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I hope Merril will return - is it possible?


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#126
TEWR

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LobselVith8 wrote...

WarBaku wrote...

I hope not. She does not seem important to the mage and templar war. If she does appear it should deal with the mirror and Morrigan's ability to use it or something along those lines. Personally, I didn't enjoy her character, but if it makes sense for her to be there then okay.


You know, a lot of people focus on the Mage-Templar War, but (with a pro-mage run) I wonder how the People will react to hearing about a Dalish mage taking on the templars at the very seat of Chantry power over eastern Thedas. Given the hostile history between the Dalish and the templars (and the Chantry), I wonder if Merrill would be similar to how pro-mage apostate Hawke is viewed among the mages - a heroic symbol showing what they can do, as well as showing that their ancient adversary can be defeated.

Would the elves ignore Merrill playing a part in the defeat of a powerful Knight-Commander and her templars?

With rumors of unrest in the occupied Dales among the elven occupants (the news of which was used to initiate the first steps in a coup against Empress Celene by Grand Duke Gaspard), I wonder if the elves would make their own move in taking back their homeland, especially with the whole of Thedas dealing with a war between mages and templars (which would prevent an Exalted March from being successfully enacted). It would give us an opportunity to side with the elves, instead of the Empress or the Grand Duke.


Agreed. I happen to think they will play a part in it myself. The Dalish believe that when the human empires crumble -- which they kinda are now, what with the Chantry in shambles -- is when the opportune moment to teach the Elves what it means to be Elves will surface.

From the codex entry on the Dalish Elves. It doesn't say they'd strike, but it certainly isn't out of the realm of possibility.

#127
Knight of Dane

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DinoSteve wrote...

Subtle? Depth? I think you are confusing Merrill with a different character, and perhaps DA2 with a different game.

No, he just uses his head friend.

You should try it sometime. ^_^

#128
Gamercat

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I hope to God we don't see her again. She was so moronic. One does not live in a city for 10 years and become as lost as she was unless they are a complete idiot.

#129
TEWR

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hawkman96j wrote...

I hope to God we don't see her again. She was so moronic. One does not live in a city for 10 years and become as lost as she was unless they are a complete idiot.


For Kirkwall, getting lost is actually a normal occurrence. It apparently happens to Hawke at times and also happened to the author of the Enigma of Kirkwall entries for the years he resided in Kirkwall.

It really depends on the size of the city. In the modern era, we have cars and maps and even GPS. For Kirkwall, which is supposed to be lore-wise a gargantuan city-state, getting lost seems to be about par for the course.

#130
Gamercat

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The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

hawkman96j wrote...

I hope to God we don't see her again. She was so moronic. One does not live in a city for 10 years and become as lost as she was unless they are a complete idiot.


For Kirkwall, getting lost is actually a normal occurrence. It apparently happens to Hawke at times and also happened to the author of the Enigma of Kirkwall entries for the years he resided in Kirkwall.

It really depends on the size of the city. In the modern era, we have cars and maps and even GPS. For Kirkwall, which is supposed to be lore-wise a gargantuan city-state, getting lost seems to be about par for the course.


This is true, however when I say lost I mean it in every sense of the word. I mean after 10 years of hearing hawke and company's humour and mannerisms, after spending all this time with them, she can hardly carry on a conversation without getting confused. And also after seeing all of the damage that careless blood magic can do time and time again, she continues to use it without really grasping the damage it can do. And even after seeing the damage it can do (killing the keeper and her entire clan) it appears to me that she still won't give it up, or at least take a serious look at what she is doing with her life.

#131
Knight of Dane

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Her blood magic didn't kill the clan.

She's the only mage who's cautious with her blood magic and you claim she doesn't grasp it?

The very reason why she doesn't use such abuses as mind control is exactly because she perfectly understands the risks.

#132
TEWR

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hawkman96j wrote...

This is true, however when I say lost I mean it in every sense of the word. I mean after 10 years


Seven.

of hearing hawke and company's humour and mannerisms, after spending all this time with them, she can hardly carry on a conversation without getting confused.


