4712 réponses à ce sujet

[justafan]

Rhayak wrote...

justafan wrote...
  Only 37% actually "chose" the Geth over Quarians.

Ouch.

All units retreat.

It actually is a promising statistic.  As it looks like almost all returning players chose peace.  it is mostly noobies who choose one over the other.

Oddly enough, no matter which side you prefer, a majority of players will have saved them.

[S.A.K]

Forgot to add:
Seeing a bunch of broken mechines doesn't upset me. (Alive or not Geth are still machines)
But seeing a bunch of dead men, women and children does upset me. Also I don't see enough points to even think Quarians should die and Geth should live even if I consider both sides to be equally alive. Geth were the side that joined the reapers to save themselves even at the expence of their own free will. And don't bring that Legion's bullsh!t to say otherwise. Heard that enough times already.

Edit : The Geth are not truely alive without the reapers code. So... yeah.

Modifié par S.A.K, 24 mars 2013 - 01:51 .

[Rhayak]

justafan wrote...

It actually is a promising statistic.  As it looks like almost all returning players chose peace.  it is mostly noobies who choose one over the other.

Oddly enough, no matter which side you prefer, a majority of players will have saved them.

I see that now.

Phew

[Rhayak]

S.A.K wrote...
Seeing a bunch of broken mechines doesn't upset me. (Alive or not Geth are still machines)

See it's this that i don't get: how is being mechanical inherently diminishing?

Imagine looking over a valley full of dead Autobots. How sad is that? Certainly as sad as uncovering a human mass grave. At least in my perception.

[S.A.K]

Rhayak wrote...

S.A.K wrote...
Seeing a bunch of broken mechines doesn't upset me. (Alive or not Geth are still machines)

See it's this that i don't get: how is being mechanical inherently diminishing?

Imagine looking over a valley full of dead Autobots. How sad is that? Certainly as sad as uncovering a human mass grave. At least in my perception.

It will be equal to seeing a valley full of dead soldiers. Thats the thing. Quarian race is not just soldiers. There are civiliance who didn't want any part of the war. There are women and children. Geth or any michanical life form don't  have anything to that effect. Every Geth is responsible for their actions. They are all soldiers. Thats my view point and I hope you undestand.

[Rhayak]

S.A.K wrote...
They are all soldiers. Thats my view point and I hope you undestand.

I do.

[DeinonSlayer]

Rhayak wrote...

In a new article on Eurogamer, Bioware says 59% of users picked the Geth.

Apparently there is still hope for humanity's humanity.

It's also at the top of the dialogue wheel, despite no paragon or renegade points being awarded for choosing one side or the other. I've yet to see a Let's Play vid on YouTube where the player didn't thoughtlessly choose paragon every single time. I don't know how many people actually play this way, but I know it's significant, and there are more of them than there are renegades.

I don't trust that statistic to reflect people who have put as much thought into it as we have, or even people who are aware of both sides of the story - if one has only ME3 as a base of reference ("best place to start the series!"), they never hear the other side. Not a whisper about the genocide, the isolationism (covered in ME1); no mention in dialogue of the difficulties posed by colonization (covered in ME2, tucked away in one of the few codex entries which carried over)... is there even any mention of the heretics in a fresh ME3 playthrough?

I call it the "sweep the mountain of corpses under the rug and pretend the mess never existed" gambit. 

Still, good at least to see people make peace if they can.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 24 mars 2013 - 04:50 .

[Iamjdr]

I still wish it was possible to use the paragon interupt to bring peace without the Geth needing to upgrade themselves with reaper code. Why is there no way to save both without it?especially when all you really do to bring peace is shout at the Quarian admirals. Does legion really need to be allowed to upgrade the all the Geth so I can tell the Quarians the Geth want peace? How exactly does upgrading the Geth with reaper code help me show the Quarians that the Geth want peace anyway? that never really made sense to me anyways.

[remydat]

Rip504 wrote...

You are basing your side on"the Quarians attacked first" and ignoring anything else. Lol give you a break? Nah,give me a break.
 Also I am not attacking your personal opinion,or trying to offend you in any way. I respect that you feel strongly in your opinion and I believe you should. As this entire discussion is based on opinions and not being right nor wrong.

