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[Legion of 1337]

I guess I have to do the old copy-and-paste thing again. Call me lazy, but it's a good statement and it still is and always will be relevant. No point is typing the same thing out again. Lemme find it, just a sec.

Here we are. 

To quote myself:
"There is, friend, a very big reason why so many people are still pissed about the ending. There is a reason why they don't get over it, why they constantly come on here and complain. It's not about being a hater, it's not about trolling, and it's not about being part of some great righteous cause - the reason you feel like that is in fact due to Bioware's writing talents.

What, you say? Writing talents? The guys who wrote this ****ty ending? Well, first off, the two guys who wrote that little diddy didn't write much else, that was done by others. And it was those others that make you so passionate to criticize the ending constantly and demand a better one.

People like Mass Effect for one main reason: the character interaction, not the plot. If everyone came for the plot, ME2 would not be seen as a shining jewel of games. Mass Effect stands among a very select few games (along with The Walking Dead and Journey, personally) that have made players emotionally attached to and invested in the characters, something that most games don't do. Mass Effect is special for that reason - it's why you love it so.

Now, I can understand disliking the ending from a critical perspective for all its thematic leaps, plot holes and contrivances, and that's all fine. But people have a lingering, passionate hatred for this ending, and that is not simply the result of a badly written ending. We've all seen movies and read books that were ****, we lamented that they wrecked a perfectly good series or premise, but we get over it because it's just a story. But Mass Effect is different because of the character focus. At the end, the characters (including Shepard himself) are shoved off to the side so as to focus entirely on the plot and explain what is happening. Coupled with bad writing, the ending simply does not give us our emotional closure and connection to the characters we love so much, so we leave the ending not only thinking that the ending itself was bad, but also that we are emotionally unfulfilled because we no endgame character interaction to bring everything full circle and provide closure. We are left feeling empty - and this is why we continue to hate it.

If you forget your love of the characters and simply look at the ending, you should realize that, yeah, it's just another stupid Gainax Sci Fi ending. Nothing new there. Tons of them. Just a **** up by a couple of idiots who thought this would be cool. You'll laugh at it - because it's dumb. 

So instead of continuing to rave on about the ending, just look at it for what it is ( a classic big dumb sci fi ending) and praise Mass Effect for what makes it so good - the characters we all know and love. Surely all that good stuff that makes up the remainder of the game and indeed the series should not be permanently tainted by a dumb ending - it's dumb, you should laugh at it, not rage.

Be grateful that it went that long before something retarded came up. Most sci fi doesn't last halfway."

This will continue to always be my response to "I hate the ending" or anything of the sort, because it will always be true. In fact, now that Citadel is out it is even more true than it was before.

Modifié par Legion of 1337, 16 mars 2013 - 06:56 .

[TheJediSaint]

I was never angry about the ending, just very disappointed, and EC did not really fix my issues with the ending. It just put a band-aid over *some* of the original ending's problems. It did not succeed in sewing a silk purse out of a sow's ear and make the ending enjoyable.

That being said, I don't thing there's anything to be forgiven. I just found the ending to be disappointing and I leave it at that.

Modifié par TheJediSaint, 16 mars 2013 - 07:02 .

[otis0310]

I still want to know who screwed up this once great franchise and why. Was it the producer and his lead writing buddy? Was it EA making cuts and unrealistic deadlines? Maybe a combination of these things.

I would tell you why I want to know this, but it would be against the terms of conduct regarding threats of violence. And I would never, ever break the terms of conduct.

[CHARK19]

What is so wrong with a happy Star Wars Medal Ceremony? Why not allow Shepard to live the rest of his/her days on Rannoch, or teaching kids who don't know how to read good, or helping rebuild the Mass Relays?
"This is the end of Shepard", so what's up with the breath of hope at the end of it all? Why keep him alive?! That's what bugs me. Am I supposed to fill in the rest with headcannon?

[RainbowDazed]

Mobius-Silent wrote...

