4466 réponses à ce sujet

[Abriael_CG]

T1l wrote...

So there is zero grounds for people who have purchased a product which has been falsely advertised?

That can't be right. I'm not in business, I’m a cop, I don't know the finer points of legal matters regarding retail... but that doesn’t seem right.

As a cop you should be most familiar with the fact that legal matters don't seem right in the 50% of  cases

As long as it's specified that the points are non refundable, one purchases them at his own risk. Many of us were misled in buying them, but all we can do is to wait to be given a chance to buy something with them. And be pissed off, of course, even if some seem to think we don't have a right to be

[Goth Skunk]

Abriael_CG wrote...

Are they? 
If they are, they sure are good at hiding it. Similar mess-ups (actually lesser mess-ups) by other software houses have resulted in CEOs writing themselves (or through the Community managers, but in their name) some very apologetic and informative posts.
I don't think I ever seen Ray in this forum, nor anyone posting an apology from him, or anyone higher up in the Bioware ranks. I see no information.

The impression I'm given is that they think that all is good, and that their customers don't really deserve being kept updated on a regular base. Let's not even talk about someone higher up than a poor blameless community manager coming here to take off his hat and give the customerbase an apology for the mess-up.

It would be incredibly naïve to assume that there is no concern from project leads and The Good Doctor's themselves. I'm sure they are being updated far more frequently than we are. Updating us at this point with anything short of 'It's done! Come and get it!' or 'Sorry, we've cancelled the project, contact this email address to receive a refund.' would just bring the community around full circle. There will be the dissenters, and there will be the defenders, and they will just rekindle the fire anew from the last one.

That act is counter-productive. It certainly doesn't help, and it only makes certain people angrier and more vocal. In turn, they spout their anger here in the community, then get pelted by rotten fruit by the patient crowd.

The probable reason you don't see the Good Doctor's posting on the forum is then because people would get the wrong impression that they answer to us, and that we can expect/demand answers personally from them. Certainly not the case.

[rruffo]

no doubt most will be disappointed and many will think twice about buying such short dlc the only way BW can redeem this issue fully is to say hey guys were sorry , thanks for ur support RTO will be released free of charge.

[zengetsu666]

kuroshimodo wrote...

Fallout 3 is one of my favorite all time games, don't get me wrong, but the game was bug haven. I don't know about the ps3 version and by the sound of the pc version bugs found a happy home but I do know the xbox 360 version was riddle with bugs. If my memory serves me correct, the Bethseda Fallout 3 forums had a huge population of people complaining about the horrendous amount of bugs. Maybe I am exaggerating but I still loved the game. The collector's edition is supposed to have many of those bugs fixed from the last time I heard. Nevertheless I am finish talking about a different company game and getting back into the problem about Return to Ostagar. I kind of have my hopes up that the bugs will be fixed for this upcoming weekend even if it seems to be a fool's dream. I want to play something with no bugs if not the lowest possible amount of bugs so I can be sure that the DLC will play without too many problems. I will be damned if I have to start all over again just because a DLC didn't function properly (like my incidence with Fallout 3 Mothership Zeta DLC, sorry for bringing up Fallout again). All in all I am quite confident the wait will be worth it and if not then i guess fan feed back is a blessing and a curse. =p

ps version was no better just hope the rto dlc is perfect for this amount of time to pass and it still have bugs

[Abriael_CG]

@goth skunk: They DO answer to us. The gaming market completely revolves around the customer (like 90% of the markets).
Many others did it, and got very positive responses. The fact that it wouldn't make you feel better, doesn't mean that it wouldn't make many others feel better.

When you mess up (or someone under your responsibility messes up), you apologize. It's the very basic of human relations.
I can only feel plenty respect for those CEOs and project leaders that can face that kind of responsibility, instead of sending blameless community managers to the meatgrinder. Most people respect that as well, and the response is usually positive.
Sure, there always be haters, but normally when someone higher up in the food chain has the guts to come and face the community himself, hat in hand and showing a bit of humility, the haters are isolated and mocked by the rest of the community.

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 21 janvier 2010 - 05:44 .

