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[Bill Casey]

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that wish to understand them...
They weaponize curiosity...

Modifié par Bill Casey, 20 février 2013 - 07:44 .

[Wayning_Star]

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that wish to understand them...
They weaponize curiosity...

sad that they learned/were programmed for it by organic Leviathan.

[Wayning_Star]

but reapership mentality is taken from organic contents.. very confusing that?

[CosmicGnosis]

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

Modifié par CosmicGnosis, 20 février 2013 - 07:49 .

[o Ventus]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

The latest Blight was an accident. My point is that the Architect is not pure evil. That, at least, has to be acknowledged.

Regardless, his means were horrific and would lead to the deaths of an immense amount of people, much like the Reapers. He essentially wanted all of Thedas to undergo the Joining, which had an overwhelming mortality rate. For those who survive, they are effectively half-darkspawn.

You can't ignore his actions and only analyze his intentions.

[Dr_Extrem]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

but he is right .. every case of curiosity on the reapers and their tech lead to the destruction of the curious.

dr. kenson - indoctrinated & killed
bigstupidjellyfish - indoctrinated & killed
batarian scientists - indoctrinated & killed
saren - indoctrinated & killed
tim - indoctrinated & killed
benezia - indoctrinated & killed

...

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 20 février 2013 - 07:52 .

[CosmicGnosis]

o Ventus wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

The latest Blight was an accident. My point is that the Architect is not pure evil. That, at least, has to be acknowledged.

Regardless, his means were horrific and would lead to the deaths of an immense amount of people, much like the Reapers. He essentially wanted all of Thedas to undergo the Joining, which had an overwhelming mortality rate. For those who survive, they are effectively half-darkspawn.

You can't ignore his actions and only analyze his intentions.

Yes, but he is at least somewhat sympathetic and more interesting than a simple evil villain.

[CosmicGnosis]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

but he is right .. every case of curiosity on the reapers and their tech lead to the destruction of the curious.

dr. kenson - indoctrinated & killed
bigstupidjellyfish - indoctrinated & killed
batarian scientists - indoctrinated & killed
saren - indoctrinated & killed
tim - indoctrinated & killed
benezia - indoctrinated & killed

...

Sovereign was salvaged to build thanix cannons and EDI. I also suspect that Reaper technology was used in Project Lazarus, but I don't know for sure.

[Chashan]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

You should consider the train of thought behind that line only very carefully for another reason:

Remember the chat with Anderson in ME1, prior to Eden Prime? An advancement in the range of two centuries was what Anderson called the discovery of the Mars Archives, the key to the mass effect and the relays. See the exaggeration and hyperbole in Mr Harper's quote compared to that?

That aside, it is not exactly directly related to Controlling the kill-bots.

[Dr_Extrem]

edi was a retcon .. in mass effect 2, she only got her cyberwarfare suits and counter viruses from sovi. later the iff

there was no reaper tech involved in pl.

the thanix cannon is a particle stream cannon, that uses mass effect fields. its technology is very similar to the javelin. peoplke would have invented it sooner or later, since it is a continuation of existing tech.

btw. sovi was dead and out of order - it was not able to indoctrinate anymore .

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 20 février 2013 - 08:02 .

[Bill Casey]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Sovereign was salvaged to build thanix cannons and EDI.

...After he was blown to hell
Is the end of that sentence...

[CosmicGnosis]

Chashan wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

You should consider the train of thought behind that line only very carefully for another reason:

Remember the chat with Anderson in ME1, prior to Eden Prime? An advancement in the range of two centuries was what Anderson called the discovery of the Mars Archives, the key to the mass effect and the relays. See the exaggeration and hyperbole in Mr Harper's quote compared to that?

That aside, it is not exactly directly related to Controlling the kill-bots.

I think Anderson's point is that from the archive discovery humanity's technology jumped two centuries. But TIM's point is that humanity's knowledge and galactic expansion have allowed them to achieve more than almost their entire history in such a short timeframe.

[BleedingUranium]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

... What? It only harvests advanced organic life, and for the purpose of preventing a singularity that could doom all organic life to everlasting obscurity.

Harvests = kills.

