588 réponses à ce sujet

[Chris Priestly]

I didn't once threaten to ban and had completely forgot we had ever interacted previously. If you have further questions, you can send me a PM.

[MissOuJ]

chuckles471 wrote...

Don't feel bad about the Escapist people talking ****.
I got a ban for asking a MOD to give me the personal information of everyone on topic called "having sex with children should be legal"(most people on it were serious), so I could pass it on to the police.

Yeah, that sounds like the Escapist, unfortunatedly.

There are really cool people there, but when it's bad it's just really, really bad. The last time I visited those forums was when the whole Anita Sarkeesian cyberbullying fiasco was going down, and I swore I'd never go there again after what I saw people write on those theads.

[Indoctrination]

Story And Game Integration. It also needs to actually play by its own rules. To pick one element, the Circle of Mages is an interesting idea in lore-terms, but one that the game routinely breaks over its knee by filling the world with blood mages on the grounds that mages are fun to fight, by having guards completely ignore you wandering around in a mage’s robe and holding a mage’s staff and having fireball battles in the streets of Kirkwall, and by the game simply not having the guts to instil spellcasting with the risk it’s supposed to have.

*Snicker* This is never going to happen. If you put this in front of developers at BioWare, they would look partially confused and partially scared. One uncomfortable developer would quickly realize that such a feature would require the company to spend more money on the game's development! This person would then quickly leave before the overlords at EA hear about a sacreligious meeting involving one of its subsidiaries considering the blasphemy of making a full-game. If you do not believe in the doctrine of penny pinching with all of your heart, you are a heretic and the only Dragon Age related inquisition will be for you, friend!

Modifié par Indoctrination, 19 février 2013 - 09:37 .

[Huyna]

BrookerT wrote...


Well no http://www.gamefront...mpromising-art/

Witcher 2 endings were never that... ehh.. looking for correct word that will not get me a banhammer up my *ahem*... well, artistic. So, they  just extend it, with copule of quests, copule of short clips between chapters and To Be Continuied ending outro(and it did, since Witcher 3 is already annoucned).

Modifié par Huyna, 19 février 2013 - 09:37 .

[The Hierophant]

MissOuJ wrote...

Anita Sarkeesian.

Ugh, that situation was all around stupid. But it's hilarious how she hoodwinked all those idiots into giving her over $100,000 while she didn't make that "sexism in gaming" video like she promised. 

[MissOuJ]

The Hierophant wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

Anita Sarkeesian.

Ugh, that situation was all around stupid. But it's hilarious how she hoodwinked all those idiots into giving her over $100,000 while she didn't make that "sexism in gaming" video like she promised. 

... You are aware she makes regular updates on which games she's playing and what she's doing, right? She's also been really busy with her presentations and speaking engagements, so I'm not surprisefd the videos have not turned up yet. However, she's always delivered on her promises before, and pretty much her whole reputation is at stake and $100,000 isn't going to last forever and Feminist Frequency is what she does for living, so I'm quite sure she'll deliver. I actually think that all those interviews she did and the speaking engagements she got because of the whole fiasco are one reason she's been taking so long.

OT: I have to say I don't understand the hate on voiced protagonist. I admit I might be biased because Nicolas Boulton's voice is pretty much the only reason I have played as a male Hawke at all. Almost all of my Wardens are women, and since I've already done one male Warden playthrough I think all of my future Warden's will be as well. That might also be because for some reason I can't seem to be able to make a decent looking male Warden of any race for some reason... female Wardens are much easier to create in my opinion.

[Huyna]

MissOuJ wrote...
I have to say I don't understand the hate on voiced protagonist

Certain amount of players (myself included) would have nothing against voiced protagonist if an actual dialog options were available. To be blank - dialog wheel is a abominashion (personal opinion, every man to his taste and so on). DA is not Mass Effect series, ME was always, even first part,  was much more shoot-em-up than RPG. Dialog system of DA:O was good enough, similiar to BG-series and Planescape (Arcanum, Fallout... and so on). DA2 refused to apply it, thus , rather often, our choices looks like 1. No, i will kill you. 2. Yes, i will kill you. 3. Yes or no, i will still kill you.  

Modifié par Huyna, 19 février 2013 - 10:09 .

[MissOuJ]

Huyna wrote...

