1056 réponses à ce sujet

[DarthSliver]

Browser Error, caused me to double post

Modifié par DarthSliver, 18 décembre 2013 - 09:12 .

[dsl08002]

In my opinion i dont Think that ME4 will be a success at all. i Believe that majority of fans will dislike it.

[durasteel]

DarthSliver wrote...

I think more than 10-30 years should pass, maybe more like enough to pretty much kill off the Liara. 

I don't see any need to kill off Liara. The MEU needs a shadow broker, might as well be her.

Modifié par durasteel, 18 décembre 2013 - 11:05 .

[AlanC9]

Liara's going to live for centuries anyway.

[KaiserShep]

durasteel wrote...

DarthSliver wrote...

I think more than 10-30 years should pass, maybe more like enough to pretty much kill off the Liara. 

I don't see any need to kill off Liara. The MEU needs a shadow broker, might as well be her.

Liara is only 109 in ME3. Unless the writers actively do something to her that shortens her lifespan (which I'm sure is a safe bet is not going to happen), she would be around for at least another 800 years. 

Modifié par KaiserShep, 18 décembre 2013 - 11:22 .

[ImaginaryMatter]

I think we should just accept the fact that Liara is going to be in ME4 if it's a sequel, she's way too popular among the writers.

[FlamingBoy]

ImaginaryMatter wrote...

I think we should just accept the fact that Liara is going to be in ME4 if it's a sequel, she's way too popular among the writers.

Popular among the fans to... the problem is after some criticism of me2 of liara not being in the game enough bioware went liara crazy.

[KaiserShep]

If only Jacob fans were more vocal. BioWare pretty much turned his own battle cry against him. "YOU'RE DONE!"

[durasteel]

StreetMagic wrote...

Fan input sucks. I don't think Bioware ever interprets it right. "Oh don't like the Mako? We'll get rid of exploration entirely then!" "Oh you want more Liara? Now she's everywhere. While other characters are barely anywhere! Yay!"

"Oh, you didn't like the ending? We'll add more exposition from the Catalyst to make it better!"

[Ninja Stan]

Fan input does suck, but maybe not in the way you mean. Fans aren't a unified voice, which is part of the problem. There are literally millions of them, each with their own opinions, preferences, and tolerances, and many of them want to share their opinion about the game and offer suggestions on what BioWare should do next.

Yeah, StreetMagic, some fans didn't like the Mako but still liked exploration. What you don't mention is the other fans who didn't like the Mako and also didn't like exploration. Or the fans who loved the Mako but hated exploring. Or those who loved both the Mako and exploration. And that's only 4 distinct points along the spectrum of fan opinion, preference, and tolerance. Whether fans liked something or not, how much did it affect their game experience? And if it negatively affected the experience, what would have made it better, more/less of that thing or the inclusion of something different, and to what degree?

durasteel, it is far too easy to frame one's disagreement as a singular decision on BioWare's part that you can immediately place yourself in relation to, but in my experience, if it is a singular decision, it's the result of many meetings between project leads and sometimes their counterparts at EA. These singular "one or the other" decisions will disappoint groups on one side or another (e.g. like the endings / don't like the endings). To make the EC decision, they have to weigh just how much fans didn't like the ending. How many fans? How does it affect sales? How much did they dislike it? Is that an accurate number? Is it worth the expense to make an EC? Whose opinion will it change? By how much? Are the numbers right? How long will it take? Who's going to do the work? How are we going to talk about it? Will that affect the opinions of those who didn't like the endings? How much? Can we trust that info? Is it worth it? And that's just one of those decisions.

By some accounts, EC did exactly what BioWare said it would do, and that was good enough for some folks. For others, for whatever reason, it wasn't. If they didn't do the EC, that too would have been good enough for some folks. For others, for whatever reason, it wouldn't have been. Was it the right decision? Your opinion and BioWare's may vary, but you have the benefit of second-guessing yourself, and you really had nothing at stake in the decision. If you liked the original endings, there was very little risk EC would make you dislike it instead. If you disliked the original endings, there was a chance you'd accept the EC instead. They made their choice, and you made yours, and when the next game comes out, you have a choice to make whether you will buy it or not. Exactly the same as if they'd made the best game ever or the worst game ever.