I think you need to refer to the context of why I said.  I said the Geth logged off 2 billion Quarians and Silver responded as if we are talking about real people and real deaths.  It was a joke so when he went all emo on me about it I said to him, "Oh give me a break dude." 

And I no problem with people having a different opinion.  Once again, I have said repeatedly in this thread believe what you want.  Silver keeps trying to pass off his head cannon as fact and that is what I challenge him.  

Rip504 wrote...

Lol No,that is your horribly mistaken interpretation of my comment.
 I no longer wish to hold a discussion with you,as you have left 90% of my questions towards you unanswered.

I think you implied that because Kai Leng used a weapon (Reaper Tech) that it must mean using that weapon is bad.  If that is what you did not say or mean then let me know.

And I am pretty sure 90% of your questions have already been answered by me given I have been in this thread for damn near 70 pages but if you think there is a question you asked that I haven't answered then let me know.

Modifié par remydat, 24 mars 2013 - 05:38 .

[remydat]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

remydat You know you don't need to censor "damn" right?

It looks silly.

Well hot damn, that's a relief.

[remydat]

silverexile17s wrote...


You MISSED the point. Unarmed miners. NOT soldiers. And AGAIN, the rebellion wasn't instantianious. And the fact that the miners were overrun so quickly and massicared is PROOF that the geth cared less about civilian casualties.

And AGAIN. 2.1 billion. All dead. How much of the population do you think could POSSIBLY have been military forces?  Putting a gun to a child's head and pulling the trigger is EXACTALLY what the geth did verbatium. And did so en masse. And AGAIN, that's the POINT. At that stage, it's NOT war, it's willing participation of conflict. And AGAIN, coordinated and precice counterattacks? And it's spicifically stated that the geth overwhelmed the quarians in weight of bodies. Sheer numbers. The geth preferred ground war. Even their War Asset screan lists them as being the most effective and best ground fighting force in existance. They didn't have much in the way of ship-to-ship besides stolen quarian ships (this was before the geth manufactured their own weapons and ships). They were dependant on ground warfare. So NO, it's NOT the same since the geth attacked indiscriminanately. And again, chemical weapons? You don't use those unless you HAVE NO INTENT to spare anyone. The geth knew full well they were butchering people. They just didn't care.

And STOP being such a ******. The death of quarians and geth is "death" regardless. "Murder" regardless. Your BS about "logging off" is insulting to people on BOTH sides, as you take genocide and mass slaughter so lightly. It makes you come off as even more prejudice then already.

Good grief, don't you sleep?

And you missed the point.  There is no proof they were unarmed.  The above blurb does not say that.  You are simply making that assumption because you want to believe it.  I can read the same blurb and make an assumption that those miners tried to shut down the Geth and were logged off in retaliation.

And when the Quarians strap guns to live ships and turn civlians into soldiers then I have no evidence they didn't do the same during the MW.  Once again, this is down to what you choose to believe.  It is possible the Geth killed unarmed civilians, it is possible the Quarian civilians armed themselves to shut down the geth and were logged off as a result. 

Please provide me with an example of a Geth putting a gun to a child's head and pulling the trigger.  I want documented evidence.  I thought people were killing the Geth used Chemical War and that is how they killed a lot of Quarians.  Chemical Warfare like a Bomb can't decide not to kill women and children.  If the Quarians bombed the Geth which I imagine the flotilla didn't just magically get built in the last days of the War and the Geth bombed or used chemical warfare in retaliation then again, that's war.

And I am not being a ******.  I am making a joke and I will continue to make a joke about fictional characters that never existed until such time that you stop getting emo about it.  You are not a Quarian Silver, they never existed so lighten up and stop with this persecution complex.

[remydat]

Iamjdr wrote...

So you not claiming that the quarians all agreed on it but you will claim that they made a knowing attempt on the Geths lives and they deserve what they got for there " attempted genocide" on the Geth which you have not yet proven has ever even taken place or that it was even discussed by the Quarian people to be an option.

What are you talking about?  The Quarians said they attacked first.  Admiral Koris says this repeatedly which is why he denounces war with the Geth.  If Koris ie a Quarian doesn't seem to fussed by 2 billion of his people dead because he realises it was self inflicted then why do I care about what somone on a message board thnks.

