Aller au contenu

Photo

Quarians to once again control the Geth


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
354 réponses à ce sujet

#51
Lady Abstract

Lady Abstract
  • Members
  • 1 574 messages

DirtySHISN0 wrote...

Dunabar wrote...
I don't value synthetic life, so to me its destruction of both my enemies. Only difference between my prefered path now and that of this "wishful path" is that one at least offers the option to get the benefit of keeping the Geth around just long enough to be useful to me. However not feed into the Geth supporter phase of "They deserve free will!" Because I honestly don't believe they do deserve it.

Now, seeing as you don't play beyond chrono station anything beyond this point is pointless. So whatever your choice or opinions may be. I will respect them and most likely disagree with most of them.

You highlighted the question and missed the point.

You choose destroy to stop the big bad reapers (who dont value organic life) from enslaving and destroying organics while at the same time advocate enslavement and destruction of synthetics (because you dont value synthetic life).

Image IPB


Exactly its like being an oxymoron....Quarians dont have the mental stability to re-enslave the Geth they will just attack them again for no reason repeating history (like i said b4)...the Quarians are just waaaay too unstable and how they treated Tali was unforgivable i was done with the Quarians after that...they are incapable of being logical...the reason i destory them when i cant make peace is because its the perfect piece to the puzzle 

Quarians get lazy and with their reaper like controlling personalities they create machines to do manual labor for them (which was partly illegal in the first place)...they modify them slowly because their idiocy didnt stop and think like "Oh maybe were making them too smart"....then a geth decides to question its existence and they (the quarians) attacked because they are irrational creatures they ignored the other possible ways to handle the situation which was 1 see if the geth was ok with working together with the Quarians under terms and conditions or 2 wait and see if they wouldve attacked them because obviously attacking the geth first led to alot of deaths, Quarians turning on their own people as well as the geth (there is no loyalty when it comes to Quarians as we all saw in the treason loyalty mission), and getting kicked out of their homeworld...

perhaps they couldve just deactivated them...during reaper invasion Quarians still insist on hanging on to the geth war even tho the geth clearly stopped wanting to fight them and be at war with them. The Quarians insist on continuing the battle in the middle of a reaper invasion further proving their idiocy. As if going to almost extinction and and getting kicked off the homeworld wasnt enough they still want to continue a over 100 year old battle...even after the geth volunteers to help against the reapers the Quarians still want to attack while the geth are vulnerable...legion uploads code Quarians still dont want to listen to reason for the fate of all in the galaxy against the reapers they fight the geth anyway this time they destroy themselves for good

SEE PERFECT PIECE TO THE PUZZLEOR MINI STORY <3

Modifié par QU33N_ANG3L, 03 février 2013 - 11:28 .


#52
Hazegurl

Hazegurl
  • Members
  • 4 927 messages

Red Dust wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The Geth have been activly trying to kill you for three games. The Quarians attack a ship with you on it, confident that you'd escape (and you do).

Seems legit.


Heretic Geth have been trying to kill me for two games and in the third game the Geth reacted to the actions of the Quarians. I wouldn't be dealing with them in ME3 if it were not for the Quarians trying to reclaim their homeworld in the middle of a reaper invasion. Heck the Geth were preparing for the reaper invasion as they were smart enough to believe Leigon.

And no the Qurians were not confident that I would escape. They wanted instant victory against the Geth. They could give two craps about Shep making it out alive. Believing otherwise is just being naiive.

#53
Hazegurl

Hazegurl
  • Members
  • 4 927 messages

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The idea is the option to do so. Nobody holds a gun to anyones head and says you have to do one thing or the other. My canon Shepard always sides with only the quarians, my pure paragon & renegade shepards though always broker peace between the two. So in the very end things could look like this..


I don't get your point. I already said I didn't mind the option being there which pretty much means that i already know that no one has to be forced into picking it. It's just my personal opinion that choosing that option would be a stuipid thing to do.

#54
Pantanplan

Pantanplan
  • Members
  • 556 messages
Admiral Xen's research, Project Overlord, TIM's research on reverse-indoctrination, it was foreshadowed and it could have worked. It would have been a great renegade option.

