1904 réponses à ce sujet

[Vlk3]

crimzontearz wrote...

Dusty was nice enough to come and talk to us....and it was not up to him anyway

Although I still would like an answer

Yeah, I know, and I'm certainly not trying to blame him for anything.

[Cecilia L]

Vlk3 wrote...

I want to thank you as well, Dusty, for coming here and talking to us. I have an exam on thursday and such bad news two days before that would make me unable to pass it. So, yeah, in some ways you really helped me.
I didn't feel offended by that zombie- Thane comment, though it actually made me realise that it is over and we lost everything.
So sweet and interesting character was wasted...

It also made me realise, that you, and here I mean BioWare, don't understand the problem here. Thane didn't have to die, there were several ways to save him, and that's why his inevitable death and content related to it will never make sense to most of the Thanemancers and people who simply liked Thane more than BioWare and other fans. Can you imagine a woman in love, who doesn't even try to find a treatment/someone who can cure/help her partner?
Can you imagine a man in love, who knows that he could get a treatment for his illness (lung transplant for example), but ignores that and decides to just sit and wait for death, talking things like "It is a good end to a life" while entire galaxy is getting murdered by the Reapers?
Or, a father, who just started talking with his son afer years of absence, that decides to just leave him again, this time forever? Without even seeking a cure. Thane jumps on a sword, making a pathetic mistake for a cause that was never his (what does he have to do with the salarians?)

I assume the content we will get is some kind of memory or another letter, some kind of dream or even meeting a ghost of Thane (that would be so lame...). No matter how sweet and touching would that be, it still doesn't make sense at all. And I'd like to remind you all, that Thane had a wife. So across the sea, there is someone waiting for him already. There is nothing to look forward to. Everything is completely lost. On top of that, i find it hard to believe in afterlife, so there's either the love triangle with Irikah at the end of the journey or just nothing.

And though it was a CDN article, I think that a way to cure Thane was already discovered in ME Universe. It is called Eupulmos Device or the 'medi gel for lungs'. So no, Thane didn't have to die, and he died only because BioWare didn't care about their fans. What I don't understand is why you decided to be so stubborn? Citadel is clearly a fan- service DLC, you could at least make a way to let Thane survive the game, and let us headcanon the rest.

Hear, hear!

[Twilight_Princess]

 As it stands, Thane romancers have one conversation of romance content in the game. One conversation of romance content. If this DLC justs adds one more conversation and Thane dies anyway...it won't be worth $15 dollars to them, sorry.  I guess that was the "complicated" reason for keeping them in the dark, it wasn't good news. It makes sense for them to watch it first.  They've been burned enough already and their immersion was broken a looooooong time ago so no worries there. And since this DLC won't be fixing the Thane interactions beforehand either that means they have to go through all that, again, just to get a "I love you siha" and shepard acting sad
(which should have happened in the first place).  

The least they deserve out of all this was some honesty finally so thank you for being honest Mr Everman (I mean that sincerely). They don't have to wait 5 more days to find out it's happy times and lots of content for everyone else's LI choices except theirs.  I'm also guessing there are no new male LI's either so for the hetro sheps it's Kaidan or Garrus or nothing. Meanwhile in maleshep land none of his LI's are axed and characters like Miri and Jack will get the content they desrve (and they do deserve it I like those characters).  I would never had predicted this outcome for Thane pre-ME3, and I don't mean that he would never die, I mean I never thought he would be side-lined like this. Such a waste.

Modifié par Hyrule_Gal, 01 mars 2013 - 10:01 .

[_Heather_Shepard_]

Hyrule_Gal wrote...
I would never had predicted this outcome for Thane pre-ME3, and I don't mean that he would never die, I mean I never thought he would be side-lined like this. Such a waste.

Indeed, hon. Indeed. We get shafted once again while Bioware pours salt on open wounds.

Modifié par _Heather_Shepard_, 01 mars 2013 - 10:04 .

[Big stupid jellyfish]

Thank you for appearing in this thread, Dusty.

