638 réponses à ce sujet

[Fang92]

N7Dropout1 wrote...

People complaining about URs must be unfamiliar with EA's model of store. This is the same model they use for sports games. URs are the lottery shot you're aiming for every time you buy a pack. Take away the chance aspect, regardless of price, and you defeat the model.

A chance at the loot/item you want is what many games offer. Even in old-school RPGs you had to farm some enemies for a particular item until it dropped. If you look at popular MMO games like WoW, Rift or SWTOR you can kill a particular boss each week for a year and conceivably not get the drop you want. The gaming industry has sort of decided for online games that the chance model is the way to go and a way to keep players playing their game. It's the same tactic casinos use with slot machines. Recognize this and decide if that game is for you or not.

BroJo, I would say many new players would decide to save up for a UR pack. Most of the silver and gold weapons are utter trash whereas a good majority of URs are excellent. A Harrier or any of the terrible gold ARs? A Javelin/BW or any of the bad gold SRs? Aside from a few rares like Acolyte, OP Reegar or Claymore most of them are just bad. If you're that new player who pounds silver matches to save up for a UR pack and get a Harrier or PPR, bam you're set for golds! ;p

I am not playing a sports game, and at least in a sports game the players you get stick around for more than one game.

In an MMO, there are trades and auction houses, if you want to emulate the ****ty drop system then emulate the factors that help mitigate the frustrations that follows it as well. Progression should never be arbitrarirly stopped.

Maybe they should fix that as well, since what theyre going for is balance. 

[Gornok]

hitman1798 wrote...

So according to you, I would need 5-10 million to have a chance of unlocking any of the new DLC ultra weapons? Yeah, no thanks.

play another game... simple as that... stopping to concern yourself of a pack after playing each and every game is more time consuming and demoralizing if you don't get anything than simply  checking in periodically and buying a high volume of packs...

there hasn't been a dlc in which I spent 20 million and haven't maxed everything
this dlc I went in with that much and maxed all but 2 weapons, and those were at level 6
there are players on this board and on the leaderboard which spent that much and already maxed out the promotional weapons...

it simply works better... it has in the past, and it has now.

basically, increase your skill level and play only platinum or gold, get friends which play the same, save your creds, spend your creds after reaching a certain eschelon...

and stay away from spectre packs
and max out your consumables with JEP so it won't take a valuable slot in your pack. 

[Taritu]

Random reinforcement is strong reinforcement: it keeps people playing, and paying and that's why ME3 MP exists, to make money.

Besides, I play for fun. I'm a ways from getting all URs, but it doesn't matter to me.

Modifié par Taritu, 13 mars 2013 - 03:32 .

[UnknownMercenary]

The first slot in SP/PSP never drops ultra rares, although I agree that people should buy JEPs more

[Barronator]

I've played maybe like 35+ hours in this dlc, 2 UR's so far lol. That's with maybe 8-10m credits. It sucks that my luck has died when they add 4 more UR's (and 5 more with N7 weps).

[Dokteur Kill]

Taritu wrote...

Random reinforcement is strong reinforcement

Actually, it's not.

The best skinner boxes are the predictable ones. Random rewards never work as well as predictable ones.

[Zkyire]

Gornok wrote...

your manifest says that you shouldn't say a thing... your manifest says that you should play more in order to get more, your manifest needs more love than the complaining in this thread. 

Your attitude leaves much to be desired.

[animeboy12]

I think I'm gonna take break from this game, least until bioware decides to do something about this. If they don't, well, I've played 1000+ matches, most of which where pretty good, so there's at least that.

[Taritu]

Dokteur Kill wrote...

Taritu wrote...

Random reinforcement is strong reinforcement

Actually, it's not.

The best skinner boxes are the predictable ones. Random rewards never work as well as predictable ones.

Ummm, no.  Random positive reinforcement is stronger.  Or to be specific, variable ratio.

ie. slot machines and other types of gambling.