I have more than enough information to conclude the Quarians forcibly tried to shut down the Geth and thus were logged off.  You are free to arrive at a different conclusion. 

[Iamjdr]

Okay Remydat just gotta say that's pretty funny your telling silver he's not a Quarian and to stop with the persecution complex seeing as when you were talking about the Geth You constantly said "I will not" as if you were speaking directly for the Geth.

[Rhiens VI]

justafan wrote...

It actually is a promising statistic.  As it looks like almost all returning players chose peace.  it is mostly noobies who choose one over the other.

On their first playthrough, most players would pick blue or red 'special' option over normal ones, because it is usually associated with something 'cool'. It isn't clear from the text what exactly is going to happen.

That said, I destroy the Geth on my renegade playthrough even if I have an option for peace, my Shepard has plenty of reasons to distrust the machine race.

[remydat]

Iamjdr wrote...

Okay Remydat just gotta say that's pretty funny your telling silver he's not a Quarian and to stop with the persecution complex seeing as when you were talking about the Geth You constantly said "I will not" as if you were speaking directly for the Geth.

No it isn't funny because I was not criticizing him for speaking in the first person.  I was criticizing him for taking a joke about fictional character deaths and then saying I among other things am prejudiced, a smartass, and a ******.  Those are personal attacks based on a joke.

That is emotional and has no room in a proper debate.  Find where I have personally attacked anyone here seriously.  I make jokes and use sarcasm but if you read his posts this dude really is all emotional and has decided to personally insult a person he has never met in real life based on a joke and a disagreement on the internet.

Modifié par remydat, 24 mars 2013 - 05:43 .

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Iamjdr wrote...

Okay Remydat just gotta say that's pretty funny your telling silver he's not a Quarian and to stop with the persecution complex seeing as when you were talking about the Geth You constantly said "I will not" as if you were speaking directly for the Geth.

He's actually a geth sent back in time to kill John Connor Commander Shepard's ancestors.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

remydat wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

remydat You know you don't need to censor "damn" right?

It looks silly.

Well hot damn, that's a relief.

Happy to help.

[remydat]

Iamjdr wrote...

I still wish it was possible to use the paragon interupt to bring peace without the Geth needing to upgrade themselves with reaper code. Why is there no way to save both without it?especially when all you really do to bring peace is shout at the Quarian admirals. Does legion really need to be allowed to upgrade the all the Geth so I can tell the Quarians the Geth want peace? How exactly does upgrading the Geth with reaper code help me show the Quarians that the Geth want peace anyway? that never really made sense to me anyways.

Why should any species be denied a right to decide how they want to develop?  That is not really Shep's or anyone else's call to make.  That is the Geth.  Do the Geth get to decide that organics technology to amplify their biotic and tech powers?

Yes the Reaper Code is a risk but it is a risk that the Geth should be allowed to take just like Organics took risks all throughout the game when it benefited them. 

[remydat]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

He's actually a geth sent back in time to kill John Connor Commander Shepard's ancestors.

Commander Shepard is a hero to the Geth so why would I kill him?  My mission is to go back in time and tell the Quarians, "You f**k with us, you die."  So far I have been back 7 times and they failed to listen 7 times. 

This time, I will be going back with power point presentations and videos showing how 2 billion lives were logged off in a few years time.  I am hoping this will prove enlightening to them regarding the consequences of attempted genocide against a more powerful force.  If you have any videos or pictures of little children getting bullets to the head you would like to contribute please PM them to me.

Modifié par remydat, 24 mars 2013 - 05:54 .

[DeinonSlayer]

remydat wrote...

Iamjdr wrote...

I still wish it was possible to use the paragon interupt to bring peace without the Geth needing to upgrade themselves with reaper code. Why is there no way to save both without it?especially when all you really do to bring peace is shout at the Quarian admirals. Does legion really need to be allowed to upgrade the all the Geth so I can tell the Quarians the Geth want peace? How exactly does upgrading the Geth with reaper code help me show the Quarians that the Geth want peace anyway? that never really made sense to me anyways.

Why should any species be denied a right to decide how they want to develop?  That is not really Shep's or anyone else's call to make.  That is the Geth.  Do the Geth get to decide that organics technology to amplify their biotic and tech powers?

