126 réponses à ce sujet

[justafan]

I would proceed with harvesting the Batarians as per usual. However, I would then shift my attention to Rannoch. Once the Geth were under my control, I would send in a large force to crush the Quarians for destroyer slushies. Then I'd use my new fleet of cannon fodder to take the Citadel with minimal reaper casualties, 5-10% of Geth did it once, 100% will do it again. From there, it's easy pickings once the relays are down.

[sr2josh]

Call the Cylons for help.

[MrFob]

First of all, I do think that it made perfect sense that the reapers did not go after the Citadel immediately (see here).
But here is what I don't get: Supposedly, until the very end, the reaper do not like the idea of the Crucible being set of. They try everything to prevent that, right? So why don't they attack the Crucible while it is being built? How can this huge alliance, in which pretty much everyone in the galaxy is involved keep this secret, especially given the fact that they apparently managed to indoctrinate Udina himself? After the destruction of Arcturus Station, Udina is according to in game dialogue the most powerful human in the Galaxy and he is directly involved in the planning of the Crucible project. Even if (and I am not entirely sure what exactly the situation was here) he is not actually indoctrinated but was just the most effective Cerberus double agent ever, Cerberus itself is basically completely corrupted by the reapers at this point.
I mean, I get it, the Crucible location was supposed to be secret in the game plot and that's how it was but I just find that highly implausible.

[LiL Reapur]

MrFob wrote...

I mean, I get it, the Crucible location was supposed to be secret in the game plot and that's how it was but I just find that highly implausible.

That just blew my world away
I agree how in the heck didn't the reaper's figure that out?
They found out when everyone knew that the citadel was the catalyst... through the illusive man...

[ShadowLordXII]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

I would take all 1000 reapers directly to the citadel, conquer it, Indoctrinate all organics on the citadel and fix the citadel so it will work as intended again - after all the reapers built the bloody place they should be able to take control of it again - and then shut down the relay system and communication between the young races and then start harvesting one system at a time.

Taking the Citadel first has always worked in previous cycles, whats stopping it from working now? In fact, the reapers do eventually take the Citadel, but only after conveniently waiting until Shepard and his fleet was ready.

What was stopping the reapers from relay hopping straight to the Citadel?

[teh DRUMPf!!]

crimzontearz wrote...

Same as the previous goddamn strategy, immediately pour through the relay near the citadel with my ENTIRE FORCE, shut the relay off behind me, take the citadel,

That was never the previous strategy.

The previous strategy allowed them to take the Citadel without a damn ship, they had control of the station.

The Protheans messed with that; taking it by force will result in too many Reaper (ship) casualties. It's a last resort.

Not sure why this did not happen to begin with but you know....I stopped asking questions when "art" was being thrown around as an answer followed by "you need more context (read subtle retcon)"

Well, you're not the first person to need more context.

ME fans have a funny tendency to forget the relevant lore/situation at hand.

[CrutchCricket]

HYR 2.0 wrote....

The Protheans messed with that; taking it by force will result in too many Reaper (ship) casualties. It's a last resort.

lol, they didn't seem to have a problem when it was convenient to the plot.

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 13 août 2013 - 09:22 .

[teh DRUMPf!!]

CrutchCricket wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote....

The Protheans messed with that; taking it by force will result in too many Reaper (ship) casualties. It's a last resort.

lol, they didn't seem to have a problem when it was convenient to the plot.

You mean after TIM gave them control, yes.

No casualties (aside from TIM, who was expendable to them anyway).

[CrutchCricket]

HYR 2.0 wrote...
You mean after TIM gave them control, yes.

lolwut?

TIM "giving" the Reapers the Citadel is about as likely as Morinth giving you penis envy. In other words, can't give what you don't have.

[Br3admax]

The Citadel is not as useful as it was in past cycles, at least not as much during the Prothean cycle. During that time, the galactic government was THE government, the Citadel was the seat of power, and all known species were under Prothean rule. The Reapers are taking out the governments to cause a lack of leadership. Taking the Citadel doesn't help as much, this time, as going to the homeworlds of the Council species.

[CrutchCricket]

Br3ad wrote...

The Citadel is not as useful as it was in past cycles, at least not as much during the Prothean cycle. During that time, the galactic government was THE government, the Citadel was the seat of power, and all known species were under Prothean rule. The Reapers are taking out the governments to cause a lack of leadership. Taking the Citadel doesn't help as much, this time, as going to the homeworlds of the Council species.

Taking out government is not the main benefit of the Citadel trap, by a long shot. The main advantage is seizing control of the relays and shutting them down. Even if the main government is somewhere else, it's still screwed if it can't get reinforced.