Extraordinarily powerful.

http://en.wikipedia....i/Reinforcement

[BiowareHeph]

Bryan Johnson wrote...

032OffensiveBias wrote...

I'd still rather pay 1m for a guaranteed UR than extend a 2 month, 8million credit no-ur dry streak of PSPs, APs, and RPs.

Is this something you have experienced or are you going based on what you have heard?

0.90^80 is higher than you'd think (1 in 4577), and that's the probability for any 8 million spend.  It has almost certainly happened plenty of times.  Assuming there are more than 5000 players, someone right now hasn't gotten an UR in his last 80 PSPs ...

[animeboy12]

Either way the Random positive reinforcement sounds way more gross and manipulative.

[SandeProElite]

Bioware needs to unlock the UR pack. I don't care how much it costs, but I want a reliable way of getting ultra rares and maxing out my manifest. Now there are way too many UR weapons and it would take forever to max them all, or even unlock the ones you want. I still haven't unlocked any of the new ultra rare weapons and I've spent close to 10M credits since the DLC came out.

[hitman1798]

Gornok wrote...

hitman1798 wrote...

So according to you, I would need 5-10 million to have a chance of unlocking any of the new DLC ultra weapons? Yeah, no thanks.

play another game... simple as that... stopping to concern yourself of a pack after playing each and every game is more time consuming and demoralizing if you don't get anything than simply  checking in periodically and buying a high volume of packs...

there hasn't been a dlc in which I spent 20 million and haven't maxed everything
this dlc I went in with that much and maxed all but 2 weapons, and those were at level 6
there are players on this board and on the leaderboard which spent that much and already maxed out the promotional weapons...

it simply works better... it has in the past, and it has now.

basically, increase your skill level and play only platinum or gold, get friends which play the same, save your creds, spend your creds after reaching a certain eschelon...

and stay away from spectre packs
and max out your consumables with JEP so it won't take a valuable slot in your pack. 

So the answer for me is to play something else?  That's nice and Sleeping Dogs is on sale so I might take you up on that offer.  Back to the subject at hand...I have played this game since March and it has been my go-to game for MP.  

In response to your, "Play more Gold/Plat", I do play gold with friends, but I refuse to play Gold with 3 randoms because most are all about saving their consumables.  I do like to play Silver because it's more fun to me.  I hate playing Plat because I get bored.

It frustrates me that I get level 4 ammo in both slots of a PSP when I still have the new "Rare" weapons that still need to be maxed out and I haven't even come close to unlocking any of the new "Ultra-Rare" weapons.  What sense does that make?  Developers take time to make this stuff and the store doesn't allow me and other players to use it.  Again, what sense does that make?

[ABjerre]

Gornok wrote...

I will tell you this...

*snip*

now frack off you pyjaks

A standing ovation for this man!

[Fang92]

Taritu wrote...

Dokteur Kill wrote...

Taritu wrote...

Random reinforcement is strong reinforcement

Actually, it's not.

The best skinner boxes are the predictable ones. Random rewards never work as well as predictable ones.

Ummm, no.  Random positive reinforcement is stronger.  Or to be specific, variable ratio.

ie. slot machines and other types of gambling.

Extraordinarily powerful.

http://en.wikipedia....i/Reinforcement

On that same note, reading further down the page there is ratio strain, which is what the people with maxed and near maxed golds are feeling. Looking at my Manifest you can see exactly where it happened to me.

[Chi_Mangetsu]

@ABjerre:

Fanboy and Steve-Dave reunite once again.

[Gezar149]

Gornok wrote...

exactly, its a game lesson

most of you lie, most of you are pathetic, and most of you whine for not having whatever it is you want


and then waste your time posting on this forum that you can't get whatever you want because the odds are against you, so you want a specialized item to ensure that you get something...

tough ****** said the kitty cause the milk taste good. 

They already gave you a pack for elevating your chances to get what you want... and now you blithering idiots want another pack so you can get URs?

frack off. 