That problem hasn't been shown to exist. He claimed something without showing any evidence, while we have evidence that it is in fact not true.

If I say that the Earth will be destroyed by pink sapient clouds of cotton candy, that doesn't make it true.

[Bill Casey]

Shepard can correctly point out that the relays were part of a reaper trap...

[CosmicGnosis]

BleedingUranium wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

... What? It only harvests advanced organic life, and for the purpose of preventing a singularity that could doom all organic life to everlasting obscurity.

Harvests = kills.

That problem hasn't been shown to exist. He claimed something without showing any evidence, while we have evidence that it is in fact not true.

If I say that the Earth will be destroyed by pink sapient clouds of cotton candy, that doesn't make it true.

I accept the premise for my own sanity. Otherwise, I have to reject the entire ending. And besides, I think his plan actually does make sense. It's just that it doesn't account for individual lives. Of course, the Catalyst has no reason to because it's a completely alien synthetic intelligence. It has no obligation to follow our morality.

[BleedingUranium]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

... What? It only harvests advanced organic life, and for the purpose of preventing a singularity that could doom all organic life to everlasting obscurity.

Harvests = kills.

That problem hasn't been shown to exist. He claimed something without showing any evidence, while we have evidence that it is in fact not true.

If I say that the Earth will be destroyed by pink sapient clouds of cotton candy, that doesn't make it true.

I accept the premise for my own sanity. Otherwise, I have to reject the entire ending. And besides, I think his plan actually does make sense. It's just that it doesn't account for individual lives. Of course, the Catalyst has no reason to because it's a completely alien synthetic intelligence. It has no obligation to follow our morality.

He kills people because he thinks he's saving them from themselves.

[Wayning_Star]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

 

destroy is a mop up operation canon ending...of cosmic proportions..wish them luck, they'll need it..in the worst possible ways.

[Dr_Extrem]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

... What? It only harvests advanced organic life, and for the purpose of preventing a singularity that could doom all organic life to everlasting obscurity.

Harvests = kills.

That problem hasn't been shown to exist. He claimed something without showing any evidence, while we have evidence that it is in fact not true.

If I say that the Earth will be destroyed by pink sapient clouds of cotton candy, that doesn't make it true.

I accept the premise for my own sanity. Otherwise, I have to reject the entire ending. And besides, I think his plan actually does make sense. It's just that it doesn't account for individual lives. Of course, the Catalyst has no reason to because it's a completely alien synthetic intelligence. It has no obligation to follow our morality.

now you can make a guess, why i play the game with mehem.

[Wayning_Star]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

... What? It only harvests advanced organic life, and for the purpose of preventing a singularity that could doom all organic life to everlasting obscurity.

Harvests = kills.

That problem hasn't been shown to exist. He claimed something without showing any evidence, while we have evidence that it is in fact not true.

If I say that the Earth will be destroyed by pink sapient clouds of cotton candy, that doesn't make it true.

I accept the premise for my own sanity. Otherwise, I have to reject the entire ending. And besides, I think his plan actually does make sense. It's just that it doesn't account for individual lives. Of course, the Catalyst has no reason to because it's a completely alien synthetic intelligence. It has no obligation to follow our morality.

thats the problem over looked on these pages, it DOES follow our morality..take destroy for instance.

[Bill Casey]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

I accept the premise for my own sanity.

O cruel, needless misunderstanding! O stubborn, self-willed exile from the loving breast!

Modifié par Bill Casey, 20 février 2013 - 08:37 .

[ZerebusPrime]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

The series made it pretty clear that Reapers prey on those that want to understand them...

Then I disagree with the writers, and Mass Effect is not a story that I can support. I don't believe in "forbidden knowledge". I want to understand our actual circumstances. I want to understand our enemies. I want to know about the "dark corners" of the universe.

One of my favorite quotes from the entire trilogy comes from the Illusive Man:

"When humanity discovered the mass relays, when we learned there was more to the galaxy than we imagined, there were some who thought the relays should be destroyed. They were scared of what we'd find, terrified of what we might let in. But look at what humanity has achieved. Since that discovery, we've advanced more than the past ten thousand years combined!"

