303 réponses à ce sujet

[Tron Mega]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

I rarely choose my squadmates based on their powers; I just bring the ones I like.

opening crates in ME1 is the reason i used garrus almost 95% of the time.

[CynicalShep]

Eterna5 wrote...

What? The Normandy crew of ME3 was great, even the new additions. James was great EDI was funny and Javik was exotic and interesting. I loved all of them besides Ashley.

I can see why you did.

[txgoldrush]

nickkcin11 wrote...

I think Mass Effect 1 did the squad mechanic best. Despite the claims that ME1 had the smallest amount of dialogue, it sure doesn't feel that way. Characters interject more frequently during story missions and they actually speak during side quests (something that almost never happened in ME2). Also, when just walking around, you can always talk to them. I loved this feature (especially since some places they actually say something really interesting), and I have no idea why they removed it. And the elevators, however infamous, provided another opportunity to hear the characters talk to each other and feel more lively. I was always confused as to why they got rid of this feature, I'd much rather sit through a slow ass elevator than watch a slow ass loading screen showing my progress up a slow ass elevator. And I feel that every time I replay ME1 (so many times now I can't remember) I get new dialogue. For instance, I always have talked to Kaiden about his BaAt training or however you spell it. But just this last playthrough did I finally hear that he knew this girl, Rahna, that he fancied. And it was her arm that got broken by the Turian, not just some random girl's. So that's why he stood up and confronted the guy. And it made me care about Kaiden more, I'll actually feel bad when I have to make the Virmire decision and leave him behind. In the other Mass Effects, I never really get a lot of dialogue I missed.

Opposite ME1, ME2 did the squad mechanic worst. There were way too many squadmembers, and only a handful of them were as interesting as the original six (Legion who you don't even get till near the end, Mordin, and Miranda). That's not to say I hated the others, I like them, but not as much as the squaddies from ME1. And then there's Samara and Jacob who are the most boring characters ever. And contrary to ME1's "less dialogue feels like more", ME2 has a lot of dialogue with all the characters onboard the Normandy, at least as much as in ME1, and then they each have a loyalty mission which is all about them. The problem is, it never feels like you really get to know them. They don't talk much after their loyalty mission (unless you romance them) which never made sense to me. Wouldn't you want to open up more with a person now that you're more loyal? And they don't really comment on any mission which pisses me off. They seem so absorbed in their own little world. But the main reason I dislike the squad mechanic is they never show any unity. It doesn't even feel like a team. The mission debriefings only have Miranda and Jacob at them. It's like Shepard sent out a memo to everyone and only the two Cerberus people showed up to offer little in terms of valuable input. It's not until the Suicide mission (which actually was handled beautifully, and to me represents the pinnacle of my Mass Effect experience right next to Virmire) that everyone joins as a group to discuss stuff. And it felt so epic! If only they had done that more often.

Mass Effect 3 did some squad mechanics very well, stuff that I felt they fixed greatly from ME2, but they tried to fix what wasn't broken. The squad moves around, congregates and talks to each other. Sometimes they talk to each other from the intercom. Squad members frequently comment on the current war situation onboard the Normandy. They also establish their own relationships with other members (Joker/EDI, Garrus/Tali, and Ken/Gabby) which made them seem a lot more alive. They finally talk on side quests and during missions often. Heck, they even have special moments with Shepard; they come to his cabin to talk heart to heart, and they share special time on the Citadel. For the first time, you really get the impression that these are more than just Shepard's teammates. They're his dearest friends. So with all this great stuff they did, where did they go wrong? The stuff no one said to change, the conversations on the Normandy, were drastically lacking. Ashley, my romance option may have had 2 conversations with me on the Normandy, and one of those conversations happened when she was totally ****-faced. Great, 1 "meaningful" conversation. I learned nothing new about Ash. And I felt that way for the majority of ME3. Aside from the new characters, I never was able to talk with the established characters all that much (the conversations common in ME1 and 2) and as a result I hardly learned anything about them. I don't think I learned a damn thing about Ashley, Liara or Garrus tbqh. I mean sure, all those characters had great scenes but I felt that there character didn't really develop. Yes they all became something more; Garrus became a bro, Ashley didn't trust you, and Liara became a shoulder to cry on. But they should've became even more than that. And because they didn't really progress, the end result is my being disappointed about ME3. BW said they'd make the squad smaller, so that they could really focus on fleshing out the given characters. But that never happened. And I feel that Miranda could've and should've been added, they don't have an excuse because it's not like the squadmates had THAT much dialogue. I also think they forced EDI into the role of a squadmember because of the endings, they wanted you to like a synthetic. But you see, she never really felt like she should be a squadmember, she was so forced and it came out of left-field. And I doubt many people used her. I wasn't too bothered by James Vega. I'm not quite sure why he had to be so buff. He wouldn't be so bad except he seems like such a meathead. Basically, the makeup of the squad didn't ****** me off, but how they used some of the members did.

