1904 réponses à ce sujet

[Sable Rhapsody]

Can we drop the hooplah over the bomb threat? No one in their right mind condones that sort of behavior. Period. No amount of anger or frustration excuses it, and no one person's actions characterize a fanbase.

[RShara]

If there were a free DLC to fix (at least) the glitches in Thane's storyline, I might consider buying some of the paid DLC.

But that'll never happen so meh.

[radishson]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Can we drop the hooplah over the bomb threat? No one in their right mind condones that sort of behavior. Period. No amount of anger or frustration excuses it, and no one person's actions characterize a fanbase.

Uh, yeah, obviously.  No one else here seems to agree.

[Renmiri1]

radishson wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Can we drop the hooplah over the bomb threat? No one in their right mind condones that sort of behavior. Period. No amount of anger or frustration excuses it, and no one person's actions characterize a fanbase.

Uh, yeah, obviously.  No one else here seems to agree.

WTF ?

[RShara]

Let's just drop it. I don't think we're understanding each other and it's not relevant to this topic.

[Sister Goldring]

RShara,

Hi sorry for the poor word choice, I didn't mean to imply that requesting more content was petty. Rather I wanted to express the feeling that personally I'm ok with getting only one scene but if that's all the time we're going to be given to explore the romance then that one interaction needs to be fulfilling and give the player the emotional hit they need to feel that the romance has weight for their character. I hope that's a little clearer.

Modifié par Sister Goldring, 02 mars 2013 - 09:40 .

[Renmiri1]

Well I'll just link 3 of my posts saying that we don't condone violence or threats. Apparently they are invisible.
http://social.biowar...035/37#16099203
http://social.biowar...035/36#16099067
http://social.biowar...035/38#16099398

[Eterna]

JECW wrote...

radishson wrote...

Squeegee83 wrote...

I thought Patrick W. and Chris P. both retweeted this on Twitter? No?

Just looked it up and yes, this is true.  It was also retweeted by Jessica Merizan.  And, uh... not sure if you guys heard about it but apparently a thane fan also tweeted/sent out/talked about bombing Bioware, or the devs or something, here's a link to a twitter convo Merizan had with a fan -- https://twitter.com/...389611276115968

Well... I guess we got the DLC sh!tstorm everyone was expecting, only four days early.

No it was not a Thane fan.
 She has no idea who it was.

Lets be honest here, it was a Thane fan. 

[RShara]

wtf

[Eterna]

RShara wrote...

wtf

Who else is pissed off about a specific characters treatment right now in the next dlc? 

Modifié par Eterna5, 02 mars 2013 - 09:41 .

[Ananka]

Just drop it. It doesn't really matter what fanbase they're part of. People like that can unfortunately be found in all fanbases. It doesn't mean they're representative of the fanbase, nor that the entire fanbase should take responsibility for their threats. Let's just drop it and move on.

Back to thread topic:



A) Will we get Thane content?
If so what gameplay conditions need to be met to save Thane from death by Kai Leng?
C) Have Bioware forgotten us?

Modifié par Annaka, 02 mars 2013 - 09:45 .

[RShara]

You realize that someone psycho enough to send a legit threat can take any tiny irritant and blow it out of proportion to the point where that sort of threat seems reasonable to them, right?

It could be someone who's upset Miranda is still infertile, that Jacob still dumps Shep, that Joker wasn't a LI, that the ending still sucks, that there aren't little blue babies.

The list goes on and on and NONE of it is reasonable.

[Sable Rhapsody]

RShara wrote...

If there were a free DLC to fix (at least) the glitches in Thane's storyline, I might consider buying some of the paid DLC.

But that'll never happen so meh.

There's no such thing as free DLC; the time, money, and resources that go into each piece of DLC cost the developers.  They already gave us the EC, and IMO that was a pretty decent sign of goodwill.

So now moving forward to address some of the other problems people had with ME3: Should the ME2 LIs have gotten fairer screentime in the game as shipped?  Yes.  Should that be something that costs extra money as DLC?  Arguably not.  But no game is ever shipped perfect, and I'd rather they address problems with paid DLC than not at all.  

As for Thane, IMO this last piece of paid DLC would've been the perfect opportunity to fix the issues with his romance and Jacob's, but it looks like the DLC isn't even going to touch the game.  Citadel looks to be its own self-contained thing, like Omega.  IMO that's a wasted opportunity, but it also might be due to restraints about the DLC itself, or how it's distributed, or even how the game is built.  We simply don't know.

[radishson]

Eterna5 wrote...

