202 réponses à ce sujet

[CroGamer002]

Yeah, romance felt quite creepy between the two.
And it's only due to Shepard, and she way worse then with Jacob in ME2.


It's not what Vega fans had in their mind when asking for romance with him.

[katerinafm]

Sabariel wrote...

LanceSolous13 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

LanceSolous13 wrote...

I think you guys are blowing some things out of proportion.

Not really.  Pretend Vega's the commander and FemShep is the lowly soldier.  FemShep flirts with her commander, but when pressed she makes it clear that she's not interested in pursuing a physical relationship.  Commander Vega, however, won't leave her alone.  Vega demands she put out.  When that doesn't work, he waits for her to get drunk.

The role reversal should help highlight how creepy it is.

But, Shepard didn't wait for Vega to get drunk. Vega agreed that he would need some drinks before he'd be up for it.

As I said, and no one commented, we don't see how they wind up in bed exactly. We don't know all the details here and we can't exactly judge. : /

Vega also never said he'd never sleep with her at all. If he never wanted to, He should have said as much.

I think the 'rapey' feelings from the scene, which I understand where they come from, are more from poor line delivery than anything else.

"I'd need to get drunk before I can sleep with you" is not huge red flag for you?

Vega's obvious discomfort when sober is not another?

Vega's side of this situation smacks of "she's my superior officer so I just better get it over with and satisfy her. Pass the vodka."

It's disturbing no matter how you slice it.

100% agreed. I don't get how there are people that don't see what's wrong with the 'hey, get drunk enough to have sex with me' and 'How many drinks would you need? 20? Okay start drinking. Are you done yet? Are your defenses and logical decision making numb by the alcohol yet so I can practically take advantage?'.  I get that some people REALLY want to be happy with the 'romance' they got, but come on.

A no is a no. Even if James had feelings for her or did want to sleep with her, he still has the right to not want to act on it or wanting to wait until he's ready rather than be pressured into it by his commanding officer (James clearly shows how much he pays notice to rank and the rules of 'fraternization'). That would go without saying if the roles were reversed and it was say mShep with Samantha, so why do we suddenly say 'nah he totally wants it' when it's the other way around?
Edit: Also, throughout the game but especially in this dlc Vega shows that his flirting is probably his defence mechanism. You can see that whenever he mentions his past (he quickly changes the topic and makes light by switching to flirting). He even says that it's 'just his way' when talking to femshep and that he doesn't mean anything by it. A good example is when you first go to the apartment and can talk to your squad. He mentions the Krogan he had to work with in Paragon Lost, but it's clearly making him uncomfortable to think about it and he quickly asks if Brooks is available.

I get that MAYBE this was their way of trying to make it make sense since the 'romance' won't continue into the main game. But it's an uncomfortable mess (a slap in the face to people that wanted to romance Vega with a femshep). It could have been done so much better.
Take out the creepy predator stuff, add in a bit of fear on James' part about them dying or her being his commanding officer etc, then have him admit his feelings at the party or show him not being able to stop thinking about it after their first talk, then the next morning they could have a simple 'I don't want to share this with the crew' and they could agree to 'continue this when they have defeated the Reapers'. See? Simple and suddenly not creepy.

Also what Steve says is really out of place with the rest of the 'romance'. He's talking as if James and femshep are deciding upon a relationship, but it's clear as day that it's not like that. Weird.

Modifié par katerinafm, 08 mars 2013 - 11:22 .

[katerinafm]

Shad Croly wrote...

Why couldn't Vega have been a romance option for male Shepards?

Agreed. But if msheps got the same as femsheps with his romance, then no thanks. I'd rather take the friend dialogue and just headcanon the rest.

Vega looked like he could be sort of like Garrus in his romance (hear me out). Garrus and Shep clearly respect each other and their relationship builds from that. Vega clearly respects Shepard (both sexes) and it would have been really interesting if they showed a relationship start from that. Vega getting over his anger for the Collactor base Shepard destroyed, seeing past the 'Commander Shepard'...such a lost opportunity. And so easy not to make it creepy D<

[Addictress]

humes spork wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Still tho, if the scene really is how you described it...  Wow.  Not cool.  Bad Shepard, go back to house arrest.

Here, see for yourself. Make sure to check out "parts" 2 and 3. The aftermath just gets...bad. Makes you wonder if they had "money's on the dresser, get the **** out when you're done making my eggs" written in there and Jennifer Hale refused to read it.

It was so uncomfortable oh my god.

[Addictress]

How uncomfortable Kaiden looked OVERHEARING Shep creep hit on Vega made it even more awkward

[ShallowlLife9871]

Addictress wrote...

How uncomfortable Kaiden looked OVERHEARING Shep creep hit on Vega made it even more awkward

Is it kinda bad I laghed at poor Kaidan listioning to this ?

[eoinnx03]

Why was he so afraid. He found her attractive and she knew she wanted him. What was the problem?

[ja_sm]

i have no idea why some of you insist on seeing no problem with this "relationship"

it smacks of sexual harassment
if you keep asking someone to sleep with you until they say yes
that isn't consent, it's coercion

[eoinnx03]

Fair point. I'm just still confused why he didn't go for it. He found her attractive, respected her, she was in to him....what was the problem?

[ThatDancingTurian]

Seriously, this "romance" was the most awful thing ever. I'm trying to forget I ever watched it simply because I don't want to even imagine an alternate reality, 100% Renegade Shepard that would do something so... gross.

I just can't understand how the writers could be so blind to how this would be interpreted. Was this intentionally awful and unsettling? That's all I can guess.

Momiji.mii wrote...

I thought it worked well in the context. When Vega first turned her down, you could see how he was kind of kicking himself for doing so.

