155 réponses à ce sujet

[Jonathan Sud]

"No. Now I just don't give a damn."

[WarGriffin]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Mumba1511 wrote...

The main thing that annoys me about the ending is the fact that I can't fathom how the ME series will move forward without altering it.

it wont move foward ...

the next game is going to takeplace during the first contact war (the dlc is full of references). the franchise will go sideways or backwards.

They are gonna AU the endings

[TudorWolf]

I was mostly good about the ending up until Citadel. Now I refuse to do the last mission and just headcanon the party as the real ending. Can't do the whole "someone must die" thing anymore

[avatar0]

It's like being in a relationship.
The more you invest in it, the more you care, the more it can hurt.
This is especially true when the other person suddenly backs out of a beautiful and well-established relationship and denies everything you both hold precious, all because a momentary artistic whim overtakes him or her.
After a few years, when the pain has subsided, we usually come to refer to this other person as "the bxtch or "that asxhole."

Modifié par avatar0, 07 mars 2013 - 11:50 .

[Razgaros]

Honestly I think Bioware did the best they could with the new endings. Now before anyone tries to kill me: hold on, I have reasons. Here's why : the debacle of the first endings is due to a small number of people, namly mister Hudson and a few others. Given the situation, they made their first (and biggest) mistake and that was to use the artistic integrity line of defense. Remaking an ending to a game due to fan demand was never seen before (not talking about the witcher 2), and thus unlikely, so they probably said " **** this, we can't do it, so let's do PR and cover our asses".

The problem is, some financial guy saw the backlash and said "hey, that's bad for sales, we need to fix this so that we can sell more bioware products", then they made studies, that was the long period where we did'nt had an answer, and then they came to the conclusion that it was indeed bad for the company.

The problem is, the people who made the endings are not on top of the food chain at EA or Bioware. I see people blaming EA for this, I'am pretty sure EA was all for extended cut, manly because that could sell more products and redeem the company, a company that they consider a valuable assest.

Now here the problem : if they had never backed the original ending under artistic vision, you would have had your new ending. Except that they did. Not because they belive in that line, belive me they don't, nobody in their right mind can be fine with it, but because they had to come up with something to pretent it was'nt bad. But as I said, some financial guy said it was bad enought to lose money, the share holders got scared, and they ordered it to be fixed.

Now if you change the ending into something new, it comes out as " Hey, we are bad story tellers, here's what you wanted, sorry" and that's not acceptable. That's also why the indotrination theory is not canon, I mean could you imagine? "Hey we are the best story tellers out there, but because we ****ed up so bad, we might as well turn to fans to make a decent story line because we are so incompetent." There is no way in hell that would have happened, because it's the wrong type of fanmade. It's the type of fanmade that says "we fans know better than you", altought as a matter of fact, in that case, the fans DID know better.

You know why you get so much fanservice on the citadel dlc? Because it's good fanservice, it's fanservice that taps both you and the writers on the back saying " see? our jokes are funny and our character are well written", and that's totally fine. The ending part however? that's bad fanservice, because it's the type of fanservice where the writters have to swallow their pride and bow to the crowd. And the best story tellers out there don't do that (I'am not saying they are, just that the company prides itself has having them).

This artistic integrity line was such bull****. Why is that people only defend the bad with it? Where was that line during the fox news sex scandal? That's right : nowhere, because the direct result of that was the tamer sex scenes in me2. We only got better ones in me 3 because somehow people had became okay with it and where willing to walk that line again. If thoses writter had that Oh so great intergrity, they would have left the company. They did'nt. You want to know why? Because it's not worth it. Beetween facing the fans and unemployement, they would rather face the fans, and that's logical. Clearly not the bravest thing to do, but hey, i'am pretty sure they all have kids to pay college funds for. And that is okay, as stupid as the original endings where, I can't expect someone to ruin his own life over it.

Thus what we got is a compromise. It's not a "Hey we made a mistake", it's a "Hey maybe we should give you more explanations". And that is also okay, because it's the best you could resonably hope for, given the circonstances. And you know what? Given that scandal, i'am pretty sure Bioware will never do a ****ty ending again, because who ever is going to write is going to have his work checked 18275892 times before approval. So yeah, we can't get a better ending for ME3, but we will have a good ending for ME4/DA3 because of that, and that's a genually good thing.

[SwordofMercy1]

wright1978 wrote...

ME3 ending is a trainwreck and has always been a trainwreck.

It's a trainwreck, and the conducters keep driving trains into it. 