I support this perspective. Of course, TIM was indoctrinated. I guess that means that we should just throw this quote out the window...

but he is right .. every case of curiosity on the reapers and their tech lead to the destruction of the curious.

dr. kenson - indoctrinated & killed
bigstupidjellyfish - indoctrinated & killed
batarian scientists - indoctrinated & killed
saren - indoctrinated & killed
tim - indoctrinated & killed
benezia - indoctrinated & killed

...

Sovereign was salvaged to build thanix cannons and EDI. I also suspect that Reaper technology was used in Project Lazarus, but I don't know for sure.

Not everyone who studied the Reapers were indoctrinated.  It's more like those who first studied X-Rays; many of them died of radiation poisoning.  Forbidden knowledge is a misnomer, IMHO.  It's just knowledge that has been made very difficult to obtain without falling into the many pitfalls set up by the Reapers to protect themselves and keep organics at a manageable level.  When organics do manage to extract the Reapers' secrets, they end up with things like the Reaper IFF or the Ilos mass relay project.  

In short, many of our most potent weapons come from studying an enemy; the Reapers recognize this and made themselves very, very difficult to study as part of a defensive mechanism.

[BleedingUranium]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

Not everyone who studied the Reapers were indoctrinated.  It's more like those who first studied X-Rays; many of them died of radiation poisoning.  Forbidden knowledge is a misnomer, IMHO.  It's just knowledge that has been made very difficult to obtain without falling into the many pitfalls set up by the Reapers to protect themselves and keep organics at a manageable level.  When organics do manage to extract the Reapers' secrets, they end up with things like the Reaper IFF or the Ilos mass relay project.  

In short, many of our most potent weapons come from studying an enemy; the Reapers recognize this and made themselves very, very difficult to study as part of a defensive mechanism.

Very true. It's also worth noting that Thanix cannons, Legion's code, and the Prothean mass relay were reverse engineered from Reaper tech, and that we're not actaully using Reaper tech.

Example: Using the current mass relays is bad, but building our own replacement relays, based on the same design, would be just fine.

[CosmicGnosis]

Michael Gamble Twitter posts:

https://twitter.com/...331064825266176
https://twitter.com/...352183313674240
https://twitter.com/...716673411923970

In these tweets, he expresses no problems with Synthesis, states that Destroy is not the best ending, and implies that Synthesis is the optimal ending.

What do these tweets mean to you guys?

Modifié par CosmicGnosis, 20 février 2013 - 09:13 .

[chris2365]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

chris2365 wrote...
Don't forget that a Reaper is composed of millions of minds and voices working in unison. Quadrillions of potential men, woman, children, etc. Don't they deserve a chance to speak before condemning them to because of what they were before, or the way they might be like in the future?  Would you condemn a whole species based on what might happen (Geth, Rachni, etc.) ?

Where in the world did you pull this fallacy from?  No wonder people fall so willingly and completely for the Catalyst's line of tripe when this kind of spurious self-serving headcanon is toted around as fact.

The Reapers are not ruled by consensus by the minds of the races they were built from.  Those races are dead, dead and gone.  They were murdered by the Reapers.

Do you need me to remind you how the Reapers are created?

Do you need me to remind you what happened to the Protheans?

Do you need me to show you how much of the Protheans the Reapers "preserved"?

Thanks for clearing that up. Must have gotten confused with the Geth. My point still stands however. It's even shown in the EC Synthesis ending that the Reapers are cooperating with the other races and even helping them rebuild and sharing their knowledge. This is done with their on their own (no Catalyst involved). So it would be wrong to say that they are all evil and agressive.

[Dr_Extrem]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

Michael Gamble Twitter posts:

https://twitter.com/...331064825266176
https://twitter.com/...352183313674240
https://twitter.com/...716673411923970

In these tweets, he expresses no problems with Synthesis, states that Destroy is not the best ending, and implies that Synthesis is the optimal ending.

What do these tweets mean to you guys?

2 statements:

"personally" and "hardest to get" ...

i dont care what mr. gamble thinks. none of the endings is nice ... if you dont believe that ... well its your thing. they all require to ****** on a certain right, shepard wanted to protect.

high ems destroy is the "hardest to get" actually.