796 réponses à ce sujet

[TJBartlemus]

Chris Priestly wrote...
4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.

 Coming from the same guy who pointed out to not believe employee's opinions as BioWare's opinions. At least until it is officially posted on the BioWare site or related Twitter/Facebook outlets. He does realize he is an employee too, right?

Until it is officially posted on the BioWare site, I think that people will continue to take the " the Extended Cut is the end of the endings" not seriously. 

PS. In case Chris is still monitoring the thread...I wonder what he believes is the ending of ME3. Cause to be literal, the ending is the stargazer scene. So content before that can be added to or changed without BioWare being accused of lying.

[MegaSovereign]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Thore2k10 wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.

i dont get it... at the end of the day you want to make money, so why dont you do something there obviously is a market for... its not like it would hurt you in any way. bethesda had no problems with that after a much smaller fan outcry, so its not like its forbidden or anything...

no offence, just honestly curious...

This is a crucial point, and whenever someone openly discusses it or asks why not since it would be practically a no-brainer, there's a need to act like they're morons, is beyond me.  Yes, he's said there won't be any before, but still and all there's no satisfactory reason given as to why content that has a ready made audience that is practically begging for it appears to be considered as stupid by a company that wants to make money and says they listen to their fans.  Other companies would tear their eyes out if customers told them exactly the stuff they would buy.

Perhaps they don't view BSN as a decent enough sampling size to devote resources to it.

Not to mention, the DLC won't actually guarantee 100% satisfaction. And there are a lot of people on BSN who are displeased with ME3 as a whole.

[3DandBeyond]

MegaSovereign wrote...

Or misleading PR statements. While it doesn't make it ethical, it's not  that uncommon in this industry. 

And they're still not obligated to refute your opinion of their game.

But what's intrinsically wrong with that, is that many think there's nothing wrong with it.  This is the only industry where hyperbolic pre-release statements (advertising directed at getting you to pre-order and buy) are not totally considered wrong by customers.  Even if it's patently untrue, many will say "oh well, that's how it goes in this industry".  A lie is a lie, and I don't care what the product is that it's being used for to convince you to part with your money.

I'm not saying you are doing this, MegaSovereign-I'm stating something I have heard repeatedly from people.  I've heard it almost as often as this one about a game ending, "well, it's a game, what do you expect?"  The issue is this is an industry that wants to be taken seriously, and BW really wants that badly.  They did want to create a break out game that would turn the industry on its ear.  But, to do that you have to first take your own creations seriously.  Video games will never be fully seen as more than glorified toys if the industry won't get real about it all.

[spirosz]

Paulomedi wrote...

spirosz wrote...

My post wasn't about writers defending anything, I just prefer the same writers to write the same characters so we don't end up with what we ended up with. I understand not all writers stay, but they could at least make sure to understand what the previous writer wrote and I know that might sound harsh, but its sad when I find fans are better understanding of what the original writer created.

They might not defend it, but how you will ever buy any piece of fiction from them again if they do not even talk about they wrote in the first place.

Casey Hudson tweeted about reviewing Deception, and we all know where that ended.

Is this a writer you invest your time?

It's a person I did have respect for, KOTOR, ME1, ME2.  People make mistakes and we honestly don't know what went on with the writing and we never will.  Also, I'm not just talking about the story writers as well, the character writers in ME3 make my head hurt with some of the aspects they seemed to forget all about from ME1 and 2, but hey, **** happens right and as a consumer, I have to speak with my money, which I'm doing by not purchasing any DLC or future games till they earn my trust back.  I've lowered my expectations on Bioware and won't expect much from them in the future, especially since realistically, I should of expected what happened to ME3, to happen, but I was just blind with love of a series.   

My only advice is, learn where your strengths are for writing, Mac is a great character writer, but not-so good story writer, where as Drew was a decent story writer, but not-so good character writer... 

[3DandBeyond]

MegaSovereign wrote...

Perhaps they don't view BSN as a decent enough sampling size to devote resources to it.

Not to mention, the DLC won't actually guarantee 100% satisfaction. And there are a lot of people on BSN who are displeased with ME3 as a whole.

I get that, but you take the case of Omega and compare it to Leviathan.  Leviathan may well have sold better due to the rumors that it might have something ending related in it.  Omega didn't have that.  So, Omega was just new territory with a lot of people saying youtube was their best friend.  The next DLC will have even fewer ready made customers because a lot of people have by now just left the series altogether.  What might bring them back-it is obvious since even the for pay reviewers are indicating ending related DLC or DLC that changes the endings would be far better than the other variety at this point.

