Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
Wayning_Star wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Enhanced wrote...
BleedingUranium wrote...
How does Synthesis solve the supposed synthetics killing organics problem? What's stopping synthepeople from making pure synthetics that will then kill everyone?
Have you seen the synthesis epilogue? It's all explained.
Remind me.
you start'n trouble again?!? lol
Nerevar-as wrote...
lordhugorune wrote...
Nerevar-as wrote...
That´s the worst. There´s no fridge horror because people are changed in a way they can´t be anything but happy about what was done to them. In a mental scale, it´s like rewriting the heretic geth on a galactic scale. If I can say anything positive about synthesis, is it made me realize what the rewrite meant.
The other way to think about it, is it right that Shepherd, having this one chance to enable organic life to attain transcendence, reject it, when life may never have another chance for millions of years? He is at the crossroads of all history, the consequences of what he chooses not to do, and what will be lost, must weigh as much as the consequences of what he chooses.
I know that, had I been in that universe, I'd have been pretty darn pissed off about Shepherd avoiding that option, if I wasn't in the ground or the belly of a Reaper by this stage of course.
Shepard: Hey, inhabitants of the galaxy! The AI behind all this death & destruction (and millions of years of cycles of genocide) just told me to add my organic energy to a beam of energy, and it´ll remade the galaxy into a tech-organic utopia for every life form! Here I go!
And had you been in that universe, your idea of transcendence doesn´t give you the right to force it in everything else. So ****** off if you like, but leave everyone else out of it. That´s why Sarif´s ending in DE:HR worked. For all advantages augmentations had, getting them was each individual´s choice (although I doubt anyone would reject them when they went nano anyway)
BleedingUranium wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
And thus Synthesis doesn't actually solve the problem.
Indeed. Ieldra will rant about people "inventing" bad things about Synthesis, and then in the Synthesis compendium thread invent bad things about Destroy / make more or less offensive assumptions about people who pick it.clennon8 wrote...
I'm not really seeing a meaningful difference. Seems like you're trying to gain agency over the way other people interpret the story and the opinions they express.
Unfortunately, it goes the whole way and destroys Earth and possible quite a few other homeworlds. Even dismissing the symbolism of destroying civilization here, it would make me feel bad. What I'd like is a Destroy variant where the relays are destroyed but the homeworlds are more or less ok, and where the epilogue tells us that the destruction of the relays has, by necessity, resulted in a new age of exploring the unknown spaces of the galaxy. I can tell you I'd be really conflicted if we had that, for I like the hyper-advanced post-Synthesis civilization, but the spirit of this Destroy variant is very appealing. It would definitely not be boring.Lizardviking wrote...
What about Low-EMS destroy then? That is quite a different setting than the others. Being ME-meets-fallout more or less.
Modifié par Ieldra2, 14 février 2013 - 06:43 .
Argolas wrote...
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
"Facts" that are viewed through the perspective of a character that has fallen unconscious multiple times in a short timespan, is lurching around in a befuddled haze, and ultimately ends up having a conversation with an apparition, all while the player is bombarded with tons of "THIS ISN'T REAL THIS ISN'T REAL" stimuli, should be called into question. At least I think so. So do a few other people.jtav wrote...
It's "you're entitled to your own interpretation, not your own facts." Saying that an ending causes an objective disaster is different from saying an ending is unethical.
Modifié par clennon8, 14 février 2013 - 06:52 .
Argolas wrote...
BleedingUranium wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
And thus Synthesis doesn't actually solve the problem.
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
Wayning_Star wrote...
Argolas wrote...
BleedingUranium wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
And thus Synthesis doesn't actually solve the problem.
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
but we must remember, according to lore, synthesis doesn't do that, reaperships do's that. I know, fine detail..but even Krogan follow orders'n all.. most'a time..
rofl
Vigilant111 wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
... and so begins a new age of elitism and oppression.
You unsynthesized people, join us or die. We let u live so u can develop along our desired path, to be ready for synthesis!
Ah yes, "Things (and people) are not always like they seem to be." Sorry, but this trope has been used again, again and again, and in the MEU not in a very subtle way.HYR 2.0 wrote...
My actual-theory says otherwise (skip to Sec IV... editted for convenience).