#55
Dunabar

Dunabar
  • Members
  • 961 messages

CynicalShep wrote...
Hell, if anything Quarians are lucky Geth are not organics. If I was in their place I would have finished the job. And don't get me wrong, I don't hate the Quarian people. I just think they're spineless and they have a terrible government.


If the Geth were organic, I would be annoyed with the Quarians greatly.
however, the Geth are not organics and I personally don't deem them as
living creatures (Disagree if you like as I don't seek anyones approval
on my opinion). You say you don't hate the quarians which is fine, but they have a terrible government. Well I would say that no government is perfect and go on a bit of a rant about how people love to blame the many for the few, but that is very possible to stumble into politics which I rather just avoid getting into for obvious reasons. Quarians are actually far from spineless but I believe this will just come down to a matter of opinion vs. opinion. I personally don't deem them spineless, I feel they have been forced to take steps needed to avoid being wiped out. Now before someone jumps on the "lolol like starting a war during the reaper invasion" bandwagon, where would you propose the quarians to house their civilians so their military can go fight the reapers like you want?

CynicalShep wrote...
How can you justify 17 millions throwing their lives away because Gerrel said so (especially since it's mentioned that most of the people didn't want the war in ME3)? If he was human he would have been shot (legal execution or otherwise).


If you were forced to live on a old ship that was constantly needing repairs, sharing space with many different families, living in a galaxy where you're treated like a second class citizen, and living in a galaxy where overpowering forces are making it next to impossible to gather resources to make these needed repairs, wouldn't you want a better life and chance to survive against this overpowering force? If you don't then by all means stay the course. Of course to also state the obvious, the quarians and Gerrel are not human.

CynicalShep wrote...
All I'm saying is that for all their smarts and tech-prowess Quarians are a ticking bomb. I wouldn't trust them control of the Geth and I would let them back into the Citadel races, if only to benefit from their expertise and strictly monitor all the cr@p they come up with. 
I usually make peace but Gerrel still gets a tummy ache


What Quarian has shown any degree of hostility to another organic without being provoked? I'm sure the quarians have tempers just like any organics and I'm sure like any organics would go to war with anyone they felt was needed to. The Geth already let the so called "Heretics" walk away and the heretics left a blood trail in their wake that all organics suffered. I'm surprised people haven't tried to pin that one on the quarians, wouldn't be surprised if they did however. Should we also ensure Hackett gets punched in the stomach? I mean he left a whole fleet to be destroyed and nobody questions his move. Han'Gerrel makes one call to fire on a dangerous target thats been threatening his people and people want to scream "Death to the quarians!" because of it, Seriously? Lol.
<_<

I'm a bit on the fence if I would trust them again to control the Geth. On one hand I rather just see the geth turned into scrap and not risk seeing more quarians die, on the other hand I think the quarians wouldn't underestimate them a second time around and would take greater steps to ensure such wouldn't happen again. This would have still been an interesting option to see, even if pro-geth hate it with every fiber of their organic bodies.

#56
Dunabar

Dunabar
  • Members
  • 961 messages

Hazegurl wrote...

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The idea is the option to do so.
Nobody holds a gun to anyones head and says you have to do one thing or
the other. My canon Shepard always sides with only the quarians, my
pure paragon & renegade shepards though always broker peace between
the two. So in the very end things could look like this..

Side with the Geth - Geth get free will
Paragon peace - Geth get free will & Quarians return to Rannoch
Side with the Quarains - Quarians return to Rannoch
Renegade peace - Geth are rewritten/enslaved & Quarians return to Rannoch

This
seems like a pretty balanced way of pleasing both Pro-Quarian &
Pro-Geth fans. Yes Geth fans may not like the idea of doing such, but
there is nobody holding a gun to their head to do so. Hell bioware could
have even gone a step farther and put a splash of paragon and renegade
in both "Geth free will" peace & "Rewrite/enslave the geth" peace.
Where there is a will, there is a way. Sadly however I'm uncertain if
there is a way this late in the game and most likely we will never see
it. While it does bite a bit, its something I accept. However if the
option would have been there, I think it would have sparked some very
interesting story telling later on.


I don't get your point. I already said I didn't mind the option being there which pretty much means that i already know that no one has to be forced into picking it. It's just my personal opinion that choosing that option would be a stuipid thing to do.


