141 réponses à ce sujet

[FlamingBoy]

zsom wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

zsom wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

you cant prove that its not in the minority. The difference between the ending lovers and haters are: the lovers dont come and qq on forums all day about it. Why? Cause they moved on from the game or are busy playing it. While many hate the ending, theres also many who love it. The haters should stop acting like no one loves the ending cause many do, you're not the only people who play the game. The ec made most content with the ending as well. You have no facts on saying most hate the ending. And i have no facts on saying most love the ending. The ending wont change for the haters when there are ending lovers, if they do the ending lovers might turn into the ending haters, so again no one will win. Its time to get over it.

Can't prove it 100% no, but all indications from every poll, survey, chatroom, forum I have ever seen shows strong evidence that the majority hate the endings.

Show me 1 poll with decent numbers which says the opposite...just 1...go on, i'll wait.

Here you go:
http://www.metacriti...0/mass-effect-3
http://www.metacriti...3/mass-effect-3

And since ME3 sold more copies on consoles than on PC it isn't impossible for these numbers to balance the more negative PC reviews:

http://www.metacriti...c/mass-effect-3

Xbox = 5.4/10

PS3 = 4.7/10

PC = 4.6/10

These are really crappy scores...what point are you trying to make exactly?

You wanted a poll where the majority liked Mass Effect. I gave you two. That is exactly the point I'm trying to make.

You do have a point, and worthy of a debate

but I think your responder was hoping for a player voted poll, not the media. I mean we can talk about all day about the bias of consumers, but we can talk all year about the corruption of the video game media industry.

[FlamingBoy]

I think I should point out that Mr. Muzyka used the phrase " important minority"

while that phrase can have different meaning I think he means a significant minority (in terms of people)

Honestly it really does not matter, the whole thing is argumentum ad populum at this stage

[SimonTheFrog]

LinksOcarina wrote...

It was a very even handed, and honest presentation if you ask me.

I think he handled the questions well too, all things considered.

I thought it was more smooth than evenhanded.

I missed real bite. It was far too polished and political correct for my taste. Lot's of praise for EA and everybody at BioWare. Hardly any real criticism.

This made the whole talk pretty worthless too me. Why should anybody listen to an hour long talk that contains no honest content that can be distinguished from blatant exagerations and smooth generic praise phrases?

I don't dislike this man, not at all, but I think it could have been a far, far more interesting talk

[Wip3out]

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

@hexley: like i said, the ending lovers couldnt care less about the ending haters, they dont come on the forums cause all we see is the haters **** and moan. Im only on the forums to pass time at work.

Ahh the old "People who love it are the most silent people on the planet" excuse.....utter rubbish m8, if anything it's statistically likely that for every 1 person who hates it 26 agree but don't say anything.

"TARP researchers have found that for every one person who complains, there are 26 who do not."

deliverbliss.com/customer-complaints-gift

You can't prove that im wrong though. 

[Hexley UK]

Wip3out wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

@hexley: like i said, the ending lovers couldnt care less about the ending haters, they dont come on the forums cause all we see is the haters **** and moan. Im only on the forums to pass time at work.

Ahh the old "People who love it are the most silent people on the planet" excuse.....utter rubbish m8, if anything it's statistically likely that for every 1 person who hates it 26 agree but don't say anything.

"TARP researchers have found that for every one person who complains, there are 26 who do not."

deliverbliss.com/customer-complaints-gift

You can't prove that im wrong though. 

And you can't even produce any evidence of your claim let alone prove me wrong.

At least I got some credible evidence to back me up.

[Wip3out]

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

@hexley: like i said, the ending lovers couldnt care less about the ending haters, they dont come on the forums cause all we see is the haters **** and moan. Im only on the forums to pass time at work.

Ahh the old "People who love it are the most silent people on the planet" excuse.....utter rubbish m8, if anything it's statistically likely that for every 1 person who hates it 26 agree but don't say anything.

"TARP researchers have found that for every one person who complains, there are 26 who do not."

deliverbliss.com/customer-complaints-gift

You can't prove that im wrong though. 

And you can't even produce any evidence of your claim let alone prove me wrong.

At least I got some credible evidence to back me up.

I couldn't care less about your evidence. But you cannot prove me wrong when i say "the ending lovers don't bother with the forums"

[Hexley UK]

Wip3out wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

@hexley: like i said, the ending lovers couldnt care less about the ending haters, they dont come on the forums cause all we see is the haters **** and moan. Im only on the forums to pass time at work.

Ahh the old "People who love it are the most silent people on the planet" excuse.....utter rubbish m8, if anything it's statistically likely that for every 1 person who hates it 26 agree but don't say anything.

