242 réponses à ce sujet

[o Ventus]

Redbelle wrote...

So I'll just ask, did you propose radiation kills Shepard?

or

Did someone else propose radiation kills Shepard?

or

Was Radiation mentioned in some context.

1. No.
2. As far as I'm aware, no.
3. Yes, but only in passing. I mentioned radiation as something kinetic barriers do not protect against.

I'm aware that Shepard survives. My point is that the scene in which it is depicted is absurdly defiant of medical logic.

[crimzontearz]

Alanosborn1991 wrote...

Isaac Clarke gets a bad ending too. He kisses Ellie goodbye while he and his dude bro Vega partner blow up a moon falling into a planet. Now they are both floating in space, yay.

he calls for Ellie after the credits

[Karlone123]

I couldn't say I knew what would really happen in the ending, but I could easily guess that Shepard could die. I was just hoping at least Shepard would go down with a LI or a close friend like Garrus, instead of dying alone which made me feel sad.

Modifié par Karlone123, 26 février 2013 - 12:37 .

[chemiclord]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

At this point, Bioware has washed their hands of the whole thing and has declared that each individual player can decide Shepard's fate. If you don't like what you've conjured up, that problem is yours.

As insulting that is to me on an authorial level (a writer throwing up his hands and saying the audience decides IS a cheap cop-out), I also have no sympathy for the fans who had been screaming "IT'S OUR STORY TOO!!!" then get even MORE pissed off when they're given the prompt and told, "Yep. Here ya go. Make it your story."

Well, this reminds me to get back to writing that score for MEHEM. I wanted Shep to survive and a reunion. It's a work in progress, so we're going to make it look professional. Everything is head canon at this point so I guess it's as valid as anything else.

The only thing that really bothers me about the MEHEM is that it completely cuts out the Catalyst.  As awful as it is presented, It inherently irks me when author's intent is thumbed at and blatantly rejected.  If I were writing the mod, I'd DEFINITELY rewrite that entire scene (because my GOD is it a mess), but I wouldn't cut it entirely.

Modifié par chemiclord, 26 février 2013 - 01:05 .

[ManiacG]

^ why not? the catalyst had no place there to begin with, he has no backstory (unless you pay for leviathan) and to me at least just feels out of place and jarring to my immersion, but to each his own.

[SurfaceBeneath]

My Shepard uploaded their mind into a Machine God and now gets to watch over the Galaxy as its protector forever. I'm cool with my Shepard's fate.

[chemiclord]

ManiacG wrote...

^ why not? the catalyst had no place there to begin with, he has no backstory (unless you pay for leviathan) and to me at least just feels out of place and jarring to my immersion, but to each his own.

Oh, I think it's God-awful too (there's some potential there had it been done right, but alas it couldn't have been done worse).  But nonetheless, the creators wanted that character there and I don't think it's right for fans to say, "**** that.  We know your story better than you!"

[OH-UP-THIS!]

Who here has ABSOLUTE CONCLUSIVE PROOF about Sheps' fate??

Shove the 'blue' or 'green' conclusions, where the sun doesn't shine, and show me FACT-BASED info, about her/his fate, after shootin' the tube.

[Dr_Extrem]

chemiclord wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

At this point, Bioware has washed their hands of the whole thing and has declared that each individual player can decide Shepard's fate. If you don't like what you've conjured up, that problem is yours.

As insulting that is to me on an authorial level (a writer throwing up his hands and saying the audience decides IS a cheap cop-out), I also have no sympathy for the fans who had been screaming "IT'S OUR STORY TOO!!!" then get even MORE pissed off when they're given the prompt and told, "Yep. Here ya go. Make it your story."

Well, this reminds me to get back to writing that score for MEHEM. I wanted Shep to survive and a reunion. It's a work in progress, so we're going to make it look professional. Everything is head canon at this point so I guess it's as valid as anything else.

The only thing that really bothers me about the MEHEM is that it completely cuts out the Catalyst.  As awful as it is presented, It inherently irks me when author's intent is thumbed at and blatantly rejected.  If I were writing the mod, I'd DEFINITELY rewrite that entire scene (because my GOD is it a mess), but I wouldn't cut it entirely.

tbh ... i dont care about the writers intent when it comes to this scene. i would normally dont do it either but this ... thing .. is something different, since its presence alone disturbs my perception of the enitre meu. its existance brings up questions - questions regarding the first 2 games and the answers to them, are not pleasant.


how would you rewrite it?

(i really am curious)

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 26 février 2013 - 01:28 .

