267 réponses à ce sujet

[Dorick]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Lathlaer wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Feirefiz1972 wrote...

I would expect this to be more true for the krogan, he will have damage reduction from tech armor, damage reduction from rage mode, regenerating health, lots of health and shields, the ability to run and he can use hard cover. The geth on the otherhand might just turn out to be a sitting duck, yes he can deploy cover, but that will keep him protected from one side only. He is going to need all the shields and health he has.

he can still get sync killed. 
He is pretty powerful, I dont see him being very popular for some reason. 

You are giving this sync kill immunity a lot more credit than it deserves. As if it was a main cause of death for players. Which bewilders me because you are an experienced platinum player. Perhaps you are so good that you only die when you get surprised by a lost banshee quickly teleporting through the wall or a phantom sneaking behind your back, but I suspect most deaths in game are caused by traditional overwhelming gunfire.

having to avoid sync kill drastically controls your DPS options, since you have constant pressure from banshees and phantoms. With no fear of them, you can just walk forward, keep your turret up, and do whatever you want. If you are in danger, shoot some scorpion rounds on the ground as you walk backwards until you can place a wall. 

You only fear sync kills if you do not know how to play offensively under pressure while controlling aggro. With a fast kit, you can around in circles killing stuff not even bothering with the 2 banshees chasing you because you are on the move.

This isnt about fear or talent, its about possibility. The Jugg is the only kit that can walk up to two phantoms and take them down without having to work to avoid sync kill/stagger. That's a big deal. Skilled players will always keep their DPS up, the point of the nerf is that this kit requires significantly less skill, bc it has too many advantages. 

Modifié par Dorick, 25 février 2013 - 09:13 .

[tux2197]

dude chill out if you look closely you can see he cant barrel roll no cover hes just a walking tank plus hes slow movement should make him easy prey on plat oh gold so just wait for him to come out then cry all you want

[TtOATMEALtT]

Can a mod please lock this troll's thread. The conversation is not going anywhere because of the stubborn nature of the OP, and this is by far one of the biggest waste of Internet storage space I've seen in a long, long time.
If anything should be nerfed it should be your ability to post, OP. every post I've seen you make has been nothing less than stubborn fact-less whining. The only way I see a Bioware (and btw that is how you spell their company's name) is if they wanted something to point and laugh at.
Also most people see as a troll because the dlc has yet to be released. If you are going whine and complain about something, then wait until someone can actually use it.

That is all the time I am going to waste on this rediculas thread, and I don't care if you respond to this OP, you may continue waste your and everyone else's time but not mine.

[LGear]

Dorick wrote...
he can still get sync killed. 

As is 99% of all the kits, and yet most of them are still used in Platinum. In fact, for any player in Gold or Platinum, sync kills should be the rarest cause of death, since playing at Gold and Platinum requires you to have situational awareness to avoid situations where you can get gibbed. The moment you're sync-killed at Gold or Platinum, you've done something very, very wrong. 

The majority of deaths at higher difficulties are from enemy units with high damage (Scions, Rocket Troopers, Ravagers etc), and/or getting swarmed by mooks, since unlike with sync kills these attacks can come from anywhere. And unlike the other kits, the Juggernaut cannot avoid those attacks by ducking or running into cover. It'll have to utilize its high HP and shields for the job, though as can be seen from the livestream that's not a perfect defense - 2-3 Ravagers using volley fire will likely tear a Juggernaut a new one. A Geth Juggernaut that just walks and stands in the open expecting to mow down everything in its path senselessly will find itself falling faster than a cautious kit with cover. You'll still need to play the Juggernaut carefully though timely use of its abilities to counteract its weaknesses, a fact which is true of all kits. 

[Dorick]

tux2197 wrote...

dude chill out if you look closely you can see he cant barrel roll no cover hes just a walking tank plus hes slow movement should make him easy prey on plat oh gold so just wait for him to come out then cry all you want

Go to a wall and use right hand advantage, or put up your own wall and shoot through it with piercing bullets. He wont be easy prey on platinum or gold. 

[ViciousN8]

ViciousN8 wrote...

I´m calling it : There will be threads popping around like popcorns saying that the juggernaut is overpowered , a lot of nerf threads...

I got psychic powers xD

[Kuato Livezz]

Defensivly, this character is strong. Offensively, it may be good, but I don't see it being an offensive powerhouse like an infiltrator or certain vanguards.

