2819 réponses à ce sujet

[Seboist]

EntropicAngel wrote...

I finally encountered the Wild Hunt in TW1. So, it's like a bunch of celestial beings looking for others "like them?"

Didn't seem like it was all that important. By that I mean, that the game gave it much importance.

Wild hunt is a background sub-plot/threat in TW1.

[DarkDragon777]

They don't classify "celestial beings" either. Well...you'll see.

[KnightofPhoenix]

renjility wrote...

Wow, I can't believe that people consider taking someone's eyes out an appropriate punishment. It was cruel, and it went way beyond making a statement. Torture is not justified.

I will not make pronouncements on whether it was cruel or not.

I will say hwoever that Radovid did not become known as the Stern by being nice. This image was necessary for him to establish himself and bring peace and order to Redania. Power is ultimately an image, and Radovid has to maintain it. 

[Mr.House]

EntropicAngel wrote...

I finally encountered the Wild Hunt in TW1. So, it's like a bunch of celestial beings looking for others "like them?"

Didn't seem like it was all that important. By that I mean, that the game gave it much importance.

The iwld hunt consist of beings from another world who come into the world of the Witcher to take children who then become riders.  They normaly only come to that world as spectres but when Geralt chased them they came in flesh. I will not spoil more as you will find out more about the wild hunt, and it's king in TW and TW2, and why it's very important.

The king of the hunts motives are still very unclear and their are severl theories to why he does this, which will most likely be revealed in TW3 and hopefully they are good and not yo dawg.

[Mr.House]

renjility wrote...

Wow, I can't believe that people consider taking someone's eyes out an appropriate punishment. It was cruel, and it went way beyond making a statement. Torture is not justified.

I admit I let Roche kill Henselt. I was very hesitant about it at first, but when Henselt said that Ves squealed like a rusty hinge he signed his death sentence. Henselt was not a great king. He was more like a common criminal who happened to be king. He hated and persecuted nonhumans, wasting much of his realms resources for that goal. The common people were starting to get sick of their king's behavior as well. There was a conspiracy for a reason.

Um no. The consipracy was because of Deathmold and any influnce he could have on the king and nay deals with Nilfgard. Henselt is a big reason the North never fell and one of the big reasons the North is still strong. People are so used to the noble good kings that other stories shove down their throat that they fail to relise that kingsl iek Henselt did exsist and they where succesful because they where strong.

As for what happen to the blue stripes, pay attention more. Henselt ordered that on the urging of Deathmold. Had Deathmold not urged, Henselt would have only killed his own men who betrayed him. Henselt is ment to be a disgusting, rude and hated, but he's also ment to show that despite these flaws he's a powerfuo king and without him the North will fall. Without Henselt and Foltest, the North is screwed, Radovid is a good ruler but he's not enough.  Sometimes you need to look past petty revenge and look at the bigger picture. Also torture is justified when it brings fruit, you know how much torture turned the tables in our own history? Torture while "cruel" is a means to an end.

[LPPrince]

Well, the last new copy of The Witcher 2 that my Gamestop had was sold like 40 minutes before I got there, and my friend who works there refused to sell me the only other copy they had because it was used and looked horrid(he's like me, games gotta be new and pristine).

So I'm off to Amazon.com to nab a new Witcher 2 copy I'll get eventually.

So I guess its Crysis 1 today.

[Seboist]

Mr.House wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

I finally encountered the Wild Hunt in TW1. So, it's like a bunch of celestial beings looking for others "like them?"

Didn't seem like it was all that important. By that I mean, that the game gave it much importance.

The iwld hunt consist of beings from another world who come into the world of the Witcher to take children who then become riders.  They normaly only come to that world as spectres but when Geralt chased them they came in flesh. I will not spoil more as you will find out more about the wild hunt, and it's king in TW and TW2, and why it's very important.

The king of the hunts motives are still very unclear and their are severl theories to why he does this, which will most likely be revealed in TW3 and hopefully they are good and not yo dawg.

The hunt kidnapping kids to prevent kids being kidnapped by spectres?

[Mr.House]

Seboist wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

I finally encountered the Wild Hunt in TW1. So, it's like a bunch of celestial beings looking for others "like them?"

Didn't seem like it was all that important. By that I mean, that the game gave it much importance.

The iwld hunt consist of beings from another world who come into the world of the Witcher to take children who then become riders.  They normaly only come to that world as spectres but when Geralt chased them they came in flesh. I will not spoil more as you will find out more about the wild hunt, and it's king in TW and TW2, and why it's very important.

The king of the hunts motives are still very unclear and their are severl theories to why he does this, which will most likely be revealed in TW3 and hopefully they are good and not yo dawg.