[Kais Endac]

XTR3M3 wrote...

While the ending(s) would have been fine for a book or movie, not having a "happy" ending option for a game that always was hyped as "choice" sucked. They can stick to their "artistic integrity" all they want but having a happy ending option to go with the options already there would have made me excited about the next game. As of now, I am just "Ho, hum" about it.

I appreciated the EC but I only played it once to see what it was. I never play the ending anymore since downers aren't my thing.

This is exactly how I feel, Instead of being exited about ME3 and any news for it I just feel.....meh. I prefer happy endnings too or at least an ending with more detail than shepard lying in the rubble.

I do like some of the darker endings and will choose them at least once to experience them. But I will always choose the happier ending as canon. The same with films and books I will read them even if I know the hero dies in the end but I will probably never read it again unless the story is exceptional.

Right now (since the 360 is my primary ME runthrough) I will only play the ending to priority earth then turn the game off. It may be shallow but right now the only problem I have with Mass Effect 3 is that they don't expand on sheps fate post destroy.

I would have even settled for a scene with him being sifted out of the rubble and someone yelling "I've found shepard he's alive" 

[AlanC9]

chemiclord wrote...

The only thing that really bothers me about the MEHEM is that it completely cuts out the Catalyst.  As awful as it is presented, It inherently irks me when author's intent is thumbed at and blatantly rejected.  If I were writing the mod, I'd DEFINITELY rewrite that entire scene (because my GOD is it a mess), but I wouldn't cut it entirely.

Catalyst or no, wasn't having to make a morally troubling choice also part of the intent? 

Edit: I'm just not sure the design objectives can be reconciled.

Modifié par AlanC9, 26 février 2013 - 02:12 .

[DeinonSlayer]

ohupthis wrote...

Who here has ABSOLUTE CONCLUSIVE PROOF about Sheps' fate??

Shove the 'blue' or 'green' conclusions, where the sun doesn't shine, and show me FACT-BASED info, about her/his fate, after shootin' the tube.

Nobody has it - and that's the whole point. It is what you want it to be. No more, no less, no fuss. Not saying it couldn't have been handled better (much better), but that's the intent of the scene.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 26 février 2013 - 01:59 .

[crimzontearz]

ohupthis wrote...

Who here has ABSOLUTE CONCLUSIVE PROOF about Sheps' fate??

Shove the 'blue' or 'green' conclusions, where the sun doesn't shine, and show me FACT-BASED info, about her/his fate, after shootin' the tube.

before the interpretation BS started the project lead said Shepard survived....then the numbers started talking....

[l7986]

Dont like Shepard's fate, but I've moved on from my butthurt status. Now I just read fanfiction and pretend nothing happened.

Modifié par l7986, 26 février 2013 - 02:39 .

[chemiclord]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

tbh ... i dont care about the writers intent when it comes to this scene. i would normally dont do it either but this ... thing .. is something different, since its presence alone disturbs my perception of the enitre meu. its existance brings up questions - questions regarding the first 2 games and the answers to them, are not pleasant.

how would you rewrite it?

(i really am curious)

First of all, I'd drop the cooperative attitude the Catalyst.  This is a being that should be looking down on this insignificant insect that dares question its conclusions.  It has billions of years and countless cycles of experience to tell it its correct in said conclusions.  This... mere child... has what?  A short term cooperation of synthetic and organic races that will last a blink of an eye in the cosmic scale?  Color the Catalyst not impressed.

Second of all, I'd adjust the premise slightly so that it wasn't so much organic/synthetic conflict, instead conflict in general.  Then all sorts of evidence comes into play.  The Rachni Wars (and the systematic extermination of a sentient species)... the Krogan Rebellions (and subsequent Genopage).  To hell with organic/synthetic... organic/organic is just as capable of exterminating all life in the galaxy.

And THAT'S the point I'd have run with.  As quick to war as species in this galaxy are, it's only a matter of time before they reach a point where ALL life (advanced or not) is at risk.  The Catalyst stops that from happening by harvesting advanced races before they reach that point.  And it's first target was the Leviathans who designed it.

It's a simplistic theme... but let's be honest, ME as a whole wasn't exactly Asmiov to begin with.  It doesn't need (and probably shouldn't be) all that complex.

I'd also alter the consequences of each choice as well... but that's kinda nitpicking and this post is already getting too long as it is.  If you want I can expand later.