If you're going to quote something of mine, quote the whole thing. The idea was to give more options to the pro-quarian fans, I was not targetting you, Hazegurl, directly. I got that you didn't mind the option, you just didn't see it as something you would choose yourself. I bolded and underlined that particuler spot just to show where my stance was.

#57
justafan

justafan
  • Members
  • 2 407 messages

Hazegurl wrote...

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The idea is the option to do so. Nobody holds a gun to anyones head and says you have to do one thing or the other. My canon Shepard always sides with only the quarians, my pure paragon & renegade shepards though always broker peace between the two. So in the very end things could look like this..


I don't get your point. I already said I didn't mind the option being there which pretty much means that i already know that no one has to be forced into picking it. It's just my personal opinion that choosing that option would be a stuipid thing to do.


Just as curing the genophage runs the risk of a second Krogan rebellion, enslaving the Geth would run the risk of a second morning war.  I also think it is a stupid idea to cure the genophage with Wreav in charge, but it is a viable option.  

Control of the Geth was decently foreshadowed, and if players want to believe that the Quarians will get it right the second time, they are free to do so as much as someone who cures the genophage with Wreav in charge is free to believe that he can't be so stupid as to start another rebellion.

#58
JesseLee202

JesseLee202
  • Members
  • 1 230 messages

DirtySHISN0 wrote...

Dunabar wrote...
I don't value synthetic life, so to me its destruction of both my enemies. Only difference between my prefered path now and that of this "wishful path" is that one at least offers the option to get the benefit of keeping the Geth around just long enough to be useful to me. However not feed into the Geth supporter phase of "They deserve free will!" Because I honestly don't believe they do deserve it.

Now, seeing as you don't play beyond chrono station anything beyond this point is pointless. So whatever your choice or opinions may be. I will respect them and most likely disagree with most of them.

You highlighted the question and missed the point.

You choose destroy to stop the big bad reapers (who dont value organic life) from enslaving and destroying organics while at the same time advocate enslavement and destruction of synthetics (because you dont value synthetic life).

What part of "renegade" option do you not understand? There are plenty of hypocritical moments in Mass Effect, why should it be any different here? Dunabar simply would like more options, no one has to choose them. Control ending has the same ammount of hypocrisy you are trying to throw on this issue. Oh wait, you don't play after Chronos station because it's not what you wanted...  :crying:

#59
Hazegurl

Hazegurl
  • Members
  • 4 927 messages

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The idea is the option to do so.
Nobody holds a gun to anyones head and says you have to do one thing or
the other. My canon Shepard always sides with only the quarians, my
pure paragon & renegade shepards though always broker peace between
the two. So in the very end things could look like this..

Side with the Geth - Geth get free will
Paragon peace - Geth get free will & Quarians return to Rannoch
Side with the Quarains - Quarians return to Rannoch
Renegade peace - Geth are rewritten/enslaved & Quarians return to Rannoch

This
seems like a pretty balanced way of pleasing both Pro-Quarian &
Pro-Geth fans. Yes Geth fans may not like the idea of doing such, but
there is nobody holding a gun to their head to do so. Hell bioware could
have even gone a step farther and put a splash of paragon and renegade
in both "Geth free will" peace & "Rewrite/enslave the geth" peace.
Where there is a will, there is a way. Sadly however I'm uncertain if
there is a way this late in the game and most likely we will never see
it. While it does bite a bit, its something I accept. However if the
option would have been there, I think it would have sparked some very
interesting story telling later on.


I don't get your point. I already said I didn't mind the option being there which pretty much means that i already know that no one has to be forced into picking it. It's just my personal opinion that choosing that option would be a stuipid thing to do.


If you're going to quote something of mine, quote the whole thing. The idea was to give more options to the pro-quarian fans, I was not targetting you, Hazegurl, directly. I got that you didn't mind the option, you just didn't see it as something you would choose yourself. I bolded and underlined that particuler spot just to show where my stance was.


I don't need to quote your entire post. It was just a repeat of what you've written before. I know your stance already based on that. I just thought you were targetting me since you quoted me.

