4712 réponses à ce sujet

[Rhayak]

That's like saying slavery is OK because Batarians aren't human. Either they're equal in moral consideration, or they aren't. Other human societies have no moral restrictions against cannibalism; that doesn't mean I'm forbidden to judge them for it.

The Geth, the TRUE Geth, want only one thing:

Create their own future.

A future that will threaten only those who meddle.
If not for the Heretics, all civilizations save the Quarians would barely be aware of their existence.

Might seem weird but the True Geth are probably the most morally 'clean' civilization of all Mass 3. It's not their fault if they destroy the ass of those who won't leave them be.

Modifié par Rhayak, 17 mars 2013 - 05:09 .

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

To be honest, I think one of the biggest reasons people pick the geth over quarians is because they hate tali. Don't deny it.

[o Ventus]

Khelish wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

That's like saying slavery is OK because Batarians aren't human. Either they're equal in moral consideration, or they aren't. Other human societies have no moral restrictions against cannibalism; that doesn't mean I'm forbidden to judge them for it.

Slavery is literally the foundation of batarian economy and society.

And that makes it OK?

To them, it does.

Again, applying human logic to alien entities.

[DeinonSlayer]

o Ventus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

That's like saying slavery is OK because Batarians aren't human. Either they're equal in moral consideration, or they aren't. Other human societies have no moral restrictions against cannibalism; that doesn't mean I'm forbidden to judge them for it.

Slavery is literally the foundation of batarian economy and society.

You aren't forbidden to judge them, but your judgements are fallacious and inapplicable .

No less fallacious than theirs. My judgements are very much applicable to my interaction with them. Just because I understand another's position (ex: allying with the Reapers to stave off extinction) doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

[Khelish]

o Ventus wrote...

To them, it does.

Again, applying human logic to alien entities.

Now this, makes me sick.

Just because some group of people think it is alright to take away someone's rights against their will, doesn't make it OK.

[Iamjdr]

@Rhayak
If that what the true Geth really want then all the Geth we see on rannoch are heretics. They do not need the old machines upgrades they want them. all you do to stop the quarians from attacking is talk them down. With or without the upgrades shep could have said the exact same thing to end the fight but the Geth WANTED the reaper upgrades or was that not made evident enough by legion basically killing himself so that the upgrade would work.

[o Ventus]

DeinonSlayer weote...

No less fallacious than theirs.

Your strawman is showing.

My judgements are very much applicable to my interaction with them. Just because I understand another's position (ex: allying with the Reapers to stave off extinction) doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

Nobody said you have to agree with it.

[Kingthlayer]

If i had to chose on my very first time through Rannoch, I think I would have went Geth. Legion is IMO a better character than Tali.

In future playthroughs, it depends on the Shepard, if I'm romancing Tali, then Quarians all day. If I'm a doing a doom the galaxy play, Quarians are dying and then destroy kills the Geth. Completely depends. I think if Mass Effect 3 had more replayability IMO, I would have done it more this past year instead of just the one time, and I would have chosen the options to kill one or the other regardless of the option of peace. Anytime I ever did Mass Effect 1 or 2 they were completely different with their choices. Paragon and Renegade were irrelevant and still are.

[o Ventus]

Finn the Jakey wrote...

Why even apply it to aliens? By this logic, people in certain countries who mutilate and rape their daughters, hang homosexuals, or stone women to death should be excused on the grounds that their society works differently to ours.

Your strawman is showing too.

Literally nobody is saying that they are right, only that they perceive it as right, because its how they've operated since forever.

Going "lolnope!" To them is just as fallacious, because you aren't looking at it from their viewpoint.

[futurepixels]

The robots can suck it.

[DeinonSlayer]

o Ventus wrote...

DeinonSlayer weote...

No less fallacious than theirs.

Your strawman is showing.

You'll have to explain what you meant by "fallacious," then. As I understand it, you're suggesting nobody's moral judgement is better than anyone else, but by the sound of it, you want us to judge others by their own standards instead of ours (which would mean excusing slavery et al). I was simply trying to argue using your terms.

o Ventus wrote...

My judgements are very much applicable to my interaction with them. Just because I understand another's position (ex: allying with the Reapers to stave off extinction) doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

Nobody said you have to agree with it.

Again, where are you going with this?

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 17 mars 2013 - 05:23 .

[silverexile17s]

o Ventus wrote...

DeinonSlayer weote...

No less fallacious than theirs.

Your strawman is showing.

My judgements are very much applicable to my interaction with them. Just because I understand another's position (ex: allying with the Reapers to stave off extinction) doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

Nobody said you have to agree with it.