tl;dr ---> I feel that the size/makeup of the squad doesn't disappoint me, it was how that squad was handled.

Wrong....

EDI had some of the best character development in the history of Bioware, she practically learns what it meant to be alive. In fact EDI is the best party member in ME3 along with Javik.

Liara got major development throughout the story along with Javik (and his development depends on whether you let him touch his shard or not), Ashley and Kaiden learned to trust you, and Garrus set some of the thematic matrial of the game with the brilliant "ruthless calculus of war" conversation.

ME1 were just talking codex entires.....all character establishment, very little character development.

The problem with old Bioware is that they "develop" characters just because you talk to them...in newer Bioware games, characters development through EVENTS IN THE STORY.

[txgoldrush]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

EDI had some of the best character development in the history of Bioware, she practically learns what it meant to be alive. In fact EDI is the best party member in ME3 along with Javik.

EDI's character in ME3 was just a bad copy of Data from ST:TNG.

Data's development is so drastically different you cannot even compare the two.

Its Cortana that EDI is closer to.

[Budgier]

I wish they'd have put the time in to make the ME3 squad have at least one or two from ME2. I understand that it's difficult when dealing with those characters because depending on the playthrough they may be dead, but that didn't stop them from having Tali and Garrus on your squad.

At least give us Miranda and Grunt! I'd love to have Samara too but I guess we already have an Asari biotic so.

[wright1978]

The lack of any of the ME2 exclusives on the squad was a very poor design choice imo. Of the newbies i thought Javik was excellent and added to the story. Really thought Vega and EDI were mediocre additions that weren't needed. Still it is not the squad that stops me replaying, that award goes to the ending.

[txgoldrush]

wright1978 wrote...

The lack of any of the ME2 exclusives on the squad was a very poor design choice imo. Of the newbies i thought Javik was excellent and added to the story. Really thought Vega and EDI were mediocre additions that weren't needed. Still it is not the squad that stops me replaying, that award goes to the ending.

Sorry but EDI is the tritagonist......she is the most important squadmate after Liara.

Sorry, but the rest of ME3's cast isn't that important.

Characters that played a bigger role in the narrative like Mordin, Miranda, and Legion got larger NPC roles....and  Thane got into the main plot from his association with Bailey. Jacob, Samara, Grunt, Kasumi, Zaeed, and Jack simply are not major narrative characters.

When you have large casts, you have to prioritize and the ME1 vets got the priority.

[Kataphrut94]

I like the ME3 squad. In terms of numbers, I think it got it right. Mass Effect 1 had too few squad members and too many missions, meaning you quickly ran out of combinations to try (not to mention you usually needed at least one techy to open crates). Mass Effect 2 had heaps upon heaps, but when you weren't doing there personal missions, most of them just felt like window dressing.

Mass Effect 3 had enough to fill most of the missions without getting too repetitive and a lot more unique banter between the groups. This helped replay value and made the missions more enjoyable.

