. The changes (streamlining) from DA:O going forward, are pretty much the same as those from ME1 going forward.

So to answer the question, yes I worry about what ME4 will be like.

[xsdob]

Does anyone even know or care to know who actually wrote the dlc? Come on people, how can we judge something if we don't even have a name to make our judgements against?

[Dean_the_Young]

KevShep wrote...

Let me give you an example: The reapers cant understand that what they are doing is wrong(harvesting) because they dont use any emotions at all behind there logic like we do(organics). Yet the reapers use indoctrination which in order to use they would have to understand emotional reasoning. How can the reapers use indoctrination but cant use that logic to understand and find a new solution?

Because they don't share your ethical perspective. That should be pretty obvious.

It isn't even necessarily a matter of emotion: there's nothing suggesting the Reapers are devoid of emotion, just sympathy for us. The Reapers already have a fundamentally different perspective of identity, potentially life and death, and... oh yeah.

They don't have free will.

[Dean_the_Young]

darkway1 wrote...

So what are you saying.?.......if enough people say they enjoy plot riddled writting, then it suddenly becomes OK.???

That you have a strong role in how much you let something affect you. Grudges don't carry themselves: they might be instigated by something or someone else, but ultimately how far you take them is up to you.

Letting the endings outweigh everything else about  the series isn't some implicit truth or consequence of their quality. No one is forcing you to react of feel a particular away. It's a personal reaction, and a personal style, to let it become such.

[Dean_the_Young]

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Nitrocuban wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

What plot holes?

Repaers cant find a new solution because they only use logic based on equations rather then emotional logic+ equations like organics do. This is why the reapers harvest every cycle because they see no other way.

However the reapers use indoctrination which means that they...WOULD...have access to OUR emotional logic(other wise they would not be able to indoctrinate at all)  to see that there is another solution if not many many more.

This is a huge plot and story breaking hole.

What other solution?

had they used logic based on emotions they would have found that there are more solutions other then a solution based only on equations.

lolol that's not a plothole at all. You're assuming that because they have access to our minds that they should agree with our own emotional view on things? You didnt name a single plot hole. You just listed a bunch of your assumptions and speculations as if they were cold hard facts.

It is a plot hole, here is how...

Do you see anything wrong with there "solution"? If yes then why?

If you answered both of those questions then they COULD have found a new solution.

Also that was only ONE plot hole, there are many many more.

Although it was certainly uninentional, there's a definite (and consequently amusing) logic error in your conditional statement: someone with a different ethics from you could simply answer 'no', thereby invalidating your conditional.

Not, mind you, that that would make it a plot hole in the first place. That phrase means something different from what you think it means.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 20 janvier 2013 - 02:11 .

[KevShep]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Let me give you an example: The reapers cant understand that what they are doing is wrong(harvesting) because they dont use any emotions at all behind there logic like we do(organics). Yet the reapers use indoctrination which in order to use they would have to understand emotional reasoning. How can the reapers use indoctrination but cant use that logic to understand and find a new solution?

Because they don't share your ethical perspective. That should be pretty obvious.

It isn't even necessarily a matter of emotion: there's nothing suggesting the Reapers are devoid of emotion, just sympathy for us. The Reapers already have a fundamentally different perspective of identity, potentially life and death, and... oh yeah.

They don't have free will.

This is my point exactly. If the reapers use indoctrination ( a tool that affects our emotions directly) then they should be able to find a new solution just like all the other races of the past(crucible). If they understand us from an emotional point of view then they would have been the crucibles architect long ago.

the problem with the reapers view is that there solution is a math problem of trying to get to equal zero on chaos. at the end of every cycle the answer is always zero chaos because they dont know how to get the answer of 0 with organics still alive. An organic would find a different solution.

Modifié par KevShep, 20 janvier 2013 - 02:20 .

[Dean_the_Young]

KevShep wrote...

Your the one missing the point. This is not that hard to understand. I will spell it out for you...


The point is is that organics would NEVER do what the reapers are doing. Organics would find a new or other solution. The REASON that the reapers CANT find one is because there logic is based on equations. They have tried to use synthesis before but failed because they do not have the insight of an organic(pay attention to what he is saying). The organics made the crucible that..."CHANGED HIM"....! It was an organic device meaning that WE made it.

Now now, don't make racist generalizations. Humans are quite capable of nihilistic fatalism. And insanity.

Had the reapers had the insight of our emotional logic along with logic based on equations then they would have stopped the cycles LONG ago.

You assume the emotional logic would dictate an end to the cycle, rather than reinforcement of it. Considering that the Reapers seem themselves as both an ascended form of eternal life, and organics as a doomed lesser form of life, equivalent value of life need not apply in pursuit of preserving worthy forms.

It's not like people are people to the Reapers: civilizations are like a forest of trees. You certainly aren't up in arms about the forestry and gaming industries.

