748 réponses à ce sujet

[Silcron]

Because there are sacrifices to be made. And while I like EDI I'll gladly sacrifice her to end the reapers. To me while interesting she is nothing more than a very complex SIRI (yes, I'm refering the ipad program) in a nice looking robot body.

She may be fun to interact with, so are videogames. Lives>software.

And mehem makes me want ot puke, I couldn't stand disney happy ending even when I was a kid.

[Village_Idiot]

Because it removes the Reapers as a threat, without subverting the will of the entire galaxy or leaving them at the mercy of a "God", who is even more fallible than the Catalyst was.

Modifié par Shadrach 88, 08 mars 2013 - 03:41 .

[Xilizhra]

If I choose synthesis, I fundamentally alter all life in the galaxy without their consent. If I choose control, I become the monster I set out to stop. Both choices are just as repugnant as wiping out the Geth.

No they're not. Especially since in the second one, it was never the Reapers' nature that was the problem, it was their actions. Don't repeat their actions, no problem.

Destroy is victory, period. Everyone knew the fight with the Reapers is a fight to the death. The Geth and EDI both chose to fight the Reapers. You don't make that choice without being willing to pay the price. Shepard has the responsibility of command and is used to it from an extraordinary career. In the end, Destroy makes the most sense according to the ruthless calculus of war. You expend some of your soldiers to achieve the objective. That is why I am comfortable choosing destroy with either a Paragon or a Renegade.

Or... you can choose to expend absolutely none of your soldiers for a more total victory, where the only cost is your own life. Which seems a better outcome to me.

She may be fun to interact with, so are videogames. Lives>software.

Your distinctions of sapience are wholly arbitrary. Your own mind is nothing but software.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 08 mars 2013 - 03:41 .

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

Given the impossibility of somehow creating an import feature from ME3 into ME4 to take the ending into account (especially since the game ends without saving; the same thing happening in ME1 is why the human Councilor choice wasn't imported into ME2 and you had to decide it in conversation with Jacob and Miranda), it seems unlikely that the next game will be continuing from any of the three endings there in particular; hence, MEHEM will probably not be any less canon than the other three endings in that it can seem to have been logically chosen in the next game (assuming it's even a sequel).

Anyway. I choose Control, but I'm holding out for a Control version of MEHEM where Shepard also survives.

I can accept it because its
mandatory. As much as I like EDI and the Geth, they will always be
machines. And they can be rebuilt. 

In the same way that organics could theoretically be cloned and repopulated, perhaps.

Neither would be the same if recreated. Just look at Legion versus the Geth VI, or Shepard's clone.

Personality imprint without vaporization, xil? I don't know if the brat's dialogue could be altered to accomodate that.

[Dunabar]

My Shepard doomed EDI and destroyed the Reapers, so only one or two of us had to die for the Reapers to be destroyed.

What about the Geth you may ask? Well they sided with the Reapers, that was enough to justify my reason for destroying them. I didn't help Legion put down the heretics just because they were Geth. If you side with the Reapers, you're my enemy, and as my enemy I will destroy you for siding against my people & my Allies.

[Xilizhra]

Neither would be the same if recreated. Just look at Legion versus the Geth VI, or Shepard's clone.

Personality imprint without vaporization, xil? I don't know if the brat's dialogue could be altered to accomodate that.

Altered with ease (though I'm not sure about technical issues, as I can't mod). Especially since his voice acting already isn't very good, so we wouldn't miss out on much.

[Joryn01]

Destroy is the best option in my opinion. Sacrifice the few for the many. I liked Edi and felt bad that she was destroyed, but the Geth I never really had any type of attachment to. Synthesis is an alteration of life on a galactic scale. Yes Shepard is a hero but who is he to decide that this is the best option for all life. And then with control, that's just a lot of power for one person. How can anyone be trusted with that type of power. Just look at the catalyst, one of the oldest beings in the galaxy. Using that power it decided the best course was to harvest organics.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

Neither would be the same if recreated. Just look at Legion versus the Geth VI, or Shepard's clone.

Personality imprint without vaporization, xil? I don't know if the brat's dialogue could be altered to accomodate that.

Altered with ease (though I'm not sure about technical issues, as I can't mod). Especially since his voice acting already isn't very good, so we wouldn't miss out on much.

You didn't find the lithp endearing or disarming?

 

[Xilizhra]

Joryn01 wrote...

