550 réponses à ce sujet

[von uber]

Doesn't she outrank shep by the end?

[Vazgen]

Doesn't she outrank shep by the end?

Nope, both of them are Lieutenant Commanders in the end. Kaidan outranks Shepard by becoming a Major

[von uber]

Ah yes knew it was one of them.

[Valmar]

Nope, both of them are Lieutenant Commanders in the end. Kaidan outranks Shepard by becoming a Major

 

Isn't Shepard actually Lieutenant Commander, not actually a commander?  So by the end they both either have the same rank or higher. Whats a man have to do to get a promotion? Beat the reapers twice?

[Vazgen]

Isn't Shepard actually Lieutenant Commander, not actually a commander?  So by the end they both either have the same rank or higher. Whats a man have to do to get a promotion? Beat the reapers twice?

Yes, that's what I said. Ash is Lieutenant Commander and so is Shepard. 

As for what to do to get promoted... A few things, not to die, not work with a terrorist organization, not to constantly risk starting a galactic war by acting with Council authority in Terminus systems and blowing up batarian systems

[JasonShepard]

Yes, that's what I said. Ash is Lieutenant Commander and so is Shepard. 

As for what to do to get promoted... A few things, not to die, not work with a terrorist organization, not to constantly risk starting a galactic war by acting with Council authority in Terminus systems and blowing up batarian systems

 

Honestly, you blow up one star system and no-one ever lets you forget it...

[Vazgen]

Honestly, you blow up one star system and no-one ever lets you forget it...

And for the right reason lol

[Valmar]

They were just batarians, though. Hard for me to put value on the lives of those who put no value on lives themselves.

 

Wait, I take that back. They do value lives. As a resource. Because slavery is their culture.

 

Many tears were shed over the sacrifice. If Bioware really wanted me to feel something from that they shouldn't had made all the lore up to that point paint the batarians as horrible monsters.

[Vazgen]

They were just batarians, though. Hard for me to put value on the lives of those who put no value on lives themselves.

 

Wait, I take that back. They do value lives. As a resource. Because slavery is their culture.

 

Many tears were shed over the sacrifice. If Bioware really wanted me to feel something from that they shouldn't had made all the lore up to that point paint the batarians as horrible monsters.

The feelings are not the point. I think Bioware did that to the batarians exactly because players would not carry much about killing a bunch of slavers.

 

The point is, the relations with the batarians are strained as it is. Then Alliance soldier goes and blows up a relay in a batarian space. That's not something to promote him for. Imagine a Russian soldier detonating a nuke in US and then getting promoted for that in Russia. 

[God]

Isn't Shepard actually Lieutenant Commander, not actually a commander?  So by the end they both either have the same rank or higher. Whats a man have to do to get a promotion? Beat the reapers twice?

 

Technically, as a spectre, Shepard supercedes even Hackett. Which means Ashley does too, but I think the Commander for Shepard is, at this point, as much a title as it is a rank. I would honestly say that Shepard has reached a point where his rank isn't indicative of his title. 

 

Like Master Chief from Halo. He was offered a direct commission to flag officer, and declined it because he didn't feel it had the same ring to it. 

[God]

The feelings are not the point. I think Bioware did that to the batarians exactly because players would not carry much about killing a bunch of slavers.

 

The point is, the relations with the batarians are strained as it is. Then Alliance soldier goes and blows up a relay in a batarian space. That's not something to promote him for. Imagine a Russian soldier detonating a nuke in US and then getting promoted for that in Russia. 

 

Technically speaking, Shepard isn't really in the alliance anymore at that point. He wasn't even really formally reinstated until Earth. Then again, the game isn't exactly what you'd call consistent with how it handles things. The definitions change to suit the needs of the writers very often.

[Daemul]

I have no idea why Shepard and the VS even remained part of the Alliance after they were made Spectres, they should have left their jobs and just focused on working for the Council like the other Spectres did. Being under both the Alliance and the Council makes no sense due to the inevitable conflict of interests. 

[Vazgen]

 

Technically speaking, Shepard isn't really in the alliance anymore at that point. He wasn't even really formally reinstated until Earth. Then again, the game isn't exactly what you'd call consistent with how it handles things. The definitions change to suit the needs of the writers very often.

Technically speaking, yes. In the context of a military career it, however, ties the hands of his superiors. Even if he was not a part of the Alliance at the time of Alpha Relay incident, his consequent promotion will be viewed as support for his actions.

[themikefest]

 Imagine a Russian soldier detonating a nuke in US and then getting promoted for that in Russia. 

It would be a short-lived promotion 

[Daemul]

Imagine a Russian soldier detonating a nuke in US and then getting promoted for that in Russia. 

 

The Russians would take him out into the middle of nowhere, put a bullet in his head, bury him in the snow and deny that he ever existed. 

[Valmar]

The feelings are not the point. I think Bioware did that to the batarians exactly because players would not carry much about killing a bunch of slavers.

