343 réponses à ce sujet

[Eterna]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

dorktainian wrote...

we get a guaranteed 'kill all the reapers' button and we dont use it? we have to use it. there are many reasons why the reapers deserve to die. there are no reasons as to why they deserve to live.

Redemption.

Do you think the Borg, the Flood, or Sauron and his Orcs should've gotten redemption?

If they could be redeemed and used for good then why not?

That's not how fiction works.

And why not?

[UrgentArchengel]

I think maybe if a Rogue Reaper actually existed, this would be a much more interesting. If a Reaper had actually broken from The Intelligence's control (no clue how, but what if?), what if you see that they want to die, or redeem themselves? How would this affect your decision? If it had said it wants to redeem itself, then maybe I would jump instead of shoot.

[Meltemph]

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

dorktainian wrote...

we get a guaranteed 'kill all the reapers' button and we dont use it? we have to use it. there are many reasons why the reapers deserve to die. there are no reasons as to why they deserve to live.

Redemption.

Do you think the Borg, the Flood, or Sauron and his Orcs should've gotten redemption?

If they could be redeemed and used for good then why not?

That's not how fiction works.

And why not?

I actually agree.  The child like stories, where the bad guy actually has a good heart is actually a fairly common tale...  Whether it is naive or not doesnt really matter, because the point is that it is trying to teach, "there is good in everyone" and you want kids to grow up thinking everyone has some good in them, right?  

[dorktainian]

i understand the stories angle, but these creatures have been obliterating everything for millenia. and now they seek redemption? from whom?

The beings they murdered can't forgive.

[Eterna]

dorktainian wrote...

i understand the stories angle, but these creatures have been obliterating everything for millenia. and now they seek redemption? from whom?

The beings they murdered can't forgive.

They don't seek redemption, but you can give it too them. 

[Meltemph]

dorktainian wrote...

i understand the stories angle, but these creatures have been obliterating everything for millenia. and now they seek redemption? from whom?

The beings they murdered can't forgive.

"There is good in everyone" - I would assume is the mantra.  I mean, there are a lot of people on this site who think conflict is a form of a lack of empathy.  And then there are those that think the more intelligence/knowledge you have the less violent you will become, becuase wisdom comes with intelligence/knowledge.

[dorktainian]

Meltemph wrote...

dorktainian wrote...

i understand the stories angle, but these creatures have been obliterating everything for millenia. and now they seek redemption? from whom?

The beings they murdered can't forgive.

"There is good in everyone" - I would assume is the mantra.  I mean, there are a lot of people on this site who think conflict is a form of a lack of empathy.  And then there are those that think the more intelligence/knowledge you have the less violent you will become, becuase wisdom comes with intelligence/knowledge.

nah i'll just blow them to kingdom come and worry about that rubbish later.  Better safe than dead.

[BleedingUranium]

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Meltemph wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

dorktainian wrote...

we get a guaranteed 'kill all the reapers' button and we dont use it? we have to use it. there are many reasons why the reapers deserve to die. there are no reasons as to why they deserve to live.

Redemption.

Do you think the Borg, the Flood, or Sauron and his Orcs should've gotten redemption?

If they could be redeemed and used for good then why not?

That's not how fiction works.

And why not?

I actually agree.  The child like stories, where the bad guy actually has a good heart is actually a fairly common tale...  Whether it is naive or not doesnt really matter, because the point is that it is trying to teach, "there is good in everyone" and you want kids to grow up thinking everyone has some good in them, right?  

I'm slightly confused by this. In most stories children have, the badguy is just pure evil and has no re-deming qualities. He kicks puppies, burns orphanages, kills parents, and does it with a smile because he's that evil.

The more mature stories I've read are the ones in which the villian does have redeeming qualities and a not black/white motiviation. The type of villians who are villians not becasue of what they're fighting to achieve, but the way they go about achieving their goals.

So I'm confused about the whole "child stories" stuff.

[Meltemph]

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

Well ya, but there is no true good either in real life.  I mean if you want to take the child blinders off, the world is much more bleak and conflict is rarely if ever about good vs evil..

[dorktainian]

Meltemph wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

Well ya, but there is no true good either in real life.  I mean if you want to take the child blinders off, the world is much more bleak and conflict is rarely if ever about good vs evil..

well that is where you are utterly wrong.  Yes the world is not a nice place, but every day there are examples of true goodness and charity.  To say that there is no true good in this world is a bit like saying we should all just give up.  lose any hope we have that things will get better.