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Goth Skunk wrote...
It would be incredibly naïve to assume that there is no concern from project leads and The Good Doctor's themselves. I'm sure they are being updated far more frequently than we are. Updating us at this point with anything short of 'It's done! Come and get it!' or 'Sorry, we've cancelled the project, contact this email address to receive a refund.' would just bring the community around full circle. There will be the dissenters, and there will be the defenders, and they will just rekindle the fire anew from the last one.

That act is counter-productive. It certainly doesn't help, and it only makes certain people angrier and more vocal. In turn, they spout their anger here in the community, then get pelted by rotten fruit by the patient crowd.

The probable reason you don't see the Good Doctor's posting on the forum is then because people would get the wrong impression that they answer to us, and that we can expect/demand answers personally from them. Certainly not the case.

Yep its counter productive to keep your customers informed when products are delayed. Especially when they've esentially already paid for it. Yep, thats just so logical and full of smart business sense right there.

[Branagen]

rruffo wrote...

no doubt most will be disappointed and many will think twice about buying such short dlc the only way BW can redeem this issue fully is to say hey guys were sorry , thanks for ur support RTO will be released free of charge.

LOL... hopeful but most likely not

[T1l]

Abriael_CG wrote...
As a cop you should be most familiar with the fact that legal matters don't seem right in the 50% of  cases

As long as it's specified that the points are non refundable, one purchases them at his own risk. Many of us were misled in buying them, but all we can do is to wait to be given a chance to buy something with them. And be pissed off, of course, even if some seem to think we don't have a right to be

Too true. Often common law can be down-right absurd, which is why there are higher courts of law.

I don't know how well Biowares' particular caveat would stand up in a court of law. This doesn't seem to be a simple case of caveat emptor - nor was Bioware intentionally misleading people for profit. I'm not exactly sure what to make of that situation, but at the very least it's terrible customer service. That's a very strange policy for a company to adopt - but I'm sure Bioware has a very good legal team who advised them of this policy; a legal team who would be immeasurably more familiar with the particular laws associated with making such a statement.

Still, I find it strange.

But what's even more strange is that we haven't had an update here for a full week.

Modifié par T1l, 21 janvier 2010 - 05:45 .

[Branagen]

Mass 2 - Next WEEK!!

[Branagen]

Maybe I can use my recent purchase of points for Mass 2

Modifié par Branagen, 21 janvier 2010 - 05:46 .

[Abriael_CG]

Branagen wrote...

Mass 2 - Next WEEK!!

I'm sure that you're aware that this is off topic. Many people here care more about DA:O than Mass Effect 2, and are more interested in finally getting some new content for the game this forum is about instead of getting another game, as interesting as it looks.

Personally, while I am looking forward to ME2. Due to the fact that ME1 was in many ways pretty lackluster, I care about it quite a lot less than about RtO, and I'm a bit tired of seeing people continuously coming to the DA:O forum to talk about another game, even if made by the same company.

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 21 janvier 2010 - 05:49 .

[jennamarae]

rruffo wrote...

no doubt most will be disappointed and many will think twice about buying such short dlc the only way BW can redeem this issue fully is to say hey guys were sorry , thanks for ur support RTO will be released free of charge.

That's not going to happen. Some people already paid for it on the Xbox and many have prepaid for Bioware points for it. They're not going to release it free now because they'd have a lot of angry people wanting their money/points refunded.

[Branagen]

Off Topic,, Off Topic!! Shut this whiney thread down!

[Branagen]

lol

[sethroskull79]

So let me get this straight.....RTO isn't fixed yet. Haha just kidding. I can wait for this, I just hope Awakening comes out when its supposed too, but now who can be of anything. I guess the rest of the game and its enormity will have to suffice.

[dirtyvermin]

Well personally as an avid online gamer iv had my fare share of updates and DLC pushed out to early by the marketing teams, all buged to hell and unplayable for me im happy that bioware at least seem to be putting quality first, and as for regular updates on what's happening what do you guys want a statement every day saying what? its still broken but we are working on it.

[rruffo]

Divinity 2: Ego Draconis is a great game! huge, fun, and they r working on full expantion pack . Larian Studios is independent and not nickel and dimeing me with 60 min add-ons. Full bore 60 to 70 hours of game and 20 to 30 hours of expantion. and I forgot when i bought DOA i paid 60 buck for PC version first time ever paid that much.