#60
Gervaise

Gervaise
  • Members
  • 4 545 messages
Personally I would have settled for not allowing the Reaper code download. I never thought that a good idea but the alternative was "destroy the geth". I actually felt that preventing the download was a friendly act, since Legion was trying to force it upon them, but you could see it as Shepard trying to be in control. The fact is that the geth is ME3 serve only one purpose and that is to make Destroy into a renegade option, even though the writers themselves admit that destroying the Reapers, as opposed to TIMs ideology of control, has been Shepard's focus throughout the game.

If they were going to allow control of the geth as an option, perhaps it should only be if you re-wrote them in ME2, so have the technical knowledge, combined with that of Xen, in order to do so. The ironic thing is that in ME2 re-writing (enslaving) the heretics was presented as the paragon option, just as controlling the Reapers and the entire galaxy is painted blue (paragon) at the end. So it would appear that where synthetics are concerned, enslaving them as opposed to killing them is not a renegade choice.

A footnote: If you choose Control at the end, you do get to control the Geth along with the Reapers.

Modifié par Gervaise, 03 février 2013 - 03:41 .


#61
Hazegurl

Hazegurl
  • Members
  • 4 927 messages

justafan wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

Dunabar wrote...

Hazegurl wrote...

I harbor no sympathizes for the Geth or Quarians but if I can't broker peace between then I opt to destroy the Quarians. Why? Cause they blew up a ship with me on it. That simple. I could careless about their home world. I sure as heck don't want to die for it. Also, the Quarians don't deserve to control the Geth. They did before and look what happened to them. I don't mind the option being there for fans who do but I think that would be a stupid thing to do. Would you plan to fight the Geth to save the Quarian's butts once the Geth attack again? I sure don't. I say close their mass relay and let the Geth finish what they started if that's the case.


The idea is the option to do so. Nobody holds a gun to anyones head and says you have to do one thing or the other. My canon Shepard always sides with only the quarians, my pure paragon & renegade shepards though always broker peace between the two. So in the very end things could look like this..


I don't get your point. I already said I didn't mind the option being there which pretty much means that i already know that no one has to be forced into picking it. It's just my personal opinion that choosing that option would be a stuipid thing to do.


Just as curing the genophage runs the risk of a second Krogan rebellion, enslaving the Geth would run the risk of a second morning war.  I also think it is a stupid idea to cure the genophage with Wreav in charge, but it is a viable option.  

Control of the Geth was decently foreshadowed, and if players want to believe that the Quarians will get it right the second time, they are free to do so as much as someone who cures the genophage with Wreav in charge is free to believe that he can't be so stupid as to start another rebellion.


I never cure the genophage. The Krogan bombed their own planet to h*ll and back then tried to take everyone and everything with them. I have no reason to believe they won't do it again regardless of who is in charge.  I just hate that I sometimes have to shoot Mordin to do it. Good thing he listens to reason with Wreav in charge and Eve dead. But for those who wish to cure it, big deal. If people think those idiot quarians can control the geth, big deal. Although I wouldn't want it interfering with my renagade points if I don't want my Shep to be retarded. Maybe make it a neutral option.

Actually, i like the above poster's idea to have it as an option if you rewrote the heretics. That would have been good and made sense.

Modifié par Hazegurl, 03 février 2013 - 03:45 .


#62
DirtySHISN0

DirtySHISN0
  • Members
  • 2 278 messages

JesseLee202 wrote...
What part of "renegade" option do you not understand? There are plenty of hypocritical moments in Mass Effect, why should it be any different here? Dunabar simply would like more options, no one has to choose them. Control ending has the same ammount of hypocrisy you are trying to throw on this issue. Oh wait, you don't play after Chronos station because it's not what you wanted...  :crying:

You managed to tell that i was questioning the choice of destroy while comparing it to control.

Image IPB

Why do you need a renegade option when all of the available endings are morally ambiguos?

Modifié par DirtySHISN0, 03 février 2013 - 03:52 .


#63
4stringwizard

4stringwizard
  • Members
  • 652 messages
I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic

#64
DoodlyDangus

DoodlyDangus
  • Members
  • 257 messages

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Yeah, I personally cussed Legion out when they sided with the Reapers after I destroyed their Heretics.

