582 réponses à ce sujet

[Dr_Extrem]

Wayning_Star wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

or tixic chemicals like benzen,

when the body tries to metabolise it using cytochrom p450, a very reactive intermediate is build, that adds to dna.

the result is cancer.

That too, but that's an external factor, it's not directly tied to evolution or normal biological processes. Mutageneic substances, as unhealthy as they are environmental...

Like sunlight, even if yet again, some people are more suceptible to those external factors than others due to their genetic setup. Risk factors add up.

Kind of hints at a regulatory aspect to evolution, either it makes you stronger or weakens the system, gene dependent. Either way time and pressure exerts change.

One old gal that I read of said that its possible and even as much as probably that cosmic particles can impact cells altering their structure long enough, if they're having a propencity, and that can result in cell damage/cancer.

I cannot remember her name, but she was in her late 80's and a geneticist of high stature,bio engineer and others. She was one of those genus folks, as later she got into astro physics as a hobby...sheesh, enough is enough..lol
anyway that's why I remembered her.

liver cancer caued by benzen will not make you harder .. it will lead to a slow and painfull death.

I wasn't talking about curing cancer, just why evolution apparently causes for it through gene deficiency. Apparently genes and evolution are linked? Aren't they?

never thought of that ..

our opposing thumb is the result of a genetic defect - it was not triggered by a changed environment. our enhanced mental capacity is also caused by a genetic defect.

the sick survied - somehow.


but smartness is new conpect for evolution. its not yet proven to be usefull.

[Dr_Extrem]

Wayning_Star wrote...

RedBeardJim wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

or tixic chemicals like benzen,

when the body tries to metabolise it using cytochrom p450, a very reactive intermediate is build, that adds to dna.

the result is cancer.

That too, but that's an external factor, it's not directly tied to evolution or normal biological processes. Mutageneic substances, as unhealthy as they are environmental...

Like sunlight, even if yet again, some people are more suceptible to those external factors than others due to their genetic setup. Risk factors add up.

Kind of hints at a regulatory aspect to evolution, either it makes you stronger or weakens the system, gene dependent. Either way time and pressure exerts change.

One old gal that I read of said that its possible and even as much as probably that cosmic particles can impact cells altering their structure long enough, if they're having a propencity, and that can result in cell damage/cancer.

I cannot remember her name, but she was in her late 80's and a geneticist of high stature,bio engineer and others. She was one of those genus folks, as later she got into astro physics as a hobby...sheesh, enough is enough..lol
anyway that's why I remembered her.

Evolution is just change. Some change may make you more likely to survive and/or reproduce, and will over time become more common in the population. Some change may have the opposite effect, with the opposite result. And some change is just change, variation. And it's all dependent on the environmental context -- something that's a huge advantage under certain conditions may be useless or even harmful under other conditions.

What are "cosmic particles", exactly? Not a term I'm familiar with. Cosmic *radiation* is just a high-energy type of EM radiation, like X-rays or gamma rays only moreso, so it would certainly have a similar effect on DNA, leading to mutations with exposure.

from what I can remember, she said they were miniscule particles we're bombarded with every day. I'd look it up but I have to take off..

charged particles are deflected by our magentic field. the only thing that can hit us, is em-radiation. (light, gamma, röntgen, uv ect.)

[Wayning_Star]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

RedBeardJim wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

or tixic chemicals like benzen,

when the body tries to metabolise it using cytochrom p450, a very reactive intermediate is build, that adds to dna.

the result is cancer.

That too, but that's an external factor, it's not directly tied to evolution or normal biological processes. Mutageneic substances, as unhealthy as they are environmental...

Like sunlight, even if yet again, some people are more suceptible to those external factors than others due to their genetic setup. Risk factors add up.

Kind of hints at a regulatory aspect to evolution, either it makes you stronger or weakens the system, gene dependent. Either way time and pressure exerts change.

One old gal that I read of said that its possible and even as much as probably that cosmic particles can impact cells altering their structure long enough, if they're having a propencity, and that can result in cell damage/cancer.

I cannot remember her name, but she was in her late 80's and a geneticist of high stature,bio engineer and others. She was one of those genus folks, as later she got into astro physics as a hobby...sheesh, enough is enough..lol
anyway that's why I remembered her.