Not true. At first, because she's inexperienced around human society, she is confused by their mannerisms. But I believe that during the later years -- Act 2 and Act 3 -- that she actually is very humorous herself, but it often goes unnoticed. Either because the companions still see her as her Act 1 self or, for the players, the voice might throw them off.

And she can carry on a conversation without getting confused. Look at how she responds to Anders' (near) murder of Ella.

And also after seeing all of the damage that careless blood magic can do time and time again, she continues to use it without really grasping the damage it can do.


She does grasp it. She remarks that summoning Demons into corpses is ghastly, and that's only the tip of the iceberg. When you bring her on Fenris' Act 2 quest, she similarly remarks that using anyone as a go-to gas station for magical fuel is also ghastly.

She knows how it can be abused. She knows the dangers associated with it. She finds all the methods of abuse to be abhorrent and abstains from using them over the course of the entire time we know her. 

And though the Chantry likes to preach blood magic leads to more cases of abominations, there's no actual evidence of this. Not a direct case, at any rate. Blood Magic is tied to the physical realm and not the Fade. The best argument one could make -- and it's my belief as well -- is that blood magic leads to Mages becoming overconfident and arrogant and thus are more prone to letting their guard down, which leads to possession.

But that's not the same thing. That's an indirect correlation which blood magic is not necessary for. And Merrill is not overly prideful by Act 3. Arguably, one could say she is in Act 2. But in the Fade quest for Feynriel, she and all the other companions were mind-controlled by the Demons -- a power Desire Demons and Pride Demons share, but are hesitant to use because they deem it "crude".

They'll only use it as a last resort when their manipulations fail them. And even so, that requires them to be in the Fade and not sundered from it while also being trapped in a Demonic Buddha statue. The Fade is the source of that power. Removing them from the Fade and sundering them from it -- and trapping them -- renders their power as being incredibly weak, wherein they can only employ subtle manipulations, illusions, and other minor things that don't pose an immediate threat.

And even after seeing the damage it can do (killing the keeper and her entire clan) it appears to me that she still won't give it up, or at least take a serious look at what she is doing with her life.


Merrill did not kill Marethari. Marethari condemned herself by choosing to become an Abomination. Saying that Merrill is responsible is flawed logic, because it attempts to nullify all responsibility people bear for their own actions. Furthermore, employing such logic also means that you could just blame it on the Warden for discovering the thing in the first place.

It's flawed logic. Marethari chose to become an Abomination because of what she speculated the Eluvian would do, when in the past she's said she never wanted to research them in the first place -- more then likely she came to that conclusion by Audacity's manipulations.

The clan similarly chooses to attack Hawke and company if Hawke tells them the truth, because by Act 3 they are not trying to think rationally. They just want a scapegoat for all the troubles they've suffered and think that Merrill's the perfect one, due in large part to the slanderous lies Marethari spread about Merrill which furthered the rift between Clan and Ex-First.

They think she's to blame for their troubles. She's not. Marethari kept them on that mountain for years, when logic dictates that she should've moved on as staying in one place just invites trouble for the Dalish from neighboring settlements.

Merrill is blameless.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 10 février 2013 - 05:41 .


#133
Reidbynature

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Merrill could be incredibly naive and annoying, but at the same time I liked her personality (and her voice actress). I kinda want to see her again, if only to provide her with some better character/story progression than what she received in DA2. I was never satisfied with how DA2 left things.

Though saying that I do not want to see her as a companion again. I don't think I could take that much of her. lol


The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Merrill is blameless.

Ha! :o

Modifié par Reidbynature, 10 février 2013 - 05:46 .


#134
Face of Evil

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Honestly, I'm of the mind that she shouldn't. Those players who killed her (boo!) don't have to see her again, and I get to pretend that she and Hawke got married and ran off to Orlais. Win-win all around.

#135
dragonflight288

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The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Merrill is blameless.

Ha! Posted Image


At lot more blameless than every other Dalish in the clan, as she fought only in self-defense. Merrill never once initiated an assault. And Merethari is the one who forced the situation beyond the point of no return by choosing to become an abomination without anyone's knowledge, thereby putting the clan at risk. What she says at that point can no longer be trusted as she's now a demon. Most likely, the demon was trying to get Merrill to lower her guard.