No, its not a life lesson.  No matter how you rationalize spending your life on a video game it doesnt teach you anything.  Your manifest, acomplishments, everything that you are proud of can be deleted in a second.  Nothing that you have done in this game will matter in the long run.  Not really sure what you get out of this game but it seems like its far more than what people consider healthy.  

Again, not one good reason why there cant be or shouldnt be an UR pack.

Modifié par Gezar149, 13 mars 2013 - 04:06 .

[ABjerre]

Dokteur Kill wrote...

N7Dropout1 wrote...

People complaining about URs must be unfamiliar with EA's model of store. This is the same model they use for sports games. URs are the lottery shot you're aiming for every time you buy a pack. Take away the chance aspect, regardless of price, and you defeat the model.

That doesn't necessarily make it a good model, though.

Blizzard et al and their annual 1.980 million dollar revenue on WOW subscriptions would like a word with you about challenging the viability of said model.

Dokteur Kill wrote...

N7Dropout1 wrote...
The gaming industry has sort of decided for online games that the chance model is the way to go and a way to keep players playing their game.

That's not exactly true.

Many games (such as the Battlefield series and CoD) use a predictable progression system where your awards are decided by your in-game actions. And you can't exactly deny that these are successful franchises with a substantial player base.

It comes down to knowing your target market. CoD and Battlefield is typically targeted towards a younger segment, not known for being particularly patient or percistent; thus they need a different model for prolonging the product life cycle - to keep the game alive.

RPG's are typically targeted towards older segments that exhibit a higher degree of patience and engagement being tenacious in their pursuit of the rewards they want.

I'll bet you 10 of your local currency that the majority of the people complaining about the store are either 1) New to the game and haven't understood how it works yet or 2) Have the emotional qualities, and thus are exhibiting the behaviour of, the younger segment (described above). To put it in ley mans terms, whiners are either noobs or kids.

Modifié par ABjerre, 13 mars 2013 - 04:11 .

[Zkyire]

Gornok wrote...

I will tell you this... and really, this
is for the ones complaining about spending an obscene amount of credits
to max their manifest and spent the same amount of hours playing as
well..

before I speak... here is my manifest

http://social.biowar...5&platform=xbox

many of you lie so much, that its pathetic

there hasn't been a single time in which I spent 4 million credits and didn't get a UR
there hasn't been a single time in which I spent 3 million credits and didn't get a UR
there have been times when I spent between 1-2 million and didn't get one

most
of you who have played understand the game... when you start to have
everything maxed out, you get it less and less instead of the other way
around, reason for this is because you have already maxed everything
else out and the odds are against you from seeing a single thing for
awhile

the complaints on this board are the most idiotic,
butthurt, pathetic, wimpy, etc excuses and whines and cries which I
heard of outside of a preschool.

Its starts usually when there is
a new DLC and people are clamoring for the new weapon or kit... you see
these threads, now with the promo being UR... its even worse... this
really brings the worse out of you pathetic pieces of vermin waste...
you complain about nearly every damn thing in the game... you complain
that you don't have it, you complain that need it so badly because you
see others with it... you whine, you **** and you complain... then you
LIE about the amount of time spent in the game, you lie about the amount
of credits you spend in the game, you lie because you want to make you
damn point, and most of you come off as pathetic when you do so...

didn't get it in a pack? grow a pair and play some more and spend more
you want another pack with a guarantee? frack you... spend like all those before you and play the game..

don't like it? simply destroy the game and stop being so pathetic and play something else

they
give you free DLCs for this from jump... you have the option [not
saying you should] to spend money to elevate your chances in getting
one, they gave you a higher level of gameplay in order for you to gain
more credits so you could spend on packs...

yet most of yoku moist tissues sit there and complain about the measly amount which you spend?

simply open your veins... not across the street but down the road.

and a hint... don't even look at the damn store until you have 5 - 10 mill... you will see how easily they will come..

now frack off you pyjaks

Gornok wrote...

exactly, its a game lesson

most of you lie, most of you are pathetic, and most of you whine for not having whatever it is you want


and then waste your time posting on this forum that you can't get whatever you want because the odds are against you, so you want a specialized item to ensure that you get something...

tough ****** said the kitty cause the milk taste good. 