The hunt kidnapping kids to prevent kids being kidnapped by spectres?

And then in order to get peace you must merge humans, elves and dwarfs into one being. However all magic is destoryed.

[Chromie]

LPPrince wrote...

Well, the last new copy of The Witcher 2 that my Gamestop had was sold like 40 minutes before I got there, and my friend who works there refused to sell me the only other copy they had because it was used and looked horrid(he's like me, games gotta be new and pristine).

So I'm off to Amazon.com to nab a new Witcher 2 copy I'll get eventually.

So I guess its Crysis 1 today.

Your first time. I'm jealous.

Don't like downloading games? Only $20 on GOG/Steam. Well you'll at least like the packaging CDPR put alot of crap in the box.

[Dutchess]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Henselt was not a great king. He was more like a common criminal who happened to be king. He hated and persecuted nonhumans, wasting much of his realms resources for that goal. The common people were starting to get sick of their king's behavior as well. There was a conspiracy for a reason.

Then you are completely blind to what happened in the lore and in the game you were playing.

The conspiracy? Driven by nobles at the behest of Roche who were opposing Dethmold and any deals Henselt might make with Nilfgaard. Nobles who were bought by Roche.

He was a competent general who is one of the biggest reasons the north is still standing, He has improved the lives of his own people while the rest of the north is rotting away.

I know that Roche was the leader of the conspiracy and that the nobles played an important part. That's not what I was talking about. I was referring to the many soldiers in Henselt's own camp with a square coin with a fish on it. Henselt's own soldiers, the men that are supposed to fight a war for him, were cooperating in a conspiracy to get him killed. I don't recall any mention that those common men were bought into the conspiracy as well.

Also, being a good general is not the same as being a good ruler. Henselt likes playing war, but he's greedy and selfish. I think it comes up in the conspiracy theory quest that he spends more on more on his own pleasures? I'm not 100% sure if I remember that correctly or not.

Chewin3 wrote...

Then in your definition, what makes one a great king?

Certainly, he is seen as a ruthless amoral bastard through his quarrels with neighbouring kingdoms / regions and his enmity with nonhumans, but under his reign he has strengthened Kaewden as a state and improved the well being of thousands of people. And he is not loathed by all the common folk. Zyvik states this himself. He is a respected general by his soldiers.

As for the consiparcy, that was done by Roache who paid them to conspire against Henselt. And him slaughtering the Blue Stripes is entirely justifiable, since he found out it was Roche who was behind it. Plus, it was Dethmold who adviced Henselt to have them executed. 

Having at least a tiny sense of morality would help. That he wastes resources on persecuting nonhumans makes him pretty bad in my book already. I think at least Foltest and Radovid are better kings, though neither of them is perfect. It's probably cheating to mention Saskia's name, because it seems likely that her ideals will be difficult to become reality. But a ruler who strives for at least a degree of equality among his/her people seems like a step in the right direction.

Again, being a respected general is not the same as being a good/respected king. And there was also a considerable group of conspirators amoung the king's soldiers. Oy, the king remembers your name! Wonderful, but that same king won't give a damn if your skull gets split in half during the battle, as long as he wins. Henselt lets his men fight each other because he's bored, and not just "honorable" duels, but fights to the death as well. Things like that make even old veterans lose their sympathy.

Mr.House wrote...

As for what happen to the blue stripes, pay attention more. Henselt ordered that on the urging of Deathmold. Had Deathmold not urged, Henselt would have only killed his own men who betrayed him. Henselt is ment to be a disgusting, rude and hated, but he's also ment to show that despite these flaws he's a powerfuo king and without him the North will fall. Without Henselt and Foltest, the North is screwed, Radovid is a good ruler but he's not enough.  Sometimes you need to look past petty revenge and look at the bigger picture. Also torture is justified when it brings fruit, you know how much torture turned the tables in our own history? Torture while "cruel" is a means to an end.

That is such a weak excuse. "Dethmold made me do it!" Henselt does whatever he likes. He is king, he makes the decisions. He tells Dethmold to shut up if he wants to. If he didn't want to execute the Blue Strips, he wouldn't have given the order to do so. Don't overestimate the influence Dethmold has.

Torture is not justified, and not even a reliable way to get information, because even an innocent will say anything you want to hear eventually. If they pull out your nails and teeth one by one, if the snap your bones and hold a candle underneath the soles of your foot, you will give them the names of everyone who comes to mind. You will confess to pretty much anything, even if you actually didn't do it. You can only support torture when you believe strongly that the end justifies the means, and I disagree with that belief.

[LPPrince]

Skelter192 wrote...

