Auintus wrote...
No. The wave was just energy, released from the Crucible. The Citadel only determined how it was released. It couldn't do it by itself.
Auintus wrote...
Wayning_Star wrote...
some prothean Ai's knew of it and the cycle/pattern. Also, the Leviathan knew about it all. Maybe the rachni knew more than Hackett gave them credit for? The crucible was utilized in previous cycles apparently, getting upgrades between them. I doubt the cat would hook up such a device and use it, so it has to have some form of interfaces that links with the catalsyt and as to be causual. The reaperships tried to destroy it and the catalyst ran from it to earth to upend Sheps plans, exposed by TIM. Once it were connected, then the catalsyt began to utter a different opinion on it's experiment within the MEU.
But even the Protheans believed it was the Citadel itself. Nobody indicated that their was an AI involved.
Wayning_Star wrote...
It were only hinted as to what the catalyst was in reference to the crucible. The alliance only knew it were powerful, they didn't know anything about the catalsyt and it's interplay with the cosmic D cell. We know after connection, it was more than a power supply, but even that wasn't fully explained. We take those from the Shep experienc post decision. Shep has to know that it's more than a power supply after making it up to the cat's lair, but even then, it's theoretical. Heck even the choices are theoretical. And, we have to trust that the cat is under some sort of control, we can pretty much depned, that as an absolute thinking manchine, that the organic trait/survival tactic of lying isn't in it's programming. It doesn't need to lie. It's the one who does everything already. But that in of it's self works FOR Shep, not against the MEU.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Auintus wrote...
No. The wave was just energy, released from the Crucible. The Citadel only determined how it was released. It couldn't do it by itself.
Thus, the devices inside the Citadel that modulate the energy are in the Citadel.
Power supply -(Raw Energy)> Citadel -(Colored Energy)> Ending wave of doom
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Wayning_Star wrote...
It were only hinted as to what the catalyst was in reference to the crucible. The alliance only knew it were powerful, they didn't know anything about the catalsyt and it's interplay with the cosmic D cell. We know after connection, it was more than a power supply, but even that wasn't fully explained. We take those from the Shep experienc post decision. Shep has to know that it's more than a power supply after making it up to the cat's lair, but even then, it's theoretical. Heck even the choices are theoretical. And, we have to trust that the cat is under some sort of control, we can pretty much depned, that as an absolute thinking manchine, that the organic trait/survival tactic of lying isn't in it's programming. It doesn't need to lie. It's the one who does everything already. But that in of it's self works FOR Shep, not against the MEU.
Well they guessed it was what regulated the energy into something useful.
And no, the Crucible always was just a power source. No less, and very little more (It had engines to move around and arms to attach to the Citadel, woo).
Again, if we could generate the ending "effects" without the Citadel, you could do a much easier campaign of just setting it off on a system by system basis, without getting thousands killed by crap tactics.
Modifié par Some Gamer Guy, 30 janvier 2013 - 05:13 .
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
The Reapers aren't "sufficiently" advanced to even touch that scale. Molding the entire galaxy to one's will is a whole distant tier of power that does not fit.
"Rewrite the circuits"?Radiation, to the very best of my knowledge, can't even come close to doing that with the precision needed to make it to the form needed to "empathize" with organics... whatever that means on hardware level, which doesn't make sense. That's like saying "I'm going to direct gamma rays into your brain, rearranging things so that you can link to machines."
They can go if the Catalyst says I can control them.
Hammers don't indoctrinate the nails to think that being hit with a hammer is a great thing.
I didn't have any problems with the Geth or EDI. Hell, I got the Quarians to allow Geth into thier suits to help acclimate. Even before that there was no open conflict with the Geth... until Sovereign came along. Gee, this cycle seemed to be going pretty good until the Reapers came. The Reapers are the problem, not the Geth or any other AI's.
Considering that Hackett and Anderson tried thier best to kill Shepard on Earth, don't blame him.
"What do you mean I have to charge towards the walking skyscrapper WITHOUT a diversion? Or going around."
Faust1979 wrote...