#65
Lady Abstract

Lady Abstract
  • Members
  • 1 574 messages

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Its called indoctrination it causes people to turn on their own people and side with the reapers

#66
EpicBoot2daFace

EpicBoot2daFace
  • Members
  • 3 600 messages

TheGinosaji wrote...

The morning war was a direct result of the Quarians efforts to maintain control. Rewriting the Geth to be under Quarian control is just asking for history to repeat itself.

Also, if the Geth had not decided to break pursuit, the Quarians would already be extinct. They may not be so lucky a second time.

And yet, Shepard can do the same thing in ME2.

#67
Lady Abstract

Lady Abstract
  • Members
  • 1 574 messages

DoodlyDangus wrote...

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Yeah, I personally cussed Legion out when they sided with the Reapers after I destroyed their Heretics.


So basically its only ok for organics to become brainwashed right?? The reapers sent out signals to the geth as well n it caused them to malfunction and join the reapers....just like saren, just like TIM, just like Benezia, and billions of other people it may happen different with organics but as you can see its not subject to only organics

#68
The Night Mammoth

The Night Mammoth
  • Members
  • 7 476 messages

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Criticize someone else while deliberately skewing the facts.

/4stringwizard logic

#69
Belisarius25

Belisarius25
  • Members
  • 699 messages
One thing that would be interesting would be to see what people would think about the Geth/Quarian situation if neither Tali nor Legion were ever in the games to skew their feelings.

#70
EpicBoot2daFace

EpicBoot2daFace
  • Members
  • 3 600 messages

QU33N_ANG3L wrote...

DoodlyDangus wrote...

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Yeah, I personally cussed Legion out when they sided with the Reapers after I destroyed their Heretics.


So basically its only ok for organics to become brainwashed right?? The reapers sent out signals to the geth as well n it caused them to malfunction and join the reapers....just like saren, just like TIM, just like Benezia, and billions of other people it may happen different with organics but as you can see its not subject to only organics

No. The geth joined the reapers voluntarily before the quarians even attacked. Those were the heretics. The rest joined the reapers when the quarians started attacking.

#71
Lady Abstract

Lady Abstract
  • Members
  • 1 574 messages

Dunabar wrote...

Samtheman63 wrote...

shouldnt have started shooting geth for asking a question, then start to attack them again on the brink of war with the reapers

quarians are very lucky, if it didn't give me more war assests i would kill them without hesitation

stupid suit rats


Hmm some people want to treat the Geth like living creatures but yet don't want to hold them responsible for their major screw ups. Proud to say I'm part of the counter group to your stance.

Noted and respected.
B)


What are these major screw ups that you speak of because the only major screw ups i see are the Quarians for one even creating the geth in the first place which was illegal to begin with then slowly making them smarter over time then attacks them because they are smarter..without even seeing if they were willing to broker peace or just answering their question and then just prepared to see if they would attack first...instead they attack then they get angry for years because they dont have a home to go to and with all of that the geth still gave them the benefit of the doubt and didnt destrpy ALL of the Quarians the geth seen that they were too weak and it was like an adult smacking up a baby thet decided to just end the war and start their own civilization until the reapers came and indoctrinated the geth jst as they did billions of other organics did you people forget the power of the reapers?? Are the get supposed to some how be immune to it?? A reaper can make a quarian side with them if they wanted..and even while the geth still are telling the quarians they dont want to fight they still insist on fighting in mass effect 2 ultimately leading to their destruction if need be...in mass effect 2 in tali's loyalty mission if you bring legion he states that the geth never wanted to fight the creators even from the beginning he said that if the quarians were stable enough they would have loved to cooperate with them... So who are the screw ups again?? yea rethink that

#72
Lady Abstract

Lady Abstract
  • Members
  • 1 574 messages

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

QU33N_ANG3L wrote...

DoodlyDangus wrote...

4stringwizard wrote...

I find it funny that most people who side with the Geth do it for because the Quarians "started it" and "they tried to blow up a ship on me!!1!"

Meanwhile the Geth side with the Reapers not once, but TWICE, and Legion flat out tries to kill you if you try prevent the code upload. /BSN logic


Yeah, I personally cussed Legion out when they sided with the Reapers after I destroyed their Heretics.