Having said that the reapers use indoctrination which is REQUIRED to understand our emotions to use. If they have access to it then there would have been no problem that took millions of cycles to begin with!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There's no requirement about it: indoctrination is technologically advancing conditioning. We have non-sentient systems that do that already (ways that animals condition us), and we have the ability to condition minds that we don't share thought-styles with (animal conditioning).

btw Iam not going to list all the othe plot holes, as you can see just trying to explain this one is a pain.

Possibly because you fail to describe a plot hole as opposed to an assumption-hole.

[Dean_the_Young]

KevShep wrote...

This is my point exactly. If the reapers use indoctrination ( a tool that affects our emotions directly) then they should be able to find a new solution just like all the other races of the past(crucible).

This is a false conditional. Indoctrination isn't just a tool that affects our emotions directly: it's neither an emotional appeal or solely reliant on the victim's emotional agreement.  Indoctrination can be associated with a euphoric state, but that's more biology from the impulses than emotions.

Moreover, all the other races of the past didn't find a new possibility. It's not the creation or design of the Crucible that makes a difference, it also includes the ability to successfully deploy it. You're selective choosing phrases and applying them to a separate context.

Neither Destroy or Control are new solutions to the problem, and not all the races of the Crucible were aware of Synthesis.

If they understand us from an emotional point of view then they would have been the crucibles architect long ago.

This is pretty silly, to be frank. Your argument rests on an assumption that understanding implies agreement and shared values: that's a failure in just looking across human cultures, let alone alien ones.

the problem with the reapers view is that there solution is a math problem of trying to get to equal zero on chaos. at the end of every cycle the answer is always zero chaos. An organic would find a different solution.

Unless they were smart, and valued better logic than emotional impulses.  Or they were amoral and didn't care. Of if they were desperate and felt the alternatives were insufficient. Or- or- or-

Seriously, not everyone agrees with eachother. You aren't even putting out what a more viable solution is.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 20 janvier 2013 - 02:30 .

[KevShep]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Your the one missing the point. This is not that hard to understand. I will spell it out for you...


The point is is that organics would NEVER do what the reapers are doing. Organics would find a new or other solution. The REASON that the reapers CANT find one is because there logic is based on equations. They have tried to use synthesis before but failed because they do not have the insight of an organic(pay attention to what he is saying). The organics made the crucible that..."CHANGED HIM"....! It was an organic device meaning that WE made it.

Now now, don't make racist generalizations. Humans are quite capable of nihilistic fatalism. And insanity.

Had the reapers had the insight of our emotional logic along with logic based on equations then they would have stopped the cycles LONG ago.

You assume the emotional logic would dictate an end to the cycle, rather than reinforcement of it. Considering that the Reapers seem themselves as both an ascended form of eternal life, and organics as a doomed lesser form of life, equivalent value of life need not apply in pursuit of preserving worthy forms.

It's not like people are people to the Reapers: civilizations are like a forest of trees. You certainly aren't up in arms about the forestry and gaming industries.

Having said that the reapers use indoctrination which is REQUIRED to understand our emotions to use. If they have access to it then there would have been no problem that took millions of cycles to begin with!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There's no requirement about it: indoctrination is technologically advancing conditioning. We have non-sentient systems that do that already (ways that animals condition us), and we have the ability to condition minds that we don't share thought-styles with (animal conditioning).

btw Iam not going to list all the othe plot holes, as you can see just trying to explain this one is a pain.

Possibly because you fail to describe a plot hole as opposed to an assumption-hole.

1. what do you mean Iam making racist generalizations? what is racist about what I said? Some people are insane, that does not mean that we all  have the same mindset like the reapers do however. that is the difference in us vs them.

2. Judging by the organics getting along with the geth(synthetics) and the fact that all past races had a part in the crucible design proves that the emotional driven organics had a better solution(not perfect but better at least). That is the problem of trying to answer a question to the fate for people reguarding life and death SHOULD NOT be judged ONLY by an equation without adding the value of our emotions to life in the way that we see it. That is where the reapers are dead wrong. If your going to judge a races fate then take into account there views on your judgments.

3. For this one I think you missunderstand me. I ment that to indoctrinate someone you need to understand that persons emotional state. You cant indoctrinate a person without there emotions being affected. Since we are emotionaly driven then it stands to reason that in order to use indoctrination there emotions MUST be manipulated. If there manipulated then they have advanced knowlege of our emotions which whould in turn mean that the reapers could have done what organics did(crucible design or something like it) along time ago.

4. Ive described a polt hole, the fact that you cant see it or comprehend it does not make it an "assumption hole", its an"assumption hole to you not me.

I will spell it out in the most easiest way possible...

-reapers logic= mathmatical equations ONLY!...hence no new solution or ideas in millions of cycles.

Organics logic= equations+emotional logic. Organics have made a new solution many many cycles ago(crucible) however the reapers have stopped them at every turn.