On my second play through I chose synthesis and it was an even better ending than destruction. From what I've been seeing from playing the game back to back, the people that have been saying the endings don't fit with the games are completely wrong! these endings have been great and I liked seeing all the races I helped and the wars I stopped bring people to together. In the epilog Shep kept saying she was alive I guess she didn't die in the beam and she became something else as well.
Auintus wrote...
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
The Reapers aren't "sufficiently" advanced to even touch that scale. Molding the entire galaxy to one's will is a whole distant tier of power that does not fit.
"Rewrite the circuits"?
They can go if the Catalyst says I can control them.
Hammers don't indoctrinate the nails to think that being hit with a hammer is a great thing.
I didn't have any problems with the Geth or EDI. Hell, I got the Quarians to allow Geth into thier suits to help acclimate. Even before that there was no open conflict with the Geth... until Sovereign came along. Gee, this cycle seemed to be going pretty good until the Reapers came. The Reapers are the problem, not the Geth or any other AI's.
Considering that Hackett and Anderson tried thier best to kill Shepard on Earth, don't blame him.
"What do you mean I have to charge towards the walking skyscrapper WITHOUT a diversion? Or going around."
I dunno.
Yeah. Not a tech guy here.
I meant without using the Crucible, as I assumed you meant.
What? No, you are not the nail. The nail is whatever task you want accomplished. Making the Reapers leave instead of help makes no sense.
The Catalyst has been around a long time. I believe it when it says that synthetics always rebel. The Reapers didn't give them the chance.
...okay then.
Auintus wrote...
I meant without using the Crucible, as I assumed you meant.
What? No, you are not the nail. The nail is whatever task you want accomplished. Making the Reapers leave instead of help makes no sense.
The Catalyst has been around a long time. I believe it when it says that synthetics always rebel. The Reapers didn't give them the chance.
...okay then.
Some Gamer Guy wrote...
Synthesis was the most intriguing to choose and witness the results (albeit briefly). It was a "morbid curiosity" thing. From a storytelling stand-point, it was the least interesting and had the least potential for continuation. Conflict is gone from the galaxy, and it doesn't appear to be returning anytime soon. The genophage is a thing of the past, the geth and quarians went from circumstantial allies to close friends (same thing with the krogan and turians), and I guess Shepard is everyone's Jiminy Cricket.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Auintus wrote...
I meant without using the Crucible, as I assumed you meant.
What? No, you are not the nail. The nail is whatever task you want accomplished. Making the Reapers leave instead of help makes no sense.
The Catalyst has been around a long time. I believe it when it says that synthetics always rebel. The Reapers didn't give them the chance.
...okay then.
Well, we don't need the vaporize handles when we get to the end. There's no harm in letting Shepard keep his form, and just give the Catalyst his orders. Sure, there's a middleman, but it's more sensical.
Except the Reapers are the problem. You never heard Shep at any point in the series say "The Reapers are our friends, instead, we need to deal with the conflict between organics and synthetics. Sorry Legion and EDI, gotta do something about you because the Reapers said so."
The Catalyst has also believed that using giant lasers on beings and turning them into goo saves people. I don't trust him nearly as far as I can throw him.
Wayning_Star wrote...
you, luckily, don't have to trust reaperships, you know what they'll do.. That intelligence and organic Leviathan are the ones you have to outstrip..compete with. Take the competition away and you have???
And maybe wants to eat flesh? Wasn't sure what a husk eats.Hurbster wrote...
BirdsallSa wrote...
And I'd think that's a beautiful world where people can look past the outer appearance of a husk and see them for what they really are on the inside. That's the sort of stuff we'd have to look forward to with synthesis.XXIceColdXX wrote...
Imagine your daughter came home and told you she was going to marry a husk.
That's the sort of s@&$ we'd have to deal with synthesis.
Rotting flesh and wires ?
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Wayning_Star wrote...
you, luckily, don't have to trust reaperships, you know what they'll do.. That intelligence and organic Leviathan are the ones you have to outstrip..compete with. Take the competition away and you have???
Yes you do, since now the Catalyst is itself and all of them.
And the Leviathans aren't a worry since they can be beaten by a rock apparently. Plus having the "do not mind control me" shields are nice.