Merrill's only crime was disagreeing with the Keeper on studying the Eluvian (which is part of ancient Arlathan culture, and since the Dalish Elves exist to rediscover and rebuild ancient Arlathan, that also includes the Eluvians,) and leaving the clan of her own free will, and left the area of influence Audacity had on Merrill. Merethari was still in the area of influence (based on the short story.) Merrill's only crime was loving the Keeper like a mother, but feeling more inclined to do her duty as a Dalish more than play nice and do as she's told. She left on her own free will.

The most dangerous thing she'd ever start is make frowny faces at people.

#136
iOnlySignIn

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The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Merrill is blameless.

Yeah I'm pretty sure she's below the age of criminal responsibility. Mentally at least.

Eve Myles is brilliant though. And much more attractive.

Modifié par iOnlySignIn, 10 février 2013 - 07:24 .


#137
Bizantura

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Good God, nooooooooooo.

#138
Walsh1980

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As far as her being able to die is concerned, I saw Leliana's head leave her shoulders in DAO and there she was in a major roll no matter which save I imported.

I'll be pretty let down if Merrill doesn't show up in DA3, as she's probably my favorite from both games. Sure she's flawed, but who the hell wants a group full of perfectly well adjusted companions who always make the right calls?

#139
Izana

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I hope so. She might be a dumb cloud cuckoolander, but that's what made her so likable. I don't expect a big role, but something like a cameo.

#140
Arppis

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Liamv2 wrote...

 Why does everyone hate Merril? :crying:

I do hope she returns it whould fit since she is a blood mage


She can't heal. :P

#141
Bfler

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iOnlySignIn wrote...

Yeah I'm pretty sure she's below the age of criminal responsibility. Mentally at least.


Yes, when it is stated ingame, that she picks flowers in the garden of other people the picture of a 6 year old girl singing, barfooted and with a circlet of flowers on the head comes to my mind.  

Modifié par Bfler, 10 février 2013 - 11:23 .


#142
wright1978

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Really don't want Merrill or other companions returning in DAI. Think they are tied to Hawke and should remain with him/her dependent on player choices.

#143
Thelzar

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I hope she return, assuming she has a role in the story of DA:I, not just a cameo. It should be possible, since the story is likely to involve mages, templars and blood magic.

#144
Rawgrim

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I don`t want her in another game. Having her forced on me in one game is bad enough.

#145
Heimdall

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I hope people realize that much of the things she says in the latter acts, when examined beyond face value, seem more like dry humor than naivety.

#146
Blazomancer

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Arppis wrote...

Liamv2 wrote...

 Why does everyone hate Merril? [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie]

I do hope she returns it whould fit since she is a blood mage


She can't heal. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]


But she does have a near infinite casting pool. Posted Image

#147
Uccio

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Shes with my Hawke now. No change of her coming back alone.

#148
dragonflight288

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Bfler wrote...

iOnlySignIn wrote...

Yeah I'm pretty sure she's below the age of criminal responsibility. Mentally at least.


Yes, when it is stated ingame, that she picks flowers in the garden of other people the picture of a 6 year old girl singing, barfooted and with a circlet of flowers on the head comes to my mind.  


To be honest, I can actually see almost every Dalish doing that. They live out in the woods and culturally use whatever they can. But they have no real sense of ownership. Merrill does a right to get the tool for fixing the eluvian as it belongs to ALL the Dalish, not just Merethari, and by killing the Varterral, Merrill earned the right to take possession of it for a short while.

Culturally, the idea of people's stuff in their own yards and garden belonging only to them probably hasn't occurred to Merrill. I think it's pretty realistic.

But on the other hand, I can see how people could take that as childish behavior as well, and see her more like a younger sister in the end. I just take it as a cultural thing.

#149
Sejborg

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This is how I feel:

 www.youtube.com/watch

#150
RetroActiv

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Unless they force the issue at best Merrill will have a brief fanservice cameo appearance if that. She just doesn't play a very important of a role in the grand scheme of things so she's fairly disposable.