[Hisilome]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Ninalupa wrote...
 I'll watch a Thane-romance playthrough on youtube and figure out if I want to go through with it myself from there.

Though I encourage you to wait for feedback from your fellow Thane enthusiasts before making a purchase, I encourage you not to watch it first on YouTube. Games are not movies, and watching something on Youtube just ruins a personal experience.  YouTube is a great venue for seeing the parts of the game you couldn't see for yourself (e.g. I had Wrex alive in my game, but how would this have played out if Wreav was in charge?) But as content devs, we try to craft an experience through pacing and choice.  We hope that you are immersed and in the moment, which can't happen through YouTube. You can only see something for the first time once.

First off, thank you very much, as well, for coming in here!:happy:

You are very  right in what you say; seeing something on Youtube is hardly the same as experiencing it yourself, especially in a game. I recall having seen the ME3 endings before my own copy of  the game reached me; I actually saw them twice, once in Youtube and once in a friend's playthrough...The impact was not the same as it was when I saw them in my own game for the first  time; when it was my game, my character going through those traumatic endings,it was entirely different than just observing them from a non-involved point of view.

That said...with the upcoming dlc in mind, I can't really fault my fellow fans, especially  those of us unfortunate enough to romance Thane in ME2 only to see that romance, that character and, by extension, our own Shepards, wrecked and ruined in ME3. The arguments and views are well  known and even if they weren't, I'm sure they have been explained in great detail in this thread, as well as others...The end point is this: we had high hopes for this dlc, we hoped we would be heard after so many protests and creative actions we took to be heard; we hoped our character would get something more than she got and we would finally get  that option we have been clamoring for for a year now regarding  Thane!Now, it seems that will not happen and with this being the last dlc for ME3, well...it never will, apparently!

So aye, even though I have bought every single ME dlc before and though it pains me to say this now, I too, will prefer to watch whatever meagre Thane-relevant content the last dlc contains on Youtube, rather than face even more sorrow and possible agitation at confronting more of the treatment the character got in ME3 yet!:/

Unless I am pleasantly surprised; I would like that and I would like to hope it's still possible!:)I think pretty much all of the Thanemancers would like to hope that!!

Modifié par Hisilome, 01 mars 2013 - 10:28 .

[Resyra]

Hey!

I'm also a Thanemancer from ME2 (I've unlocked him as soon as I reached Illium, I've tried anything to get him as a romance option for my femshep asap and restarted the suicide mission so many times to save him.) and I'd like to see some extra thane content in CItadel DLC, too. But not only just because of having a extra date. I'd like to see a cure for thane as described above! Please Bioware, Fullfill the pledges and wishes of the thanemancers! give him an ending that he deserves! 

Best regards 

Modifié par Resyra, 01 mars 2013 - 10:40 .

[TheRealJayDee]

Dusty Everman wrote...

You can only see something for the first time once.

First things first: nice of you come here and talk to us - it's much appreciated!! (even if the things you say aren't entirely what people might have hoped for)

...

You know what, screw what else I was going to say. No real need for any negativity from my side here. Good to have you here!

[Dusty Everman]

Belyn wrote...
Bioware killed a character. That's all they did. What that character could have been was so much more than that. Too many opportunities lost.

_Heather_Shepard_ wrote...

It is sad, but it is true. A waste of an amazing character. Unbelievable, Bioware.

I'm stepping in here as a fan, not as a dev.

For a long time I wondered if a game could affect me enough to actually get me to cry, to have at least one tear stream down my face. Movies could do it, and I could get immersed in many games enough to affect me very deeply, but never to the degree where I actually teared up.

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when. The other one was Mass Effect 3, when I played it at home after ship. And the scene that did it was Thane's death scene. I'm a sucker for father/son moments, and when I was told the prayer was for me, oh man, it was too much. And it was awesome. It sits as a high moment in gaming for me.

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.



 

[SpamBot2000]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Belyn wrote...
Bioware killed a character. That's all they did. What that character could have been was so much more than that. Too many opportunities lost.

_Heather_Shepard_ wrote...