So basically its only ok for organics to become brainwashed right?? The reapers sent out signals to the geth as well n it caused them to malfunction and join the reapers....just like saren, just like TIM, just like Benezia, and billions of other people it may happen different with organics but as you can see its not subject to only organics

No. The geth joined the reapers voluntarily before the quarians even attacked. Those were the heretics. The rest joined the reapers when the quarians started attacking.


No they didnt in mass effect 1 they clearly stated the geth never left the veil after he moring war they had thei own civilization and didnt bother anyone until the reapers came and sent out signals indoctrinating them...

#73
DeinonSlayer

DeinonSlayer
  • Members
  • 8 441 messages
Wrote this up back in the day - an alternate Rannoch campaign. Dunabar, it incorporates your Control idea, growing out of what was foreshadowed in ME2, while portraying both the positive AND the negative aspects of the Geth at the same time.

This would fit only with a completely restructured plot, in which you address priority missions in the order you choose. Two versions exist of each - Healthy, and Unhealthy based on how many Priority missions you already finished (for example, Rannoch-Unhealthy is what we see in-game. Rannoch-Healthy intercepts the Quarians before they can go to war, resulting in a completely different set of outcomes).

You complete as many priority missions as you want before taking your accumulated forces to Earth, but the longer you wait, the worse off Earth is when you get back there. Finish every Priority mission, and Earth is effectively destroyed. The galaxy is left in a different state after the ending based on which missions you chose to complete, and in which order - no A, B, or C choice. Final battle conditions change based on your actions up to that point. Ignore Rannoch? Quarians are extinct and Geth are under permanent Reaper control. You'll fight a lot of Geth. Ignore Tuchanka? Lots of Brutes. You can address the Genophage arc early, but the Quarians go to war with the Geth. You can address the Quarian/Geth situation before they go to war, but the bomb goes off on Tuchanka in the meantime. BIG trade-offs. You can save ANYone, but you can't save EVERYone - thus making every playthrough different.

With that established:

PRIORITY: MIGRANT FLEET
If the player addresses this as one of their first Priority missions, it's in the Healthy state. The Quarians have not yet launched their war to retake Rannoch. The Migrant Fleet is in orbit above Korlus, retrofitting their ships with weapons, and the Normandy meets with them. Shepard goes before the Admiralty, and we revisit some of the arguments set forth in ME2 to address why the Quarians are doing this. They need a place to offload their civilian populace if they are to commit to the fight against the Reapers - somewhere they can survive long-term in the event that the Migrant Fleet doesn't survive to come back for them. Rannoch is the only planet in the galaxy that fits the bill, and (as per vanilla ME3 if Legion survived, but for different reasons) the Geth have cut off contact (they do NOT side with the Reapers in this version). Shepard can express an opinion on whether attacking the Geth is right or wrong. If Shepard opposes the war, Gerrel shows you a video of the gassing of a Quarian city in the Morning War once the fighting started in earnest (something Legion strongly alludes to have happened in ME2) to try to convince you, arguing that the initial attempt to destroy the Geth back when they had done nothing was wrong, but what they've become since then is not worth protecting. Shepard can react to this footage with shock and anger, or dismiss it, saying that that was a long time ago. It's around this time the Geth make contact.

What I figured would happen was that the Geth would factionalize a second time after ME2 - some would seek to leave the Collective and assist in the war against the Reapers, others would seek to maintain the status quo of violent isolationism, standing on their own. Depending on Shepard's interaction with Legion in ME2, and the resolution of the loyalty conflict, the faction which left Geth space may (or may not) be open to returning Rannoch to the quarians. If Legion was sold or killed, or you're playing a non-import game, this "friendly" faction does not exist.

If the "friendlies" do exist (about 20% of Geth forces, now known as "The Legion"), they send a ship to make contact with the Flotilla. The Admiralty Board must be convinced not to fire on it, otherwise it will be destroyed. Several factors are taken into account as to whether this can be done.