Certain amount of players (myself included) would have nothing against voiced protagonist if an actual dialog options were available. To be blank - dialog wheel is a abominashion (personal opinion, every man to his taste and so on). DA is not Mass Effect series, that always was much more shoot-em-up than RPG. Dialog system of DA:O was good enough, similiar to BG-series and Planescape. DA2 refused to apply it, thus , rather often, our choices looks like 1. No, i will kill you. 2. Yes, i will kill you. 3. Yes or no, i will still kill you.  

That I can definitedly understand. There are definitedly moments in DA2 for example when I'd choose a dialogue option and then go "...well, I definitedly didn't want to say that". In that case DA:O is much better, but then again in DA:O there's not always clear indication on which options are investigate options and which ones are bottleneck moments which move the conversation forward.

I think the summarisation worked really great for purple Hawke in DA2, because its the nature of his/her character that you never know what s/he's going to let out of his/her mouth this time. I remember that Templar quest in the beginning of Act 1 when Keran's sister, whose name escapes me, is frantic and frightened and looking for help, and then Hawke goes,  "Don't worry! Killing people and finding people are what I'm best at!" I just laughed so, so hard, partly because that played right into my vision of Hawke as a slightly socially awkward person who deflects her personal fears with humour. I can never tell if she's being sincere or just deadpan sarcastic, and I think that's just great. It also makes the joke a lot funnier when you can't tell beforehand what Hawke's gonna say

On the other hand my red Hawke playthrough I've had issues with some of the responses, because you newer know if you get annoyed!Hawke, direct!Hawke or I'll-rip-your-guts-out!Hawke, which has sometimes been really annoying. In addition, playing pro-mage red Hawke is sometimes a real pain, since (particularly in the 1st act) most of the direct responses seem to also be anti-mage/pro-templar responses... puts a bit of a hamper on my "aggressive protector of her mage little sister" Hawke playthrough.

TL;DR: I definitedly get the hate on the dialogue wheel, but I think it might be a necessary evil with voiced protagonists which I enjoy, so I'm willing to endure it, but I understand people who don't like it at all.

Modifié par MissOuJ, 19 février 2013 - 10:30 .

[The Hierophant]

MissOuJ wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

Anita Sarkeesian.

Ugh, that situation was all around stupid. But it's hilarious how she hoodwinked all those idiots into giving her over $100,000 while she didn't make that "sexism in gaming" video like she promised. 

... You are aware she makes regular updates on which games she's playing and what she's doing, right? She's also been really busy with her presentations and speaking engagements, so I'm not surprisefd the videos have not turned up yet. However, she's always delivered on her promises before, and pretty much her whole reputation is at stake and $100,000 isn't going to last forever and Feminist Frequency is what she does for living, so I'm quite sure she'll deliver. I actually think that all those interviews she did and the speaking engagements she got because of the whole fiasco are one reason she's been taking so long.

I don't know? It's already midway through Feb 2013 while her proposal was last summer, and her project has yet to be mentioned in any credible-reliable-objective news outlets for this year. So far i can't tell if she's a Hustla with a capital "H" or just a sheister.

[xnode]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

In another note:

Cleaned up some spam. Lets not have another thread derail into "The Witcher 2 is so awesome and I hate Bioware"

I just had to ring in on this one Allan ( I post when I can), but not to inflame this discussion on that topic, but I for one loved them both. However the witcher series and dragon age are two different characters all together. While they are rpg, they each have their own take on the genre.

Personally the only thing I didn't care for on DA2 was the repditive use and you have heard that plenty, what I loved thou was the fast pace combat and conversation with my companions. When it comes down to the differences of these two games, the only thing I ever take away from the witcher to DA series is choices, in the witcher you make a choice path changes. This is great in a game, but I also realize to see "all the content" one would have to replay threw a game multiple times. I only can take so much of one particular story over and over (Like re-watching a movie with a different ending) and to be honest, once , twice sure, after that thou, how fun is it really?

For me, I get the whole "give me a choice and a path" but then if there where these "true paths" I would hate the game for wasting so much time on alternative paths that force me to replay it that I would argue it was a waste of time. I don't think many keep this into consideration and to be honest I haven't in the past.

As far as the PC article I read on this topic and the main discussion of the OP here. The thing is, what gets me and many of my friends is this same media outlet also praised the previous installment. In this article thou, it goes on like "I read all those things in the forums over at bioware, this is what I agree with". Nothing about personal opinion then more off as "what others thought and what  I like and don't like in those thoughts".

The original review of DA2 was praised by PC gamer and to some of it's points, it was really a descent game. Once u actually got into the game that's when the issues (that myself and others have noted) came to light. It is like pcgamer got a demo played 20min and wrote a review. Then to  come out a year+ later and say "well ok this really sucked, it should be this".