[ofarrell]

After the breath scene I envision my Shepard kind of just disappearing into myth and legend, nobody really knows where he is (most likely with Tali)

[Redbelle]

AlanC9 wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

The only thing that really bothers me about the MEHEM is that it completely cuts out the Catalyst.  As awful as it is presented, It inherently irks me when author's intent is thumbed at and blatantly rejected.  If I were writing the mod, I'd DEFINITELY rewrite that entire scene (because my GOD is it a mess), but I wouldn't cut it entirely.

Catalyst or no, wasn't having to make a morally troubling choice also part of the intent? 

Edit: I'm just not sure the design objectives can be reconciled.

Unfortunately the mod author can only work with the assets available. Re-writing the scene is an answer, but it's an answer that lie's outside of the fan's ability to create on account that a rewrite implies changing the dialogue of the character's and the voice actor's are not available to do that. Also the sound recording studio is not available, and the programmer's are not available.

The MEHEM therefore had to work with what it had, and as many said a year ago, the simplest solution to the problem of the Catalyst is to remove him from the equation. The Reaper's then stay Reaper's we know of as opposed to being tool's of a higher douchy intelligence.

A troubling choice may have been a desire. But the intent that followed us through 3 game's was to beat the Reaper's in such a way that they either leave with their tail between their leg's, or are outright destroyed. Ignoring the implication's of what the RGB choice's do destroying the Reaper's was alway's the goal. Narratively, to suddenly have a new character and a choice flung at us at the last minute was a mistake as these thing's distract us from Shepard's singluar goal by suddenly throwing more information than we need at us. Shepard uses Crucible to kill Reaper's. Simple story telling at the end of a narrative.

The MEHEM accomplishes this.

[78stonewobble]

I'm kinda ambivalent... Or moist. I often get those 2 confused.

In My Humble Oppinion:

Chance of defeating Reapers: 0.00001 %
Chance of defeating Reapers and living: 0.0000001 %.

I don't get that people see Shepard as living as incredibly unrealistic when winning at all is allmost equally unrealistic.

With that in mind I'd have thought the only "realistic" way for the game to go was for the only win to be if you could make sure the next cycle had enough information to defeat the reapers.

And an extremely rare and difficult win that lets your cycle survive via I don't know a magical device that can affect all the Reapers through the relays. Lets call it a space anti reaper emp or killswitch.

PS: It's not so much that Shepard dies, but that it seems so pointless in the context of the story and it's not really emotionally engaging as compaired to if it was a loveinterest or squadmates that had to be sacrificed.

Modifié par 78stonewobble, 26 février 2013 - 07:51 .

[shodiswe]

Actualy... if well made enough even and ending where the catalyst is some kind of super hologram that beats up shepard, tells shepard it's bored with organics and this galaxy and that it has deleted the purpose assigned by the leviathans, then it kills Shepard witha little flicker of light then all Reapers fly off...

People around the galaxy would still say: Shepard Won! We won!

Shepards fate matters very little to me as much as I like my shepard... Life isn't fair. However I do expect the story beign told to be good and make some kind of sense.
I really think priority earth could have been better, the endings with the catalyst coudl have been more dramtic or interesting.

[Brovikk Rasputin]

Perfectly fine with it all.

[Meltemph]

How do people feel about Shepard's fate?

Completely indifferent. This was the last story of Shepard, how they decided to finish his journey into the Mass Effect Universe was not near as a concern as how they were going to wrap his story up, as it pertains to the integrity of the Universe itself. As it stands, since the endings fractured the setting into 3 irreconcilable differences, the setting has no future, in terms of "after ME3".

Whatever happened to Shep after, is inconsequential at this point.

[Hadeedak]

If there's one thing I really liked, it's that as far as we know, the last words Shepard got out were "What do you need me to do?" Then eventually, the Crucible fires or... not. And maybe Shep lives and shows up. But as far as last words, they feel pretty apt.

[AshenShug4r]

IsaacShep wrote...

AshenShug4r wrote...

That said, I'm a little disappointed because I believe his death/survival should depend on the choices made by the gamer.

I have good news for you, he survives in highest version of Destroy {smilie}

AlanC9 wrote...

AshenShug4r wrote...


That said, I'm a little disappointed because I believe his death/survival should depend on the choices made by the gamer.

It does.

Debatable. A bunch of devs have different opinions.

[Teddie Sage]

Betrayed.

There's nothing more that comes into my mind.

[Massa FX]

How do I feel?

Same today as March/April of last year. But a whole lot less vocal about it. ME is still the best video game series in history (for me) and I'll always despise the endings.

I feel sad. Still.