[Abriael_CG]

dirtyvermin wrote...

Well personally as an avid online gamer iv had my fare share of updates and DLC pushed out to early by the marketing teams, all buged to hell and unplayable for me im happy that bioware at least seem to be putting quality first, and as for regular updates on what's happening what do you guys want a statement every day saying what? its still broken but we are working on it.

A projected release date wouldn't be bad.

rruffo wrote...

Divinity 2: Ego Draconis is a great game!
huge, fun, and they r working on full expantion pack . Larian Studios
is independent and not nickel and dimeing me with 60 min add-ons. Full
bore 60 to 70 hours of game and 20 to 30 hours of expantion. and I
forgot when i bought DOA i paid 60 buck for PC version first time ever
paid that much.

And I don't remember this being the right place to advertise competing (and largely inferior) games.

Modifié par Abriael_CG, 21 janvier 2010 - 05:56 .

[DD_74]

Just because there is a no refund buyer beware policy does not obsolve the company from a faulty product. If that were the case then there would be no tort cases for products from companies that knowingly placed products on the market that were defective and possibly caused damage.



In this case a product was released with known bugs and those bugs affected other content in the actual game. If the download simply sucked then I would have no issues. But to take my money and cause a loss of something I actually worked for is noththing short of theft in my opinion. If the cost were higher then there would probably be even more outrage.



BTW I tried the whole delete cache memory fix and it did not unlock the now locked character specializations. I may have to actually delete RTO just to play through again and get them to unlock. Waste of time in my opinion as I now no longer have the luxury of playing all day. When it originally came out I had all the time in the world being on vacation and all. Now real life beacons.



I am no lawyer nor an MBA but it seems quite simple to me if you sell or create a product then you should stand behind it. Customer service has seriously declined in our society. Feed back from the company even if it was just to say hey we really do not care at all would at the very least let you know where you stand. Instead we get nothing and that is essentially theft. Why do you think that there are lemon laws? Even if you purchase a used car as is if it is severly defective then the law does allow for some form of compensation.

[Paradoxbound]

dirtyvermin wrote...
what do you guys want a statement every day saying what? its still broken but we are working on it.

That is the simple minimum I expect for failing to deliver a promised product.  Is it really so difficult for a customer service person to release a simple update once every 24 hours?

[T1l]

DD_74 wrote...

Just because there is a no refund buyer beware policy does not obsolve the company from a faulty product. If that were the case then there would be no tort cases for products from companies that knowingly placed products on the market that were defective and possibly caused damage.

In this case a product was released with known bugs and those bugs affected other content in the actual game. If the download simply sucked then I would have no issues. But to take my money and cause a loss of something I actually worked for is noththing short of theft in my opinion. If the cost were higher then there would probably be even more outrage.

BTW I tried the whole delete cache memory fix and it did not unlock the now locked character specializations. I may have to actually delete RTO just to play through again and get them to unlock. Waste of time in my opinion as I now no longer have the luxury of playing all day. When it originally came out I had all the time in the world being on vacation and all. Now real life beacons.

I am no lawyer nor an MBA but it seems quite simple to me if you sell or create a product then you should stand behind it. Customer service has seriously declined in our society. Feed back from the company even if it was just to say hey we really do not care at all would at the very least let you know where you stand. Instead we get nothing and that is essentially theft. Why do you think that there are lemon laws? Even if you purchase a used car as is if it is severly defective then the law does allow for some form of compensation.

For it to be theft you need to prove intent. I don't believe it was Biowares' intent to mislead and profit. Yes, that's what has happened, and I too find it strange that there are no grounds for compensation and I find it backwards for Bioware to adopt such a policy; but again, I'm no lawyer and I certainly don't claim to be an expert in retail laws.

[Shadowulph]

I have said the same thing about it being shelved for ME, they have a week to get RTO out. DA:O looks like it is dying a very slow and painful death and ME is laughing at it saying "Will You Just Die Already!" "And After You Die I Am Taking Your Armor So I Can Show Everyone I Am Better Then You!"