Destroy is the best option in my opinion. Sacrifice the few for the many. I liked Edi and felt bad that she was destroyed, but the Geth I never really had any type of attachment to. Synthesis is an alteration of life on a galactic scale. Yes Shepard is a hero but who is he to decide that this is the best option for all life. And then with control, that's just a lot of power for one person. How can anyone be trusted with that type of power. Just look at the catalyst, one of the oldest beings in the galaxy. Using that power it decided the best course was to harvest organics.

Really, you're sacrificing the many for the arguably many more. Also acting as if whether or not you had an attachment to the geth matters a damn.

[Massa FX]

EDI is a friend. The Geth had a terrible time of it. I feel horrible about Destroy. But, that hard choice is one I make every damn time. The Reapers must go. I don't and won't ever choose to befriend them because they murdered trillions. Whether its their fault or the catalyst or leviathans doesn't matter.

My hands are dirty. But I accept that consequence.

Control = Becoming a Reaper, the cycle continues = Not going to happen
Synthesis = Becoming a hybrid organic/synthetic consciousness and forcing everyone else to do the same = Utterly ridiculous
Refuse = Allowing everyone in the Galaxy to be murdered = Not going to happen
Destroy = Death of EDI and Geth and seemingly death of Shepard (had no idea about breathe scene on 1st playthrough) = The best of all choices

[Xilizhra]

Control = Becoming a Reaper, the cycle continues = Not going to happen

No it doesn't. Nothing in the ending indicates in the slightest. In any case, I really don't know why you're clamoring for the death of a race that undertook no actions of its own, and was completely mind controlled when it attacked the galaxy.

[Artifex_Imperius]

DecCylonus wrote...

If I choose synthesis, I fundamentally alter all life in the galaxy without their consent. If I choose control, I become the monster I set out to stop. Both choices are just as repugnant as wiping out the Geth.

Destroy is victory, period. Everyone knew the fight with the Reapers is a fight to the death. The Geth and EDI both chose to fight the Reapers. You don't make that choice without being willing to pay the price. Shepard has the responsibility of command and is used to it from an extraordinary career. In the end, Destroy makes the most sense according to the ruthless calculus of war. You expend some of your soldiers to achieve the objective. That is why I am comfortable choosing destroy with either a Paragon or a Renegade.

destroy: [selfish] - yes! reapers are defeated, shepard lives! victory for now and the next 1000 years! but after that you dont care cause your not alive? and that their problem? what about the synthetic/organic war? dont care?

synthesis: synthetic/organic WAR ENDs FOREVER!

[KBomb]

I can accept it for a few reasons:

1. All of the endings are abhorrent, but Destroy fits my canon Shep. Destroying the Reapers has always been her goal and the loss of the Geth and EDI are a by-product of sacrifice that sometimes comes with war, as unfortunate and sad as it is. A lot of people died, not just them, including Ashley. Who was my bff. Their sacrifice will always be honored.

2. I cannot get the MEHEM ending because I am on xbox and I am not sure I would if I were not. It isn't canon and that would most likely always been in the back of my mind and it would annoy me. The endings, imo, are but a wound among many in the game and so it probably wouldn't help all that much. I am glad others find solace in it, though.

3. It was my $60+ and I'll do whatever I want. 

[CronoDragoon]

Artifex_Imperius wrote...

synthesis: synthetic/organic WAR ENDs FOREVER!

Because of semantics.

[MattFini]

Because the reapers don't get to walk away after millions of extermination cycles.

They were always going to die if my Shepard had anything to say about it. The galaxy needed to be rid of them.

[saracen16]

scyphozoa wrote...

I never understand why people say "we rebuild EDI" or "rebuild the geth" You can no sooner rebuild a synthetic life and personality than you can rebuild an organic personality. You might have all the same genetic or synthetic makeup, but you won't get the same personality or identity.

Saying they can be rebuilt is a sugar coated way of trying to justify killing those people. New people can be born, but the ones you've killed are gone forever.

Exactly. I thought the Citadel DLC made it clear: the Shepard clone was Shepard in almost every shape and form, except he doesn't have his memories or experiences. It's both nature and nurture. The same goes for synthetics.

[AlexMBrennan]

No they're not. Especially since in the second one, it was never the Reapers' nature that was the problem, it was their actions. Don't repeat their actions, no problem.

Too bad that's our of your hands since the AI entity is not Shepard. Maybe you should actually watch the epilogue.