To understand how deep the derp in ME3 goes you have to realize that even when the Reapers reclaimed the Citadel after twiddling their tentacles on Earth for most of the game, they still don't shut the relays down, allowing Shepard and co. to actually attack with all fleets and the Crucible. Even before the ending, the real purpose is to torture us with nonsense and then just pittyingly give us "victory".

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 13 août 2013 - 10:57 .

[teh DRUMPf!!]

CrutchCricket wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote...
You mean after TIM gave them control, yes.

lolwut?

TIM "giving" the Reapers the Citadel is about as likely as Morinth giving you penis envy. In other words, can't give what you don't have.

Oof.




Anyone who knows of/locates the Citadel master-control panel can control it (ME1, Saren ring a bell). It's a station.

[CrutchCricket]

HYR 2.0 wrote...
Anyone who knows of/locates the Citadel master-control panel can control it (ME1, Saren ring a bell). It's a station.

Ah yes, and there are free tours of the master control panel available to the general public from five to nine, every other Thursday.

If you buy your tickets now, you can also win a chance to drive a Citadel fleet dreadnaught on a pleasure cruise to Thessia!

[AlanC9]

CrutchCricket wrote...
Taking out government is not the main benefit of the Citadel trap, by a long shot. The main advantage is seizing control of the relays and shutting them down. Even if the main government is somewhere else, it's still screwed if it can't get reinforced.

To understand how deep the derp in ME3 goes you have to realize that even when the Reapers reclaimed the Citadel after twiddling their tentacles on Earth for most of the game, they still don't shut the relays down, allowing Shepard and co. to actually attack with all fleets and the Crucible. Even before the ending, the real purpose is to torture us with nonsense and then just pittyingly give us "victory".

Isn't this ME1 derp? Why put the controls for the relay network someplace where the organics can get at them in the first place?

[CrutchCricket]

AlanC9 wrote...

Isn't this ME1 derp? Why put the controls for the relay network someplace where the organics can get at them in the first place?

Uhm, they didn't?

The thing Saren was accessing was to get the arms open for Sovereign who would then activate the Citadel relay so all his buddies could come through.

Presumably they would've accessed the network controls after.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

CrutchCricket wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote...
Anyone who knows of/locates the Citadel master-control panel can control it (ME1, Saren ring a bell). It's a station.

Ah yes, and there are free tours of the master control panel available to the general public from five to nine, every other Thursday.

If you buy your tickets now, you can also win a chance to drive a Citadel fleet dreadnaught on a pleasure cruise to Thessia!

1.) TIM is not what one would call a member of the "general public." His information network is top tier.
2.) Even if he were not, an indoctrinated thrall has the knowledge of its masters, and surely the Reapers would know of it.

[AlanC9]

CrutchCricket wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Isn't this ME1 derp? Why put the controls for the relay network someplace where the organics can get at them in the first place?

Uhm, they didn't?

The thing Saren was accessing was to get the arms open for Sovereign who would then activate the Citadel relay so all his buddies could come through.

Presumably they would've accessed the network controls after.

You missed the point. Why put the relay controls in the Citadel in the first place, where organics might be able to find them? It's all risk, no benefit. 

Modifié par AlanC9, 14 août 2013 - 05:35 .

[MrFob]

CrutchCricket wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Isn't this ME1 derp? Why put the controls for the relay network someplace where the organics can get at them in the first place?

Uhm, they didn't?

The thing Saren was accessing was to get the arms open for Sovereign who would then activate the Citadel relay so all his buddies could come through.

Presumably they would've accessed the network controls after.

That actually reminds me: Shepard had control over the relays when he was at the master control panel in ME1. Joker says: "Unlock the relays around the citadel[...]" and when you save the council, Shepard even confirms with "Opening the relays now Joker."
This shows that, not only should the council have full control over the relay network after ME1, it also sounds like they can even control single relays individually (or at least subsets of the whole network).
So: Why does Shepard have to destroy the Bahak system in Arrival? Couldn't they just shut it down? Why doesn't the council prevent or at least dramatically slow the reapers progress during ME3 by deactivating relays between free vs. reaper occupied systems? And why don't they seal of the Citadel (except for scheduled convoys)? ME1 (or maybe it was Revelation) establishes that the whole reason why the Citadel is inside the Serpent Nebula is because of the tactical advantage that it prevents ships from just flying there with FTL (apparently the Nebula is a too hazardous for FTL flight and you can only get there through the relays).
The council has a significant strategic advantage at their disposal here and they never use it.