 

The point is, the relations with the batarians are strained as it is. Then Alliance soldier goes and blows up a relay in a batarian space. That's not something to promote him for. Imagine a Russian soldier detonating a nuke in US and then getting promoted for that in Russia. 

 

I don't think any fair analogy can be made between the batarians and any earth government. The batarians were universally shown to all be horrible. We didn't get any "they're not all bad" moments until the very end of the trilogy. At this point the game was pushing us to view them as solely these terroristic bad guys that enjoy slavery. It wasn't just a extremist group, it was their entire culture and society as a whole.

 

Beyond that if they really cared so much about the relations then they had plenty of scapegoats. Shepard wasn't part of the alliance at that time. How do they know Shepard was the one behind it? Because Hackett told them? Keep it secret. Even if they did find out, so what? Normandy was flagged as a Cerberus vessel. Shepard works for Cerberus at that point.

[Vazgen]

I don't think any fair analogy can be made between the batarians and any earth government. The batarians were universally shown to all be horrible. We didn't get any "they're not all bad" moments until the very end of the trilogy. At this point the game was pushing us to view them as solely these terroristic bad guys that enjoy slavery. It wasn't just a extremist group, it was their entire culture and society as a whole.

 

Beyond that if they really cared so much about the relations then they had plenty of scapegoats. Shepard wasn't part of the alliance at that time. How do they know Shepard was the one behind it? Because Hackett told them? Keep it secret. Even if they did find out, so what? Normandy was flagged as a Cerberus vessel. Shepard works for Cerberus at that point.

Revelations provided quite a few insights on Batarian culture and society. When Balak says "we were a proud race" I can totally see it, since its exactly how I pictured them from the books and the games. 

Still, that's beside the point. The point is, will Shepard's promotion immediately after Bahak incident be considered a good move for the Alliance considering possible tensions with the Batarians? I think no.

As for how do they know if Shepard was the one doing it - the prison had surveillance footage that Shepard never bothered to wipe out. Shepard freed Kenson who confessed trying to smash an asteroid into the relay. So Shepard will be an accomplice at best. Assuming they uploaded the info out of the system, of course, which I think is a logical decision after Shepard escapes with Kenson. 

[Eezay]

I saved Ashley so far for every playthrough, but with my current trilogy run I will save Kaidan for the first time.

[Arcian]

Kaidan, he doesn't leave me with a sour taste in my mouth after every conversation.

[Valmar]

Revelations provided quite a few insights on Batarian culture and society. When Balak says "we were a proud race" I can totally see it, since its exactly how I pictured them from the books and the games.

 

I'll admit I haven't read Revelations in a long time so I don't really remember batarian culture in it other than the head tilting. I remember Saren killing some burnt up batarian woman, but thats about it.

 

They were a proud race... well, those who were born from the right prestigious parents due to their caste system. In the same sense the pharaohs were a proud people.
 

Also, lets recite some lovely history from the wiki:

 

"Despite being welcomed into the galactic community, batarian aggression provoked several crises in galactic relations over the years. Sometime around 1785 CE, a batarian fleet bombarded the salarian colony world of Mannovai; in 1913, the Batarian Hegemony annexed the independent asari colony of Esan; and in 2115, Citadel forces skirmished with batarian forces on the planet Enael.

 

In the early 2160s, humans began to colonize the Skyllian Verge, a region the batarians were already actively settling. The batarians asked the Citadel Council to intervene and declare the Verge an area of "batarian interest". When the Council refused, the batarians closed their Citadel embassy and severed diplomatic and economic relations, becoming an inward-looking rogue state.

 

Money and weapons funneled from the batarian government to criminal organizations led to many brutal raids on human colonies in the Verge, such as Mindoir, culminating in the Skyllian Blitz of 2176, an attack on the human capital of Elysium by batarian-funded pirates and slavers. In 2178, the Alliance retaliated with a crushing assault on the moon of Torfan, long used as a staging base by batarian-backed criminals. In the aftermath, the batarians retreated into their own systems, and are now rarely seen in Citadel space."

 

 

 

It looks to me that the batarians have always been the way they are. Balak may speak like they were proud once and are only in the position they're in now due to humanity but his claims are proven baseless in the lore. He's just a terrorists who wants to accuse others for the failings of his species. The batarians were so uppity that they couldn't get their way that they decided to separate from the council and go rogue. Yet all this blame is placed on humanity and he uses it as his fanatical excuse to commit atrocious terrorist actions. You know, like trying to kill all life on a planet.

 

Oh, and Balak? This terrorist who tried to wipe out a planet? He's part of the batarian military, not just some random thug. Sounds familiar. I'm sure Balak is/was quite proud of that culture. I argue that its NOTHING to be proud about.

 

Still, that's beside the point. The point is, will Shepard's promotion immediately after Bahak incident be considered a good move for the Alliance considering possible tensions with the Batarians? I think no.