Modifié par Uncle Jo, 14 février 2013 - 07:00 .
BleedingUranium wrote...
Wayning_Star wrote...
Argolas wrote...
BleedingUranium wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
And thus Synthesis doesn't actually solve the problem.
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
but we must remember, according to lore, synthesis doesn't do that, reaperships do's that. I know, fine detail..but even Krogan follow orders'n all.. most'a time..
rofl
He wasn't talking about Synthesis, he was talking about Reapers (if you think there's a difference).
yah think? I was just being rhetorical..
Uncle Jo wrote...
Ah yes, "Things (and people) are not always like they seem to be." Sorry, but this trope has been used again, again and again, and in the MEU not in a very subtle way.HYR 2.0 wrote...
My actual-theory says otherwise (skip to Sec IV... editted for convenience).
Every single character you meet is all but a mystery and act in a very previsible way, every choice you make in-game has consequences which are incredibly easy to foresee (Bioshock, the Witcher 1 and 2, and Baldur's Gate which I'm actually playing show me how it can be done otherwise). It boils down to "parangon/renegade" choice. Yay!
ME1 relied on the theme "chase the bad guy who's actually working for an even bigger bad guy" and accessorily on the classical opposition organics/robots.
You also have, as you said, the ton of stereotyped and mostly anthropomorphized alien races (brutal Krogans, militarized Turians, Asari dancers, intelligent but physically weak Salarians, the Volus bankers...) and their immediate counter-examples (Garrus, Wrex..) who naturally side and work for the hero.
On choice gave me a hard time though, it was saving or killing the Rachni Queen.
- ME2 had the plot depth of a Transformer movie. It was epic, for sure, but a classic "the enemy of my enemy is my ally". A temporary alliance with a former foe, based naturally on mutual mistrust. Add to that the dirty dozen recruiting, loyalty missions which mostly consist in solving daddy issues, a suicide mission that isn't one and you have the "most appreciated game of the trilogy".
I don't even want to talk about the sudden importance of humans, or the Reapers which motives are just as known as in the end of ME1. Or about the collector base which can be destroyed (parangon stance) and simply handed over to Cerberus, that if you're dumb enough to think that TIM will use it for the benefit of the galaxy or even of humanity.
Alternative choices like gving it to the Alliance or the Council would have been welcomed. But all in all, it boils down to a heart or a brain with a difference of 10 War Assets. What a joke.
The only pleasant surprise came from Legion (Although designing the Geth rogue faction as "heretic" is quite disturbing for a synthetic race) and the Morning War told from another perspective.
- ME3 did even better than ME2. "Let's take Earth back!", because naturally humans are awesome and the fate of the galaxy lies on their shoulders, since the Council still has its head stuck in the sand and the alien races are too occupied to destroy each other while the Reapers launched their galactic (and very inefficient) harvest.
I can also only understand Cerberus actions under the premise of an indoctrinated TIM (somewhere between the end of ME2 and the beginning of ME3).
As for the Reapers, it was clearly showed that the Reapers didn't give a f*ck about organic or synthetic life, that they indoctrinated and/or used them to reproduce, sustain and repair themselves. That's how it is, they are the bad guys and those bad guys need to disappear.
So no, imo ME was a pleasant and epic journey with its dark moments, that deserved an epic and straightforward ending. Not a load of metaphysical crap spit by a brat who pops out of nowhere, at the eleventh hour and shows me three ways to end my life.
Wayning_Star wrote...
Argolas wrote...
BleedingUranium wrote...
Argolas wrote...
Everything, at least everything in the known galaxy, is synthesized, but when we build new Synthetics they would be Synthetics while new Organics can still rise in new garden worlds.
And thus Synthesis doesn't actually solve the problem.
Unless we take new organics and new synthetics and combine them by reducing the organics to their essence and pumping that into the new Synthetics.
Oh wait, that sounds kinda familiar...
but we must remember, according to lore, synthesis doesn't do that, reaperships do's that. I know, fine detail..but even Krogan follow orders'n all.. most'a time..
rofl
Modifié par CynicalShep, 14 février 2013 - 07:17 .
Modifié par Mr.House, 14 février 2013 - 07:21 .
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