You could? All I saw in that awkward silence and dead eyed stare was, "I wonder how fast I could get to that door."

Even before I knew what happened afterwards, all I got from him was massive discomfort as she kept pushing.

Modifié par Aris Ravenstar, 08 mars 2013 - 04:25 .

[garrusfan1]

MegaSovereign wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

I don't get why Vega resists.

As much as I wanted Vega as a romance option for FemShep (they'd be perfect, two grunts in love), she was being waaaay too forward and pushy. Gave off a very creepy pre-rape vibe. I totally understand now why Vega shot down FemShep, at least that time.

WTF how do you get a pre rape vibe

[eoinnx03]

Oh you guys. We all know woman can't sexually harass men. Pfft you guys are funny.


....I'm joking relaxe people. In saying that I didn't get any rape vibe, Vega was just nervous because if you watch paragon lost Shep is like a god to Vega, so when stuff get's real he gets incredibly nervous

[Ayslin66]

I just encountered this... My Fem Shep, Romanced Thane only in ME2.

Now. Vega visits. and I chose the "interested" option. I am... discombobulated. Sickened. Why on earth would Shepard behave like a dime store hoochie-mama?

*Shakes head* I know many of us were disappointed James was not a Li. Really, though? Someone needs to teach you writers on the fine art of flirting. That was not it.

[wiccame]

ja_sm wrote...

i have no idea why some of you insist on seeing no problem with this "relationship"

it smacks of sexual harassment
if you keep asking someone to sleep with you until they say yes
that isn't consent, it's coercion

This ^
I would have loved James as a LI or even just a party fling but that was so bad.

[Minttymint]

Ayslin66 wrote...

*Shakes head* I know many of us were disappointed James was not a Li. Really, though? Someone needs to teach you writers on the fine art of flirting. That was not it.

Agreed, maybe theME team should get some tips from David Gaider... I mean that man feasts on tears but he writes a damn good romance. I just want James as a romance...  It isnt that hard.

[Ayslin66]

MinttyMint wrote...

Ayslin66 wrote...

*Shakes head* I know many of us were disappointed James was not a Li. Really, though? Someone needs to teach you writers on the fine art of flirting. That was not it.

Agreed, maybe theME team should get some tips from David Gaider... I mean that man feasts on tears but he writes a damn good romance. I just want James as a romance...  It isnt that hard.

[LanceSolous13]

I think the only thing awkward about it is Jenifer Hale's delivery. Vega is nervious and confused because Shepard is a legend who is asking him to share his body with her. No pressure at all? He's having some anxiety. He wants to get buzzed/drunk as there's the old phrase 'liquid courage'.

I've met Miss Hale in person and she hates the romance content because it gets so persional and etc. Her awkward delivery probably stems from that.

[epenthesis]

I agree that Vega's obvious discomfort makes Shepard's continued advances inappropriate and creepy. That said, I don't think it rises to the level of date rape for two reasons:

1) As soon as he says something that sounds like a definite "no," she backs off.

2) He then immediately walks it back and describes a scenario in which he can see it happening. A scenario that they both know is going to be a reality soon.

Nothing would happen between them if it weren't for that second point, or if he just took it easy at the party and kept his wits about him. My take is that he's interested but unable to get past the fact that it's a bad idea, and his "but something might happen if we were drunk at a great party" is his attempt to get her to keep trying while still rationalizing to himself that he's playing it by the book.

I would have much preferred something less creepy, but this isn't *that* vile. They both know what's going to happen at the party and they don't stop it.

[MerchantGOL]

If Femshep Wants the D she won't tale no for an awnser.

[ziloe]

Wow. I didn't even know that was an option. Still, quite disturbing indeed.

[Sabariel]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

I think the only thing awkward about it is Jenifer Hale's delivery. Vega is nervious and confused because Shepard is a legend who is asking him to share his body with her. No pressure at all? He's having some anxiety. He wants to get buzzed/drunk as there's the old phrase 'liquid courage'.

I've met Miss Hale in person and she hates the romance content because it gets so persional and etc. Her awkward delivery probably stems from that.

There is a massive difference between "I need a drink to settle my nerves" and "I need to get hammered".

[Sugarjaye]

I think we can all agree though, that this could have been written way better than it was.

[GreatBlueHeron]

Random Jerkface wrote...

Except...he sleeps with Ashley under specific game conditions. It really doesn't matter what his reasons were; he said "no," and that should be sufficient. The fact of the matter is, this whole sequence is horrifying (and that scene with Shepard asking if he's "had enough to drink yet" reads as straight up predatory). He says no whilst sober, expresses his discomfort...and then Shepard decides to sleep with him once he gets drunk enough.

That is some straight up date-rape garbage, and I'm surprised (not really) that there isn't more vitriol directed at it. There is no way in hell that would have passed the smell test if it were male Shepard and a woman companion (or even a male one, for that matter). The fact that this is being justified with, "But I bet he really wanted it doe" is pretty alarming.

This is the first I've heard of this and I've gotta say this ain't cool.  My femshep is liara all the way, so my option was to encourage vega and ash to hook up or not.  When anyone gives a no, end of the line, full stop.  It's NOT okay because shep is a woman.  You might not be seeing much vitriol because most people play male shep, so it's likely not a lot of people know about it yet.  I wonder if femshep has already romanced someone you might not get this horrible option?  Don't know...didn't have a clue about it until this thread. 

[Boneyaards]

Who cares? It was hilarious. 

Anyone who claims that this scene is condoning predatory sexual behaviours is exaggerating this whole thing immensely.

[Ayslin66]

I don't find it predatory. I find it... sleazy and a one night stand. This was just done in poor taste. Come to wake up with Vega next to you, (never to speak of it again, if he makes eggs) Rolls eyes.