Wayning_Star wrote...
lol, you've decided, but on hollow grounds. Small talk is not arguement Tico, only noise. Over simplification of complex systems is a fools errand,and actually lends toward detrimental opionon of your vialbilty as a debator.
Cyberfrog81 wrote...
"Tico" isn't the one underestimating his enemy.
Modifié par GimmeDaGun, 30 janvier 2013 - 06:28 .
Modifié par Cyberfrog81, 30 janvier 2013 - 06:40 .
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Well, we don't need the vaporize handles when we get to the end. There's no harm in letting Shepard keep his form, and just give the Catalyst his orders. Sure, there's a middleman, but it's more sensical.
Except the Reapers are the problem. You never heard Shep at any point in the series say "The Reapers are our friends, instead, we need to deal with the conflict between organics and synthetics. Sorry Legion and EDI, gotta do something about you because the Reapers said so."
The Catalyst has also believed that using giant lasers on beings and turning them into goo saves people. I don't trust him nearly as far as I can throw him.
If the story wants us to see un-Synthesis'd/un-Control'd synthetics as our inevitable doom, it's doing a ****** poor job at it. So I don't believe it does.Auintus wrote...
Because he never saw it that way. The Reapers were made as a solution to the synthetic-organic conflict, but when you look at it from an individual perspective, they aren't saving anyone. They are killing millions for what seems to be nothing but pure malice. That is what the Catalyst is there for: To help Shepard understand the motivations behind the Reapers.
The synthetic-organic confict had arisen so many times previously that the Catalyst takes it as a foregone conclusion. "It's gonna happen soon enough, so we might as well get started before one of them gets wiped out."
I don't see the Reapers doing much to teach us about the civilizations they wiped out. Those "benevolent" creatures are too busy tormenting and killing everyone. Somehow their leader still gets you to take a leap of faith, and suddenly they're our friends and teachers and everyone lives happily ever after? It's absurd.He never said it saved the person. The the gooifying bit lets the Reapers remember the civilization, the culture. The people are dead, undeniably, but the culture lives on in the form of a Reaper.
Cyberfrog81 wrote...
If the story wants us to see un-Synthesis'd/un-Control'd synthetics as our inevitable doom, it's doing a ****** poor job at it. So I don't believe it does.Auintus wrote...
Because he never saw it that way. The Reapers were made as a solution to the synthetic-organic conflict, but when you look at it from an individual perspective, they aren't saving anyone. They are killing millions for what seems to be nothing but pure malice. That is what the Catalyst is there for: To help Shepard understand the motivations behind the Reapers.
The synthetic-organic confict had arisen so many times previously that the Catalyst takes it as a foregone conclusion. "It's gonna happen soon enough, so we might as well get started before one of them gets wiped out."
The Intelligence wants to impose order on the galaxy. That means controlling natural evolution (biological as well as cultural), which it sees as dangerously chaotic. Yet Synthesis fans act like there can't possibly be a downside to the Intelligence's favourite solution.I don't see the Reapers doing much to teach us about the civilizations they wiped out. Those "benevolent" creatures are too busy tormenting and killing everyone. Somehow their leader still gets you to take a leap of faith, and suddenly they're our friends and teachers and everyone lives happily ever after? It's absurd.He never said it saved the person. The the gooifying bit lets the Reapers remember the civilization, the culture. The people are dead, undeniably, but the culture lives on in the form of a Reaper.
Cyberfrog81 wrote...
If the story wants us to see un-Synthesis'd/un-Control'd synthetics as our inevitable doom, it's doing a ****** poor job at it. So I don't believe it does.
The Intelligence wants to impose order on the galaxy. That means controlling natural evolution (biological as well as cultural), which it sees as dangerously chaotic. Yet Synthesis fans act like there can't possibly be a downside to the Intelligence's favourite solution.
I don't see the Reapers doing much to teach us about the civilizations they wiped out. Those "benevolent" creatures are too busy tormenting and killing everyone. Somehow their leader still gets you to take a leap of faith, and suddenly they're our friends and teachers and everyone lives happily ever after? It's absurd.
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