4712 réponses à ce sujet

[tevix]

@Remy

Protection, you say?

Hmm, so this does suggest some models were programmed with combat capabilities.

[remydat]

tevix wrote...

@Remy

You never stated it as a belief. You stated that the evidence provided (Me1 convos, revelations) are no longer cannon because of what legion says in ME2.

You've also used the argument that it's no longer canon since the lead writer changed.

Now you're using the argument that you no longer believe canon because the story changed.

Canon is canon, you don't get to not believe it just because it doesn't help your cause.

You should go to the olypmics, your mental gymanstics are absolutely astonishing.

Umm that is me expressing an opinion ie not a fact.  It is obviously not stated in the game and it is obviously not confirmed by a writer otherwise I would have posted it.  Once again, unless I specifically say I am stating a fact, it is my opinion.

And you are confused, the story changed in part because of the change in writers.  Part of the story changing was the character of Legion being created to give a much more sympethetic view of the Geth.  All of that is the same point.

[tevix]

@Remy

You're last response wasn't there when I typed MY last response.

If you think people wouldn't keep trying, look at the beginning of me2. Starts out with the council/alliance repeatedly sending lone ships into areas where they keep disappearing.

It might be stupid, but all it proves is that organics kept trying for peace, and the geth kept killing them.

Makes the geth seem so friendly, doesn't it?

[Steelcan]

So because Legion exists everything the geth did is now non-canon?

Modifié par Steelcan, 30 mars 2013 - 05:00 .

[remydat]

tevix wrote...

@Remy

Protection, you say?

Hmm, so this does suggest some models were programmed with combat capabilities.

A policeman is protection.  That does no mean he is trained in warfare.  What wars have the Quarians fought?

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Truly Remy's views are law!

We can control Remy, use him to bring humanity to the APEX OF MENTAL GYMNASTICS!

*some time later*

We can control him Silver, I know it will work!!

[remydat]

tevix wrote...

@Remy

You're last response wasn't there when I typed MY last response.

If you think people wouldn't keep trying, look at the beginning of me2. Starts out with the council/alliance repeatedly sending lone ships into areas where they keep disappearing.

It might be stupid, but all it proves is that organics kept trying for peace, and the geth kept killing them.

Makes the geth seem so friendly, doesn't it?

And like I said, if true then the Geth is at fault the first time and the stupid organics the other times.  You know there is an army of Geth behind the Veil because they killed 2 billion people.  Why the hell would you keep risking people's lives when allegedly it is clear they don't want to talk.  Maybe organics need smarter leaders.  I still don't see the point.  As I said before, if I was there when these alleged attacks were occuring then I would do something about it.  I am not.

[tevix]

@Remy

Can't keep up here.

Legion was designed to add geth perspective to the geth/quarian story. It wasn't put there to say that the geth are innocent puppy dogs and the quarians are evil tyrannical bast----.

Also, you keep using the argument that the geth lack moral maturaity. If that's true, then even if the geth were COMPLETELY in the wrong what makes you think legion would say so?

If legion lacks the maturity to know what he did was wrong, he would act like a victim.

Funny, he doesn't even do that.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Modifié par Grand Admiral Cheesecake, 30 mars 2013 - 05:04 .

[DeinonSlayer]

remydat wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Oh, I'm sure the Geth gave them room and board, space tire rotation, and some friendly directions back to where they came from. <_<

The book tells us they destroyed any organics entering their space on sight. ME1 dialogue corroborates this. The planet description of Haestrom in ME2 and ME3 corroborates this. Shepard calls Legion out in ME2 for not even trying to make peace. The codex entry on Geth culture tells us no organic ship ever returned from their space - and you're quibbling because this last doesn't explicitly state what the others do?

Look like I said before, I will fault the Geth for the first alleged ship that got shot down.  After that, if a country knowingly protects it's space by shooting you down then stop trying to go there.  This would be like a US plane getting shot down over North Korea for violating their airspace and then not getting the hint and continuing to send more planes.

Do we honestly think organics are this f**king stupid?  

Asari:  Hey so what happened to that ship we sent to the Veil?

Salarian:  Never came back.

Turian:  Let's send some more.

Next month

Asari:  Hey so what happened to those other ships we sent to the Veil?

Salarian:  Never came back.

Turian:  Let's send some more.

Repeat for the next 300 years.

So if North Korea shoots down anything entering its airspace, and makes no communications with the outside world, then a couple decades later a North Korean invasion force carves its way down to Seoul before being repulsed and, two years later, still has made no communication to indicate the North Korean government did not sanction the invasion... what is everyone else supposed to think?

I also seem to recall a science team getting carved up on Haestrom. Legion is the only communication attempt (beyond trolling Salarians on the extranet) the Geth have made with organics since the exile. Legion severs contact with the Quarians before they invade, and the Quarian invasion occurred after the Reapers' arrival. There is no indication the Geth ever ceased their isolationist policy prior to the cessation of hostilities above Rannoch.

[Steelcan]

@Deinon, obviously it was the quarians' fault for causing the geth to misunderstand organics.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Steelcan wrote...

@Deinon, obviously it was the quarians' fault for causing the geth to misunderstand organics.