[CrutchCricket]

HYR 2.0 wrote...
1.) TIM is not what one would call a member of the "general public." His information network is top tier.
2.) Even if he were not, an indoctrinated thrall has the knowledge of its masters, and surely the Reapers would know of it.

1) He is as far as C-Sec is concerned. No wait, he's a wanted terrorist. So actually it'd be like free tours for Al Quada members.

2) He's not getting anywhere near the controls, pal. In case I was being too subtle about it before.

MrFob wrote...
That actually reminds me: Shepard had control over the relays when he was at the master control panel in ME1. Joker says: "Unlock the relays around the citadel[...]" and when you save the council, Shepard even confirms with "Opening the relays now Joker."

Huh. I had no recollection of that line. Yeah I guess that is a pretty big fail. And not one that can be explained by the Council just being dumb and in denial.

Well I never claimed ME1 was perfect. Then again it is the sequels that fail to take everything into account.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

CrutchCricket wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote...
1.) TIM is not what one would call a member of the "general public." His information network is top tier.
2.) Even if he were not, an indoctrinated thrall has the knowledge of its masters, and surely the Reapers would know of it.

1) He is as far as C-Sec is concerned. No wait, he's a wanted terrorist. So actually it'd be like free tours for Al Quada members.

2) He's not getting anywhere near the controls, pal. In case I was being too subtle about it before.

1.) And Saren was a wanted fugitive, as far as C-Sec was concerned, but he still got there.

"But HYR, he got to the Citadel from Ilos through the Conduit!" Saren had to do so because the Council had a fleet outside the Citadel ready to stop his ship. TIM has no such thing in his path, and once he gets on, it's already too late.

"But HYR, he had an army of geth behind him!" Yes, and TIM became a Terminator reincarnate with Reaper upgrades. Those upgrades were good enough to stop Anderson and Shepard in their tracks and shoot them down (unless Shepard talks him down, ofc). Good enough to get him past C-Sec guards? Odds are, yes.


2.) Your subtlety doesn't matter when you're wrong. We're shown TIM standing right there on the Citadel.

And before you say, "well it doesn't look like the console/location from ME1," save it. We're told this is not a part of the Citadel that is familiar to anyone there -- not to Anderson, not to Shepard. Only the Reapers (and now TIM) know about this place.

[KaiserShep]

It's already established that random yahoos can get into the Citadel if they're determined enough. Aria got in with however many Vorcha and whoever else is in her gang force. A Batarian terrorist ended up among refugees. In the end, it doesn't matter, because a bullet stops him just fine.

[KaiserShep]

Disregard

Modifié par KaiserShep, 14 août 2013 - 05:42 .

[KieranW]

I would take the Citadel, shut off all the Mass Relays, ergo dividing the Galaxy, removing it's government and having all it's census data. Then begin the long slow process of harvesting. Y'know, their original plan.

[CrutchCricket]

HYR 2.0 wrote...
1.) And Saren was a wanted fugitive, as far as C-Sec was concerned, but he still got there.

"But HYR, he got to the Citadel from Ilos through the Conduit!" Saren had to do so because the Council had a fleet outside the Citadel ready to stop his ship. TIM has no such thing in his path, and once he gets on, it's already too late.

Yeah, there sure is no reason to keep a fleet back to protect the center and theoretical brain of your society whilst in the middle of a galactic war (and all those guards and heightened security measures in the Citadel itself are just for show). Seems legit. Also congrats on arguing against yourself. If there's no fleet guarding the Citadel where are all those supposed Reaper casualties gonna come from, mate? Seems to me like you don't need a chain-smoking mole after all if the weakspot is so unguarded.

"But HYR, he had an army of geth behind him!" Yes, and TIM became a Terminator reincarnate with Reaper upgrades. Those upgrades were good enough to stop Anderson and Shepard in their tracks and shoot them down (unless Shepard talks him down, ofc). Good enough to get him past C-Sec guards? Odds are, yes.

lol you've made for some interesting debate in the past but this is just hilarious. TIM can **** with two nearly dead dudes, one of which is getting on in years and that makes you think he can solo all of C-Sec?

We're shown TIM standing right there on the Citadel.

After it's been in Reaper possession for days, maybe even weeks or months (taking into account mustering and travel time for the final battle)

[Alien Number Six]

Hit the Humans and Turians first. The Human knowen as Shepard has forced my armada to fly through dark space to get back to the milky way. That is unacceptable. The Humans need to be shown who the true power in the galaxy is. The Turians are the military arm of the only group that can oppose us. They need to be dealt with swiftly. The rest will be harvested with ease.