First off, it's YOUR srawman that's showing, not his. Second, YOU said he agreed with it.

[o Ventus]

silverexile17s wrote...

First off, it's YOUR srawman that's showing, not his.

The presenter of the argument cannot, by definition, be using a strawman.

Second, YOU said he agreed with it.

Whatever you say.

My point was that accusing them of being wrong is itself fallacious, because we don't think like they do. Their society was built on different foundations, with different social norms and expectations. 

[Rhayak]

Iamjdr wrote...

@Rhayak
If that what the true Geth really want then all the Geth we see on rannoch are heretics. They do not need the old machines upgrades they want them. all you do to stop the quarians from attacking is talk them down. With or without the upgrades shep could have said the exact same thing to end the fight but the Geth WANTED the reaper upgrades or was that not made evident enough by legion basically killing himself so that the upgrade would work.

No, it's not thirst for power. They felt like they needed it because, in their situation, they believed it was their only hope of survival against the Quarians, both in the initial phase of the attack and in the end.

We'll never know if they ACTUALLY needed it, but their losses had diminished their judgement.

Modifié par Rhayak, 17 mars 2013 - 05:40 .

[Iamjdr]

Slavery it's still wrong no matter how the batarians feel about it WTF does it matter what there social norm is. It was a social norm for people to have slave at one point does that mean it wasn't wrong then? They might not punish slavers where they come from but that don't mean jack **** when your the slave, an it sure as he'll don't make it okay.

[Rhayak]

The Batarians were clearly depicted to act as hate-magnets. I however like to see slavery as intrinsecally wrong.
Might be integral to Batarian culture but i'm pretty sure it's slaves would do without.

[Iamjdr]

@ Rhayak
Regardless the "true Geth" views now align with the heretics who I eradicated, or so I thought. They are now willing to have there future handed to them by the reapers instead of working for it themselves which is the exact opposite of what legion told me in me2. As a matter of fact now intead of never being alone with yhe Dyson sphere they  will be forever alone with reaper upgrades

Modifié par Iamjdr, 17 mars 2013 - 05:53 .

[Ar7emis]

Without any hesitation, I'd pick the geth. Never liked the quarians, with the exception of Tali (sometimes, she can be irritating), Reegar and Zaal'Koris vas Qwib Qwib.

[Iamjdr]

That's 3 Quarians to the 1 Geth you have ever met that hasn't tried to kill you and everyone you Know, but you wouldn't hesitate?

[ghost9191]

yeah but he doesn't like the qurians. reason enough i suppose =0

[NeonFlux117]

depends if you've rewrote or destroyed the heretics. If you have rewrote the heretics then I would pick the geth (more EMS) but if you destroy them, then the Geth are weaker so go with the quarians. I don't like the Quarian admirals, other than Tali and her aunt, but here you go.


All things being equal and not accounting for the "EMS" silly statistic. I would go with the Geth- in fact I would go with the Geth over every infantry in the galaxy. Why? They have perhaps the largest, and easily best equiped infantry in the galaxy. They don't require supply chains- for food, water, living quarters. They don't get tired- they're synthetics, they're a hive mind but after the reaper code upgrades they're capable of operating on there own, like Legion.

Then there's the Geth Fleet. A Geth dreadnought is what like 3 or 4 times the size of an alliance dreadnought. Wow. After the reaper upgrades they complety own the largest fleet in the galaxy (quarians).

Post reaper upgrades the Geth are the only single military faction that could go toe to toe with the reapers for a while if they had to. They're easily the strongest military in the game post reaper upgrades. Easily.

Modifié par NeonFlux117, 17 mars 2013 - 06:10 .

[Iamjdr]

I've met jerk quarians,nice quarians,slave quarians,dying quarians, overzealous quarians, honorable quarians and the list goes on and on but of the Geth , I've only ever met legion and the heretics. if that doesn't stop and make you think for a bit then I don't know what to tell you.

[Khelish]

NeonFlux117 wrote...

They're easily the strongest military in the game post reaper upgrades. Easily.

... and it doesn't matter at all, because we cannot beat the Reapers conventionally.

[Dean_the_Young]

Rhayak wrote...

NCommand wrote...
Billions of Quarians beg the differ

If you attempt to exterminate another race just because you're not ok with it being sentient, and it reacts symmetrically, you have brought it upon yourself.

How do billions of Quarians qualify for that?

Many Quarians tried to prevent the madness, and were silenced like in the worst dictatorships.

They were rounded up for mass forced labor and execution camps?

That's a tad extreme exageration of what was in the game.