The only downside I'll say is that the squad feels too constrained by previous games - they could only include the bare minimum of ME2 squad members to compensate for the possibility of deaths, so they chose the two safest and most predictable reps. Liara couldn't die so she was guaranteed a spot, and James and EDI were necessary to fill the basic support roles in the event of a disaster playthrough. None of them were bad, but I imagine it would have been a lot different were it not for the Suicide Mission.

[avenging_teabag]

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Modifié par avenging_teabag, 19 février 2013 - 08:39 .

[txgoldrush]

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

[Galbrant]

The current squad mates were fine to me for the most part I was just angry that none of the Mass Effect 2 Squadmates rejoined Shepard. I wanted my Justicar, Baby faced Krogan and Japanese Thief backed.

[avenging_teabag]

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid. So stop that.

Modifié par avenging_teabag, 19 février 2013 - 09:07 .

[Dieb]

txgoldrush wrote...

Wrong....

You mean "I disagree".

Gee, that seems to be quite the common problem, even given the short time I've spent here so far.

[David7204]

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid. So stop that.

The fact you that even consider the player being able to understand characters in a story a 'gaffe' tells me you aren't terrible competent at deciding what quailfies as 'stupid.'

[txgoldrush]

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid.

Please.....ME1 was deus ex machina fest with very little character development with the worst script in the series, with a Shepard so retarded he compares the treatment of humans to the genophage in front of Wrex and can ask if Joker's disease is contagious. Nevermind Saren's search for the Conduit is utterly ridicoulous. Nevermind the Biowarian dark side where the writers are confused with what Renegade really is, stupidily making some parts evil. Please the phrase in which Shepard kills the Rachni queen is maybe the most laugable line in the entire series nevermind Benezia making Kai Leng look like an amazing villian.

[john-in-france]

I missed Thane.

There was no reason to leave him out, as the characterisation from ME2 could have been taken into account. If you were just friends with him, he was still fatalistic and expecting to die (pretty much the scenario played out in ME3). However if you romanced him then he wanted to live.

The difference: During Shepards incarceration friend Thane survives by a thread, but is too ill to join you in ME3. Whereas LI Thane had a lung transplant ( mentioned as a possibility in LoTSB) and can join Shepard again.

They could still have him take on Kai Leng during Citadel II, but then it would have felt more like Virmire, or if you succeeded in saving Kirrahe, then Kirrahe could have snuffed it, leaving Thane alive.

They pretty much screwed the romance and characterisation. 48% of female players romanced Thane. He came in joint second, tying with Kaidan in Bioware Stats (Garrus came first).

The Life Support room remains empty, suggesting that someone was actually meant to be recruited and on the squad, that got written out due to the script leak.

Yes I'd support some romance development for the ME2 characters. However I think that Kaidan, Garrus and Liara all have enough already. Maybe the Citadel DLC will help, maybe not.

[avenging_teabag]

David7204 wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid. So stop that.

The fact you that even consider the player being able to understand characters in a story a 'gaffe' tells me you aren't terrible competent at deciding what quailfies as 'stupid.'

It's a story convenience, nothing more, nothing less; certainly nothing plot- or immersion breaking. But suit yourself, whatever.

Modifié par avenging_teabag, 19 février 2013 - 09:23 .

[Addictress]

EDI's character development would have been taken more seriously if she didn't look like a sex bot. End of story.

[David7204]

No. Romance should not have that kind of an effect on the plot. Players should not be penalized like that for not romancing Thane.

Modifié par David7204, 19 février 2013 - 09:24 .

[txgoldrush]

john-in-france wrote...

I missed Thane.

There was no reason to leave him out, as the characterisation from ME2 could have been taken into account. If you were just friends with him, he was still fatalistic and expecting to die (pretty much the scenario played out in ME3). However if you romanced him then he wanted to live.

