120 réponses à ce sujet

[TEWR]

ZEGABITES wrote...

They have announced a KH MMO, which will likely flop.

.

Source please.

[Seifer006]

J. Reezy wrote...
Lol seems legit.

i thought so

then again. I remember you and I didn't even agree on the other threads I made on SE so why you on this one?

[Seifer006]

J. Reezy wrote...
opinions and facts.

well yeah it's no surprise that the new gen of gamers are caught up with the new gen of Dev of SE.
I'm not against opinions. You like the new SE games eg FF cool great awesome.

But do reseach on google. Even the Pres of SE isn't happy with the company. Even said that if SE can't produce quality games (speaking of past squareSOFT games) that many in the company will be fired. Because SE has lost a lot of reveune

What is it you want Reezy of facts? Some damn chart that has numbers? You can't really show facts in terms of game quality in expression of numbers. Why you think Bioware has asked a lot of fans of what they wanted to see in the next DA game? Because the facts showed that DA 2 wasn't a great as DA:O

or why you think their were so many videos on YT of people pissed off of ME3 (and I'm not even speaking about the ending) but just as the game as a whole? That just people opinions? Or did ME3 lacked substantial amount of what people expectations were when they were expecting the same measure of quality from it's predecessors?

anyway it's cool you like the new FF games. But be great if they brought back the original devs

[Lotion Soronarr]

The first few FF? Good.

But after that? Honestly I couldn't call them good by any definition of the word (except mabye X) - and I'm trying to be as objective as I can.

The plots are nonsenical and horrible, the characters dull and redicolous (Squall? Cloud? Lighting?), fights generally boring.

The only thing it has going really is the visuals and the immagination it sometimes shows.
But the problem is that that imagination is never focused, constrained...properly harnessed.
The entire world makes no sense whatsoever, and more ofthen than not, neither do the characters.

[jesuno]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The first few FF? Good.

But after that? Honestly I couldn't call them good by any definition of the word (except mabye X) - and I'm trying to be as objective as I can.

The plots are nonsenical and horrible, the characters dull and redicolous (Squall? Cloud? Lighting?), fights generally boring.

The only thing it has going really is the visuals and the immagination it sometimes shows.
But the problem is that that imagination is never focused, constrained...properly harnessed.
The entire world makes no sense whatsoever, and more ofthen than not, neither do the characters.

I find Cloud gets a bad rap from all the extra crap SE pumped out to cash in on the original game. In FFVII, I felt he went through some great highs and lows, and his character progression was spot on. Squall and Lighning I would agree with you, both of theirs was so forced and uninteresting.

[Legion 2.5]

Square should make Kingdom Hearts III instead of working 5 or so years on Final Fantasy XIII Versus. Just watch the game fail.

[jesuno]

EntropicAngel wrote...

jesuno wrote...

I find Cloud gets a bad rap from all the extra crap SE pumped out to cash in on the original game. In FFVII, I felt he went through some great highs and lows, and his character progression was spot on. Squall and Lighning I would agree with you, both of theirs was so forced and uninteresting.

I'm honestly surprised how popular VII was. I found Cloud in that game to be a laughable bundle of mental disorders. Just laughable.

And the best part--"Alright everyone, let's mosey"

Sorry, you are going to have to explain a "laughable bundle of mental illness." He went from accomplishing everything he wanted and having two women chase after him to being nothing but a failed science experiment. All of the memories of being poked and prodded rushing in at once is sure to cause some instability followed by the severe poisoning he suffered. By the end he pulls himself together.

[The Hierophant]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Dude, he thinks he is someone else.

He has transplanted himself into the life of another human being.

You know what happens to people who think they're the king of England in real life? They're taken to a nice room with white walls.

Well you have to give him a break as his mother was killed, childhood friend was skewered, village burned to the ground, experimented on to hell and back by Hojo, forced to listen to Zack tirelessly blabber on about his life during an entire trip that spans two continents, and watch on as Zack is gunned down.(I think the bolded was what made him snap.)

Cloud, however, is heralded as a "great" character.

He was decent character(nothing to write home about) but like the rest of the game the tards wanked the crap of him, then Squeenix milked FFVII for all it's worth, and turned him into an emo for the sake of drama, despite most his mental issues being resolved before his last battle with Sephiroth in the game.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 20 février 2013 - 03:58 .

[jesuno]

EntropicAngel wrote...

jesuno wrote...

Sorry, you are going to have to explain a "laughable bundle of mental illness." He went from accomplishing everything he wanted and having two women chase after him to being nothing but a failed science experiment. All of the memories of being poked and prodded rushing in at once is sure to cause some instability followed by the severe poisoning he suffered. By the end he pulls himself together.

Dude, he thinks he is someone else.

He has transplanted himself into the life of another human being.

You know what happens to people who think they're the king of England in real life? They're taken to a nice room with white walls.

Cloud, however, is heralded as a "great" character.

Ok, basing fantasy standards on real world standards is not the way to enjoy any fantasy setting. Cloud is a great character because he starts off as an outcast child that turns into an angry bully that runs off to chase a dream. Instead of accomplishing his goals, he fails miserably and in a mission to his hometown, has to hide his face because not only did his boasting not come true, he was alongside someone who was exactly who he wanted to be. He could not handle watching his hometown get burned to the ground and subsequently being turned into a science experiment (his mind was rather weak, one of the key reasons he was rejected for the Soldier program) that he could not lift a finger to save himself all the way to Midgar. In order for him to save himself, his mind had to supplant Zack's stronger personality (his most high) in order to escape. After the reunion, he started questioning everything in his life, even the real memories, to the point of questioning his own life (his lowest) and trying to commit suicide. After being nursed back to health from severe poisoning, he is able to pull himself together and defeat his nemesis. Good character.

