225 réponses à ce sujet

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

In the epilogue, EDI also makes very clear evolution is continuing though. "To recover the greatness that was lost....and surpass it." "We may transcend mortality itself, to reach a level I cannot even imagine."

I think you're misinterpreting metaphor.

That first one is not evolution, it refers to rebuilding the galaxy, that is clear in the context of the slides. About transcending mortality, this is a very ambigious statement, but considering that Synthetics as well as Reapers are already immortal, it is safe to assume that it already happened and EDI is just not consicious about what exactly Synthesis did yet.

And I don't understand how this is a metaphor at all. "Final evolution" means that was the final one, nothing more coming.

It has a qualifier that you keep leaving off.  "Of all life".  Not just "Final evolution" but "Final evolution of all life".    This from a being that has already referred to this as a "new DNA".  Damn thing speak it metaphors all the time. 

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Whoa there tiger.  The removal of the conflict between organics and synthetics ain't the same thing as the removal of all conflict. 

Synthesis seems to remove all conflict. It even appeases Wreav, and I am pretty sure he was not on a crusade against synthetics.

Do you suggest it also removes all conflict between creatures and their environment? 

[Yestare7]

Dinner spaghetti also invalidates Synthesis.

[Argolas]

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

In the epilogue, EDI also makes very clear evolution is continuing though. "To recover the greatness that was lost....and surpass it." "We may transcend mortality itself, to reach a level I cannot even imagine."

I think you're misinterpreting metaphor.

That first one is not evolution, it refers to rebuilding the galaxy, that is clear in the context of the slides. About transcending mortality, this is a very ambigious statement, but considering that Synthetics as well as Reapers are already immortal, it is safe to assume that it already happened and EDI is just not consicious about what exactly Synthesis did yet.

And I don't understand how this is a metaphor at all. "Final evolution" means that was the final one, nothing more coming.

It has a qualifier that you keep leaving off.  "Of all life".  Not just "Final evolution" but "Final evolution of all life".    This from a being that has already referred to this as a "new DNA".  Damn thing speak it metaphors all the time. 

Well yes, what other evolution than the evolution of life are you talking about?

[Gilbert Salarian]

Conflicts occur when two groups with differing life-views knock heads. What Synthesis does is take those many life-views which populated the pre-Crucible galaxy and merge them into one. A single life-view cannot come into conflict with itself.

[Argolas]

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Whoa there tiger.  The removal of the conflict between organics and synthetics ain't the same thing as the removal of all conflict. 

Synthesis seems to remove all conflict. It even appeases Wreav, and I am pretty sure he was not on a crusade against synthetics.

Do you suggest it also removes all conflict between creatures and their environment? 

Probably yes since it affects plants as well.

[Mavqt]

Mcfly616 wrote...

mavqt wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

One problem....synthetics didn't help create the Crucible

Don't the Geth say they'll help once you either side with them or peace is created between them and the Quarians.

so? We're simply building a machine based on blueprints handed down from cycle to cycle. All thr Geth would be doing is following the blueprints....not adding anything.

I beg to differ.

[o Ventus]

Mcfly616 wrote...

One problem....synthetics didn't help create the Crucible

So those geth engineers working on the Crucible aren't synthetic?

[Yestare7]

Gilbert Salarian wrote...

life views and merge them into one.

That sounds wonderfull:sick:
Reminds me A LOT of North Korea.

Modifié par Yestare7, 20 mars 2013 - 12:58 .

[ruggly]

It seems that a lot of pro-synthesizers block out that particular phrase, what with it not making sense and all.

[Yestare7]

ruggly wrote...

It seems that a lot of pro-synthesizers block out that particular phrase, what with it not making sense and all.

DING DING best quote sofar!!

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

In the epilogue, EDI also makes very clear evolution is continuing though. "To recover the greatness that was lost....and surpass it." "We may transcend mortality itself, to reach a level I cannot even imagine."

I think you're misinterpreting metaphor.

That first one is not evolution, it refers to rebuilding the galaxy, that is clear in the context of the slides. About transcending mortality, this is a very ambigious statement, but considering that Synthetics as well as Reapers are already immortal, it is safe to assume that it already happened and EDI is just not consicious about what exactly Synthesis did yet.

And I don't understand how this is a metaphor at all. "Final evolution" means that was the final one, nothing more coming.

It has a qualifier that you keep leaving off.  "Of all life".  Not just "Final evolution" but "Final evolution of all life".    This from a being that has already referred to this as a "new DNA".  Damn thing speak it metaphors all the time. 

Well yes, what other evolution than the evolution of life are you talking about?

The evolution of the combined Synthetic/Organic races.  It's quite common to refer to synthetics as "not being alive".  Synthesis has changed everything, and "life" may no longer be the correct term, as all organics are now at least partly synthetic.  Thus, Synthesis is the final evolution of all life - because afterward, it's not life anymore.  It's something different.

Considering how dependent your theory is on that one sentence which is never actually explained, and certainly never spelled out to mean exactly what you're claiming.....I am completely unconvinced.

[CosmicGnosis]

If anything, Synthesis brings an end to "natural" evolution because those who learn how to integrate with technology are no longer bound by it. They have literally seized control of their bodies and can decide how they should physically develop. Evolution still occurs, but Synthesized sapient beings are not at the mercy of nature. EDI says that they will "reclaim the greatness that was lost... and surpass it." This is not stagnation.

