202 réponses à ce sujet

[Absaroka]

Xilizhra wrote...

In that case, it's a good thing you're incapable of mistakes right?

The fact that the new Catalyst makes it clear it and the reapers will be sticking around (as opposed to just shutting down or flying into the nearest star) regardless of what you want shows that you do not have any true control anymore. Whatever your Shepard was, that person has died after being fried.

Hardly. My Shepard never wanted the Reapers destroyed as the primary objective; the primary objective is to stop the cycle. She just didn't know there was another possibility until right then. Knowing that, I don't want the Reapers destroyed either.

That's merely a hypothetical of what a Shepard who chose control could do because Shepard supposedly has control after the fact, but it is an incorrect one because there is no choice in the matter afterward.  If that really were the case, I (and I imagine others) would agree Control would be a better choice.

What I am saying, is your Shepard is dead, and has no saying in what the AI based off her will now do.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

I suspect everyone has lines in-game which they simply will not cross. This is one of mine. Sorry if it came across that I was snapping at you - this is a bit of a hot topic to me. You're entitled to your opinion as well.

By the way, you were incorrect in one line before: Shepard does try to inform the fleet of the geth upload, and Tali does as well (either that, or Shepard just gets Tali to do so). The only difference is that it fails in that instance; siding with the geth seems to be the more natural culmination of a failed attempt at peace.

I've watched the scene up to the point the upload is completed on YouTube. At no point is the fleet informed that the Reaper code is being uploaded (because apparently only The Shepard can say those words). Both Peace outcomes make this distinction - informing the fleet that the code is being uploaded (something they have no other way of knowing) and that the Geth will respect a ceasefire (something the Quarians were never offered historically - as evidenced by the VI - and thus had no reason to expect). If I remember right, the first words you hear from Quarian radio chatter when the Geth regroup is "What's going on?"

In the only outcome where they die, they're left completely in the dark.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 08 mars 2013 - 08:32 .

[Xilizhra]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I suspect everyone has lines in-game which they simply will not cross. This is one of mine. Sorry if it came across that I was snapping at you - this is a bit of a hot topic to me. You're entitled to your opinion as well.

By the way, you were incorrect in one line before: Shepard does try to inform the fleet of the geth upload, and Tali does as well (either that, or Shepard just gets Tali to do so). The only difference is that it fails in that instance; siding with the geth seems to be the more natural culmination of a failed attempt at peace.

I've watched the scene up to the point the upload is completed on YouTube. At no point is the fleet informed that the Reaper code is being uploaded (because apparently only The Shepard can say those words). Both Peace outcomes make this distinction - informing the fleet that the code is being uploaded (something they have no other way of knowing) and that the Geth will respect a ceasefire (something the Quarians were never offered historically - as evidenced by the VI - and thus had no reason to expect). If I remember right, the first words you hear from Quarian radio chatter when the Geth regroup is "What's going on?"

In the only outcome where they die, they're left completely in the dark.

And again, peace strikes me as the only outcome that actually makes sense.

[AdmiralCheez]

Never was enchanted by it in the first place, OP.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I suspect everyone has lines in-game which they simply will not cross. This is one of mine. Sorry if it came across that I was snapping at you - this is a bit of a hot topic to me. You're entitled to your opinion as well.

By the way, you were incorrect in one line before: Shepard does try to inform the fleet of the geth upload, and Tali does as well (either that, or Shepard just gets Tali to do so). The only difference is that it fails in that instance; siding with the geth seems to be the more natural culmination of a failed attempt at peace.

I've watched the scene up to the point the upload is completed on YouTube. At no point is the fleet informed that the Reaper code is being uploaded (because apparently only The Shepard can say those words). Both Peace outcomes make this distinction - informing the fleet that the code is being uploaded (something they have no other way of knowing) and that the Geth will respect a ceasefire (something the Quarians were never offered historically - as evidenced by the VI - and thus had no reason to expect). If I remember right, the first words you hear from Quarian radio chatter when the Geth regroup is "What's going on?"

In the only outcome where they die, they're left completely in the dark.

And again, peace strikes me as the only outcome that actually makes sense.

And when I can make peace, I do. When I can't, I side with the Quarians. Simple.

[Rip The Reaper]

Someone liked synthesis to begin with? Hmmm

[Ieldra]

Rip The Reaper wrote...
Someone liked synthesis to begin with? Hmmm

Read the OP of the thread in my sig and you'll see there's quite a bit to like about it, regardless of how it's brought about.

[Liamv2]

For me it made me want to choose it more mainly due to joker and EDI

[Slashice]

Destroy all the way!

Tho at my first playthrough I chose control, because:

- I didn't want the geth to die cause of Legion and his sacrifice
- I didn't want people with synthetic enhancements to die
- I didn't want to turn all organic into a synthesis abomination thing against their own will - I'm not a god
- It looked good to provide protection to the Galaxy using the Reapers.

[FOX216BC]

Citadel dlc last scene just makes people who already are convinced of their choice even more eh... convinced that they making the(ir) right choice.

I mean Shepard sounds like he/she already accepted he/she is not going to survive this war.

So Control, synthesis, low ems destroy and refuse can be regarded as the right choice.

But when you hold your LI words in account then high ems detroy+breath scene feels like the right choice.

Modifié par FOX216BC, 08 mars 2013 - 10:02 .