Yes the Reaper Code is a risk but it is a risk that the Geth should be allowed to take just like Organics took risks all throughout the game when it benefited them. 

Think of it like a country developing nuclear weapons. It's a risk to everyone else, as well. We can't pretend it's not a concern. Shepard has to trust that this Reaper code won't exploit the Geth, again, and turn their entire fleet against the rest of the galaxy. The IFF bit us in the ass once after initially appearing innocuous; we know almost nothing about this code.

As I've said, I make peace when I can, but I have to metagame the hell out of it to know the Reaper code won't make the Geth turn around and do what the Rachni Breeder does to us.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 24 mars 2013 - 05:56 .

[justafan]

remydat wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

He's actually a geth sent back in time to kill John Connor Commander Shepard's ancestors.

Commander Shepard is a hero to the Geth so why would I kill him?  My mission is to go back in time and tell the Quarians, "You f**k with us, you die."  So far I have been back 7 times and they failed to listen 7 times. 

This time, I will be going back with power point presentations and videos showing how 2 billion lives were logged off in a few years time.  I am hoping this will prove enlightening to them regarding the consequences of attempted genocide against a more powerful force.  If you have any videos or pictures of little children getting bullets to the head you would like to contribute please PM them to me.

But... it's 2013, you're a little late to the party.  The morning war happened like 150 years ago.

Geez, I thought time travelers were supposed to be punctual.

[Iamjdr]

seeing as at that moment shep is already the one deciding if the Geth can upload the code or not I don't really get what your trying to say?You ask how it could be sheps call to make when he already is doing just that ingame. He just cant do it an still make peace.

[remydat]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

]Think of it like a country developing nuclear weapons. It's a risk to everyone else, as well. We can't pretend it's not a concern. Shepard has to trust that this Reaper code won't exploit the Geth, again, and turn their entire fleet against the rest of the galaxy. The IFF bit us in the ass once after initially appearing innocuous; we know almost nothing about this code.

As I've said, I make peace when I can, but I have to metagame the hell out of it to know the Reaper code won't make the Geth turn around and do what the Rachni Breeder does to us.

I never said it wasn't a concern.  I am saying it is still not really their call to make.  There are plenty of things I have concerns about that ultimately I recognize that despite my concerns, it is not my call.

And the fundamental problem with the nuclear example is it proves my point.  The USA and USSR have something like thousands of times more nuclear weapons and then go around trying to tell other people nuclear weapons are bad so we will sanction you if you have them.

The point is, it is a means to reinforce the status quo.  The people who got advanced tech first then turn around and cry about the horrors of advanced tech as means to ensure they are the only ones with advanced tech.  Organics are fully sentient and then want to deny synthetics the ability to also become fully sentient.  Organics entire civilization is built on Reaper tech but then want to deny the Geth the ability to use Reaper Tech.

So yes I understand why they are concenred but it is inherently hypocritical because the things the Geth desire are things organics already have and have no problem using.  Prove you concern by destroying the Mass Relays and the Citadel and all the other Reaper Tech you use.

Modifié par remydat, 24 mars 2013 - 06:03 .

[remydat]

Iamjdr wrote...

seeing as at that moment shep is already the one deciding if the Geth can upload the code or not I don't really get what your trying to say?You ask how it could be sheps call to make when he already is doing just that ingame. He just cant do it an still make peace.

The game allows Shepard to make the call because he is the hero.  That doesn't mean objectively speaking it is a decision that really should be in the hands of an organic. 

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

justafan wrote...

remydat wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

He's actually a geth sent back in time to kill John Connor Commander Shepard's ancestors.

Commander Shepard is a hero to the Geth so why would I kill him?  My mission is to go back in time and tell the Quarians, "You f**k with us, you die."  So far I have been back 7 times and they failed to listen 7 times. 

This time, I will be going back with power point presentations and videos showing how 2 billion lives were logged off in a few years time.  I am hoping this will prove enlightening to them regarding the consequences of attempted genocide against a more powerful force.  If you have any videos or pictures of little children getting bullets to the head you would like to contribute please PM them to me.

But... it's 2013, you're a little late to the party.  The morning war happened like 150 years ago.

Geez, I thought time travelers were supposed to be punctual.

Time travel is hard!