[Matahari0711]

Nope not at all. EC changed it for me and am ok with it

[avatar0]

Razgaros wrote...


Thus what we got is a compromise. It's not a "Hey we made a mistake", it's a "Hey maybe we should give you more explanations". And that is also okay, because it's the best you could resonably hope for, given the circonstances. And you know what? Given that scandal, i'am pretty sure Bioware will never do a ****ty ending again, because who ever is going to write is going to have his work checked 18275892 times before approval. So yeah, we can't get a better ending for ME3, but we will have a good ending for ME4/DA3 because of that, and that's a genually good thing.

You are assuming that EC could save face and keep the fans at the same time.
How would a potentially great ME4 benefit me, when I have been so wounded by ME3 that I refuse to buy another Bioware product until they have fixed the endings?

If, for the sake of argument, your wife cheats on you with another man.
She, realizing her mistake, makes up some lame excuses such as the voice of god telling her do so for why she cheated on you.
You don't buy it, and you suspect she doesn't either.
Will you be content knowing that she probably knows better now and will not cheat on you again in the future? Will you forgive her by thinking to yourself, "That was the best compromise ever. She gets to save her face, and we are going to be a great couple from now on?"
I don't think so.
The logical thing to do, at this moment, is to get as far away from the crazy bxtch as you can.

[Rip504]

Like a fine wine. They get better with time.

[Razgaros]

avatar0 wrote...

You are assuming that EC could save face and keep the fans at the same time.
How would a potentially great ME4 benefit me, when I have been so wounded by ME3 that I refuse to buy another Bioware product until they have fixed the endings?

Because beetween now and then, there is going to be an adverisement campaign, with trailers, new story line an characters and promises and all of that stuff. I suspect most people will come around when that happens, and you might even get some new players. Considering it's a new studio, it's not really fair to blame them for the mistakes of 5 guys in the old one right? :3

Altought don't get me wrong, if EC never happened, I would'nt be on this forum, or paying for a Bioware product ever again.

[Taboo]

dreamgazer wrote...

Nah, it just stays the same: a flawed attempt at aping Asimov with ridiculous and contradictory logic.

This.

Now Alien Resurrection. That gets worse every second.  

[cbutz]

Yea, I was indifferent to BW and the endings before the dlc.I actually re installed the games for it. The DLC, even the vibe of post-ending, should have been post-ending but w/e, drew me back into the universe and characters. Unfortunately when it was done it was March 6th 2012 all over again. I didn't think the DLC would have that effect, it was surprising. Although this time I am well back to indifference, dissapointment, and "Im done", although I will check out MEHEM when V0.3 comes out. I see the bad endings for what they are and at times I "accept them" and head canon what happens after destroy but then start to get perturbed at the endings. MEHEM makes it better but there would be playthroughs that I would be reminded of the endings, especially with the tone, and quality, of ME 3 in general.

I wonder, if this DLC will have the unintended consequences of making the ending controversy worse overall. Heck I didn't expect the dlc to make me hate the endings again. I guess only time will tell.
TLDR: I am not sure the endings got better, but I think the dlc may have unintentionally made them worse, even though many of the characters, particularly Jack, assure Shep they would pull him out of the rubble, thus kinda making the endings better becasue BW is trying to say "He/She will be fine. (At least in High EMS Destroy)...but it still made me Hate/accept them.

Modifié par cbutz, 08 mars 2013 - 01:03 .

[MattFini]

Yeah, it's the one severe flaw in an otherwise good game (my nitpicks aside).

[Linkenski]

Any ending to a story, especially a trilogy, should summarise the key points about the story, and reveal some sort of message. I tried thinking hard about what the ending was trying to say, and i simply don't see it. It stumbles around on this theme of synthetics rivaling organics, but i can't see how it connects to any present issue in the main plot (you already got a resolution on this at rannoch) and even looking at how it could refer to something IRL, i don't see it.

Simply put, The writer(s) wanted the ending to be philosofical but didn't know how, so it was forced into the ending.

[Archonsg]

I have made my peace and resigned to the fact that Bioware, for reasons of their own, have made the decision not to make and release an alternate ending DLC that I believe would have been well received.

So, thankfully, we have the MEHEM team, whom I would still like to buy each a beer, are still at work to polish their MOD, which for me at least, does what Bioware would not.

Rewarded me for playing their game.

It's because of it that I even considered buying this Citadel DLC.