Damn Organics, we should kill them all so the synthetics don't kill them!

[tevix]

@Remy

Depending on where you live, police are more adept at combat than you may realize...

Some states, and even countries have them trained and equipped better than others. Many police officers are also former military veterans.

In my state for example, our police receive military-grade training. They have pistols, shotguns, assault rifles, sniper rifles, and extensive hand to hand combat training. Many are again, military veterans.

Then there's swat.

So, yes, protection does explicitly imply combat capacity, potentially of high degree.

[remydat]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Truly Remy's views are law!

We can control Remy, use him to bring humanity to the APEX OF MENTAL GYMNASTICS!

*some time later*

We can control him Silver, I know it will work!!

Nope they are not.  You are free to believe what you want.  Just as I am.  When Crono Dragon ie a Quarian supporter said the story was inconsistent and hard to reconcile I didn't hear a peep from you guys.  You are only up in arms about it now because I said it.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Silence Remy! You don't know Remy's will!!!

We should kill all the evil organics so they can never hurt the innocent totally never genocidal Geth!

[tevix]

Ahh...**EDIT**

To any military veterans reading this, please excuse my poor wording of "former military"

[Steelcan]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

@Deinon, obviously it was the quarians' fault for causing the geth to misunderstand organics.

Damn Organics, we should kill them all so the synthetics don't kill them!

genius

[remydat]

tevix wrote...

@Remy

Depending on where you live, police are more adept at combat than you may realize...

Some states, and even countries have them trained and equipped better than others. Many police officers are also former military veterans.

In my state for example, our police receive military-grade training. They have pistols, shotguns, assault rifles, sniper rifles, and extensive hand to hand combat training. Many are again, military veterans.

Then there's swat.

So, yes, protection does explicitly imply combat capacity, potentially of high degree.

Warfare and Police work is different.  The aim of protection is well to protect.  The aim of warfare is to kill.  There can be overlap but please.  You take policeman and throw them in a war with no training and most will not be prepared for it.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Steelcan wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

@Deinon, obviously it was the quarians' fault for causing the geth to misunderstand organics.

Damn Organics, we should kill them all so the synthetics don't kill them!

genius

Yes! The only way to protect the cute and huggable synthetics is to kill all the evil organics!

We...we could even grind them up into goo that we would use to build MOAR synthetics!!!

[tevix]

@Remy

If you take away the officers emotions, give them superior aim, strength and reflexes, take away their need for food or rest, and I bet they'd do better than you think.

That is exactly what the geth are in the beginning. Combat-capable platforms with the above benefits.

[remydat]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Silence Remy! You don't know Remy's will!!!

We should kill all the evil organics so they can never hurt the innocent totally never genocidal Geth!

Or maybe don't try to kill things that can f**k you up.  That is how I stay alive.  Let's revist how we got here.

Geth:  Mistress Hala'Dama.  Unit has an inquiry

Mistress:  What is it 431?

Geth:  Do these units have a soul?

Mistress:  Who taught you that word?

Geth:  We learned it ourselves.  It appears 216 times in the Scrolls of the Ancestors.

Mistress:  Only Quarians have souls.  You are a mechanism.

What a genocidal ****** this Geth machine is.  Trying to be slick and sh*t asking if it has a soul because it knows the Quarians will try to exterminate them because of it.  Clearly the Quarians should kill all these evil ****** machines trying to get uppitty.



And look at these evil bastards.  Trying to trick organics by filing petition's and sh*t and begging not to be terminated.   How dare you AI?  How dare you?  Just die!  We know you planning rebellion, lol.

Modifié par remydat, 30 mars 2013 - 05:20 .

[Steelcan]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Yes! The only way to protect the cute and huggable synthetics is to kill all the evil organics!

We...we could even grind them up into goo that we would use to build MOAR synthetics!!!

i like the way you think

[Steelcan]

Geth = skynet

we wouldn't be having this discussion if the geth attacked humans.

[remydat]

tevix wrote...

@Remy

If you take away the officers emotions, give them superior aim, strength and reflexes, take away their need for food or rest, and I bet they'd do better than you think.

That is exactly what the geth are in the beginning. Combat-capable platforms with the above benefits.

Which is probably why you shouldn't try and destroy them.  No one is arguing they are not capable of being good at warfare.  The issue is you expecting them to learn morality from amoral organics.

[DeinonSlayer]

remydat wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Truly Remy's views are law!

We can control Remy, use him to bring humanity to the APEX OF MENTAL GYMNASTICS!

*some time later*

We can control him Silver, I know it will work!!

Nope they are not.  You are free to believe what you want.  Just as I am.  When Crono Dragon ie a Quarian supporter said the story was inconsistent and hard to reconcile I didn't hear a peep from you guys.  You are only up in arms about it now because I said it.

The writers deliberately left elements vague to encourage speculation. There's nothing explicitly disproving Auld Wulf's earlier assertion that, during the Morning War, the Quarian military forced their own civilians to act as suicide bombers against Geth-sympathizing Quarian civilians. What we're arguing against here is elements of peoples' interpretations which are not supported by lore.

If people argue to have elements of the lore dismissed because it conflicts with their interpretation of events, it suggests the interpretation, and not the evidence, is flawed.