 

Fair enough but why wait until that point to think of promotion anyway? Didn't he earn a promotion after his exploits in the first game? The events in ME2 were widely unrelated to the argument why he deserves a promotion. It seems funny that Ashley can skyrocket through the ranks but Shepard remains Lt. Commander throughout the entire trilogy considering all his accomplishments and feats. Though I do agree with the sentiments brought up with others that its more a title than a rank at this point. Still, bit amusing. Ashley deserved tons of promotions, apparently, but Shepard isn't even humored it.

 

Hell, Shepard doesn't even get say so in being a Spectre. Maybe I didn't want to be the first human spectre. Maybe I didn't want the council to decide to make me spectre again in ME3. Forever forced to be The Commander Shepard, Spectre. Personally I don't mind it but still acknowledge how forced some of this is on the player.

 

 

As for how do they know if Shepard was the one doing it - the prison had surveillance footage that Shepard never bothered to wipe out. Shepard freed Kenson who confessed trying to smash an asteroid into the relay. So Shepard will be an accomplice at best. Assuming they uploaded the info out of the system, of course, which I think is a logical decision after Shepard escapes with Kenson.

 

What if my Shepard wore a recon mask the entire time?

[God]

 

 

Technically speaking, yes. In the context of a military career it, however, ties the hands of his superiors. Even if he was not a part of the Alliance at the time of Alpha Relay incident, his consequent promotion will be viewed as support for his actions.

 

 

Oh I'm not saying he'll be promoted for his actions. I'm saying that it's technically irrelevant given that he's really only notionally in the alliance again.

[Cette]

To be fair here I'd best state my biases up front. I'm not particularly fond of the military and the type of mindset it seems to encourage, religious folk and poetry. I absolutely despise xenophobes, nationalists and people who lack the capacity for self reflection. Also just people in general and certain types of beetles.

So yeah I used to spare Kaidan on the basis of not being able to nuke both and him mearly being boring as opposed being everything I don't like in one person.

However in 3 he really came into his own while I now wish I could send Vega back and nuke him instead.

I'm just now starting a ME2 play through with Ash alive though just to see how that plays out in 3. From what I'm hearing she's been done dirty and that seems questionable after the much more literal character assassination she normally gets from me.

Edit: Also she kinda has the Innsmouth look about her. Which isn't a deal breaker but ain't exactly helping her case.

[God]

To be fair here I'd best state my biases up front. I'm not particularly fond of the military and the type of mindset it seems to encourage, religious folk and poetry. I absolutely despise xenophobes, nationalists and people who lack the capacity for self reflection. Also just people in general and certain types of beetles.

So yeah I used to spare Kaidan on the basis of not being able to nuke both and him mearly being boring as opposed being everything I don't like in one person.

However in 3 he really came into his own while I now wish I could send Vega back and nuke him instead.

I'm just now starting a ME2 play through with Ash alive though just to see how that plays out in 3. From what I'm hearing she's been done dirty and that seems questionable after the much more literal character assassination she normally gets from me.

Edit: Also she kinda has the Innsmouth look about her. Which isn't a deal breaker but ain't exactly helping her case.

 

Nationalism or patriotism? There is a very distinct difference.

 

I'd argue that patriotism itself isn't bad, and isn't really made worse with practical survivalism (which is how I'd define Cerberus for the most part). Patriotism is merely the love of ones own country. Nationalism is the kicker (and when not taken out of control is also not that bad). It's when the people reach a state of 'my country, right or wrong' and the even worse 'my country, do or die' which is the point where they start seeing Americans (specifically white conservatives who are probably Christian) as inherently superior to everyone else (aka, the American exceptionalist crowd)

 

Also, what about military types do you not like? I'm one, and I'd argue that, sans the military part of me, I wouldn't meet any of your issues. I'm a secular atheist and (trans)humanist, I don't mind poetry (but I don't care much for it either), I'm certainly not a xenophobe (I've fought xenophobes before on the battlefield), I am a patriot with some minor nationalist beliefs (but as I said, there are varying levels of both, and I don't feel my home country, the United States, is inherently superior. Hell, I'm 25 years old and I can say with certainty that I quite a lot about other countries; I've lived about 11 of those years abroad in other country at some point. I loved every single one of those countries. 
 

I'm patriotic enough that I want to see it healthy and taken care of environmentally. I want to volunteer abroad for the Peace Corps and build some goodwill for America and whatever country is my host. I would like to be part of a diplomatic mission one day too. Hell, I want to emmigrate to Australia, and spend a good 2 or 3 years backpacking around Europe, while hiking in the vast mountains of the Himalayas. There's so much I want to do, and so much I want to see that I can't list all of it here, and I know I will be able to do it because I have worked to give myself that opportunity in a country that helps me very much to do it. In my country that was founded on an ideology of liberty and opportunity, where everyone is guaranteed a chance to try for both. I wouldn't say that's unhealthy love for country would you?

 

Point I'm making here is don't push broad strokes over certain people.

[von uber]

Secular atheist? Mr Massively you have gone up in my estimation, sir.

[God]

Secular atheist? Mr Massively you have gone up in my estimation, sir.

 

What'd you think I was, a fundie?