I would recommend anyone who are able, to get http://social.biowar...index/14795358' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'> MEHEM and for those who haven't seen it yet, here's the http://www.youtube.c...e_gdata_player' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'> MEHEM Trailer , especially that trailer. For something "fan made" the polish seen, could have easily been mistaken for an actual Bioware (The *Old Bioware*) product.

[SolidisusSnake1]

Everytime I get "contempt" with the ending they do something like the Citadel DLc that gets my blood rising all over again. I MEAN JESUS CHRIST! How could they **** up so badly? I swear every time I think I've forgotten about it that questions just jumps right back into my mind, how could they have possibly thought that was a good idea. And for them to just sit back and accept it, to not even acknowledge that it was a failure, but then to go even farther and try to shove it farther down our throats is just appalling.

There is a part in the Citadel DLC when you are in the archives and you see some footage of C-Sec security gunning down all AI's on the Citadel and I felt like puking. Stop trying to shove your nonsensical Organic v. Synthetic theme down my throat BioWare, just stop, it doesnt work and will never work for Mass Effect.

[Punisher cork]

Frankly, OP, its more sad with this Citadel DLC. If you loved the characters and wanted to see them interact, then yes, this is the best DLC for that, last night I spent over 3 hours on the variations of the party just enjoying the dialogue with a huge smile on my face, its great. And when you get to the end and you go back out to finish the game, this huge depression weighs down on you because the ending was so terrible.

I mean, I didn't beat it right away when it came out, I heard people were saying it was bad, and I expected it to be partially dissapointing, ending a trilogy is difficult and I know how hype works. However, this ending to the game was insulting and just plain goofy. I feel your pain.

[dreamgazer]

Taboo-XX wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Nah, it just stays the same: a flawed attempt at aping Asimov with ridiculous and contradictory logic.

This.

Now Alien Resurrection. That gets worse every second.  

Things could be so much worse. 

[NeonFlux117]

I've got used to it. It's doesn't sting and make me so angry and sad like it did for months. I don't like them. They suck and are detrimental to the series but not overly so. And it doesn't ruin ME3 or the series for me. But yeah, the endings for ME3 are AWFUL.


The new citadel DLC is my ending now. Everything I could have wanted Post ending destroy content is in this DLC. So..... I'm good.

[Punisher cork]

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

There is a part in the Citadel DLC when you are in the archives and you see some footage of C-Sec security gunning down all AI's on the Citadel and I felt like puking. Stop trying to shove your nonsensical Organic v. Synthetic theme down my throat BioWare, just stop, it doesnt work and will never work for Mass Effect.

Thank you. I'm so tired of this "A.I.'s are all inherently evil!" theme being pushed. I get that the organics are distrustful, but so many AI's are just children that are lost, not Skynet looking to eradicate all life. I never thought the organic vs ai theme even belonged in the Mass Effect universe back in ME1. Really? This is a "hate all machines" kinda place? 

[Applepie_Svk]

dreamgazer wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Nah, it just stays the same: a flawed attempt at aping Asimov with ridiculous and contradictory logic.

This.

Now Alien Resurrection. That gets worse every second.  

Things could be so much worse. 

Like... a .... 2 or 3 years later... BioWare will release the new ME and it´s start with words like an ... indoctrination LoL...

[Schneidend]

Punisher cork wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

There is a part in the Citadel DLC when you are in the archives and you see some footage of C-Sec security gunning down all AI's on the Citadel and I felt like puking. Stop trying to shove your nonsensical Organic v. Synthetic theme down my throat BioWare, just stop, it doesnt work and will never work for Mass Effect.

Thank you. I'm so tired of this "A.I.'s are all inherently evil!" theme being pushed. I get that the organics are distrustful, but so many AI's are just children that are lost, not Skynet looking to eradicate all life. I never thought the organic vs ai theme even belonged in the Mass Effect universe back in ME1. Really? This is a "hate all machines" kinda place? 

That's the idea. It isn't supposed to be a place where machines are hated. That's the cycle that needs to be broken. The assumption that organics and synthetics cannot coexist is the root of all of the problems in the universe. Characters like EDI and Legion are the signs that this hatred can be broken.

[LeandroBraz]

With me happened the opposite, the most I play, the less I see issues on the ending (and on the entire game)..

[Shaleist]

It doesn't get worse per se. It just seems more and more out of place. I can't believe how awful it is. Now that Citadel fixed a LOT of what I thought was wrong with the rest of ME3.... that ending is like shag carpeting in an office setting. It just stands out.

[HooblaDGN]

I don't know if it's worse so much as it's saddening to see that it will probably never change. Let Citadel be your end, and forget the rest.