It's about immortality not labour, organics create advanced tech to overcome mortality, on the way they create imortal, emotionless synthetics, and they both fear and envy the synthetics they've created. The only way to satiate that need is to give the organics the immortality they are searching for... another reason building a reaper out of them seem like a good idea to the Catalyst. Hence why Synthisis is a beter option from the Catalyst's perspective, Organics can finally work on immortality directly and the synthetics get emotions that allow them to value the lives of Organics inherrently rather than simply an optional intellectual value, hence mitigating the fear and envy from the organics.

That's an interesting angle. I'll have to think about that. 

The Catalyst has _nothing_ to do with the ending options. The software, hardware and triggers all come from the crucible and were added by previous races, all the Catalyst does is ennumerate them for you and the Relay network does what it says on the tin "Relay network", it relay's the effect... through a network.

In a pervious script the Catalyst states that the Crucible docking has cut off it's control of the Reapers and they are acting on their own volitation, while that is no longer the case, the writers intent is clear, the Catalyst is a passive observer by the time the Crucible is docked, it has opinions but it neither created this situation nor can resolve the situation.

If we only concider the official ending that made the final product as canon, then why does shooting the catalyst trigger refusal ending if what you say is accurate? The final EC-ending suggest that Catalyst is still in control of the reapers and in control of the situation. 

Modifié par RainbowDazed, 17 mars 2013 - 10:14 .

[PainCakesx]

CHARK19 wrote...

What is so wrong with a happy Star Wars Medal Ceremony? Why not allow Shepard to live the rest of his/her days on Rannoch, or teaching kids who don't know how to read good, or helping rebuild the Mass Relays?
"This is the end of Shepard", so what's up with the breath of hope at the end of it all? Why keep him alive?! That's what bugs me. Am I supposed to fill in the rest with headcannon?

That's one of my biggest complaints with the ending.

Shepard's character arc hasn't been completed for the High-EMS Destroy ending. I can headcanon it, but it isn't nearly as satisfying as seeing it unfold on screen. 

The emotional catharsis of the ending is just as important as the logical one. The ending left me feeling cold and empty - not how I wanted to feel after a 120+ hour journey.

[ill_eyggro]

The ending is poorly executed... period

[LiL Reapur]

Steelcan wrote...

Eterna5 wrote...

Reap_ii wrote...

ending still sits way outside of ME thematically. it still just doesn't make sense.

It does fit themeatically and it does make sense. 

. Organic/synthetic conflict was wrapped up over Rannoch.  It was resurrected and made the main theme for some reason.  

And no, it doesn't make sense, none of it does.

Thank you! That guy was urking me with his opinion lol. yea but the ending didnt make sense and wasnt competent enough.

[Adoramei]

I get that these days, people try to be jaded and artsy with the epic hero sacrificing everything for the greater good, but seriously. Shepard is not a comic book character. Shepard sacrificed SO much already. And I was surprised at how well the final goodbyes and amazing voice acting has really tugged at my heartstrings. I've only played it with the EC, and I have to say that I'm really, really REALLY disappointed. There is NO good ending. And absolutely no closure.

The "paragon" ending is one of the darkest things I could possibly imagine. Not to mention the fact that my character just promised Kaidan over and over and over again, "No, we're not going to die. We'll survive and I'll see you on the other side whether you like it or not." AND she left him crying as she stepped back from the Normandy while he begged her weakly not to leave him behind. And after all of that, she just gives up and dives into a beam of light for her genetic material to be dispersed. Right.. And for what?

To irreversibly change EVERYONE to conform. Just because they "gain understanding" through the same DNA does NOT mean that they're going to suddenly live in peace. And honestly.. if there's absolute peace all of a sudden, it reeks of free will being stripped away. The whole point- which was highlighted by Javik SEVERAL times was that our differences made us stronger. NOT TO MENTION that Shepard already got the Geth and the Quarians to see eye-to-eye. What? The synthetics will always rebel against their creators? What's this about sharing the homeworld and helping rebuild?

The ending- the reasoning into forcing us into 3 (sorry, 4- which I discovered by accident when I got mad and shot the weird god-child thing for once I regained control of Shepard, thinking that this non-corporeal form would not even notice.. oops. Pretty sure others have done the same) TERRIBLE, very non-Paragon options.. was a moot point. It had already been proven inaccurate. I honestly feel cheated. I mean.. after so much work, so much planning.. 3 just rushed past with barely any real interaction. I honestly felt no immersion until the final farewell scenes with my character's love interest. That voice acting.. Man. And watching a grown man cry and beg because he knows he'll never see you again? They did a wonderful job with the facial expressions, not to mention the VA's vocal nuance. But that's about it.