No, BSN isn't everybody, but it's got the most vocal sampling of all sides.  The most often requested (repeatedly asked for) DLC was ending related.  And as they've shown-you don't have to make everyone that buys it happy-you just have to make them think they will be.  :innocent:

It's a pipe dream to think you'd ever please 100% of the people with anything.  But when people are asking for something and willing to pay for it, you really aren't doing yourself any favors if you ignore it.  That's exactly what the little suggestion cards are for in restaurants.   And it's what every company wants to know and work hard and pay a lot of money to find out.  Companies have psychologists to determine trends-they use rebates that go to one clearinghouse that determines buyer habits, and they use datamining to figure out what you might buy.  People here are telling them what they would buy.  I'm just saying that should be considered.

[TurianRebel212]

3DandBeyond wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Or misleading PR statements. While it doesn't make it ethical, it's not  that uncommon in this industry. 

And they're still not obligated to refute your opinion of their game.

But what's intrinsically wrong with that, is that many think there's nothing wrong with it.  This is the only industry where hyperbolic pre-release statements (advertising directed at getting you to pre-order and buy) are not totally considered wrong by customers.  Even if it's patently untrue, many will say "oh well, that's how it goes in this industry".  A lie is a lie, and I don't care what the product is that it's being used for to convince you to part with your money.

I'm not saying you are doing this, MegaSovereign-I'm stating something I have heard repeatedly from people.  I've heard it almost as often as this one about a game ending, "well, it's a game, what do you expect?"  The issue is this is an industry that wants to be taken seriously, and BW really wants that badly.  They did want to create a break out game that would turn the industry on its ear.  But, to do that you have to first take your own creations seriously.  Video games will never be fully seen as more than glorified toys if the industry won't get real about it all.

Yes, The gaming idustry is not held to same professional standing as film. Just look at reviews from place like ign, gamespot, EGM, or many more. They are bias. Casey Hudson blantly lied to us and then sold us an inferior product. But becasue the majority of lawmakers and people who are in charge don't considering The gaming industry as an art form like film, music or literature they don't care.

The whole " well it's game what do you expect" is so spot on. This climate and attitude must change in order for the game industry to move forward. Un-bias reviews, profesional repercussions for Devs for misleading statements and more open communication between devs and the community. If say Casey Hudson were to come to the forums or whatever outlett and activly engadge in a respectfull manor with the community I think many of us who were spured by the ending and the hadling of ME3 would forgive him and bioware. The utter disconnect between Hudson and the community is outlandish. The only thing we can do since none of the above things are happening is talk with our money. If the next DLC does not live up to my standards I will never by another bioware product again. This is my personal choice. And I'm not saying my choice is better than your's or your's or whatever. But that's what I will do. They have one more chance. 

[spirosz]

You really think there is no bias in award shows like the Oscars? It's in every form of media.  Gaming just happens to still be young.  

Modifié par spirosz, 23 janvier 2013 - 12:46 .

[Hexley UK]

spirosz wrote...

You really think there is no bias in award shows like the Oscars? It's in every form of media.

True but most forms of media don't cost £40+.

[MattFini]

TurianRebel212 wrote...

Yes, The gaming idustry is not held to same professional standing as film. Just look at reviews from place like ign, gamespot, EGM, or many more. They are bias. 

There's bias in MOST online outlets that review media...movies, music, books and video games.

It's a fact of life and it's up to the reader to take this into account and figure out which outlets (if any) they trust. 

[MegaSovereign]

3DandBeyond wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

Or misleading PR statements. While it doesn't make it ethical, it's not  that uncommon in this industry. 

And they're still not obligated to refute your opinion of their game.

But what's intrinsically wrong with that, is that many think there's nothing wrong with it.  This is the only industry where hyperbolic pre-release statements (advertising directed at getting you to pre-order and buy) are not totally considered wrong by customers.  Even if it's patently untrue, many will say "oh well, that's how it goes in this industry".  A lie is a lie, and I don't care what the product is that it's being used for to convince you to part with your money.

I'm not saying you are doing this, MegaSovereign-I'm stating something I have heard repeatedly from people.  I've heard it almost as often as this one about a game ending, "well, it's a game, what do you expect?"  The issue is this is an industry that wants to be taken seriously, and BW really wants that badly.  They did want to create a break out game that would turn the industry on its ear.  But, to do that you have to first take your own creations seriously.  Video games will never be fully seen as more than glorified toys if the industry won't get real about it all.

I don't disagree. I don't believe Casey Hudson remembers half of what he said about ME3 pre-release , but I think Bioware is a little more cautious about what they say after what happened with ME3's release. Hence why I believe Chris Priestly when he says that the company is done making more ending content.