It is sad, but it is true. A waste of an amazing character. Unbelievable, Bioware.

I'm stepping in here as a fan, not as a dev.

For a long time I wondered if a game could affect me enough to actually get me to cry, to have at least one tear stream down my face. Movies could do it, and I could get immersed in many games enough to affect me very deeply, but never to the degree where I actually teared up.

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when. The other one was Mass Effect 3, when I played it at home after ship. And the scene that did it was Thane's death scene. I'm a sucker for father/son moments, and when I was told the prayer was for me, oh man, it was too much. And it was awesome. It sits as a high moment in gaming for me.

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.



 

Indeed, made me tear up. A very powerful scene. 

So you see, a lot of us that get called 'haters' really loved Mass Effect. Such a shame.

[Thrazesul]

Dusty Everman wrote...

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.

For most of us, it's not the death but how disconnected Thane seems as a LI in ME3. There's a lot of people who has said/explained this a lot better than I ever can, so I'll leave that to them.

As a friend I'm perfectly fine with his death and dying scene, the first time I saw it I did cry.

[Hisilome]

Well,  we're very happy to see you, as you can probably tell!!

Once more, you make some lovely points; I can tell you I was crying like a baby during  the prayer and those last moments before Thane died, it WAS a powerfully given scene; and I like your view of it being a Romeo and Juliet tale-huge fan of Shakesperean plays-I have to say, but...for myself and for many others the fact Thane had to die isn't the reason of our ire and sorrow. The thing is, we all felt the romance arc was lacking; we got no chance to try and save him-even if it failed, to feel our choices mattered to some extent! We came across a Thane in ME3 who was as if reverted to his original ME2 state, you know? Fatalistic, at ease with his death, distanced. And he had changed, his whole personality had, in ME2, if romanced! And Shepard herself is...off-key, as well, as a result.

And of course, the aftermath; Shepard nearly collapses when Thessia falls and when Legion is killed-well, if he is killed, he was in my game, sadly:(-everyone comforts her. Thane, aka the man she loved, dies tragically, and not even a word is uttered, from any squad member.As if he never existed...which really pours salt into an open wound,because you expect something...and you just get silence! 

Modifié par Hisilome, 01 mars 2013 - 11:58 .

[Stilographium]

Dusty Everman wrote...

I'm stepping in here as a fan, not as a dev.

For a long time I wondered if a game could affect me enough to actually get me to cry, to have at least one tear stream down my face. Movies could do it, and I could get immersed in many games enough to affect me very deeply, but never to the degree where I actually teared up.

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when. The other one was Mass Effect 3, when I played it at home after ship. And the scene that did it was Thane's death scene. I'm a sucker for father/son moments, and when I was told the prayer was for me, oh man, it was too much. And it was awesome. It sits as a high moment in gaming for me.

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.

I'm not by any means trying to be rude -- I very much appreciate that you gave us info about Thane's role in the DLC and came to share your opinion, so thank you for that -- but have you read Thanemancers' reasoning of why we felt his treatment in ME3 felt like a wasted opportunity? Personally, I was prepared for a tragic/bittersweet romance when I first recruited Thane in ME2. I knew I would be sad if he died, but that wouldn't come as a surprise. BUT, then we started to get these hints about different ways to prolong Thane's life (for example, he was a viable transplant candidate), and learned that romanced Thane was not anymore at peace with dying. After that, it would seem logical that Thane would, maybe after discussing with Shepard, consider having his life prolonged in some way. Yet in ME3 we had no option to mention the transplant; all Thane talked about was how he was alright with dying again; he didn't care about leaving his dear son and his lover behind; he was nothing more than his illness. So when he died, I wasn't only sad. I felt betrayed and confused. Those hints about a cure in ME2 (and the "Cure for Thane" campaign) didn't need to be there in the first place if they were going to kill Thane anyway.
These are not the only issues we have with Thane's romance in ME3, but I'm trying to keep this short. So thank you again for answering that question about Thane; after everything the Thanemancers have been through, it truly means a lot.