[Meltemph]

I'm slightly confused by this. In most stories children have, the badguy is just pure evil and has no re-deming qualities. He kicks puppies, burns orphanages, kills parents, and does it with a smile because he's that evil.

The more mature stories I've read are the ones in which the villian does have redeeming qualities and a not black/white motiviation. The type of villians who are villians not becasue of what they're fighting to achieve, but the way they go about achieving their goals.

So I'm confused about the whole "child stories" stuff.

Typically children books are either 1 of 2 things, either it is a very clear bad guy vs good guy or it is about there being good in just about everyone or it tried to show the good in everyone.

The books for adults, that are typically considered great throw away good vs evil for the most part.

[Red Panda]

I'm so glad destroy exists. That way we can kill all the abominations with one stone. Reapers and Geth are not needed by the galaxy and should all die.

[Meltemph]

well that is where you are utterly wrong. Yes the world is not a nice place, but every day there are examples of true goodness and charity. To say that there is no true good in this world is a bit like saying we should all just give up. lose any hope we have that things will get better.

Huh? The acts of good or evil is separate from whether we are either good or evil. Just because someone does good doesn't mean they are wholly good and people who do evil doesn't mean they are wholly evil.

And when I said no true good, I mean in terms of people, because it is all perspective and beliefs. Nobody is either extreme in thought.

[dorktainian]

whatever.... one mans perfection is anothers monstrosity.

[Eterna]

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

The Reapers aren't evil though. 

[BleedingUranium]

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

The Reapers aren't evil though.

And you were convinced of that by who? Right, the Reapers themselves.

[dorktainian]

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

The Reapers aren't evil though. 

   

[ElSuperGecko]

Eterna5 wrote...
They don't seek redemption, but you can give it too them. 

LOL.

So - by fulfilling the Reapers purpose, doing their job for them and screwing over the entire galaxy, you can REDEEM the Reapers?  That's the most epic piece of catflap drivel I've ever had the misfortune to hear.

The Reapers don't ask for your "redemption".  They're unrepentant.  They couldn't care less.  All they want from you is for you to do their bidding.

And, fool that you are, that's exactly what you do.

And even better than that, you then convince yourself that it was a good idea.

[AlanC9]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...
Do you think the Borg, the Flood, or Sauron and his Orcs should've gotten redemption?

If they could be redeemed and used for good then why not?

That's not how fiction works.

It doesn't? If Trek had gone on long enough I guarantee the Borg would have been redeemed in some fashion. Hell, they were flirting with the idea back in TNG.

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 février 2013 - 10:13 .

[AlanC9]

ElSuperGecko wrote...
So - by fulfilling the Reapers purpose, doing their job for them and screwing over the entire galaxy, you can REDEEM the Reapers?  That's the most epic piece of catflap drivel I've ever had the misfortune to hear.

What's your evidence for the bolded part?

[ElSuperGecko]

AlanC9 wrote...
What's your evidence for the bolded part?

Would YOU be happy in a universe where your steak had wires and LED's in it?

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

The MEHEM in its final iteration will be the best. I guarantee it.

If BW refuses to set a canon ending for ME3, does it matter? No. Because all the endings are fan fiction. I hate to break it to everyone, but without a canon ending there is no future. They are not going to create a new game from multiple timelines again. There are way too many variables. Sorry.

[Obadiah]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

There is no true evil in real life, but there is in some fiction, like the Reapers.

The Reapers aren't evil though.

And you were convinced of that by who? Right, the Reapers themselves.

I'm pretty sure that if the Catalyst had appeared as a slobbering demon and spoken its current lines with Sovereign's awesome voice, this would in no way be a point of contention.

[dorktainian]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The MEHEM in its final iteration will be the best. I guarantee it.

If BW refuses to set a canon ending for ME3, does it matter? No. Because all the endings are fan fiction. I hate to break it to everyone, but without a canon ending there is no future. They are not going to create a new game from multiple timelines again. There are way too many variables. Sorry.

  

thats the beauty of the breath scene.  it manages in one hit to ensure that actually (and bioware have confirmed this) destroy with all your war assets in tow is the 'best' ending.  All they have to do is follow that on.  sure it may pee off a few indoctrinated souls that inhabit BSN nowadays but in the long run it would work.