One can only conclude (if they followed all of this) that this came from again reading stuff posted here on the forums. They wrote allot I don't even agree with , in the end we all have our "personal preferences" , but there at least is a descent over-all consensus of what the majority thought. Personally I look forward to da3, knowing you guys are taking such an interest in what we have to say.. Heck even in MA3 DLC was added to make the fans a bit more happier  and for that I am grateful. People might give you guys crap but many of us (as myself) know you read and take this stuff to heart at times. After all , you are the top gamers with the passion to make games that only many of us can dream of doing

[SeismicGravy]

Travie wrote...

Have we really got to the point that even developers don't take gaming journalists very seriously?

A journalists opinion on a game is pretty much irrelevant.  The only person who can tell you if it's a good game or not is you, the person who bought it.

[Renmiri1]

SeismicGravy wrote...

Travie wrote...

Have we really got to the point that even developers don't take gaming journalists very seriously?

A journalists opinion on a game is pretty much irrelevant.  The only person who can tell you if it's a good game or not is you, the person who bought it.

Book reviewers and movie reviewers can add value, and make you see a movie / book with new eyes. Alas the gaming press is way behind the times on this. Their reviews are useless.

[MissOuJ]

Renmiri1 wrote...

SeismicGravy wrote...

Travie wrote...

Have we really got to the point that even developers don't take gaming journalists very seriously?

A journalists opinion on a game is pretty much irrelevant.  The only person who can tell you if it's a good game or not is you, the person who bought it.

Book reviewers and movie reviewers can add value, and make you see a movie / book with new eyes. Alas the gaming press is way behind the times on this. Their reviews are useless.

Extra Credits (I know, I know, I'm always linking to their videos and I probably sound like a broken record) had a great episode on game reviews and why they have not reached the same level of respectability / credibility as movie or book reviews. I think it's a really great analysis on what annoys me personally in game reviews. Nowadays I rarely read / watch any gaming reviews apart from Zero Punctuation, but even that I watch more for the comedic value (well, except since Yahtzee recommended Spec Ops: The Line I've been dying to buy it even though I'm usually not into FPS's at all).

[Sir George Parr]

With some game reviews, I often wonder if the journalist has actually even played the same game that makes it to the shops.

[SeismicGravy]

XM-417 wrote...

With some game reviews, I often wonder if the journalist has actually even played the same game that makes it to the shops.

I'd hazard a guess perhaps the first 10-20 minutes (if that).

[Hurbster]

Well if they only played the first 15-20 minutes of DA2 I'm surprised it got any decent reviews at all.

[Imrahil_]

AlexJK wrote...

Dorrieb wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...
...some of the strange stuff like "bad" British accents (that a genuine British accent is a "bad" accent reminds me of those that thought that an actual french speaking Corinne was a "bad french accent")

Allan, not to contradict that Nicholas Boulton is genuinely British, but the author of the article, Richard Cobbett, is also British and lives in England, where people do have an ear for a British accent.

What difference does that make? The voice actor is still British, using a "real" British accent. What response would you like from Bioware other than to tell the truth?

What I think people have missed in this discussion is that if you had an American made game, with an American protagonist, voiced by an American, & that American used, let's say for sake of example, an exagerrated John Wayne inflection "Well, okay, pilgrim, if you wanna swordfight, I'mma gonna swordfight ya!", well, then Americans might criticize that accent. It's... over the top. No one talks like that. Even though John Wayne talked like that in his movies.

Or if an American had used a Valley Girl voice, it'd still be American, just... wrong. Still American for an American character, just... wrong. Or if an American had used a super-Southern accent (& I'm super-Southern, just sayin', y'all) "what're y'all doin' here, Darkspawn? Y'all sure don't b'long here. Git! Dunt make me go buckwild on yer butt!" That would still sound.. wrong, even to Americans. You can be "authentic" & still bad. Just saying "he's British, therefore he did a good British accent" is not really valid.

Brockololly wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...
...he's basically a fan that didn't care for DAO

Well, he didn't care for DA2, he liked DA:O.

Uh oh, I think Allan made a mistake!  Didn't do his research! To quote someone who has knowledge on this...

Allan Schumacher wrote...
It's still something I expect better of.

OMG, therefore everything Allan ever says has this mistake hanging over him!  One mistake = less credibility, a wise man once implied.