RShara wrote...

wtf

Who else is pissed off about a specific characters treatment right now in the next dlc? 

this.  If you guys are struggling this desperately over flowing any sort of legitimate criticism away from yourselves, that's signs of a larger problem.  There needs to be accountability when people start making death threats.  That is really not an unreasonable expectation.

And who the **** cares what we talk about here anymore?  The thread has almost hit 1000 posts despite the fact it was pretty obvious from day one that Thane was getting the shaft.

edit:

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

As for Thane, IMO this last piece of paid DLC would've been the perfect opportunity to fix the issues with his romance and Jacob's, but it looks like the DLC isn't even going to touch the game.  Citadel looks to be its own self-contained thing, like Omega.  IMO that's a wasted opportunity, but it also might be due to restraints about the DLC itself, or how it's distributed, or even how the game is built.  We simply don't know.

Yeah, I doubt even the other LIs will have material outside of the DLC.  One of the devs commented that it was 'pretty obvious when the DLC ended and normal play resumed'.

Modifié par radishson, 02 mars 2013 - 09:54 .

[RShara]

Sorry, I'm way past the point of giving Bioware the benefit of the doubt at this point.
Fixing the glitches, such as you can actually say you're at the Citadel to see Thane, Shepard can tell Thane she loves him, and unlocking the paramour achievement with Thane should be fixes (what I'm calling DLC), not something you have to pay for.

[David7204]

That doesn't sound like a glitch.

[KiwiQuiche]

Ah, that drell

[Sable Rhapsody]

RShara wrote...

Sorry, I'm way past the point of giving Bioware the benefit of the doubt at this point.
Fixing the glitches, such as you can actually say you're at the Citadel to see Thane, Shepard can tell Thane she loves him, and unlocking the paramour achievement with Thane should be fixes (what I'm calling DLC), not something you have to pay for.

Those are not glitches.  Journal doesn't display quests correctly?  That's a glitch.  Banter in engineering being flagged wrong?  That's a glitch.  What you are describing are not so much glitches as deliberate oversights for Thane's romance.  For better or worse, it's intended behavior that Thane doesn't give Paramour, and so on.

Changing those would mean DLC that follows in the footsteps of the EC: changing the game as shipped.  Not adding to it, not fixing a few plot flags, changing it.  That's something that does not seem to be within the scope of Citadel.  And I think it's unreasonable to ascribe that to deliberate maliciousness when we know so little "behind the scenes," so to speak.

[RShara]

Conrad Verner's conversation problem was considered a glitch, this is the same type of thing--not recognizing relationship flags correctly.

I don't think that the writers WANTED to cut the two least numerous fanbases out of the content, but they had to and they chose what they wanted. It's either cutting corners, or pure negligence. Neither one should be something that the consumer has to pay for to be corrected.

I'm not saying that Citadel should be free. I've said repeatedly that if they fixed the problems with Thane, I would immediately buy ALL the DLC that they have released, to show my support of their willingness to fix their mistakes.

What I'm saying is that some small "fixes" put out for free would encourage me to purchase *some* DLC regardless of whether they do everything I want or not.

[Renmiri1]

radishson wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

RShara wrote...

wtf

Who else is pissed off about a specific characters treatment right now in the next dlc? 

this. *snip*.  There needs to be accountability when people start making death threats.  That is really not an unreasonable expectation.

I agree radishon

But forgive me if I don't jump to crucify people before I know more details. Jessica never even mentioned Thane's name. 

She never said if the threat was on her inbox, snail mail, deviantart, BSN thread, etc... 

I told you the reason I find it hard to believe Jessica was referring to myth's post on deviantart.  I don't think I'm being unreasonable for waiting to hear more details before I jump to conclusions.

The most important thing for the entire community to do was to make it very clear that threats are not condoned or acceptable. And every single Thane fan posting here has said this.

I don't see us being unreasonable. We condemned the bomb threat in very clear statements. We dug into our conscience and found some hot headed posts and explained that we never meant harm. What we have refused to do is pass judgement before getting more details. That is just common sense.

Modifié par Renmiri1, 02 mars 2013 - 10:07 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

RShara wrote...
Conrad Verner's conversation problem was considered a glitch, this is the same type of thing--not recognizing relationship flags correctly.

Hmm, I should clarify.  It's not the same kind of thing as Conrad Verner.  For Conrad's ME2 conversation, it's intended behavior that Conrad reacts differently to Paragon vs. Renegade Shepard.  He doesn't react as intended because the import flags get messed up.  That's a fairly simple fix: tick the correct box.