They already gave you a pack for elevating your chances to get what you want... and now you blithering idiots want another pack so you can get URs?

frack off. 

Oh by the way, both posts of yours reported.

Telling people to slit their wrists, really?

Modifié par Zkyire, 13 mars 2013 - 04:14 .

[MoeRayShep]

OP has made the mistake of extrapolating UR drops as a linear function of time played.

[MetalGearMetroid]

Ive had a steak of 30 psp's with no UR, thats incredibly frusterating.

Also I needed 9 URs to max my manifest before Reckoning. Now with the weekend weapons added to the pool I need 65!!!!! I don't want any of those reckoning or weekend weapons I just want those 9 URs I originlly needed. Honestly, I dont feel like playing anymore because of the incredibly massive load of **** that has just been dropped.

So yeah UR pack please.

[MrRag]

At this late point into the game, many people have their rares maxed. I don't see why we shouldn't have UR packs. Especially now that BioWare dropped the promo weapons.

[ABjerre]

Chi_Mangetsu wrote...

@ABjerre:

Fanboy and Steve-Dave reunite once again.

People are circle-jerking eachother in whining about the drop rates being too low now that we have many UR's in game. Someone tells them to shut the hell up and either accept the game for what it is or jump out the air lock.

I happen to agree with that someone and i'm a fanboy?

You circle-jerking whiners, acting like kids at the first sight of a challenge should really choose the "or" option described above.

[Barge6000]

Mp will die without it for me. (max rares, half UR crew.)

[Gezar149]

ABjerre wrote...

Dokteur Kill wrote...

N7Dropout1 wrote...

People complaining about URs must be unfamiliar with EA's model of store. This is the same model they use for sports games. URs are the lottery shot you're aiming for every time you buy a pack. Take away the chance aspect, regardless of price, and you defeat the model.

That doesn't necessarily make it a good model, though.

Blizzard et al and their annual 1.980 million dollar revenue on WOW subscriptions would like a word with you about challenging the viability of said model.

Dokteur Kill wrote...

N7Dropout1 wrote...
The gaming industry has sort of decided for online games that the chance model is the way to go and a way to keep players playing their game.

That's not exactly true.

Many games (such as the Battlefield series and CoD) use a predictable progression system where your awards are decided by your in-game actions. And you can't exactly deny that these are successful franchises with a substantial player base.

It comes down to knowing your target market. CoD and Battlefield is typically targeted towards a younger segment, not known for being particularly patient or percistent; thus they need a different model for prolonging the product life cycle - to keep the game alive.

RPG's are typically targeted towards older segments that exhibit a higher degree of patience and engagement being tenacious in their pursuit of the rewards they want.

I'll bet you 10 of your local currency that the majority of the people complaining about the store are either 1) New to the game and haven't understood how it works yet or 2) Have the emotional qualities, and thus are exhibiting the behaviour of, the younger segment (described above). To put it in ley mans terms, whiners are either noobs or kids.

.
http://social.biowar...n&platform=xbox
I am neither young or new and as my "Emotional development" you just have to take my  word that I am reasonably mature individual..
Problem with generalizations is that they discredit your argument.  I am patient and by my time played should have at least a level in each UR.  I think its ridiculous that I have 5 maxed URs and still lack a PPR.  I understand the random reward system and its psychology, hell its had me hooked for a year and some change now.  I think that a guaranteed UR pack would still force people to play and gamble for that chance to use the weapon that they want.  If its only one UR and a gold card PSP and Jumbo packs would still need to be purchased so to renew level 4 consumables.