The endings are still terrible. I mean, it leaves everything- EVERYTHING unanswered. And I know that there are quotes out there from Devs promising closure. An answer to everything. But we have none of that. I feel like I'm left with more questions than anything. What happens after everything ends? Who survived the final assault? Who was lost of those you've helped along the way- and who survived? What happened to your companions? And of course, what happens to your love interest?

Seriously. My fiance and I were commenting that from the amount of times we'd heard Kaidan tell my Shep that he couldn't lose her (+again) or that any outcome other than their reunion was unacceptable, uh.. we were really expecting him to finish putting up her nameplate and go back to his cabin to eat his gun. He didn't let me see the Liara romance ending because he finished the game before me and he didn't want to spoil it for me, especially since I have an upcoming character that's romancing Liara. But I believe it goes more favourably. I mean, hell, Shepard practically proposes on their date. (And wtf do female players get from Kaidan? He admits that his visit is a booty call- but y'know, he loves her with all of his being. Screw that. Get a ring on that finger, man. But my disapproval for Bioware's handling of romances for females vs. better options for males is a long rant in and of itself.. not to mention the wussing out for same-gender romances that were already pre-planned and voice acted for both 1 and 2.) But good god. I mean, in the Destroy ending, yes.. Shepard takes a breath at the end. But does Shepard actually survive it? Do they have to rebuild him/her again? (FFS.) Is there even the option for a reunion? (Or did Kaidan already blow his brains out?) I pretty much feel like no matter the ending, Shepard dies. There are only 2 where he/she goes down fighting. Otherwise, to choose the most Paragon choices and either take away free will and force-rewrite everyone's DNA/thought processes for a "Utopian" society or become so self-absorbed that he/she truly believes that they are evolved enough to become the machine-god, somehow retaining their organic-centric goals whilst losing all physical remnants of humanity.. Well, it doesn't seem very Paragon to me. (By the way, Shepard DOES remember that absolute power corrupts absolutely, right?)

Honestly, though. We've all gotten emotionally invested with our Shepards. And in the end, even with the sucky handling of the endings.. there would be a lot of happier people if there was some semblance of the hero finally attaining what they've earned. Some peace. A respite in the company of those that they love, those whom they've fought for. Is that so much to ask? This is not a hero's ending. It almost feels like the murder of an icon. One you've worked so long and hard to build and develop. Only to be bottlenecked into an entire third installment filled with easy-mode Paragon or Renegade chat options (since, apparently, brain damage only allows them to process only 2 possible responses at a time for any question) to their final ending, the least damaging of which (to society) end in suicide. I mean, really.. what?

[Nydus Templar]

No.

It softened the blow, but no, the EC didn't fix it. In some ways it made things worse, especially changing things that didn't need to be.

That said, it was something they didn't plan on doing, and did it anyway because they do care what the fans think. That says alot, too. I can give them credit where credit is due.

However, I'll agree with most that the entire plot had some weakness, but the ending was a sharp blow that I barely managed to recover from. The reasons listed are legion, and though I don't agree with all of them, that's for each person to decide.

What stung the most about the endings were how they felt rushed, like this wasn't planned, it was forced. If all the pieces had fit into place, but I didn't like the picture, I could've respected it more. But I'm not getting into this again, its off topic anyway.

I could enjoy the DLCs though, and multiplayer because that's awesome in and of itself. However, the Endings will probably always be a sore spot for me. I hope a lesson was learned from it within Bioware.

So the answer is "No", but I can thank them for trying, and doing more than most would ever do.

[Massa FX]

The ending sucks. Period.
EC gave a little more story, but caused more questions.
Citadel: Shore Leave - Rocks the Casbah! But, the ending still sucks.

[Peregrin25]

Was I mad when I beat and watched the ending to Mass Effect 3 back in March of last year? The answer is yes. I still am. Well, not so much mad as I am now more so just befuddled and disappointed with how BioWare handled the whole debacle.