[earendil87]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Ninalupa wrote...
 I'll watch a Thane-romance playthrough on youtube and figure out if I want to go through with it myself from there.

Though I encourage you to wait for feedback from your fellow Thane enthusiasts before making a purchase, I encourage you not to watch it first on YouTube. Games are not movies, and watching something on Youtube just ruins a personal experience.  YouTube is a great venue for seeing the parts of the game you couldn't see for yourself (e.g. I had Wrex alive in my game, but how would this have played out if Wreav was in charge?) But as content devs, we try to craft an experience through pacing and choice.  We hope that you are immersed and in the moment, which can't happen through YouTube. You can only see something for the first time once.

Thanks for stepping into the post, Dusty. I have to say that the reason for people acting like that is precisely the total breaking of immersion that ME3 gives to Thane romancers. Every single scene that involved Thane (as a LI) was a big WTF to me because it was totally inconsistent with ME2. I was not Shepard at those moments, I was someone watching two videogame characters doing something I did not understand. The death scene didn't make me cry out of sadness but out of anger and indignation of how obvious it was that the scene was made for a friend-Thane and BW didn't care about the romance AT ALL. And then there was Thane no more... The only scene that I cried out of excitement was when Shepard remembered Thane before killing Kai Leng.

And I think we all agree in this forum that Thane was well written if you didn't romance him but we're complaining about the other thing. Who's your favourite LI? could you imagine that on the epic end of the trilogy, all excited, you found out that you favourite LI had just one line of romance dialog, he had changed his pesonality 180º, he wasn't even considered a LI anymore and he died in the middle of the game without even a sad date or a love scene? could you imagine that for Liara or Garrus or Kaidan?

Edit: btw, Romeo and Juliet were in love. Thane and Shepard look like two friends who like having casual inapropriate encounters in the middle of the hospital and nothing more. If there was any intention of continuing the Romeo-Juliet thing they had in ME2 I think how it's done in ME3 is not the best way to do it...

Modifié par earendil87, 02 mars 2013 - 12:31 .

[Major Alenko]

I think bringing his character back from the death would be a little over the top and a bit too much to pin your hopes on. I think Thane died at the perfect time in the game. Although I do hope there is a beautiful scene like if you romanced him, could be flashbacks, could be visiting his son. I'm hoping it's his funeral, something beautifully tragic lol

[_Heather_Shepard_]

I also remember reading somewhere where a writer admitted that he "dropped the ball" by killing Thane off. So, I disagree. There were so many different ways that Thane could've been handled. When I romanced him, like the post above, he was afraid to die because he was reconnected withhis son, and had fallen for Shepard. And no, I'm not trying to be rude and insult you, Dusty. It's just that this type of stuff somehow contradicts the Thane in ME3 where he wants to accept death. Even after the hints dropped about the lung transplant in ME2 that built a lot of hope....

[cogsandcurls]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Belyn wrote...
Bioware killed a character. That's all they did. What that character could have been was so much more than that. Too many opportunities lost.

_Heather_Shepard_ wrote...

It is sad, but it is true. A waste of an amazing character. Unbelievable, Bioware.

I'm stepping in here as a fan, not as a dev.

For a long time I wondered if a game could affect me enough to actually get me to cry, to have at least one tear stream down my face. Movies could do it, and I could get immersed in many games enough to affect me very deeply, but never to the degree where I actually teared up.

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when. The other one was Mass Effect 3, when I played it at home after ship. And the scene that did it was Thane's death scene. I'm a sucker for father/son moments, and when I was told the prayer was for me, oh man, it was too much. And it was awesome. It sits as a high moment in gaming for me.

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.



 

I'm glad you got that experience. That was the experience I wanted from this romance. I cried a lot during my first run of ME3. The moment my LI died should have been the moment that hit me hardest, but honestly? It was tempered by annoyance about how the whole coup had played out, and it only got worse once I left the hospital and had someone (either Ash or Steve, I can't recall) do a Citadel wall mourning scene right after, with Shep not saying a word. It got worse again once I got on the ship and my Shep's BFF talked about how great it was that nobody got killed during the coup.