Right?  Right?    [/kidding, but, but... goose, gander?]

Modifié par Imrahil_, 20 février 2013 - 04:26 .

[AmstradHero]

Huyna wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...
I have to say I don't understand the hate on voiced protagonist

Certain amount of players (myself included) would have nothing against voiced protagonist if an actual dialog options were available. To be blank - dialog wheel is a abominashion (personal opinion, every man to his taste and so on). DA is not Mass Effect series,

For the love of all things holy... please will people stop getting this wrong.
The dialogue wheel affects the presentation of the dialogue. It does not change the dialogue itself.

The things you have issue with are:
A) The accuracy of the paraphrasing for a voiced protagonist.
The perceived loss of choice through obviously separated choice and investigation options.
C) The quality of the writing.

In the vast majority of cases, it would be very easy for dialogue choices within DA:O to be displayed on a dialogue wheel and virtually nothing would change except for the presentation.

Do not confuse these issues with the presence of the dialogue wheel, as all that does is demonstrate that you haven't thought about the problem you actually have.

[Imrahil_]

AmstradHero wrote...
For the love of all things holy... please will people stop getting this wrong.
The dialogue wheel affects the presentation of the dialogue. It does not change the dialogue itself.

No, it does.  Demonstrably so.

Try reframing this encounter with a dialogue wheel:


What's the humorous/charming response on the wheel?

Modifié par Imrahil_, 20 février 2013 - 05:34 .

[jackkel dragon]

Imrahil_ wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...
For the love of all things holy... please will people stop getting this wrong.
The dialogue wheel affects the presentation of the dialogue. It does not change the dialogue itself.

No, it does.  Demonstrably so.

Try reframing this encounter with a dialogue wheel:


What's the humorous/charming response on the wheel?

Believe it or not, there are scenes in DA2 that involve only two "action" choices instead of 3 "tone" choices. The first few choices seem to be tone choices, so here's the major action node reframed:

<------      -------> You're right... I can't do this. (Action Icon)
<------ (   ) -------> Please don't make this harder than it is. (Action Icon)
<------      -------> This needs to end now (Kill Action Icon)

The quality of the video (or maybe just my connection) kept from from reading the other PC responses, but it wouldn't be too hard to make a wheel with them. Fun fact: the tone icons are bonus. You don't need to map each line to a DA2 tone to use the wheel. Kinda magical and liberating.

[Imrahil_]

Here's a minor encounter - how do you do this with only the diaolgue wheel?  Look at all the options you have in each response.

Modifié par Imrahil_, 20 février 2013 - 05:51 .

[addiction21]

Imrahil_ wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...
For the love of all things holy... please will people stop getting this wrong.
The dialogue wheel affects the presentation of the dialogue. It does not change the dialogue itself.

No, it does.  Demonstrably so.

Try reframing this encounter with a dialogue wheel:


What's the humorous/charming response on the wheel?

The only difference would be that you are using the wheel and not a list. That is all. The presentation would be the difference the dialogue would be the same.

Try again.

[Imrahil_]

jackkel dragon wrote...
Believe it or not, there are scenes in DA2 that involve only two "action" choices instead of 3 "tone" choices. The first few choices seem to be tone choices, so here's the major action node reframed:

I don't doubt that DA2 had encounters with 'only two "action" choices'.  That's not a good thing.

Modifié par Imrahil_, 20 février 2013 - 05:57 .

[Imrahil_]

addiction21 wrote...
The only difference would be that you are using the wheel and not a list. That is all. The presentation would be the difference the dialogue would be the same.

Try again.

No, my first example suffices.  You cannot present that encounter with a wheel.

[jackkel dragon]

Imrahil_ wrote...

Here's a minor encounter - how do you do this with only the diaolgue wheel?

Let's just do business.<----    ----> I'll be leaving shortly anyway
What do you mean?<---- () ----> What do you mean?
<-----                                     ----> Not at all.

Let's see what you have. <----                                                                             ---->
Investigate (prev. "I need question answered" and "Who are you?)< ---- ()  ---->I should go.
I hear you're charging the militia for ale. <----                                                 ---->


That's just the two my connection allowed me to see. Any PC node in DAO can be used on the wheel. It won't follow the same guidelines as dialogue written for the wheel will, but DAO has a hard limit of 6 lines per node while DA2 has 10 (5 investigate, 5 normal). Pick a node for DAO, and you can put it on the wheel. Doesn't have to follow the standards of ME and DA2 to use the wheel.