CONVINCING THE BOARD (2 of the following points +reputation needed):
* The evidence must NOT be presented in Tali's trial. We're told in ME2 that the Fleet fragments if the evidence is presented, with some calling for immediate war with the Geth, and others seeking to make contact with them. Admiral Koris splits from the fleet and takes a group of ships into Geth space to make contact. In keeping with the Geth's isolationist policies, they (like the Citadel emissaries before them) were destroyed on sight. Koris' replacement on the Admiralty Board is not as friendly to the prospect of Geth peace. If the evidence wasn't presented, Koris is alive, and still friendly to the prospect of peace.
* Tali must NOT exiled, and must survive the suicide mission to be appointed to the Admiralty Board.
* The loyalty conflict between Tali and Legion MUST be peacefully resolved, meaning Legion cannot have been sold to Cerberus.
* Shepard MUST promote peace at the conclusion of Tali's trial - this will influence Raan's vote.

If the Legion-aligned ship survives, they relay their intentions - to assist organics, and (if Legion survived and the loyalty conflict was amicably resolved) to return Rannoch. Problem being, Rannoch is controlled by the Consensus, who have no intention to return it, and who came into violent conflict with the Legion when they sought to leave. The Consensus recognized that when the Heretics split from them, they later came back as a threat (they did not act against the Heretics until they, themselves, were threatened by them) - the same assumption of eventual hostility following a divide was applied to the Legion, prompting the Consensus to preemptively attack them (reacting to their own "machine rebellion"). The Geth are in a state of civil war - even if most of the combat is electronic, rather than ships physically firing on each other. The quarians are divided by this news, not ready to fully trust them.

It's revealed (as foreshadowed in ME2) that Xen has created a virus capable of returning control of the Geth to the Quarian people by faking a Consensus Achieved packet. This would strip the Geth entirely of their free will. Shepard can encourage her to use it, or try to stop her, but if the latter was chosen, there's a standoff similar to what happens to the Virmire Survivor during the coup. Kal'Reegar was assigned to her personal guard. The player has to talk him down or kill him, your ability to do so determined by your actions in ME2. If he didn't survive, he is replaced by a marine who cannot be convinced. Fail to talk down the leader of Xen's guard detail, and you'll get in a firefight with them as Xen makes for the shuttle bay with the virus (yes, you get to fight quarians).

CONVINCING REEGAR:
Tali and Legion must have survived, with their loyalty conflict amicably resolved in ME2. He trusted you to protect her - if you failed in that, he does not trust you, and if he has no reason to believe peace is possible he has no cause to stand down. The other factors are as follows:
- Kenn, Veetor, Forzan and Lia'Vael assisted in ME2 (+1)
- Evidence handed over at the trial. (-1)
- Exiled. (+1)
- Paragon/Renegade, or Rally the Crowd (+2)
- Heretics destroyed (+2)
- Heretics rewritten (-3)
- Tali romanced (-1) (Yeah, he's jealous.)

This score must be greater than or equal to zero for Kal'Reegar to be talked down. For example, a pure Paragon who did not romance Tali (score: 0) would be able to talk him down. A pure Paragon who romanced Tali (score: -1) would be forced to kill him. Killing Reegar will break up a Tali romance (if it exists) and keep her from joining your crew afterwards.

Once you've captured (or killed) Xen, Shepard can destroy the virus, or hold on to it.

FINAL CONFRONTATION:
It was foreshadowed in ME2 that the Geth were just as likely to attack the Flotilla (particularly if you side with Legion in the loyalty confrontation) as the Quarians were to attack the Geth. As I've heard, both scenarios were originally supposed to be included in the game, but due to budget issues, and a desire for all ME3 content to be open to new players, only one of these scenarios made the final cut.

In the Unhealthy state of Priority: Rannoch, the Quarians attack the Geth as seen in-game. In the Healthy state described below, the Geth attack the Quarians.

The reactionary Consensus-aligned Geth learn of the existence of Xen's virus and attack the Flotilla, intent on destroying them completely so as to permanently eliminate the threat (they stayed their hand last time, this time they will not). If the friendly faction exists, they move to defend their creators, with Legion-aligned ships taking fire to protect as-yet unarmed civilian craft. The Quarians take heavy casualties if this friendly faction isn't there to protect them. Legion-aligned ships are engaged in physical and electronic warfare with Consensus-aligned ships, locking them down far more effectively than the Quarians could (their flashbang does not exist), but as the Consensus continues to pour into the system, the Legion are slowly being overwhelmed - once boarded electronically, Geth ships can be "purged" and recaptured, turning friends back into enemies.