I feel like too often people see Thane's death as sad (which it was), and look at all the people unhappy about it, and decide that every single person who has a problem with it must have a problem with the "sad" part, and while I can't speak for everyone, I can speak for myself: that is not the case. I like tragedy. My first ever Bioware romance experience was one of the most emotionally intense gaming experiences I've ever had in my life, and at the end of her long journey my Warden's LI made a brave decision and died tragically, leaving her alone and bereft. And it was brilliant. To this day it's probably my favourite outcome to a Bioware romance, and although I could have changed the outcome of that particular story (unlike Thane), I didn't, because I liked it so much.

I love tragedy (and yes, the Walking Dead was an absolute masterpiece in such things. Loved it from start to finish). But I like my tragedy to be done well, and given appropriate emotional weight within the story.

[Vlk3]

Sadly, I can't agree. It was a waste of amazing character. We don't hear anything new about the drell, anything new about Thane and his life in this game. He was reduced to the illness and his death, even the assassin part is nearly gone. Multiple retcons in his character (especially romanced). All that counts in this game is his death. And I've read a lot of opinions that people are okay with Thane's death, because he was going to die anyway. It somehow takes away from the experience if you ask me. More emotional are sudden, completely unexpected deaths.
I understand that you didn't play femshep who romanced Thane - to me that dying scene couldn't go more wrong. Shepard shows no emotions, even though she showed a lot of them when the kid had died and when the VS got hurt. I feel that this DLC will address that issue, but it is something that should have been there from the start.

I started ME experience with ME2. First thing I saw was Lazarus Project. Then Mordin finding brilliant solutions, such like cure for plague on Omega or countermeasure for Seeker Swarms. I saw wonderful technology, that made travelling across the galaxy possible. And then someone says that his lungs are failing and it cannot be healed at this moment. On the Normandy he said he was dying, but also that the hanar were working on a cure. I believed that his loyalty mission would be about finding a cure for him and his people. Is it a wrong way to interpret what was said in the game?

Then why there's only one way in ME3? For unloyal, loyal, friended and romanced Thane? Because it is logical outcome or there wasn't enough time or resources to create multiple outcomes? I didn't want it to be too easy. There should be multiple factors that decide whether he'll live or die. I definitely didn't want it to be a situation: do things well and he would live or make stupid mistakes so that he would die. A perfect example of a good and yet optional death is Mordin. You may save him, but you need to sacrifice something. Not all your Sheps will have him alive. Mordin's death was much more emotional to me than Thane's.
It wasn't forced and it felt right, despite its sadness.

Thane died, because he was ill. Nothing was right there, especially since some kind of treatment for him should be available.

But the main point of my post is in truth the fact that both ways of interpreting Thane romance or just his character are valid:
- that he is doomed to die,
- and that by finding friends or even love and reconnecting with his son, Thane finds a reason to live and therefore, he is interested in finding ways to prolong his life, he is no longer seeking death. (the whole point of romancing Thane is seeing the character progression throughout the game, it was well thought, beautiful and meaningful romance and it led me to believe there will be an option)

Sadly, BioWare chose to force only one way of interpreting Thane's romance, it seems there was no one who really cared for his character. Too bad that Chris L'Etoile left BioWare.
BioWare chose to force only the 'emo' outcome, even though they knew a lot of people wanted Thane to be cured. They purposely dissapointed a lot of people, majority of them being female part of the fanbase.

Would it hurt so much to make a not-obvious way to let Thane survive the game?
Would it hurt so much to leave Thane situation unresolved so people who want a tragic romance could decide that he didn't live long enough to receive a cure?

And how anyone thinks, how does it feel, when your favourite character and your Shepard's canon LI dies early in the game with no possibility to save him?

It COMPLETELY ruined the game. Sorry, but life is hard out there, I don't need games to teach me that. I need them for escape, for entertainment. I'm not entertained.

Modifié par Vlk3, 02 mars 2013 - 12:44 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

cogsandcurls wrote...
I love tragedy (and yes, the Walking Dead was an absolute masterpiece in such things. Loved it from start to finish). But I like my tragedy to be done well, and given appropriate emotional weight within the story.