The Extended Cut was a much needed addition to the ending. And I say Ending as in a singular form, because pre-Extended Cut we only had one ending. Just with a different colored explosion.

However The Extended Cut slightly renewed my faith in BioWare a little, but not much. I do think that is the Extended Cut had been added from the get go the issue with the ending would never have happened.

However, I do envy those that did get to play Mass Effect 3 with Extended Cut not ever knowing how it ended pre-Extended Cut. I still think the Extended Cut was a tid bit weak though.

You would still get those that would have complaints about things in the game, but the ending would never have been among the discussions. I am pretty certain of that.

The Citadel DLC was awesome, but I felt it had no context to the story and really didn'f fit. Was it fun? Yes it was. I enjoyed it far more than any other DLC for Mass Effect.

But I have to say, I am still disappointed in BioWare for the original ending debacle. Not so much now of how it ended but as how BioWare staff and PR boobs handled the whole thing. Reason being. If they do it once, chances are it will be done again. I'm not saying it will.

BioWare last year became one of the most notorious game developers along with Blizzard *cough*Diablo III*cough* and a prime example of what not to do in the gaming industry. I hope BioWare learns from it and grows. So, just because they are capable of ignorance, doesn't mean they will repeat themselves. It is however very likely that it could.

I still won't be pre-ordering any BioWare products for a long time. Hell, I may not even purchase any future games until a year or two after release. They hurt the fans in a way that will slowly heal. There are many still sore at BioWare. Hopefully they will regain our trust and support in the future.

I haven't written them off yet!

Modifié par Peregrin25, 17 mars 2013 - 08:15 .

[JPN17]

I'm not nearly as upset about the ending now as I used to be, but no I still can't enjoy it. The ending is absolutely nonsensical and to put it bluntly insulting. The EC changed nothing, it fixed nothing, and it actually created a huge gaping plothole trying to fix something. The squad interaction in citadel was good, I'll give the writers a lot of credit for that, but as I've said before the DLC only makes sense as a post ending occurence, which it can't be. Pretty silly for marines to be throwing a party while all life in the galaxy is being cleansed.

[Kesak12]

I hated the original endings more than I hate the EC cut endings but I still hate them. Just a few weeks ago I could finally play through the ending again. I have not forgiven Bioware, but the EC made me hate them for this less. Wether or not it would be shipped with the game, I would have been the same level of mad as I am today.

[Obsidian Gryphon]

hell destroyer wrote...

Did you forgive the ending of Me3 with the Extended Cut or with the Citadel DLC? Do you like Me3 now? Are you still mad at it or you can enjoy it now?
Would you have liked ME3 if the base game shipped with the EC and Citadel DLC contents?

Myself, I've forgiven it with the EC.

1] No.
2] No.
3] Mad about it? No. I don't have so much energy to invest on anger. After one year, I'm done with ME 3 and zero interest in any of the DLCs. The only thing I'm touching is the MP and even that would soon taper off.
4] No.

Right now, I'm regarding BW with mild interest and less inclination to fully support it with the passion I had years ago.

[k8ee]

I keep trying to do a new play through now that I have all the DLC... and I really thought having the EC and the Citadel installed would allow me to do that. But part of me can't help but expect to feel that same kick in the gut disappointment when I reach the end. God I wish I didn't care.

[Adoramei]

Peregrin25 wrote...
BioWare last year became one of the most notorious game developers along with Blizzard *cough*Diablo III*cough* and a prime example of what not to do in the gaming industry. I hope BioWare learns from it and grows. So, just because they are capable of ignorance, doesn't mean they will repeat themselves. It is however very likely that it could.

Well.. to be honest, they did repeat themselves. At least from how I see it. Dragon Age 2 was, I thought, the worst thing to ever happen. And then, I was proved wrong by Mass Effect 3's superficiality and ending. They did the same thing. They gave us a blob ending like they did with DA2 with slight differences with no follow-up. Even with the EC, there's no follow up. But they knew how much a terrible generic "blob" ending was loathed by the fans, and they did it again regardless. No matter what your choices, no matter who you saved.. You are faced with the same question for the same endings. After what was for many of us years of time, love, and imagination invested.. we have 3 very unsatisfying endings.