Also, your statement implies that Square threw a bunch of disorders onto him haphazardly with no rhyme or reason, and you did not support your statement.

[jesuno]

EntropicAngel wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...
Well you have to give him a break as his mother was killed, childhood friend was skewered, village burned to the ground, experimented on to hell and back by Hojo, forced to listen to Zack tirelessly blabber on about his life during an entire trip that spans two continents, and watch on as Zack is gunned down.(I think the bolded was what made him snap.)

Lol. But that still would not logically have the effect of transplanting ones personality so completely. The only thing that could possibly do that would be watching Zach die. And then only maybe.

He was decent character(nothing to write home about) but like the rest of the game the tards wanked the crap of him, then Squeenix milked FFVII for all it's worth, and turned him into an emo for the sake of drama, despite most his mental issues being resolved before his last battle with Sephiroth in the game.

I personally saw Advent Children and some of Crisis Core before I played VII, and I liked him there. I like his struggle with Sephiroth. But VII is riddled with problems, and I'm careful to point them out to the folk who have rose-colored glasses.

Wait, you are trying to logically in fantasy, fictional setting. Ok, logically in the scientific community, multiple personality disorder does not exist. That does not mean that it has not been the setting for some great stories.

Also, "rose-colored glasses?" Cute. Next time, instead of widdling down someone's enjoyment of a story and its characters to nothing but nostalgia, try giving some evidence to support your claims.

[jesuno]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Multiple Personality Disorder doesn't exist?

Number one, this isn't multiple personality disorder. MPD is thinking you're multiple people. Cloud thinks he's someone else.

And, really, where are you getting that it "doesn't exist?" That's an awfully wild claim.

My evidence speaks for itself: the guy thinks he's another person.

Where did I get that "wild" claim? I do not know, maybe the scientific community that changed MPD to Dissociative identity disorder because people with that affliction do not create separate identities to become. They missplace large amounts of time and act differently, but they do not become another individual. And I never accused Cloud of having it, I was using it as an example of how things that do not exist in the real world can be used in fictional setting to create a good story.

Now, as far as your evidence is concerned, first of all you are wrong. He does not think that his is Zack, he takes Zack's accomplishments as his own. He does not walk around calling himself Zack, he is still Cloud. And it all boils down to being something that you did not like, which is fine, but you cannot say that it is not executed properly in the story. But, your agruments boil down to " I believe this so this is how it is, and  I am not going to give reasons why."

[Seifer006]

J. Reezy wrote...
 I've never even IMPLIED that I like the new Final Fantasy games on this forum

who ****ing cares j reezy?
I didn't know? I dont read your comments...except the only one I replied too... so yeah I assumed. I assume a lot of things like life in general.

man.........

[Seifer006]

EntropicAngel wrote...
I'm saying Cloud as a character is mediocre to poor, and not the bastion of character-writing that FF fans have posthumously lifted it up to be.

I'm a big fan of FFVII (actually all the classics) but EntropicAngel I do agree with you. I'm glad I found someone who agrees that Cloud's character is boring. He's not interesting. In fact, I didn't find Zach all that interesting either (speaking of side-quels) and AC

but VII imo was a very good FF game. It's story was simple unlike XIII's bull****. Man I really found XIII to be the worst. I'm not sure what SE was even thinking...

Also what is your view on the music? I thought VII captured it masterfully. For example the forested temple and you can hear the cry of the planet was very well indeed in terms of where the story and level design all fit very well. Or anxious heart when you get off the train and you're in the slums (i believe it was the slums)

or when you're in the mountains areas and of course the Gold Saucer was very uplifting and exciting. Great memories

[jesuno]

EntropicAngel wrote...

You stated that multiple personality disorder does not exist. It was not relevant to the discussion, but I would love to know where you found this out. As in, a source to the actual scientists who say it does not exist.

http://psychcentral....disorder/all/1/
As for its relevance, it was relevant to point you made where it makes no logical sense. I stated that there are many things in fantasy settings that do not make logical sense but make great stories.

As to your argument, interesting point. I'm dubious of whether an actual name change is necessary--because this is a personality, not a title. Zach's personality is not titled "Zach." Neither is Cloud's titled "Cloud." It is a personality--how they behave.

But he did not become Zack's personality. While a member of Avalanche, his still the arrogant, boastful person he was as a child that caused him to be an outcast as a child, and later develop anger issues. Zack was more reserved and caring. To become Zack, he would need to be Zack past, present and going forward identifying himself as Zack (which would have made an interesting story with him running into both Tifa and Aeris in Midgar) .

This is NOT something I don't like. I'm okay with it. But it's cheesy. You seem to have misunderstood what I was saying. I wasn't saying VII was a bad story. I'm saying it was no better than any other FF I've played (and undoubtedly worse than XIII), and that's why I was so surprised. I'm saying Cloud as a character is mediocre to poor, and not the bastion of character-writing that FF fans have posthumously lifted it up to be.

To be fair, I probably did jump the gun. The lastest trend with the 13 crowd seems to be bashing 7 while adding nothng to mix other than "I liked 13," and recently replayed 7 for just these kind of arguments. Also, how is that bit cheesy? People have assumed other people's identities for personal gain. In Cloud's case, he had the most to gain because ever since leaving his home, Zack was everything he boasted to Tifa he was going to become. The story would have fallen apart if Cloud just decided that "I did those things," and coupled with immense physical and mental trauma he went through after seeing his hometown destroyed, becoming a lab rat, and not lifting a finger when he and Zack were escaping, his mind had to be someone stronger in order to move on.

I think if you look at Cloud completely, his is far more interesting than anything that crawled out of 13.