This.  As someone who's watched plenty of Joss Whedon, AND is an avid fan of A Song of Ice and Fire, I'm pretty used to seeing beloved characters get the axe.  Here's the thing, though; a well-done character death comes with a complete character arc, good writing, and an end that means something for the story.  Mordin's death in the Tuchanka arc was an excellent example of how to do character death, and if Thane had gotten a storyline in ME3 like that, I'd be much more OK with his mandatory death.

[Maera Imrov]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when.

 

Brief offtopic for me, but my b/f had the same reaction to that game. He gets involved emotionally in movies, games, books all the time, but they seldom make him actually shed a tear. He says that TWD definitely did it for him. He praised the storytelling in that game enough to almost convince me to buy it, and that's not usually my thing, the zombie stuff. I've seen a few episodes of the show and it looks pretty interesting, though, so I may have to actually look into buying the game.

[crimzontearz]

uh.....I never had a loved one be murdered but I would not want it to happen let alone REPEAT the experience multiple times because it elicited an emotional response


does the nature of the response count for nothing?????

[Renmiri1]

Dusty Everman wrote...

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.

First of all, thank you for being here. Means a lot.

Second, as you said, he wasn't your LI and when you find out the prayer is for you, it hits you right in the feels. Because you weren't expecting it. Nor should you. Thane was a buddy, a friend, a mentor but not an Li, to have his last thought be for you is powerful indeed.

And that was done at the expense of the Thanemancers. Romeo and Juliet ? Does Romeo kill himself for any other person in Verona ? Does Juliet ? No, they were in love with each other and went through hell to keep their love alive. When they couldn't their last thought wasn't for a friend, a buddy, a mentor or a shipmate. It was for their LI.

So we Thanemancers who braved a doomed tragic romance and knew there would be tears coming got the exact same content that the male Shep who is going to boink Liara and leave the DLC full of blue babies. Everyone got the same content we Thanemancers did. Everyone got the prayer. And we got cheated out of a content we suffered for. We didn't romance anyone easier, we didn't cheat on Thane with Kaidan, Liara, Ailers, etc.. and got the same content that people who didn't even have to like Thane got.

So when some fan tells me "Thane's death was awesome", I can't help but feel kicked in the shin. Because no, it wasn't awesome, it was very painful and the fan who loves it didn't "pay any price" for it. He romanced a happy LI, he will get several more scenes that I don't get, and he wants to keep the scene that was excruciatingly painful to me. Sure, I'd love to have Liara on her death bed saying her last thought is for Shepard, even if all I do on the Normandy is try to avoid her stalking. It is fun to get gratuitous affection you don't pay any emotional price for. I might even shed some tears for that deathbed Liara. And then go happily have a date with my green man.. Oh wait. I can't. You can, any fan can but me. 

Modifié par Renmiri1, 02 mars 2013 - 01:50 .

[Nykara]

Dusty Everman wrote...

devSin wrote...

Dusty Everman wrote...

There's a whole lot of could-be-dead characters we need to account for, and as far as I know, we fixed all those type bugs before ship.

Wasn't there still a bug where zombie-Tali would visit Shepard's quarters before the attack on Cronos (even though she jumped off a cliff on Rannoch)?

Only four more days! Looking forward to it (I'm going to try to guess your combat area, but I can't imagine how I'd be able to tell at this point).

Oooo, that does sound familiar.  I think we fixed that in a later DLC or patch, didn't we?

When people say your choices don't  really matter in ME, it always kills me a little inside.  We spent so much time making the game work for everyones own experience.  Choices you make two games earlier can change what you see in ME3.  What other game has done that?  It's a testing nightmare.  I tip my hat and bow deeply in gratitude to the QA teams of Mass Effect.

I can't wait to talk to you about the DLC once its been released to the wild!