The thing is, they are just video games. It naturally shouldn't invoke the same response as, for example, a car being advertised as "excellent condition" but later finding out that the brakes don't work right while your on the freeway.

[hiraeth]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Ok, a few points here:
1 - Knock off the fighting and bickering or people will get banned and teh thread closed.
2 - BIOWARE has not hyped this up. A few staff have tweeted and FANS are making much of what is said. There is lots of speculation on what the next DLC will be, but we have not said anything and will not until the content is locked and thinsg are final. Any guesses based of leaks, tweets, conjecture, etc are GUESSES.
3 - Jennifer Hale works on projects besides Mass Effect. Take that with a grain of salt.
4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.
5 - Details of what the upcoming DLC will be, content, price if any, date, etc will be made available when the ME team is ready.
6 - See #1.

it's sort of sad that BW staff are trying to contain fans who have positive expectations (i.e., hype) for upcoming DLC. don't get me wrong, i can understand that given the huge controversy surrounding the ending, some amount of endorsement of realistic expectations is probably warranted on BSN, but to me it sometimes feels like any sliver of hope is immediately shot down by BW staff.

i mean, come on...sure jennifer hale is involved in other projects, but the project she tweets the most about it ME (unless i only get a filtered version of her tweets). it's not unreasonable or crazy to read that tweet as ME-related. geez.

[spirosz]

Hexley UK wrote...

spirosz wrote...

You really think there is no bias in award shows like the Oscars? It's in every form of media.

True but most forms of media don't cost £40+.

True, but remember, you have to consider what we get out of these forms of media.  Games can be anywhere from a few hours, to 100+, films (not shorts) tend to be average of 2-3 hours, correct?  

[3DandBeyond]

TJBartlemus wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...
4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.

 Coming from the same guy who pointed out to not believe employee's opinions as BioWare's opinions. At least until it is officially posted on the BioWare site or related Twitter/Facebook outlets. He does realize he is an employee too, right?

Until it is officially posted on the BioWare site, I think that people will continue to take the " the Extended Cut is the end of the endings" not seriously. 

PS. In case Chris is still monitoring the thread...I wonder what he believes is the ending of ME3. Cause to be literal, the ending is the stargazer scene. So content before that can be added to or changed without BioWare being accused of lying.

See the bolded part is exactly what can be inferred.  As I said, some have tried to say that the genophage cure is an ending and so is Rannoch and all, so changing the other ending or adding to it isn't technically changing the endings. 

I'm not saying what will or will not happen, but until something has and this train hits a wall, I believe it should tour the area and see who gets on board.

[Hexley UK]

MassEffectFShep wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Ok, a few points here:
1 - Knock off the fighting and bickering or people will get banned and teh thread closed.
2 - BIOWARE has not hyped this up. A few staff have tweeted and FANS are making much of what is said. There is lots of speculation on what the next DLC will be, but we have not said anything and will not until the content is locked and thinsg are final. Any guesses based of leaks, tweets, conjecture, etc are GUESSES.
3 - Jennifer Hale works on projects besides Mass Effect. Take that with a grain of salt.
4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.
5 - Details of what the upcoming DLC will be, content, price if any, date, etc will be made available when the ME team is ready.
6 - See #1.

it's sort of sad that BW staff are trying to contain fans who have positive expectations (i.e., hype) for upcoming DLC. don't get me wrong, i can understand that given the huge controversy surrounding the ending, some amount of endorsement of realistic expectations is probably warranted on BSN, but to me it sometimes feels like any sliver of hope is immediately shot down by BW staff.

i mean, come on...sure jennifer hale is involved in other projects, but the project she tweets the most about it ME (unless i only get a filtered version of her tweets). it's not unreasonable or crazy to read that tweet as ME-related. geez.

OPTIMISM IS NOT SANCTIONED!

ENGAGING OPTIMISM OPPRESSION PROTOCOLS!

YOU HAVE 20 SECONDS TO COMPLY!

[Hexley UK]

spirosz wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

spirosz wrote...

You really think there is no bias in award shows like the Oscars? It's in every form of media.

True but most forms of media don't cost £40+.

True, but remember, you have to consider what we get out of these forms of media.  Games can be anywhere from a few hours, to 100+, films (not shorts) tend to be average of 2-3 hours, correct?  

True...but only if the game isn't so bad you can't even play it for that long...i'm looking at you DA2.....

[hiraeth]

Hexley UK wrote...