LPPrince wrote...

Well, the last new copy of The Witcher 2 that my Gamestop had was sold like 40 minutes before I got there, and my friend who works there refused to sell me the only other copy they had because it was used and looked horrid(he's like me, games gotta be new and pristine).

So I'm off to Amazon.com to nab a new Witcher 2 copy I'll get eventually.

So I guess its Crysis 1 today.

Your first time. I'm jealous.

Don't like downloading games? Only $20 on GOG/Steam. Well you'll at least like the packaging CDPR put alot of crap in the box.

Hah, thank you/gracias/grazie/obrigado/merci/dankeschön/sukriya. I decided to order TW2 on Amazon and got the day one shipping option so I'll get it tomorrow.

I think I'll hold off on Crysis, wait till I get TW2, and start with that, putting off the shooters for later.

Way later.

[Addai]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Radovid is Stern, ruthless, pragmatic but not cruel.

What he did to Philippa was cruel.

There was a purpose to, it was to prove he was stronger then her, that he could finally unshackle himself from her grasp. The master had finally become the prisoner.

Executing her would have done that, he didn't need to torture her first.  That was revenge.

[Mr.House]

renjility wrote...


That is such a weak excuse. "Dethmold made me do it!" Henselt does whatever he likes. He is king, he makes the decisions. He tells Dethmold to shut up if he wants to. If he didn't want to execute the Blue Strips, he wouldn't have given the order to do so. Don't overestimate the influence Dethmold has.

Torture is not justified, and not even a reliable way to get information, because even an innocent will say anything you want to hear eventually. If they pull out your nails and teeth one by one, if the snap your bones and hold a candle underneath the soles of your foot, you will give them the names of everyone who comes to mind. You will confess to pretty much anything, even if you actually didn't do it. You can only support torture when you believe strongly that the end justifies the means, and I disagree with that belief.

Dethmold has massive influnce, which wast he cause of the plotters to begin with. Also Ves even outright tells Roche not to kill Henselt becauset hat's what Henselt wnated. Henselt raped Ves for that reason, he wnated to ****** off Roche and he did not beleive Roche hadt he balls to kill him. I despise Roche killing Henselt because Roche becomes the very thing he is hunting and it;s just bad, killing Dethmold on the other hand is a cruel and crazy mage who wanted the blue stirpes to be killed, his death was justified. Killing a king and plunging it into chaos just for petty revenge is not justified.

[Costin_Razvan]

Addai67 wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Radovid is Stern, ruthless, pragmatic but not cruel.

What he did to Philippa was cruel.

There was a purpose to, it was to prove he was stronger then her, that he could finally unshackle himself from her grasp. The master had finally become the prisoner.

Executing her would have done that, he didn't need to torture her first.  That was revenge.

Executing her right there would been a foolish move, yet he couldn't just let her get away with her defiance in front of bloody shillard.

It's like trembling in front of a pack of very hungry wolves. They will jump on you at the first sign of weakness.

 Henselt's own soldiers, the men that are supposed to fight a war for him, were cooperating in a conspiracy to get him killed. I don't recall any mention that those common men were bought into the conspiracy as well.

Have you talked with those common soldiers? I did with Odrin and his chaps and then Sven and his father, none of them mention wanting to kill Henselt. They don't even care about Dethmold but instead want to limit Nilfgaard's supposed influence on Henselt.

And I say supposed for a reason. Henselt's not an imbecile.

 Also, being a good general is not the same as being a good ruler. Henselt likes playing war, but he's greedy and selfish. I think it comes up in the conspiracy theory quest that he spends more on more on his own pleasures? I'm not 100% sure if I remember that correctly or not.

So how does him being greedy and selfish make him a bad ruler? The vast majority of rulers were lol. Ghenkis Khan once said he took great pleasure in taking the women of his slain enemies to his chest, I read that as him saying that he enjoyed forcing himself on them, but to argue Ghenkis Khan was not one of the greatest leaders of all our times considering his military and political achievements is to be ignorant of history. He comes off as a brute, a mass murderer, but in reality he created a strong, very large state from nothing with leaders promoted based on their merits rather then birth and with freedom of religious ( in the medieval ages that was quite something ).

Now obviously Henselt isn't Ghenkis Khan, but he ain't a bad leader either. A journal entry from DANDELION, as are all journal entries, who'se a biased idiot isn't going to convince he's one. 

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 19 février 2013 - 10:07 .

[Mr.House]

Philippa refused to answer Radovids question, if she did, she would have been executed for her crimes. SHE refused to talk, thus Radovid went to torture. Philippa has no one to blame but her self in that situation.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Radovid was not going to execute Philippa without a trial, it would have been idiotic. He wants to destroy her influence within and without Redania once and for all, and a trial would do that.