[Dorick]

TtOATMEALtT wrote...

Can a mod please lock this troll's thread. The conversation is not going anywhere because of the stubborn nature of the OP, and this is by far one of the biggest waste of Internet storage space I've seen in a long, long time.
If anything should be nerfed it should be your ability to post, OP. every post I've seen you make has been nothing less than stubborn fact-less whining. The only way I see a Bioware (and btw that is how you spell their company's name) is if they wanted something to point and laugh at.
Also most people see as a troll because the dlc has yet to be released. If you are going whine and complain about something, then wait until someone can actually use it.

That is all the time I am going to waste on this rediculas thread, and I don't care if you respond to this OP, you may continue waste your and everyone else's time but not mine.

^Doesnt like my opinion, therefore begs mods for a lock?

Too bad. 

[Zero132132]

Dorick wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Listen to yourself! You're indoctrinated!

Seriously, though, it sounds like he has **** for offensive capabilities. The other stuff won't compensate for that to the extent that you probably think it will.

Absolutely wrong, if anything, he has heightened offense bc he doesnt have to spend time avoiding sync kills, and can tank so much that he can keep up his DPS. Survivability=DPS

He doesnt receive a nerf to his damage output from what I could tell. 

Not a nerf, but he has no real benefits to them either. Honestly, I don't think survivability is necessarily DPS. If you're spamming the shield regen melee and the turret to keep yourself up, you're not firing at the enemy. Could be wrong, but it looked like that heavy melee can only target one enemy, and it doesn't do a lot of damage.

We'll see, but he looked really unimpressive offensively, at least to me.

Best kits in the game have high survivability. The end. 

Tgi has special evade, cloak, and stims. 
GI can see through walls, evade, and cloak
Kroguard can charge, hight fitness, and has barrier. 

Survivability => +DPS

That doesnt give you the highest dps, but it makes it more and more noob friendly. Kits that go down faster require higher and higher amounts of skill to survive with.

So is it your position that the GI's OP nature has nothing at all to do with his ridiculous damage output and everything to do with wallhax?

[Dorick]

Kuato Livezz wrote...

Defensivly, this character is strong. Offensively, it may be good, but I don't see it being an offensive powerhouse like an infiltrator or certain vanguards.

Optionally, some kits have higher DPS, but realisticly, this kit will be OP for its survivability, not for some special damage output mechanic. Staying alive lets you do more damage. Not having to worry about sync kills and being able to spam a healing turret only boosts this. 

[Lathlaer]

Dorick wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Lathlaer wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Feirefiz1972 wrote...

I would expect this to be more true for the krogan, he will have damage reduction from tech armor, damage reduction from rage mode, regenerating health, lots of health and shields, the ability to run and he can use hard cover. The geth on the otherhand might just turn out to be a sitting duck, yes he can deploy cover, but that will keep him protected from one side only. He is going to need all the shields and health he has.

he can still get sync killed. 
He is pretty powerful, I dont see him being very popular for some reason. 

You are giving this sync kill immunity a lot more credit than it deserves. As if it was a main cause of death for players. Which bewilders me because you are an experienced platinum player. Perhaps you are so good that you only die when you get surprised by a lost banshee quickly teleporting through the wall or a phantom sneaking behind your back, but I suspect most deaths in game are caused by traditional overwhelming gunfire.

having to avoid sync kill drastically controls your DPS options, since you have constant pressure from banshees and phantoms. With no fear of them, you can just walk forward, keep your turret up, and do whatever you want. If you are in danger, shoot some scorpion rounds on the ground as you walk backwards until you can place a wall. 

You only fear sync kills if you do not know how to play offensively under pressure while controlling aggro. With a fast kit, you can around in circles killing stuff not even bothering with the 2 banshees chasing you because you are on the move.

This isnt about fear or talent, its about possibility. The Jugg is the only kit that can walk up to two phantoms and take them down without having to work to avoid sync kill/stagger. That's a big deal. Skilled players will always keep their DPS up, the point of the nerf is that this kit requires significantly less skill, bc it has too many advantages. 

Well then we essentialy disagree on what requires less or more skill. I'm thinking that maneuvering this character good enough to overcome the speed penalty and be reliable team member (kill some enemies when others are rushing the spawnpoints) or clear a solo gameplay in reasonable time (25 minutes or less for gold would be great) requires quite a deal of skill.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

Dorick wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Lathlaer wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Feirefiz1972 wrote...