That's why fan input can be so frustrating. It's a source of great feedback for BioWare to consider, but some fans misinterpret what "feedback" and "consider" can mean.

[durasteel]

Ninja Stan wrote...
...
That's why fan input can be so frustrating. It's a source of great feedback for BioWare to consider, but some fans misinterpret what "feedback" and "consider" can mean.

For what its worth, I think the feedback is probably most effective at pointing out what worked and what didn't, but much much less so when it comes to pointing out why, or what to do about it.

By the way, Stan, thanks for being here.

Modifié par durasteel, 19 décembre 2013 - 06:02 .

[Grizzly46]

Ninja Stan wrote...
That's why fan input can be so frustrating. It's a source of great feedback for BioWare to consider, but some fans misinterpret what "feedback" and "consider" can mean.

Correct. And yet we have a thread were Casey Hudson is asking for fan input regarding the next installment of Mass Effect... That thread is now 154 pages long, and I doubt there are two posts that look the same, which makes me wonder: why haven't they taken this question seriously and made a poll about it - "what would you like to see in the next Mass Effect game? Thermoclips or limited ammo, direct continuation from ME3 or stand alone, before, after or during the reaper war"... And so on. There is no way Bioware can extract any useful input from that thread.

But I wrote in it, just because...

[AlanC9]

Polling us would not be all that useful. Whenever you look at hard data from the tracking system, you'll find that the people on this board are very different from what that data shows the average players doing.

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 décembre 2013 - 08:49 .

[Grizzly46]

AlanC9 wrote...

Polling us would not be all that useful. Whenever you look at hard data from the tracking system, you'll find that the people on this board are very different from what that data shows the average players doing.

Better than to try to sift through thousands of posts. Besides, wouldn't your statement indicate then that most players (ie not on this board) were happy with the original ME3 endings? I mean if average players are not milling around message boards?

[SilencedScream]

If it IS a post-ME3 game, then essentially, our choices for ME3's ending don't matter either.
The ramifications of your decision would be too drastic to carry on into a new game, so they'd have to select something as canon.

That's... pretty damn funny.
"Not only did your choices not matter then, they don't matter now!"

[Iakus]

SilencedScream wrote...

If it IS a post-ME3 game, then essentially, our choices for ME3's ending don't matter either.
The ramifications of your decision would be too drastic to carry on into a new game, so they'd have to select something as canon.

That's... pretty damn funny.
"Not only did your choices not matter then, they don't matter now!"

This is why I keep saying they should go AU

End Shepard's story.  Completely.  Start a new one.  And hopefully learn from the experience.

To try and continue along the red, green, and blue paths will only invite more resentment.

[crimzontearz]

AU please....total reboot ala NWOD

[Iakus]

Heck BG---->NWN reboot would do.

[AlanC9]

Grizzly46 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Polling us would not be all that useful. Whenever you look at hard data from the tracking system, you'll find that the people on this board are very different from what that data shows the average players doing.

Better than to try to sift through thousands of posts. Besides, wouldn't your statement indicate then that most players (ie not on this board) were happy with the original ME3 endings? I mean if average players are not milling around message boards?

The mere fact of posting on this board  means that you're different from other players.

I wouldn't say that most players were happy with the endings; we don't know that. But since only 42% of players finished the game even once.....

(Note that only 36% of players finished DA:O. Too long? Beats me)

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 décembre 2013 - 03:59 .

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

I wouldn't say that most players were happy with the endings; we don't know that. But since only 42% of players finished the game even once.....

(Note that only 36% of players finished DA:O. Too long? Beats me)

Did DAO's ending cause unprecedented backlash?

[AlanC9]

Maybe it did and we just didn't know it. More players finished DA2, which is 1% below ME3. ME2 is a bit higher than both.

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

Maybe it did and we just didn't know it. More players finished DA2, which is 1% below ME3. ME2 is a bit higher than both.

ME3's problems made it into mainstream press.  I think we'd know

DA2's ending caused some backlash as well (you'll know why when you get there) which I believe is one of the aspects that later got acknowledged as one of DA2's deeper flaws.

[Iakus]

<-----Four complete playthrus of DAO. And I intend to do at least two more, so I can see all the origins.