"TARP researchers have found that for every one person who complains, there are 26 who do not."

deliverbliss.com/customer-complaints-gift

You can't prove that im wrong though. 

And you can't even produce any evidence of your claim let alone prove me wrong.

At least I got some credible evidence to back me up.

I couldn't care less about your evidence. But you cannot prove me wrong when i say "the ending lovers don't bother with the forums"

And you can't prove I don't have a fire breathing Dragon in my bathroom....doesn't make it true though.

[Khayness]

If they really had to play the games then how come many shipped with inexcusable bugs everyone with two working eyes should have noticed?

ME2 squaddies spazzing the hell out in the background during cutscenes, DA:A content gets locked because they won't trigger unless played in a very specific sequence, ME3 cutscene glitches like Shepard's amazing neck tricks and Omega DLC, dialogue gets cut before it is finished, etc. DA2 was plagued with game breaking bugs aswell (hello Isabela and Sebastian), but they needed unique conditions to happen so I let them slide.

The demonstration is interesting and insightful, but when you know how the ideas turned out it's just a nice speech. Very nice political speech, far from the facts.

[Wip3out]

say what you will hexley but if you can prove that i'm wrong then by all means until then ill stick with my opinion. I loved the game. I loved the ending. I couldn't care less that you didn't.

[Hexley UK]

Wip3out wrote...

say what you will hexley but if you can prove that i'm wrong then by all means until then ill stick with my opinion. I loved the game. I loved the ending. I couldn't care less that you didn't.

Stop talking to me then.

[Ninja Stan]

Hexley UK, Wip3out, cut it out, please.

[DamonD7]

I'm not getting hung up on the minority thing...49% is a minority for instance, yet still important.

Whatever it was, it was obviously a large enough minority to where Bioware really felt they did need to address it with additional content.

[ninemil]

ZombifiedJake wrote...

Said critical response was in the minority (yeah, right), and that this minority was what prompted the extended cut. If it really was such a minority, I don't think any action would have been taken at all. The bashing was widespread - or at least it seemed so, but I'm willing to believe that it was overplayed - and deservedly so.

Don't blur press bandwagon jumping and BSN whine with either representing a majority. Via Origin, EA/Bioware see exactly how many people are playing the game, how far through the game they are, and where they stop, or which endings they choose, if they choose one at all.

I believe Ray when he says the response was a minority. I also laugh mightily, having worked in development myself, at how self-important forum communities become over time. There are as many people here that youtube DLC rather than play it out of cheapness, as there are that have invested in and supported the company over the years.

tl:dr

Forum whine and press capitalization =/= anything closely resembling a majority.

[Dubozz]

Good find, thanks.

Also

FlamingBoy wrote...

very interesting, I am finally getting a more clear picture of biowares mentality of the me3 reaction.

and why they buggered it so badly

[Shermos]

Hexley UK wrote...

zsom wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

zsom wrote...

Hexley UK wrote...

Wip3out wrote...

you cant prove that its not in the minority. The difference between the ending lovers and haters are: the lovers dont come and qq on forums all day about it. Why? Cause they moved on from the game or are busy playing it. While many hate the ending, theres also many who love it. The haters should stop acting like no one loves the ending cause many do, you're not the only people who play the game. The ec made most content with the ending as well. You have no facts on saying most hate the ending. And i have no facts on saying most love the ending. The ending wont change for the haters when there are ending lovers, if they do the ending lovers might turn into the ending haters, so again no one will win. Its time to get over it.

Can't prove it 100% no, but all indications from every poll, survey, chatroom, forum I have ever seen shows strong evidence that the majority hate the endings.

Show me 1 poll with decent numbers which says the opposite...just 1...go on, i'll wait.

Here you go:
http://www.metacriti...0/mass-effect-3
http://www.metacriti...3/mass-effect-3

And since ME3 sold more copies on consoles than on PC it isn't impossible for these numbers to balance the more negative PC reviews:

http://www.metacriti...c/mass-effect-3

Xbox = 5.4/10

PS3 = 4.7/10

PC = 4.6/10

These are really crappy scores...what point are you trying to make exactly?

You wanted a poll where the majority liked Mass Effect. I gave you two. That is exactly the point I'm trying to make.

5.4, 4.7 and 4.6 out of 10 show universal dislike, those are crappy scores.

To show me the majority liked Mass Effect 3 you showed me tons of reviews hating on it....interesting method.....

Stop holding on to the overall score and take a second to look at the numbers. MORE people gave ME3 a positve score than a negative one, with the (embarrassing) exception of PC gamers.

The overall scores are not worth looking at since a lot of people gave absolutely ridiculous scores like 0 or 1.

Ray's comments were very diplomatic, but he didn't lie. He comes accorss as a good, intelligent guy. The gaming industry really is lesser without him.