I would expect this to be more true for the krogan, he will have damage reduction from tech armor, damage reduction from rage mode, regenerating health, lots of health and shields, the ability to run and he can use hard cover. The geth on the otherhand might just turn out to be a sitting duck, yes he can deploy cover, but that will keep him protected from one side only. He is going to need all the shields and health he has.

he can still get sync killed. 
He is pretty powerful, I dont see him being very popular for some reason. 

You are giving this sync kill immunity a lot more credit than it deserves. As if it was a main cause of death for players. Which bewilders me because you are an experienced platinum player. Perhaps you are so good that you only die when you get surprised by a lost banshee quickly teleporting through the wall or a phantom sneaking behind your back, but I suspect most deaths in game are caused by traditional overwhelming gunfire.

having to avoid sync kill drastically controls your DPS options, since you have constant pressure from banshees and phantoms. With no fear of them, you can just walk forward, keep your turret up, and do whatever you want. If you are in danger, shoot some scorpion rounds on the ground as you walk backwards until you can place a wall. 

You only fear sync kills if you do not know how to play offensively under pressure while controlling aggro. With a fast kit, you can around in circles killing stuff not even bothering with the 2 banshees chasing you because you are on the move.

This isnt about fear or talent, its about possibility. The Jugg is the only kit that can walk up to two phantoms and take them down without having to work to avoid sync kill/stagger. That's a big deal. Skilled players will always keep their DPS up, the point of the nerf is that this kit requires significantly less skill, bc it has too many advantages. 

Just to make myself clear, I wasn't criticizing your skills. I'll agree however that the Juggernaut is a good equalizer, which means that players who aren't that good will have an easier time with him. But any good player probably can do better with other kits, who are more squishy/aren't immune to synckills.

The question is : should Biower nerf because a character is easy to use or because of its potential power? Or should it nerf at all, as no matter what the game will stay easy because of engine limitations?

[Sulaco_7]

3 juggernauts + volus and you can set up a "box of shame" in any small room/corner on any map. I still don't mind.. more people playing platinum pugs is a good thing. The alliance infiltration unit will help with that too.

[ToaOrka]

Crimson Vanguard wrote...

Go kill yourself.

Or better yet, allow me the honour.

[Dorick]

Zero132132 wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Listen to yourself! You're indoctrinated!

Seriously, though, it sounds like he has **** for offensive capabilities. The other stuff won't compensate for that to the extent that you probably think it will.

Absolutely wrong, if anything, he has heightened offense bc he doesnt have to spend time avoiding sync kills, and can tank so much that he can keep up his DPS. Survivability=DPS

He doesnt receive a nerf to his damage output from what I could tell. 

Not a nerf, but he has no real benefits to them either. Honestly, I don't think survivability is necessarily DPS. If you're spamming the shield regen melee and the turret to keep yourself up, you're not firing at the enemy. Could be wrong, but it looked like that heavy melee can only target one enemy, and it doesn't do a lot of damage.

We'll see, but he looked really unimpressive offensively, at least to me.

Best kits in the game have high survivability. The end. 

Tgi has special evade, cloak, and stims. 
GI can see through walls, evade, and cloak
Kroguard can charge, hight fitness, and has barrier. 

Survivability => +DPS

That doesnt give you the highest dps, but it makes it more and more noob friendly. Kits that go down faster require higher and higher amounts of skill to survive with.

So is it your position that the GI's OP nature has nothing at all to do with his ridiculous damage output and everything to do with wallhax?

I'm saying if the GI couldnt survive, it wouldnt be considered top tier. Being able to see through walls and cloak matter. Surviving takes priority over doing slightly more damage than another kit. In this case with the Jugg, you cant even get grabbed. 

[kingvenom41392]

go take an arrow to the knee then take a vow of silence

[tux2197]

please tell me he isnt pressing F5 every second

[JG The Gamer]

I get a feeling that a gold/platinum solo is going to be a LOT harder than one would think. He is powerful. But he is a big target and he is SLOW. We've all fought Geth Primes before. Deadly against a single opponent. Easily beaten by several players. If the Juggernaut gets swarmed, he's done.