Evolution is just change. Some change may make you more likely to survive and/or reproduce, and will over time become more common in the population. Some change may have the opposite effect, with the opposite result. And some change is just change, variation. And it's all dependent on the environmental context -- something that's a huge advantage under certain conditions may be useless or even harmful under other conditions.

What are "cosmic particles", exactly? Not a term I'm familiar with. Cosmic *radiation* is just a high-energy type of EM radiation, like X-rays or gamma rays only moreso, so it would certainly have a similar effect on DNA, leading to mutations with exposure.

from what I can remember, she said they were miniscule particles we're bombarded with every day. I'd look it up but I have to take off..

charged particles are deflected by our magentic field. the only thing that can hit us, is em-radiation. (light, gamma, röntgen, uv ect.)

some get through, see my earlier post for a link.

[RedBeardJim]

Wayning_Star wrote...

I wasn't talking about curing cancer, just why evolution apparently causes for it through gene deficiency. Apparently genes and evolution are linked? Aren't they?

They are, but there really isn't a direct link between cancer and evolution. The majority of cancers are caused by either random copying errors in body cells, or by external factors like toxic chemicals and radiation -- evolutionary processes are only involved with the forms of cancer that are hereditary, which are very rare in the population as a whole. And more importantly, the majority of cancers occur *after childbearing age has been reached*. From an evolutionary standpoint, just about anything that happens to you after you've had kids is irrelevant.

[Dr_Extrem]

Wayning_Star wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

RedBeardJim wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

or tixic chemicals like benzen,

when the body tries to metabolise it using cytochrom p450, a very reactive intermediate is build, that adds to dna.

the result is cancer.

That too, but that's an external factor, it's not directly tied to evolution or normal biological processes. Mutageneic substances, as unhealthy as they are environmental...

Like sunlight, even if yet again, some people are more suceptible to those external factors than others due to their genetic setup. Risk factors add up.

Kind of hints at a regulatory aspect to evolution, either it makes you stronger or weakens the system, gene dependent. Either way time and pressure exerts change.

One old gal that I read of said that its possible and even as much as probably that cosmic particles can impact cells altering their structure long enough, if they're having a propencity, and that can result in cell damage/cancer.

I cannot remember her name, but she was in her late 80's and a geneticist of high stature,bio engineer and others. She was one of those genus folks, as later she got into astro physics as a hobby...sheesh, enough is enough..lol
anyway that's why I remembered her.

Evolution is just change. Some change may make you more likely to survive and/or reproduce, and will over time become more common in the population. Some change may have the opposite effect, with the opposite result. And some change is just change, variation. And it's all dependent on the environmental context -- something that's a huge advantage under certain conditions may be useless or even harmful under other conditions.

What are "cosmic particles", exactly? Not a term I'm familiar with. Cosmic *radiation* is just a high-energy type of EM radiation, like X-rays or gamma rays only moreso, so it would certainly have a similar effect on DNA, leading to mutations with exposure.

from what I can remember, she said they were miniscule particles we're bombarded with every day. I'd look it up but I have to take off..

charged particles are deflected by our magentic field. the only thing that can hit us, is em-radiation. (light, gamma, röntgen, uv ect.)

some get through, see my earlier post for a link.

then you should learn, what the difference between a particle and a wave is.

[Mazebook]

Subject M wrote...

Well, without having read all the replies in this thread, I agree to some extent on what OP says. (I even made my own statement about it many months ago). There definitely is a crypto-totalitarian "message"in the endings that is built on ideas we find in ultra-nationalist and supremacist movements.

That is total BS.
It is like saying if you learn a new language you are a facist...which is utterly absurd and the complete opposite of the true meaning.

Modifié par maaaze, 22 février 2013 - 03:14 .

[RedBeardJim]

maaaze wrote...

Subject M wrote...

Well, without having read all the replies in this thread, I agree to some extent on what OP says. (I even made my own statement about it many months ago). There definitely is a crypto-totalitarian "message"in the endings that is built on ideas we find in ultra-nationalist and supremacist movements.

That is total BS.
It is like saying if you learn a new language you are a facist...which is utterly absurd and the complete opposite of the true meaning.

No, it's more like saying that if someone else *forces* you to learn a new language, with you having no say in the matter, that someone else is acting like a "fascist" or at least some sort of totalitarian.

[Chris Priestly]

And we're done here.


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