Modifié par Shermos, 14 mars 2013 - 03:30 .

[Shermos]

Double post. Please delete.

Modifié par Shermos, 14 mars 2013 - 03:01 .

[Lyria]

So. Bioware people say that people's hatred of the ending is a minority, yet use resources and time to make the EC? But when people commented how the Citadel dlc did not address the ending Bioware said their polls showed that ending hate was only a minority of the fans and that is why we didn't get a new/edited/better ending or post ending dlc? Kind of seems odd.

IT really sucks that the Doctors left Bioware. Their company was responsible for many of my fondest gaming moments.

Thanks for the link, op.

Ps: I liked me3. Me3 seems rushed at times. Story is rather weak. Graphics are good. Combat is best of the three. Everything past Rannoch and the lack of any real content on Earth annoyed me. The nonsensical ending and poorly written, trite, copy and pasted ending ruined what would've been a B+ to A- game.

Modifié par protognosis, 14 mars 2013 - 09:11 .

[Shermos]

There's a difference between people who hated the ending and wanted it totally changed, and people who wanted more closure. The EC was intended for the later group.

It's fair to say that ending haters are a minority. A very vocal one sure, but still a minority. Most people I've seen who had issues with the ending wanted more closure and explanation as well. I didn't think the EC was necessary but it seems the folks at Bioware did, so we got it. It didn't ad anything much that I hadn't figured out on my own and the Normandy pick up scene is a bit stupid, but everything else was fairly well done.

[SimonTheFrog]

I think the "ending haters" is maybe a minority as it implies passion for the game.
Likewise, the "ending lovers" are surely a very small minority.

Most gamers probably played the game and thought "what the heck??" at the end and moved on, quickly forgetting the whole thing.

For them it is not necessary to do anything special other than advertise the next game like crazy.
People are like sheep and all that...

But as a company it would be wise to look at the passionate fans as they can create a lot of bad reputation that the sheep-customers will pick up on. That's why they created the EC, even if it was for a minority.

What I don't get it why they stick to that particular ending seeing that it was offensive for the until then loyal fans... but that is a whole different story.

Modifié par SimonTheFrog, 14 mars 2013 - 12:10 .

[visionazzery]

what about bioware's total lack of justification for another patch to fix long standing problems for both mplayer AND SPLAYER?

http://social.biowar.../index/16268802

[Dragoonlordz]

Peeks into thread, reads so many douché type responses from ME3 ending haters bashing on Ray for one small segment of his very long video without saying anything positive towards one of the men who created the studio which in turn created vast amount of games over years most of you loved and enjoyed in their whining rants. Further showing they are just a bunch of miserable sods, show some respect for the guy who made possible all those great games you loved through the years since without him and Greg forming the studio, hiring the talent to create them there would not have been any of those games on top of the fact his video covered vastly more than the one thing your whining about.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 14 mars 2013 - 06:54 .

[Kushan101]

Interesting that the topic of the "vocal minority" comes up - just seen a video going into that very topic. According to all the polls (of which he cites plenty) he looked at regarding the ending, people who were dissatisfied were the overwhelming majority,

[dsl08002]

Kushan101 wrote...

Interesting that the topic of the "vocal minority" comes up - just seen a video going into that very topic. According to all the polls (of which he cites plenty) he looked at regarding the ending, people who were dissatisfied were the overwhelming majority,

exactly becuase those polls determined that the majority is upset, but strangly everyone is dissmising that claiming that they still are a minority. how can someone be that ignorant and stupid when what the polls and surveys are proving .

And as soon as bioware claimed that they performed a survey on this matter and they said that it was a minority they immidiatly dismiss the result from the a lot more polls from different sites.

I am doing this on a daily basis with surveys and polls and i have never ever seen anyone until now dismiss others  becuse of their own one small survey aginst many.   

[Kushan101]

dsl08002 wrote...

Kushan101 wrote...

Interesting that the topic of the "vocal minority" comes up - just seen a video going into that very topic. According to all the polls (of which he cites plenty) he looked at regarding the ending, people who were dissatisfied were the overwhelming majority,

exactly becuase those polls determined that the majority is upset, but strangly everyone is dissmising that claiming that they still are a minority. how can someone be that ignorant and stupid when what the polls and surveys are proving .

And as soon as bioware claimed that they performed a survey on this matter and they said that it was a minority they immidiatly dismiss the result from the a lot more polls from different sites.

I am doing this on a daily basis with surveys and polls and i have never ever seen anyone until now dismiss others  becuse of their own one small survey aginst many.   

Exactly, the only claim that could be made is that the poll samples are small compared to the number of people who bought the game. But thats the case with ALL polls - yet they are still treated as being representitive of the overrall consensus.