For ME3 Thane, there's no box to tick, no bug to fix.  Whether you're in a romance or not, loyal or not, the game was never at any point designed for him to react to Shepard differently apart from a few lines.  Was it a mistake in design?  Yes, but not a glitch.

I'm picking over this detail because there's a huge difference between fixing a glitch (the way one patch fixed the engineering banter bug) and fixing something that is not a glitch, but still a problem for Thanemancers.  One is a matter of getting the game to behave the way you intended.  The other can be much harder.  And maybe that's an amount of work that simply wasn't feasible in even paid DLC like Citadel.  It certainly wouldn't be something you'd see for free in a patch.

[RShara]

Oh I realize the difference, but to me, these oversights ought to be corrected as a courtesy. That's just my opinion though, feel free to ignore it I feel that mistakes/oversights and glitches should be treated the same way.

I can't say for sure the difficulty of doing so, but from my understanding of programming (which is enough to understand architecture) inserting triggers and dialogue, in the modal way that ME3 is designed, isn't an impossible or horribly difficult task.
Yes, it'd take up resources, and would only be something a (relatively) small part of the fanbase would appreciate, which is why I know it wouldn't happen. Any more than a good romance arc for Thane will ever happen in ME3.

[Renmiri1]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

RShara wrote...
Conrad Verner's conversation problem was considered a glitch, this is the same type of thing--not recognizing relationship flags correctly.

Hmm, I should clarify.  It's not the same kind of thing as Conrad Verner.  For Conrad's ME2 conversation, it's intended behavior that Conrad reacts differently to Paragon vs. Renegade Shepard.  He doesn't react as intended because the import flags get messed up.  That's a fairly simple fix: tick the correct box.

For ME3 Thane, there's no box to tick, no bug to fix.  Whether you're in a romance or not, loyal or not, the game was never at any point designed for him to react to Shepard differently apart from a few lines.  Was it a mistake in design?  Yes, but not a glitch.

I'm picking over this detail because there's a huge difference between fixing a glitch (the way one patch fixed the engineering banter bug) and fixing something that is not a glitch, but still a problem for Thanemancers.  One is a matter of getting the game to behave the way you intended.  The other can be much harder.  And maybe that's an amount of work that simply wasn't feasible in even paid DLC like Citadel.  It certainly wouldn't be something you'd see for free in a patch.

Not that complicated actually. I myself changed the flow of the convo with Thane just messing with binary codes on the PCC file

[Renmiri1]

Isn't it ironic how EVERYONE just KNOWS this bomb threat is about Thane yet Bioware and BSN alike think it is completely fine to refuse to fix the obviously flawed, anger inducing content for Thane that so painfully obviously unbalanced in relation to other fandoms ?

BW: Someone is so angry with their character treatment they made a Bomb threat
Thane fan: Is it about Thane ?
BSN: DUH!
BW: DUH!

BW1: We need to give more content with LIs but can't spend much money
BW2: Cut Thane again ?
BW1: DUH!

And everyone knows and pretends it isn't happening.

Thane Fan: Thane content is severely inadequate, short, badly written..
BSN: It's fine get over it.
Thane Fan: But.. but..
BSN: U Mad Bro ?
Thane Fan: DUH!

<_<

Modifié par Renmiri1, 02 mars 2013 - 10:34 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

RShara wrote...
Oh I realize the difference, but to me, these oversights ought to be corrected as a courtesy. That's just my opinion though, feel free to ignore it I feel that mistakes/oversights and glitches should be treated the same way.

I can't say for sure the difficulty of doing so, but from my understanding of programming (which is enough to understand architecture) inserting triggers and dialogue, in the modal way that ME3 is designed, isn't an impossible or horribly difficult task.
Yes, it'd take up resources, and would only be something a (relatively) small part of the fanbase would appreciate, which is why I know it wouldn't happen. Any more than a good romance arc for Thane will ever happen in ME3.

That's fair.  I'd like the freaking journal system (which is still terribly unhelpful) to be corrected as a courtesy too.

As for the feasibility of fixing Thane, there's more to it than just programming.  There always is, unfortunately.  Maybe there was a design decision a long time ago not to touch the base game after EC.  Maybe there was never a chance to fix any of the oversights with this DLC.  Maybe the EC only worked because it patched one very discrete part of the game, and was mostly cinematics.  Who knows?  Personally, I find it easier to give the devs the benefit of the doubt than to believe it's deliberate laziness or maliciousness.  But that might just be naivete on my part