You're either green for the "best" ending, which essentially assimilates everyone and takes away their free will. (Honestly, did they really expect us to think that "understanding" will lead to cessation of hostilities? Suddenly, everyone's just.. getting along? Hmm..) Which was a moot point anyhow because you DID bring peace before it. Oh, and you commit suicide after promising your LI several times that you'd fight their way back to them.

Or you're blue when you become some sort of machine god. Because, "We're not ready for it yet." But.. oh, okay. So that's really an option? Sure. I guess I'll try it out. See how it goes. Oh, and the suicide.

Or you're red. You commit genocide, but hey, at least you get to take a breath at the last second.

In the end, I still feel like it was a green/blue/red ending. It's slightly extended, but even if I had finished it pre-EC.. I don't know. I feel like a lot of people with the EC are going, "Well.. it's not as bad as it was." But you can say that about a lot of things. Like.. you got into a terrible car crash and were pinned for hours before finally being pulled out only to have your legs amputated. It's not as bad as it was at least. Hey, you're out of the wreck and they've restored homostasis. Great. Now what? I feel like they tried to appease the fans a bit, yes.. But it's way too little too late.

I don't hate Bioware. I love Bioware. I feel that EA is at fault for a lot of their mistakes because they were too rushed. But I do shove some of the blame on them too. They made the conscious decision for some of these choices. But all in all.. that's what happens when you sell out. It's great for the company. They make money regardless. But the fans are the ones who have to sit there after finishing the game and go, "Wait.. I.. what did I just spend all that time and money on?" But I feel like they should admit that they screwed up with DA2 and ME3. Big time. I just barely tolerate the oversimplification of ME2, but at least it was bearable.

[Adoramei]

I was thinking the same thing, Tickle. I mean.. there's also the option of getting a synthetic body much like EDI did.

[hiraeth]

hell destroyer wrote...

Did you forgive the ending of Me3 with the Extended Cut or with the Citadel DLC? Do you like Me3 now? Are you still mad at it or you can enjoy it now?
Would you have liked ME3 if the base game shipped with the EC and Citadel DLC contents?

Myself, I've forgiven it with the EC.

Horrendous ending aside, I've always loved ME3. The ending didn't make me hate ME3, but it did take away a lot of my enthusiasm for the series, which I think is a shame. Neither the Extended Cut nor the Citadel DLC changed the fundamental flaws in the ending, so neither of them really did anything for me. The EC actually did nothing to me, save for explain via retcon the destruction of the mass relays. The Citadel DLC has the character focus that I wanted in the ending, but it's not ending or post-ending material, so I can appreciate it only for what it is. It doesn't "fix" the ending or make me think that the ending now isn't as bad b/c I can headcanon Citadel as an ending. I shouldn't have to headcanon the entire ending of a video game in a franchise where the writers have shown that they can do an excellent job of closing story arcs.

I would have enjoyed the ME3 game more if the base game included EC and Citadel DC in general, but I still would have been furious at the ending. To be honest, I don't think it would have done anything in terms of my dislike for the ending to include those two in the base games.

[dirtdiver32318]

Love the game hate the ending more than anything. I have played ME 1- ME 2 way to many times none stop now I force myself to play the third I play a lot of mp now has better endings hahahahaha

[Nykara]

tickle267 wrote...

Adoramei wrote...

I was thinking the same thing, Tickle. I mean.. there's also the option of getting a synthetic body much like EDI did.

i always thought that the synthesis ending was the true sacrifice, the galaxy was saved entirely, but at the cost of your life, with your romance option left complety alone with no goodbye.

That happens with control too imo. The only difference is with Shep in the reaper itself I guess she might be able to say goodbye to her LI but its unlikely.

[JosieFrances]

I was pretty upset about the ending, but the EC did help a lot, it gave me the closure I needed. Especially with the way they made you feel taht your LI wasn't ready to give up on you and doesn't put your name on the memorial wall and signifies that they are not ready to believe you are dead, theres still hope. (Destroy Ending)

And for me like many others I have seen on the forums, in my head I just imagined the Citadel DLC took place after the end of the game and thats all im getting and im satisfied, all I do now is miss the game, because it was one of the best franchises overall that I have ever played!