236 réponses à ce sujet

[Il Divo]

I think it could be fun, assuming I knew what I was getting into from the start, a game/series where all my character's decisions will have wildly unpredictable consequences.

[imbs]

Darth Wraith wrote...

"A Song of Ice and Fire style storytelling" - by this I suppose you mean that we should have at least five years between each installment?

That would actually be perfect. Might get a real game for once.

Modifié par imbs, 13 mars 2013 - 09:48 .

[Reznik23]

imbs wrote...

Reznik23 wrote...

By "Song of Ice and Fire storytelling" I assume you mean boring?
No thanks - I'd rather have "Dragon Age" storytelling please.

you bioware fanatics truly know no bounds do you

What makes me a BioWare fanatic???
Is it because I have the temerity to find Song of Ice and Fire tedious and numbingly dull?
Well I'm sorry if I don't like everything that you like imbs, but I think BioWare generally do a very good job with their storytelling. My apologies if this offends you, but I am NOT a BioWare fanatic!
(Except, I have to say that while I'm not a Mass Effect player, I was really disappointed in BioWare for bowing to fan pressure & rewriting the end of ME3. I found that to be very sad.)

Modifié par Reznik23, 13 mars 2013 - 10:23 .

[imbs]

Reznik23 wrote...

imbs wrote...

Reznik23 wrote...

By "Song of Ice and Fire storytelling" I assume you mean boring?
No thanks - I'd rather have "Dragon Age" storytelling please.

you bioware fanatics truly know no bounds do you

What makes me a BioWare fanatic???
Just because I have the temerity to find Song of Ice and Fire tedious and numbingly dull?
I'm sorry if I don't like everything that everyone you like... but I think BioWare generally do a very good job with their storytelling.
(Except, I have to say that while I'm not a Mass Effect player, I was really disappointed in BioWare for bowing to fan pressure & rewriting the end of ME3. I found that to be very sad.)

You are a Bioware fanatic not because you find ASOIAF boring but because you find ASOIAF boring, and find an infinitely simpler and worse-written story/world to be at the very least "very good".

Disliking/finding ASOIAF boring is a-ok. It's not that good a series. But liking a story/world that is worse in literally every way indicates a high level of bias indeedy.

The little annecdotal tidbit you attached to your post is not the least bit convincing that you are not a fanatic either

[MisterJB]

If Bioware thinks it can write something as complex as "A Song of Ice and Fire", I'm all for it.
Having a series of bad decisions in the game leading to something like the Red Wedding would be beyond words.
If our PC can be a veritable LittleFinger, you can have my money. All of it.

Modifié par MisterJB, 13 mars 2013 - 10:28 .

[Reznik23]

imbs wrote...

Reznik23 wrote...

imbs wrote...

Reznik23 wrote...

By "Song of Ice and Fire storytelling" I assume you mean boring?
No thanks - I'd rather have "Dragon Age" storytelling please.

you bioware fanatics truly know no bounds do you

What makes me a BioWare fanatic???
Just because I have the temerity to find Song of Ice and Fire tedious and numbingly dull?
I'm sorry if I don't like everything that everyone you like... but I think BioWare generally do a very good job with their storytelling.
(Except, I have to say that while I'm not a Mass Effect player, I was really disappointed in BioWare for bowing to fan pressure & rewriting the end of ME3. I found that to be very sad.)

You are a Bioware fanatic not because you find ASOIAF boring but because you find ASOIAF boring, and find an infinitely simpler and worse-written story/world to be at the very least "very good".

Disliking/finding ASOIAF boring is a-ok. It's not that good a series. But liking a story/world that is worse in literally every way indicates a high level of bias indeedy.

The little annecdotal tidbit you attached to your post is not the least bit convincing that you are not a fanatic either

Oops...did I express an opinion?? I think I did didn't I...

And this, ladies and gentlemen is why I rarely come here anymore.

[Terraforming2154]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

How many of ya'll who're hatin on aSoIaF have actually read the books and not just watched the tv show?

I've actually only ever read the books and never seen the show.
Got through book four and just gave up. Nothing personal, I can see why people like them, but they aren't my cup of tea.