MassEffectFShep wrote...

it's sort of sad that BW staff are trying to contain fans who have positive expectations (i.e., hype) for upcoming DLC. don't get me wrong, i can understand that given the huge controversy surrounding the ending, some amount of endorsement of realistic expectations is probably warranted on BSN, but to me it sometimes feels like any sliver of hope is immediately shot down by BW staff.

i mean, come on...sure jennifer hale is involved in other projects, but the project she tweets the most about it ME (unless i only get a filtered version of her tweets). it's not unreasonable or crazy to read that tweet as ME-related. geez.

OPTIMISM IS NOT SANCTIONED!

ENGAGING OPTIMISM OPPRESSION PROTOCOLS!

YOU HAVE 20 SECONDS TO COMPLY!

ABORT! ABORT! ABORT!

[crimzontearz]

3DandBeyond wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...
4 - We have said repeatedly that we will not be doing more endings for ME3 and that the Extended Cut is the "end of the endings". People refuse to believe me, which is fine as I have been known to not tell the whole story, but do not blame me because you choose not to believe. Temper your expectations.

 Coming from the same guy who pointed out to not believe employee's opinions as BioWare's opinions. At least until it is officially posted on the BioWare site or related Twitter/Facebook outlets. He does realize he is an employee too, right?

Until it is officially posted on the BioWare site, I think that people will continue to take the " the Extended Cut is the end of the endings" not seriously. 

PS. In case Chris is still monitoring the thread...I wonder what he believes is the ending of ME3. Cause to be literal, the ending is the stargazer scene. So content before that can be added to or changed without BioWare being accused of lying.

See the bolded part is exactly what can be inferred.  As I said, some have tried to say that the genophage cure is an ending and so is Rannoch and all, so changing the other ending or adding to it isn't technically changing the endings. 

I'm not saying what will or will not happen, but until something has and this train hits a wall, I believe it should tour the area and see who gets on board.

by that token adding a reunion scene/funeral (depending on in game choices as I explained before) does not technically change the ending either but according to Truly A adding ANY context alters the ending

[TurianRebel212]

MattFini wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

Yes, The gaming idustry is not held to same professional standing as film. Just look at reviews from place like ign, gamespot, EGM, or many more. They are bias. 

There's bias in MOST online outlets that review media...movies, music, books and video games.

It's a fact of life and it's up to the reader to take this into account and figure out which outlets (if any) they trust. 

I understand and agree with you that nothing is complety unbiased, but look at the VGA's. I mean wow. What a load. The press and devs just promote each other with alot of back rubbing. It's kinda disconcering. As is the handling of ME3. And us fans aren't all that immuned to responsibilty and blame. We need to expect more from Devs and the Game industry. Until we take a stand and speak with our pocket books. Like I will do if the next DLC isn't at the very least high quality and gives some closure. But I'm not getting my hopes up.  

 

[XXIceColdXX]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

XXIceColdXX wrote...

Well bit of a letdown hearing from Chris. It's hard to hear when your hopes are high.

Because it's not like he's been saying the same thing for months now..

Consistant as always Rasweezy! If we can count on somethinng, we can count on that.

You may be right (time will tell), but didnt stop a lot of us hoping.

[spirosz]

TurianRebel212 wrote...

MattFini wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

Yes, The gaming idustry is not held to same professional standing as film. Just look at reviews from place like ign, gamespot, EGM, or many more. They are bias. 

There's bias in MOST online outlets that review media...movies, music, books and video games.

It's a fact of life and it's up to the reader to take this into account and figure out which outlets (if any) they trust. 

I understand and agree with you that nothing is complety unbiased, but look at the VGA's. I mean wow. What a load. The press and devs just promote each other with alot of back rubbing. It's kinda disconcering. As is the handling of ME3. And us fans aren't all that immuned to responsibilty and blame. We need to expect more from Devs and the Game industry. Until we take a stand and speak with our pocket books. Like I will do if the next DLC isn't at the very least high quality and gives some closure. But I'm not getting my hopes up.  

 

Well, think about it this way.  If you see an award show like VGA, give awards to a game you personally love, would you still think it's "a lot of back rubbing?" 

I do agree that it's a joke, but sometimes what we like and what isn't appreciated from our perspective, can blur our perception of what's going on.  Anyway, I agree about high quality DLC, personally - I miss expansion packs so much.  I blame microsoft and their limits for the Xbox and publishers wanting to push the "quicker, faster" mindset.

[Hexley UK]

vivaladricas wrote...

Hardest day ever......my paycheck was only 150k....I mean if you knew what we had planned you would hold on to your copy forever.

And I would get 200k.

You win at the internet sir.