I wont doubt that there are a few things that have made a difference to ME3. Like seeing Kelly not seeing Kelly. Seeing Conrad and not seeing him etc but honestly those are pretty minor compaired to the *major* choices that often got overlooked or glossed over. Things like, for example the council, no matter what choice you made in ME1 one way or another you get another citadel council. It might not be the same people but there is a council in place again non the less, humans are no longer in charge - that was a pretty major decision which now seems pointless.

I can't speak for the EC which I have not bothered to play however - in the original version of the ending the war assests also had a very very minor impact - numbers only that said if crew members lived or died and that was all. None of the actual war assests where seen.

Probably the most well done decision that DID have an impact was the difference between Wrex and Wreave and that was about all that comes to mind. When it comes to the big choices nothing had an impact on the *ending* outcome of the game, again other then a crew member living or dying and the breath scene if you did happen to choose destroy, that's it. Surely you have to see why all these *major* decisions along the way during this game ended up coming across as completely pointless and why did we even bother making them type of decisions because at the end it made no difference what so ever - all three endings sucked no matter what we did before and so many choices seemed to have been glossed over or ignored completely. The *end* game counts only it didn't count at all. Nothing made any worthwhile difference to the crappy ending of the game.

I am not saying all those small variations within the game wouldn't have been difficult to keep track of and add in. I am sure they did. Why.. why go to all that effort for small decisions to ignore the larger more important ones?

[Big stupid jellyfish]

Dusty Everman wrote...

Belyn wrote...
Bioware killed a character. That's all they did. What that character could have been was so much more than that. Too many opportunities lost.

_Heather_Shepard_ wrote...

It is sad, but it is true. A waste of an amazing character. Unbelievable, Bioware.

I'm stepping in here as a fan, not as a dev.

For a long time I wondered if a game could affect me enough to actually get me to cry, to have at least one tear stream down my face. Movies could do it, and I could get immersed in many games enough to affect me very deeply, but never to the degree where I actually teared up.

Then last year not one, but two games got me to cry. One was Telltale's: The Walking Dead, and I don't want to spoil anything by saying when. The other one was Mass Effect 3, when I played it at home after ship. And the scene that did it was Thane's death scene. I'm a sucker for father/son moments, and when I was told the prayer was for me, oh man, it was too much. And it was awesome. It sits as a high moment in gaming for me.

To say that was a waste of an amazing character, I personally have to disagree. My love for Thane lead me to an emotional experience that I hadn't encounter before in a game. It is sad that Thane was gone, but that in part is what made it special to me. I do acknowledge that he wasn't my love interest, but I think if he was, I would have had the expectation that it was a romance destined for tragedy.  It's a Romeo and Juliet tale; It's a bitter sweet ending.  I say this as a fan, and not speaking officially for BioWare.  It's just my opinion.


 

I see where you are coming from, Dusty.


As a Thanemancer, I actually liked the death scene itself. It might be surprising to hear, but I just liked the fact that Shepard is very distant in that scene, as if she's losing a squadmate and a friend, but not a loved one. That was in-character for my Shepard who is having attachment issues, so, *I* was okay with the dialogue in that particular moment.

Still, please consider following points, for example:

-- the nature of Thane's ilness was changed in ME3 without any explanation or reason
-- the character was changed: Thane goes from fearing death and wanting to live to accepting death, and there is no explanation as to why this happened, and no chance for Shepard to bring this up and ask why Thane changed so much in the six month they haven't seen each other
-- no matter whether you are romancing Thane or not Shepard would say she's there in the hospital to visit Kaidan/Ashley
-- there are many hints at possible cure/treatment in ME2 and CDN, yet, they were completely dropped in ME3
-- we get only one dialogue with Thane, Citadel coup aside, even though Thane was not bedridden and we could have had a date in a cafe, for example
-- no one mentions Thane's death except for Kai Leng ("Your friend Thane died like a coward"), and Shepard doesn't have an option to discuss and mourn it, the death scene aside; the squadmates who were with Shepard during the coup apparently don't care either

That are some of the reasons Thane fans are not happy with what they have got in ME3.

Modifié par Big stupid jellyfish, 02 mars 2013 - 04:13 .