[The Hierophant]

Reznik23 wrote...

Oops...did I express an opinion?? I think I did didn't I...

And this, ladies and gentlemen is why I rarely come here anymore.

(Looks at imbs's sig)

imbs wrote...

Hiding behind words like opinion does not protect one from being wrong.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 13 mars 2013 - 10:36 .

[Volus Warlord]

While we all know Davos Seaworth is far superior to any and all Dragon Age characters, I don't think Bioware is capable of making something that resembles ASoIaF that doesn't come across as total nonsense.

Bioware's writing staff is rather idealistic, and if you made ASoIaF idealistic, it'd lose all its power.

[Straw Nihilist]

This place makes me fear for many things, especially my virginity!

[saMoorai]

No.

Simply because they wouldn't do it right.

[MisterJB]

Volus Warlord wrote...

While we all know Davos Seaworth is far superior to any and all Dragon Age characters, I don't think Bioware is capable of making something that resembles ASoIaF that doesn't come across as total nonsense.

Bioware's writing staff is rather idealistic, and if you made ASoIaF idealistic, it'd lose all its power.

I think DA's writing staff is much less idealistic than ME's.
All epilogues regarding elves in DAO serve as examples, I believe. Even if the Warden is an elf and the Dalish helped defend Ferelden, the epilogues don't attempt to suggest that two thousand years of animosity were forgotten just like that. Rather, it makes the point of telling us that conflicts between humans and elves arose eventually and that "no matter how things may change, they always remain the same."

[IntoTheDarkness]

simfamSP wrote...


The plot doesn't need to be dark for one to learn. Shakespeare often used entertainment as a form of educating his audience. No one likes to be told 2+2=4, but hide it under humour or use a character whose expertise is math and you'll be absorbing knowledge without noticing.

I bet Mass Effect will turn a lot of younger kids towards a passion for science or even literature. The same goes for Dragon Age and the Witcher.

That being said, I think it's time for Dragon Age to feel darker. Not that the world isn't dark (and it's true. Either we have become desensitized or torture and rape isn't edgy enough any more.) Adding these elements, however, isn't going to make Dragon Age more 'mature' or 'gritty.' It's just going to make it look desperate.

Mature story telling is what it needs. For the most part, Dragon Age is mature, but lacks that avaricious feel there is to A Song of Ice and Fire. Everyone is out for themselves, and no one is working together under perfect negotiations. Hell, we have allies ALREADY trying to take over Kings Landing because they see that the throne is there to take.

Personally it's hard for me to pin-point where exactly Dragon Age goes wrong. Overall it is a very dark world, and those who say otherwise need to sort out their morality. As I've said, rape, torture etc... that's not what I'd call a fable-esque fantasy. I think David Gaider and company have done an awesome job, but there is *still* something I can't quite conjure up at the moment, which is missing.

I'll leave it for someone more intelligent than I to spot it.

I agree 100% but Bioware has been tilting towards immature and childish stroytelling as evident with ME3 and themes of new ME3 DLCs.

The Witcher 2 is the only game in last 10 years in which I've felt the story is mature and very well written. Even if all the rape/torture scene from the game are gone, TW2 would still be much more mature than what ME or DA would ever be in a sense that every single character in the game carries different motivations and they do what they do for their own sakes not for the sake of plot progression.



In ME3 the bad guys outpower the good guys by 100:1 and they still lose. One can imagine how insanely absurd they have to act(in fact they don't do anything) to achieve that. In DA:O the Arch Demon patiently awaits for 3~4 months with no specific reasons while the Warden gathers all the alliance, then AD shows herself and flies around high towers to get sniped by a grey warden; very smart move, indeed.

And Logain's betrayal and circumstances surrounding it are very unplausible. Betraying a king in the middle of a battle and convincing other rival nobles to fall in line is not something I would call realistic. (and to think it would have succeeded if it weren't for the protagonist. are the other nobles ****ing marionettes?) It's equivalent to Lancel in ASOIF pushing Robert's back towards a boar's horn to kill hiim and convincing others that he is not responsible.