And I just had an interesting thought... I wonder if it's possible to argue that the entire harvest cycle was a figurative "crucible"? The existence of the cycle encouraged the development of the Crucible, and Shepard is the "catalyst" that triggered Synthesis. Hm...

Modifié par CosmicGnosis, 20 mars 2013 - 01:07 .

[Phatose]

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Argolas wrote...

Phatose wrote...

Whoa there tiger.  The removal of the conflict between organics and synthetics ain't the same thing as the removal of all conflict. 

Synthesis seems to remove all conflict. It even appeases Wreav, and I am pretty sure he was not on a crusade against synthetics.

Do you suggest it also removes all conflict between creatures and their environment? 

Probably yes since it affects plants as well.

Will it also make all hostile environments now pleasant?  Space is a warm, tropical paradise instead of a cold hard vacuum?  And the bottom of the volus oceans is now a pleasant place for a swim without a suit?

[DarkSpiral]

I can only agree with everything right until your conclusion.

Synthesis could also be a form of technological singularity that encompasses organic as well as synthetic life. Rather than reach a plateau, and suffer stagnation, it is merely the bottom run of a completely new ladder.

Not that I think your conclusion can't possibly be true. Simply that the points you raise do not declare with any finality that it (your conclusion) MUST be true.

[Steelcan]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

If anything, Synthesis brings an end to "natural" evolution because those who learn how to integrate with technology are no longer bound by it. They have literally seized control of their bodies and can decide how they should physically develop. Evolution still occurs, but Synthesized sapient beings are not at the mercy of nature. EDI says that they will "reclaim the greatness that was lost... and surpass it." This is not stagnation.

.

. We are already outside of natural evolution.  Genetic engineering is rampant in numerous businesses nowadays, only a matter of time before it is applied to humanity.

[Yestare7]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Synthesis could also be a form of technological singularity that encompasses organic as well as synthetic life.  

Synthesis could also be my noisy neighbour.

[DarkSpiral]

Steelcan wrote...

CosmicGnosis wrote...

If anything, Synthesis brings an end to "natural" evolution because those who learn how to integrate with technology are no longer bound by it. They have literally seized control of their bodies and can decide how they should physically develop. Evolution still occurs, but Synthesized sapient beings are not at the mercy of nature. EDI says that they will "reclaim the greatness that was lost... and surpass it." This is not stagnation.

.

. We are already outside of natural evolution.  Genetic engineering is rampant in numerous businesses nowadays, only a matter of time before it is applied to humanity.

Doesn't that just lend strentgh the to idea of the Synthesis placing orgainic life (not just a single species) completely outside of it?

[DarkSpiral]

Yestare7 wrote...

DarkSpiral wrote...

Synthesis could also be a form of technological singularity that encompasses organic as well as synthetic life.  

Synthesis could also be my noisy neighbour.

As yes.  Truly a stunning rebuttal.  Or not.

[ruggly]

CosmicGnosis wrote...

If anything, Synthesis brings an end to "natural" evolution because those who learn how to integrate with technology are no longer bound by it. They have literally seized control of their bodies and can decide how they should physically develop. Evolution still occurs, but Synthesized sapient beings are not at the mercy of nature. EDI says that they will "reclaim the greatness that was lost... and surpass it." This is not stagnation.

And I just had an interesting thought... I wonder if it's possible to argue that the entire harvest cycle was a figurative "crucible"? The existence of the cycle encouraged the development of the Crucible, and Shepard is the "catalyst" that triggered Synthesis. Hm...

We're half way there with designer babies.  Obviously without integrating into technology...yet.

[Steelcan]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Doesn't that just lend strentgh the to idea of the Synthesis placing orgainic life (not just a single species) completely outside of it?

. I'm sorry but I don't think plants need to be outside of natural evolution.

[DarkSpiral]

Steelcan wrote...

DarkSpiral wrote...

Doesn't that just lend strentgh the to idea of the Synthesis placing orgainic life (not just a single species) completely outside of it?

. I'm sorry but I don't think plants need to be outside of natural evolution.

I don't really see what that has tro do with the subject, which is what affect synthesis would have if you take the option.

As a reason to not take Synthesis at all, okay sure.  There is a consideration as to what effect the process would have on non-sentient life.

[Yestare7]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Yestare7 wrote...

DarkSpiral wrote...

Synthesis could also be a form of technological singularity that encompasses organic as well as synthetic life.  

Synthesis could also be my noisy neighbour.

As yes.  Truly a stunning rebuttal.  Or not.

I put a lot of thought into that one.

[Steelcan]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

DarkSpiral wrote...

Doesn't that just lend strentgh the to idea of the Synthesis placing orgainic life (not just a single species) completely outside of it?

. I'm sorry but I don't think plants need to be outside of natural evolution.

I don't really see what that has tro do with the subject, which is what affect synthesis would have if you take the option.

As a reason to not take Synthesis at all, okay sure.  There is a consideration as to what effect the process would have on non-sentient life.

. How would synthesis affect plants....... It'd be the end of vegetarianism.  And the end of eating meat....  We'd all starve.

[CosmicGnosis]

Steelcan wrote...

DarkSpiral wrote...

Doesn't that just lend strentgh the to idea of the Synthesis placing orgainic life (not just a single species) completely outside of it?

. I'm sorry but I don't think plants need to be outside of natural evolution.

They are not. That's why I said sapient beings. Only a sapient being can benefit from Synthesis. A sapient being has to actually integrate with technology and control the results. A synthesized plant is still just a normal plant.