[Beerfish]

This guy will continually arrive on the scene too late and watch as all the nimble builds rack up huge scores in any kind of non coop game. He'll be very useful if a team sets things up to take advantage of him but I bet he does not score big.

[Dorick]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Lathlaer wrote...

Dorick wrote...

Feirefiz1972 wrote...

I would expect this to be more true for the krogan, he will have damage reduction from tech armor, damage reduction from rage mode, regenerating health, lots of health and shields, the ability to run and he can use hard cover. The geth on the otherhand might just turn out to be a sitting duck, yes he can deploy cover, but that will keep him protected from one side only. He is going to need all the shields and health he has.

he can still get sync killed. 
He is pretty powerful, I dont see him being very popular for some reason. 

You are giving this sync kill immunity a lot more credit than it deserves. As if it was a main cause of death for players. Which bewilders me because you are an experienced platinum player. Perhaps you are so good that you only die when you get surprised by a lost banshee quickly teleporting through the wall or a phantom sneaking behind your back, but I suspect most deaths in game are caused by traditional overwhelming gunfire.

having to avoid sync kill drastically controls your DPS options, since you have constant pressure from banshees and phantoms. With no fear of them, you can just walk forward, keep your turret up, and do whatever you want. If you are in danger, shoot some scorpion rounds on the ground as you walk backwards until you can place a wall. 

You only fear sync kills if you do not know how to play offensively under pressure while controlling aggro. With a fast kit, you can around in circles killing stuff not even bothering with the 2 banshees chasing you because you are on the move.

This isnt about fear or talent, its about possibility. The Jugg is the only kit that can walk up to two phantoms and take them down without having to work to avoid sync kill/stagger. That's a big deal. Skilled players will always keep their DPS up, the point of the nerf is that this kit requires significantly less skill, bc it has too many advantages. 

Just to make myself clear, I wasn't criticizing your skills. I'll agree however that the Juggernaut is a good equalizer, which means that players who aren't that good will have an easier time with him. But any good player probably can do better with other kits, who are more squishy/aren't immune to synckills.

The question is : should Biower nerf because a character is easy to use or because of its potential power? Or should it nerf at all, as no matter what the game will stay easy because of engine limitations?

They should nerf him as soon as they realize he is way overplayed bc he is ez mode and players prefer to have their credits handed over for a reward rather than become skilled at an actual game.

Kits should be fun. Kits should be interesting. But Kits shouldnt make difficutly not matter. If you play platinum, it should be about the same difficulty per kit, or at least require specific strategies to be easy. if your strategy is to use an OP class, the game has lost balance, and its integrity, and personally, its fun. 

[duffpastorius]

Reported. Hope you get your IP banned and can't download the DLC

[Kuato Livezz]

Dorick wrote...

Kuato Livezz wrote...

Defensivly, this character is strong. Offensively, it may be good, but I don't see it being an offensive powerhouse like an infiltrator or certain vanguards.

Optionally, some kits have higher DPS, but realisticly, this kit will be OP for its survivability, not for some special damage output mechanic. Staying alive lets you do more damage. Not having to worry about sync kills and being able to spam a healing turret only boosts this. 

Maybe.  When a round begins, what do squad mates do?  They scatter like roaches finding the enemy spawn.  Do squadmates walk around finding the next spawn?  Not often, most of the time, they run instictively to the next spawn. You can stay alive, but if you can't get to the enemies before you teammates do, you're not going to kill too much.  

[StrawHatMoose]

Oh f*ck, this guy is actually serious. Thought it was a troll thread when I looked at the title.

[Dorick]

Beerfish wrote...

This guy will continually arrive on the scene too late and watch as all the nimble builds rack up huge scores in any kind of non coop game. He'll be very useful if a team sets things up to take advantage of him but I bet he does not score big.

He will stand in the open and kill most mooks without having to take cover. He will never be out of a round from OHKO, and he will have the opportunity to kill groups without going down himself. I dont see how this kit wont be a contender for first unless you have a full team of highly skilled players. 

[LoonySpectre]

If you play platinum, it should be about the same difficulty per kit, or at least require specific strategies to be easy. if your strategy is to use an OP class, the game has lost balance, and its integrity, and personally, its fun.

Replace "kits" with "weapons". Should we refrain from using Harrier or Reegar on Platinum because it's so much easier than playing Platinum with Avenger or Katana?