Indoctrination=emotional manipulation. Emotional manipulation rules out any form of logic the person mite have and clouds there mind just like a religious zealot who know better but there beliefs prevent them from see the truth.

If the reapers know of indoctrination then they have insight into our emotional thought process and most likely have been the creators of the crucible instead of us for this very reason. Just look at the geth, they are trying to understand our emotional thought process and are making great strides in it....why are the reapers not doing this? The fact that they have been through millions of cycles proves that they have no insigth into our views or ideas which also means that they cant indoctrinate.

Modifié par KevShep, 20 janvier 2013 - 02:59 .

[Mcfly616]

Seems like an assumption hole to me lol


You're still listing your mere speculations as the basis for your argument and its failing miserably

[KevShep]

Mcfly616 wrote...

Seems like an assumption hole to me lol


You're still listing your mere speculations as the basis for your argument and its failing miserably

The reapers(catalyst) CANT figure out how the crucible's decisions(three choices) are going to work because its outside of a mathmatical equation(emotional resaoning).

If...IF...the reapers have indoctrination then the reapers could have answered that question(solution) long ago.

Do you see what Iam saying now?

[KevShep]

KevShep wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Seems like an assumption hole to me lol


You're still listing your mere speculations as the basis for your argument and its failing miserably

The reapers(catalyst) CANT figure out how the crucible's decisions(three choices) are going to work because its outside of a mathmatical equation(emotional resaoning).

If...IF...the reapers have indoctrination then the reapers could have answered that question(solution) long ago.

Do you see what Iam saying now?

There is no assuming that the reapers logic is flawed due to the reapers solution of absolutely zero chaos. They are subtracting the galaxy to zero every time...that is there answer...0.

The reapers are NOT using logic based on emotions.

What on earth is any part of that an assumption?

[rekn2]

calm down. youre letting your emotions get the best of you.

humans share emotions across the spectrum. we still have disagreements. look at 9-11. committed by people who get happy sometimes, they get sad sometimes, they worry about stuff just like you and i. i dont agree with what they did and were almost directly the same. hell were related. look at DNA. your trying to tell me that something without the same emotions, without the same neuro system is going to give a crap about what i think? why would they? do they even think in the same sense humans do?


its funny some one brought up trees and forestry. did you know that were related to them? that at 1 time we were 1 species? your "emotions are be-all end-all" is laughable at best. people still kill other people and you expect a space robot to give a damn because humans are dieing...for all we know emotions by be a human specific thing. until we meet other sentient things saying organics have emotions is a huge and unfounded statement

[KevShep]

rekn2 wrote...

calm down. youre letting your emotions get the best of you.

humans share emotions across the spectrum. we still have disagreements. look at 9-11. committed by people who get happy sometimes, they get sad sometimes, they worry about stuff just like you and i. i dont agree with what they did and were almost directly the same. hell were related. look at DNA. your trying to tell me that something without the same emotions, without the same neuro system is going to give a crap about what i think? why would they? do they even think in the same sense humans do?


its funny some one brought up trees and forestry. did you know that were related to them? that at 1 time we were 1 species? your "emotions are be-all end-all" is laughable at best. people still kill other people and you expect a space robot to give a damn because humans are dieing...for all we know emotions by be a human specific thing. until we meet other sentient things saying organics have emotions is a huge and unfounded statement

Dude you completely missed the point and the conversation.

It was about the catalyst(and or reapers) logic not making sense because he cant use indoctrination if he does not have access to an understanding of our emotions. If he(catalyst/and or reapers) has an understanding of emotions then he(or reapers) would have sided with other organics in the past that were making the crucible.

Modifié par KevShep, 20 janvier 2013 - 05:18 .

[NightShadow1800]

After playing the Omega DLC I'm worried Mass Effect 4 will end up being Gears of War set in the Mass Effect universe. Only time will tell, but I don't see myself getting it until I see the reaction from those who take the risk buying it out of the gate. (planing to do the same thing for Dragon Age 3 to be honest)
I no longer consider myself a "hard core" Bioware fan... they're going to have to work hard to win me back at this point.

[Bizantura]

I'm cured of my negativity towards Bioware for the most part. Bought telltale's "The Walking Dead" after reading so much positiviness her on BSN. Was that a bummer. No gameplay, no choises and a gastly zombie story full of doom and gloom. If games would all go that way I would pull my hair out of my head. I simply don't understand the ravings for that game.

Except for the ending I don't really have much problems with the ME trilogy. Enjoyed Omega dlc as well. So no I don't worry about ME4, it probably will have things in the game I lesser like but I'll probably survive it. Not so for telltale's game of the year that was a waste of money and time and resources if you ask me.

[TheWerdna]

Mcfly616 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Until the writers are in place, you can't really tell.

level design and combat..... But I think Casey is project lead again.

Casey is apparently producer of the next game rather then project lead. Thus this means he has less say....thus this makes me happy.