Or... you can choose to expend absolutely none of your soldiers for a more total victory, where the only cost is your own life. Which seems a better outcome to me.

Yes, with hindsight everything's clear - but that is as meaningful as "know the winning lottery numbers" is good investment advice. Yes, sure, the epilogue shows that it's all sunshine and rainbows but Shepard had no way of knowing that this would happen.

Modifié par AlexMBrennan, 08 mars 2013 - 03:59 .

[WhiteKnyght]

Pakundo wrote...

 Provided you're not Javik-minded, and you liked EDI, the Geth and every A.I. that isn't an absolute crapshoot, why can you accept Destroy?
Why not cast it away, along with the lol-Shepard-dies-lol-sacrifice endings that're Control and Synthesis?
(Refuse isn't counted, doesn't matter that Shepard stands by their principle - everybody dies.)

And if you do accept Destroy because it's supposedly the best canon ending, (so let's talk about things the way Bioware thinks as canon), why not prefer Synthesis, if Bioware approves of it so much (seeing as it's the best in-universe ending, minus Shepard's sacrifice)?

Why not MEHEM?

Synthetics can be rebuilt. Files restored from old backups, like the Geth do.

Also I think Control is the best option, personally. Though Synthesis has the best outcome.

[Xilizhra]

Too bad that's our of your hands since the AI entity is not Shepard.

It's close enough to Shepard to still be played.

Yes, with hindsight everything's clear - but that is as meaningless as "know the winning lottery numbers" is good investment advice. Yes, sure, the epilogue shows that it's all sunshine and rainbows but Shepard had no way of knowing that this would happen.

Shepard also had no way of knowing if the Catalyst's description of Destroy would be accurate; you have to trust it to choose any of the endings.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

Control = Becoming a Reaper, the cycle continues = Not going to happen

No it doesn't. Nothing in the ending indicates in the slightest. In any case, I really don't know why you're clamoring for the death of a race that undertook no actions of its own, and was completely mind controlled when it attacked the galaxy.

They chose to work for the Reapers, both times. It'd be like someone who volunteered for Cerberus implants instead of being kidnapped.

[themikefest]

I can't use MEHEM for my PS3

I am Javik minded.I will always choose destroy.

Don't care about the robot Didn't want it as a squadmate..

If I can't get peace on Rannoch, I have the robots killed. Even when I do get peace I still choose destroy.

Nothing will convince me to pick control(reapers still around), synthesis(reapers still around) or refuse(the cycle continues)
.

[Bfler]

scyphozoa wrote...

I never understand why people say "we rebuild EDI" or "rebuild the geth" You can no sooner rebuild a synthetic life and personality than you can rebuild an organic personality. You might have all the same genetic or synthetic makeup, but you won't get the same personality or identity.

Saying they can be rebuilt is a sugar coated way of trying to justify killing those people. New people can be born, but the ones you've killed are gone forever.

They rebuild Shepard at the beginning of ME2 with fully funtional brain and memories. 
And with the introduction of synthesis at the end of ME3, I think everythig is possible in the ME3 universe.

Modifié par Bfler, 08 mars 2013 - 04:03 .

[Massa FX]

.... as for those that poo poo the idea of restoring Geth and EDI..... yes the science makes no sense, but neither does bringing a brain dead decayed Shepard back to life exactly the same. If that can happen in the Mass Effect Universe... anything can happen.

Shepard = Miracle rebirth of organic flesh, mind and soul which seems so much harder than a software reboot, memory chip download and time spent with organics that care
EDI = ? why not
Geth = ? why not

How can we put total faith in a codex entry that basically is debunked by the legendary Commander Shepard?

I don't buy into that "not the same" malarkey. Because... Shepard.

[Xilizhra]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Control = Becoming a Reaper, the cycle continues = Not going to happen

No it doesn't. Nothing in the ending indicates in the slightest. In any case, I really don't know why you're clamoring for the death of a race that undertook no actions of its own, and was completely mind controlled when it attacked the galaxy.

They chose to work for the Reapers, both times. It'd be like someone who volunteered for Cerberus implants instead of being kidnapped.

I was referring to the Reapers themselves. Wiping out the geth isn't even worth considering; only a tiny portion of them sided with the Reapers the first time, and the second time, they had to do so or face extinction at the hands of quarian bloodlust. Also, a lot of the programs favoring not siding with the Reapers were killed in the quarian attack on the Dyson sphere, so...

Modifié par Xilizhra, 08 mars 2013 - 04:03 .