IMO, DA series has to many flat characters devoid of motivation although it has much less of such characters compared to ME series. If the dwarf succession crisis were handled in the witcher 2 we would see a constantly flapping situaitions where two sides keep plotting and attack each other instead of relying 100% on the main character that is supposed to be an outsider.

[SgtElias]

Fraq Hound wrote...

The TV show Spartacus on the Starz network, is one of my favorite TV shows of all time. It portraits sexual relationships of all shapes and sizes. To the point of gratuity sometimes.

To the, um, point of gratuity? If people aren't screwing, then you ain't watching Spartacus! [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

Great series, though.

Bones 6oS wrote...

And by that you mean storytelling whereby the bad guys are more likeable and waaay more awesome than the good guys?

Wait, what? What characters are you referring to? Maybe I'm just predictable in preferring characters like Arya Stark and Daenerys Targaryen over Cersei Lannister and Ramsey Snow.

Though I will say that characters like Roose Bolton and Petyr Baelish are sort of . . . disturbingly fascinating, so if you're referring to them, I see where you're coming from. And it would be frustrating but awesome to have antagonists such as them for Inquisition.

Modifié par SgtElias, 14 mars 2013 - 12:25 .

[AshenShug4r]

No.

[Plaintiff]

Solmanian wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

So the game would go something like "Talking talking talking, ******, talking, ******, talking talking, ******, talking talki- holy **** a dragon! ******, ******, talking, ******..."

How is that different than the witcher 2?

I wouldn't know. I haven't played The Witcher and don't intend to.

[IntoTheDarkness]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Spare us the Witcher fanboyism. It doesn't help your point.

Except I havn't read one proper argument as to how DA or ME has superior storytelling over TW2.

"Gameplay sucks!", "combat is stupid!", etc. yeah, yeah. but the story and characters are still much better and much more realistic, objectively speaking. TW2 antagonists don't conviniently wait until the protagonist finish all the preparations. In DA:O the female lackey of Logain blocking your way in front of the Landsmeet hall and Lohgain not executing the warden immediately upon capture are examples of unrealistic storytelling compared to the withcer. The witcher 2's side characters have more motivations and act according to their own agenda, thus the story is more mature and realitic. (DA > ME in that regard)

I refrained from using TW2 from the main post because it always had resulted in people digressing and calling each other the witcher/Bioware fanboys just as you did.

Modifié par IntoTheDarkness, 14 mars 2013 - 01:52 .

[Plaintiff]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

How many of ya'll who're hatin on aSoIaF have actually read the books and not just watched the tv show?

What difference does it make? Are the books any less of a confusing slog filled with gratuitously graphic sex and violence?

Watching the show is more than enough for me, considering I don't even do that of my own volition. An episode of the second season recently made me feel physically ill. And when it's not doing that, it's boring as hell.

I don't see how experiencing it in book form would make it any less unpleasant and tedious.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 14 mars 2013 - 02:02 .

[MisterJB]

Gratuitous violence? I'd like to see you justify that.

[Drunkencelt]

Worst written book series I have ever read. No thank you.

I don't want to see all the redeemable/remotely likeable people in my game die in act 1.

[Plaintiff]

MisterJB wrote...

Gratuitous violence? I'd like to see you justify that.

I don't have to justify dick to you. If it makes me feel like I'm going to throw up, it's gratuitous, and I don't give even half a **** how the story rationalises it.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 14 mars 2013 - 02:04 .

[The Hierophant]

MisterJB wrote...

Gratuitous violence? I'd like to see you justify that.

In contrast to Dragon Age where people explode when poked by daggers, decapitations, crushed, frozen, and shattered i find myself intrigued now.

[CELL55]

Oh dear Maker please no. If there's any one work that exemplifies TVTrope's 'Darkness Induced Audience Apathy' page to me, it's Game of Thrones. After reading the first few books, the only ending that would really please me would be if everyone dropped dead. And I can just as well imagine that on my own, thank you very much.

[The Hierophant]

Drunkencelt wrote...

Worst written book series I have ever read. No thank you.

I don't want to see all the redeemable/remotely likeable people in my game die in act 1.

So it's a terrible series because the supposed good guys are not running around large and in charge, while the antagonists carry the idiot ball for the majority of the story?