There is an element of revenge and rivalry in plucking her eyes out, but it's also for his image. She refused to admit her guilt and continued to defy him, so an example had to be made.

EDIT:an d as costin asutely points out, Shilard, the representative of the most powerful and aggressive nation on the continent was there. RAdovid could not afford to look weak or defied for even a second. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 février 2013 - 10:48 .

[Yrkoon]

Mr.House wrote...
 Also torture is justified when it brings fruit, you know how much torture turned the tables in our own history? Torture while "cruel" is a means to an end.

Well, see, that's why I view Philipa's eye-gouging as ultimately pointless.  What kind of "fruit" did it bring.... besides feeding the ego of the guy who did it to her?

I would have had her killed, then just  brought her HEAD to whatever symbolic ceremonial type "trial"  that people here think is needed.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 19 février 2013 - 10:48 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yrkoon wrote...
Well, see, that's why I view Philipa's eye-gouging as ultimately pointless.  What kind of "fruit" did it bring.... besides feeding the ego of the guy who did it to her?

I would have had just had her killed, then just  Brought her HEAD to whatever symbolic ceremonial type "trial"  that people here think is needed.

Image. It's half of power. You don't establish the moniker of the Stern for nothing.

As for bringing a decapitated head to a trial....I'll assume that's tongue in cheek so I won't take the time to formulate a response. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 février 2013 - 10:50 .

[Yrkoon]

Well, Dethmold was able to get information from a slain witcher.... perhaps someone can get Philippa's head to talk.

As for extravegant displays of "stern" being half the power....  What can be more Stern than  KILLING someone who refuses  to submit to your will?

Modifié par Yrkoon, 19 février 2013 - 11:02 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yrkoon wrote...
As for extravegant displays of "stern" being half the power....  What can be more Stern than  KILLING someone who refuses  to submit to your will?

Because that would be acting outside the law and wouldn't be as effective in destroying Philippa's power and demonstrating his own. 
Radovid is ruthless, but he always wants to appear as acting within the confines of the law. 

A trial where everyone can see her fall would destroy her image completely. 

Not to mention that a trial would give him further casus belli for his repression of the lodge, and justificaiton for his control over the Order. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 février 2013 - 11:08 .

[sympathy4sarenreturns]

The Wild Hunt can traverse outer space, correct? I believe I remember reading that in Vergen. I wish Phillipa had more info on them when I asked her before. I don't think she said too much on them when asked.

[Yrkoon]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...
As for extravegant displays of "stern" being half the power.... What can be more Stern than KILLING someone who refuses to submit to your will?

Because that would be acting outside the law and wouldn't be as effective in destroying Philippa's power and demonstrating his own.
Radovid is ruthless, but he always wants to appear as acting within the confines of the law.

A trial where everyone can see her fall would destroy her image completely.

Not to mention that a trial would give him further casus belli for his repression of the lodge, and justificaiton for his control over the Order.

The law? Really? At that point in the game, the fate of multiple kingdoms hangs by a thread.... Plus a dragon is about to turn a massive inter-state meeting of rulers into a blood bath, And You're concerned about Radovid possibly breaking a law?

No.  Have the trial.  Perform Necromancy, defend your actions by telling the world that under his rule  we will no longer suffer a power-hungry manipulative witch to live.  Or better yet:   Gag her, shackle her then toss her to the Scoietel to pass their judgement on her. 

Modifié par Yrkoon, 19 février 2013 - 11:21 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yrkoon wrote...
The law? Really? At that point in the game, the fate of multiple kingdoms hangs by a thread.... Plus a dragon is about to turn a massive inter-state meeting of rulers into a blood bath, And You're concerned about Radovid possibly breaking a law?

The dragon appeared after. So moot point. 

Yes the law really. 

No.  Have the trial.  Perform Necromancy, defend your actions by telling the world that we will no longer suffer a power-hungry manipulative witch to live.  Or better yet:   Gag her, shackle her than toss her to the Scoietel to pass their judgement on her. 

That's not a trial. That's justifying a fait accompli. And you'd be losing the chance to humiliate her in front of everyone and break her image completely.

A poor course of action. Someone like Henselt might do it. But not someone as intelligent as Radovid. 

[Yrkoon]

The problem I have with a trial in such a situation is that we know what can happen when you put a powerful, still living, well connected Sorceress on trial. Or rather... we Never know what can happen. Perhaps we can ask Henselt what happens...

Modifié par Yrkoon, 19 février 2013 - 11:25 .