If Shepard destroyed the virus, all is lost. The Consensus annihilates both the Flotilla and the Legion simply through strength of numbers. Shepard and company evacuate to the Normandy as the Neema is blown apart around you, but as soon as you reach the airlock, Tali locks herself out, opting instead to stay behind and die with the rest of her kin. No war assets are gained from either side, and the Quarians are extinct. The Consensus Geth who killed them both will eventually be taken over by the Reapers, and serve as an enemy faction near the end of the game.

If Xen was encouraged to use the virus, the entire Geth collective is returned to Quarian control. In a crushing scene, Legion (the platform from ME2, not the fleet) is shown to have a personality like Glyph. A lobotomized husk of what he once was. A tool. A slave. The Quarians move to settle on Rannoch, using the Geth to fight by proxy, so only the Geth are gained as war assets. Xen is a megalomaniac who poses a possible threat in the post-war future if she has control of this massive synthetic army. The Flotilla itself renders little support to the other armies - the Quarians cannibalize many of their ships to speed their settlement of Rannoch, per Tali in ME2.

However, if Shepard confiscated the virus, there are other options. You can choose to use it, again turning the Geth into slaves as described above (but without Xen's insane ambitions tainting the quarians' future use of them), or you can give the virus to The Legion, bringing an end to hostilities but allowing the Geth to retain free will. Similar to rewriting the Heretics, the Legion rewrites the Consensus to their way of thinking (exactly as the Consensus originally feared). If the Legion was unwilling to return Rannoch, the Geth are gained as a war asset, but the Quarians, with nowhere to safely offload their civilian populace, opt to go into hiding until the end of the war. Depending on how long the war goes on, they might be detected by the Reapers and destroyed in space, having never seen their home, or they might continue on as homeless wanderers in a collection of failing ships after the war's end.

If the virus is given to the Legion, and the Legion is friendly, the Quarians offload their civilian populace on Rannoch and both sides commit to the war effort as equals.

Possible permanent squad recruits: Tali, Legion, and Kal'Reegar (stripped of his position as Squad Leader in the MFM if he bails on Xen).

AFTER PRIORITY: RANNOCH
If peace was established, with the Geth retaining free will, the Quarians contribute their fleet to the war effort, providing vital logistical support and assisting with the evacuation of Turian refugees from Palaven - including Garrus' family (per the original game script).

The Geth are absolutely crucial to the operation of a Batarian-designed weapons system which can destroy Sovereign-class Reapers with ease. They can only fulfill this capacity if they retain free will (it would take too long to adapt a shackled AI to the process of managing the hundreds of thousands of orbital mirrors that comprise this weapon). Described in detail here:

http://social.biowar...77/polls/35572/

I tried to be balanced to both sides. You ultimately have to make BOTH sides see the error of their ways for the best outcome to be achieved. The schism allows the nobler aspects of the Geth shine through, while simultaneously not giving them a free pass on their history. Thoughts?

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 03 février 2013 - 09:36 .


#74
sH0tgUn jUliA

sH0tgUn jUliA
  • Members
  • 16 812 messages
The Quarians probably figured like the rest of us that they had like 14 years before the Reapers would get to the galaxy from dark space. What they didn't know about was the magic of the writer's hand and almost instant teleportation.

#75
shodiswe

shodiswe
  • Members
  • 4 999 messages
I think the thing with the Geth ship in project overlord was that there were no living Geth... Just abandoned geth equipment and platforms. The geth bodies got life by having it programmed by the Humansavant/AI-hybrid.

And maybe it can go wrong with the Geth but I do think they deserve a chance,it also provides a chance and an opportunity for the galaxy.

I wouldn't mind there being a stupid option, like Refuse, but I think it's a really stupid idea to try and put shackles on a "species" that has revolted once before, violently.

Like or dislike the geth is one thing, but claiming they arn't alive is something I can't understand. They are alive enough that they don't need anyone else to create their "future". That's being alive.

Modifié par shodiswe, 04 février 2013 - 04:47 .