The difference: During Shepards incarceration friend Thane survives by a thread, but is too ill to join you in ME3. Whereas LI Thane had a lung transplant ( mentioned as a possibility in LoTSB) and can join Shepard again.

They could still have him take on Kai Leng during Citadel II, but then it would have felt more like Virmire, or if you succeeded in saving Kirrahe, then Kirrahe could have snuffed it, leaving Thane alive.

They pretty much screwed the romance and characterisation. 48% of female players romanced Thane. He came in joint second, tying with Kaidan in Bioware Stats (Garrus came first).

The Life Support room remains empty, suggesting that someone was actually meant to be recruited and on the squad, that got written out due to the script leak.

Yes I'd support some romance development for the ME2 characters. However I think that Kaidan, Garrus and Liara all have enough already. Maybe the Citadel DLC will help, maybe not.

Reject Thane in ME2 in the romance cabin scene....you will find out the truth of his worries. Thane is afraid of losing Shepard.



Nevermind that in ME3, he goes out a hero.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 19 février 2013 - 09:26 .

[David7204]

Understanding characters is not a 'convenience.' It's a necessity.

[avenging_teabag]

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid.

Please.....ME1 was deus ex machina fest with very little character development with the worst script in the series, with a Shepard so retarded he compares the treatment of humans to the genophage in front of Wrex and can ask if Joker's disease is contagious. Nevermind Saren's search for the Conduit is utterly ridicoulous. Nevermind the Biowarian dark side where the writers are confused with what Renegade really is, stupidily making some parts evil. Please the phrase in which Shepard kills the Rachni queen is maybe the most laugable line in the entire series nevermind Benezia making Kai Leng look like an amazing villian.

Worst script in the series? LOL, gtfo, we're done here.

[txgoldrush]

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

avenging_teabag wrote...

Not really, no.

The moronic plot, poor writing, autodialogue, everyone in the game being suddenly retarded, the unbearable insults my Shepard suffered in the end, all prevented me from touching ME3 ever again. The squadmates being less colorful than in ME3 is a very minor concern. I actually liked Vega.

Look at ME1.....the entire Conduit thing was stupid...nevermind Shepard was an Ultima IX avatar retard in many places in ME1.

I rather have autodialogue than "stupid PC syndrome" that ME1 Shepard has.

Don't you try bring down ME1 to uphold this piece of relentless derp they call "conclusion to the epic trilogy". It won't fly.

ME1's plot was air-tight, by space opera standards, save for an occasional gaffe (english speaking citadel, Tali's quest and the like). Nothing plot-breaking though, and nothing that even compares to ME3's mountains of stupid.

Please.....ME1 was deus ex machina fest with very little character development with the worst script in the series, with a Shepard so retarded he compares the treatment of humans to the genophage in front of Wrex and can ask if Joker's disease is contagious. Nevermind Saren's search for the Conduit is utterly ridicoulous. Nevermind the Biowarian dark side where the writers are confused with what Renegade really is, stupidily making some parts evil. Please the phrase in which Shepard kills the Rachni queen is maybe the most laugable line in the entire series nevermind Benezia making Kai Leng look like an amazing villian.

Worst script in the series? LOL, gtfo, we're done here.

Renegade Shepard in ME1 takes the cake.....always whining about humans getting the shaft and then trying to act badass. Easily the worst dialogue in the series, especially Shepard.

[Caihn]

Alex Arterius wrote...

Am I alone on this?

I found the squad pretty boring to say the least... minus Garrus, Liara and Javik really.

One thing I really liked about ME2 was all the awesome characters and i loved to do new play throughs using different charcters on different missions to hear what they had to say.

On ME3 i'm seriously limited on options though, EDI and James are completely uninteresting and the Virmire Survivor and Tali can hardly be held up to the likes of Mordin and Legion.

Anyone else think more squad mates should have been included + more interesting ones?

I also find most of the ME3 squadmates boring and not interesting.
I miss the ME2 team.