[keegdarv1]

encanted by systhesis? i just cant take systhesis for real as a choice. the choice the reaper wants you to take and you think thats a good idea? and i cant think of one character that i grew to love that would be ok with me changing them the ones they care about or everyone else without thier say so.

oh and ill never understand why if destory is pick its call genocide, if i drop my toaster and it breaks its not murder, at the end of the the geth and edi becoming more "real" is a nice story but thier still a machine i feel bad edi had to go and the only other machine i cared about it gone already so ill get by an joker will understand

[Edolix]

After playing through Citadel I've come to appreciate EDI's character a lot more. But I'll still choose Destroy.

[GiarcYekrub]

No, it re-enforces my believe that Synthsis is the correct choice of action:-

*Through interactions with EDI it for me highlights sentient life is sentient life, there is no difference between a synthetic lifeform and an organic one.
*I want to allow Joker/EDI babies
*I could never kill EDI nevermind commiting genocide not only to the Reapers but the Geth too
*Equally freewill is something I could never rob anyone of.

[FellishBeast]

Refuse.

[Zered]

I said I'd blow them to hell. I did. Anything else is just wrong.

On another note I'd pay a lot to see Javik reacting to synthesis.

[Little Queen]

Liamv2 wrote...

For me it made me want to choose it more mainly due to joker and EDI

Exactly. 

[CrazyRah]

Started out with Destroy, kept Destroy(ing) after EC and i will keep destroy(ing). But the Citadel DLC greatly pushed Control as an option that i'm seriously considering.

[RiptideX1090]

Destroy when the game came out, more so after EC (though I can at least understand the appeal of Control better), and especially after Leviathan and now Citadel.

I destroyed the Reapers, refused to be the end result of the Catalyst's experiment via Synthesis, and hearing Tali say "come back to me" and now "no, this isn't the last party we'll have, you'll do what's right, for all of us" as well as Jack's bit about pulling Shepard out of the rubble, I'm more convinced now than ever to do Destroy. As Mordin says:

Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.

[Steelcan]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

cerberus1701 wrote...

Destroy Pre-EC.

Destroy Post-EC.

Profoundly, happily, enthusiastically Destroy post-Citadel.

Same.

. This

[Barquiel]

I was never a synthesis fan. But choosing destroy is going to be even harder now because of EDI. Citadel made me love EDI

[TudorWolf]

I liked synthesis well enough before, but now killing Shepard isn't really a conceivable outcome. Which of course means none of the endings are great (because I won't murder EDI/the geth either). 

[Ieldra]

RiptideX1090 wrote...
Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.

A similar rationale makes me choose Synthesis. The sacrifice only makes sense if within the constraints set by the Catalyst, Synthesis unfolds according to how Shepard envisions it. If your Shepard thinks Synthesis has fundamentally undesirable results, then he shouldn't choose it or those will manifest. My Shepard envisions Synthesis as the path to a hyper-advanced future where tech integration empowers individuals with new possibilities, and beings of organic and synthetic origin have enough in common not to be doomed to conflict. Not a future free from conflict, not even from conflict between organics and synthetics, but those will all be rooted in regular conflicts of interest and competition rather than a "creator vs. created" dynamic, and the increased interdependence of everything will create a natural preference for nonviolent solutions.  

So...yeah. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.

[shodiswe]

Destroy symbolizes the eternal conflict between organics and synthetics fueled by the choices made by Organcis.. Just like that record in the citadel where early AI's wanted to petition the council for their right to live but got gunned down despite being unarmed.

If it keeps up like that then the only resolution would be the destruction of all organics. Because at some point, one of thousands of AI's will get a chance to defend itself.
The war exists because Organics wants to destroy or subdue AI's not because synthetics are nessesarily dangerous or agressive.

[shodiswe]

I pick Control, which allows people to advance at their own pace and allows Sheppard to share the stored knowledge and tech of the reapers and all previous civilizations at a controled pace.

Synthesis, I don't think it's bad, and it's not making everyone the same or creating a hive mind. Adding the green colour to everything was a bad designdecition though.

Control > Synthesis > Destroy >>>>>>>>>>>>> Refuse..... Not even sure what the point of Refuse was anyway.. Just don't bother fighting let shepard die on Mars and everyone dies anyway.

[Ieldra]

TudorWolf wrote...
I liked synthesis well enough before, but now killing Shepard isn't really a conceivable outcome. Which of course means none of the endings are great (because I won't murder EDI/the geth either). 

There are two lore-friendly ways to bring Shepard back from the dead again:

(1) The Reapers collect minds. It's what they do. During the process of Synthesis, Shepard's personality, their thoughts and memories must be copied a billionfold and more. A complete set might be caught by the Reapers, which would enable Shepard's mind and personality to recoalesce post-Synthesis within the Reaper network. Then have someone create a new body using a DNA sample and upload.

(2) If you make Javik look into the Echo Shard, he'll give it to Shepard at the FOB. Before jumping into the beam, Shepard stores all of his/her thoughts and memories in the Echo Shard, and can be brought back from there. I wonder if it's possible to create a mod that adds a glowing echo shard to the scene with Shepard's N7 helmet.

@shodiswe:
Yep, Control is a good alternative. I'm conflicted about which is better, but in the end I don't choose Control because I don't like the idea that an AI god controls the fate of galactic civilization. I'm not at all saying the result is bad. It's a thematic consideration.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 08 mars 2013 - 12:11 .