461 réponses à ce sujet

[Stanley Woo]

At the risk of perpetuating an internet meme, jellmoo32 gets 32 internets for a very reasonable post which I agree with a lot.

[Eowien Thiele]

Jellmoo32



You asked how the handling of the release of Return to Ostagar affected my enjoyment of the product I purchased. You assume a lot by assuming that I only paid for Dragon Age Origins. Or that this is the only time that I've paid for premium BioWare content or a game expansion only to find that it does not perform as promised. I don't enjoy paying for faulty products, and I definitely don't enjoy trying to use them. I thought long and hard about buying DAO because of past experiences with NWN and NWN2. I was actually pleasantly surprised when Warden's Keep worked! My experience with RtO is only too familiar.

[Dragoon001]

jellmoo32 wrote...

Eowien Thiele wrote...

How did this affect the enjoyment of the product I purchased? I paid for the opportunity to play a highly replayable and complex game that would have a consistent selection of download-able add-ons. That is how the game was marketed, that is what makes it unique. So far, I am not having the full experience that I paid for. So, not food-poisoning, but definitely something that could get BioWare kicked out of "Hell's Kitchen".

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

That said I will contact EA support to get a refund for my 400 BioPoints I bought December, 9th in expectation of the DLC Return to Ostagar.

Since Christmas I have been visiting the forums everyday to check for the release of the DLC. Which is excatly to the day 4 weeks.
I slowdown my playthrough because I wanted to play the DLC before finishing the game for a better game experience.  Instead it influenced my playthrough negatively and I am after 28 days annoyed to see if the DLC is out or not.

When I got my refund for the BioPoints I unfortunately bought ahead I have no reason to visit the forums again. Instead I focus on my DAO playthrough exclusively without being distracted by thoughts about the DLC.
For me, I'm sure it's the best to ignore this and any further DLC, and instead wait for a regular expansion on disc.

And please don't forget: I'm not your enemy, I'm your customer.

Modifié par Dragoon001, 14 janvier 2010 - 09:40 .

[fistandantilius8]

ROFL. I've been saying it since yesterday. You people FREAK OUT over something as puny and as absurd as a DLC. Get a life people!!!!



Great posting Jellmoo!! You own them whiners!!

[jellmoo32]

Eowien Thiele wrote...

Jellmoo32

You asked how the handling of the release of Return to Ostagar affected my enjoyment of the product I purchased. You assume a lot by assuming that I only paid for Dragon Age Origins. Or that this is the only time that I've paid for premium BioWare content or a game expansion only to find that it does not perform as promised. I don't enjoy paying for faulty products, and I definitely don't enjoy trying to use them. I thought long and hard about buying DAO because of past experiences with NWN and NWN2. I was actually pleasantly surprised when Warden's Keep worked! My experience with RtO is only too familiar.

I am not assuming anything. All I mean is that you have paid for Dragon Age Origins. You have not paid for RtO.

In regards to DAO, you have exactluy what you have paid for.

If past experience purchasing Bioware products has been poor, then by all means, speak with your wallet and do not purchase them. Do not however say that the product you have purchased is somehow incomplete. Dragon Age Origins is a perfectly fine stand alone title.

[Eowien Thiele]

Just to be clear - I want this game to be successful. I'm happy to wait for the release of RtO when it's ready. I don't want or expect compensation for the current state of my specializations. I just want BioWare, or EA, or Atari, or all of them to take a close look at how they integrate their operations around communications (internal and external) and how they coordinate the release of products.

[ZeroR3D]

jellmoo32 wrote...

Then they are hammered with threads of people constantly asking when it will be done, and for more updates. This is a no-win situation.

I don't think it is.  It's probably the lesser of two evils (vs stating a date then going back on it).  But I know what you mean, just giving out enough information is tough.

I would counter that they are not doing this intentionally, or for fun. Mistakes are happening, true, but there is no malicious intent. I'm sure that theyfully meant it when they made those announcements.

I don't see any malicious intent on their part for missing repeated dates.  But combined with a lack of response and/or poor response, it doesn't leave a very professional image.  On a basic level, people do business with people they trust.  Losing the trust of your customers and prospects is never a good thing for a company or an industry.

To what end? The reason could be multi-faceted, completely internal, or quite simply something that they are unable to share.

Revealing the cause for the delay is purely up to their discretion.  Yes, I understand it may be political between MS/Sony or it may be Mr Woo spilling his tea on the mainframe, but the offficial response was something like "quality issues at the last minute".  So as a consumer, you are led to think "oh, Bioware must be working on somethign that will provide me more value!".  Until evidence to the contrary surface.

I think from day one, the correct response should have been "Due to a number of circumstances, whose technical details are too opaque for us to mention here, we have delayed the release of RtO for the time being.  Rest assured, loyal fans, that we have our best teams working at their peak to resolve all issues preventing us from delivering this frickin awesome DLC to you.  updates from [insert figurehead here] will be coming [insert update frequency here]  THANKS for your continuing support and loyalty.  Also hot tub party at Priestly's -Bioware team"

Complete agreement. This is what I would advocate if you are unhappy with the situation. Speak with your wallet.

The problem with negative feedback through refusing to purchase is that its punitive to both parties.  As a consumer, you deny yourself more fun, and as consequence, the developer loses financial incentive to continue producing DLC.  By understandin that the relationship between producer and consumer can be easily managed through good customer service, everyone comes out with somthing of value.

Again, if you are disatisfied, speak with your wallet. Do not buy the points ahead of time. One could argue that it is in fact much more prudent to do so.

Given the BETA state of social.bioware, I prefer to buy points before a DLC is released in order to avoid server overloads or random crashing during my transaction.  The amount of money is also trivial, but the original point was that people hadn't purchased the game yet. I was simply trying to illustrate that purchasing points off the webpage for RtO should be tantamount to purchasing the DLC.

PC Gamers have the toolset, the modding community and by far the best vversion of the game. I'm thinking that there is plenty of love going on there.

Touché.

At any incredibly busy restaurant a minor delay results in a comp? I'm sorry, but I don't think so. The entire restaurant would need the compensation. An incredible set of circumstances that inconvenience an individual? Certainly.

If everyone was sitting around waiting with no server to come by to refresh their drinks, bring them some more bread, etc, yes, everyone should get a comp.  In the real world, no business operates like that, at least not for long.

Should the token not be an increidle meal that is satisfying? That's what you are paying for, after all.

I'm also paying for the atmosphere and service.  Either of those being poor can ruin a good dining experience.

[Urazz]

Mr. Eight wrote...

Game delays are nothing new. Get used to it.

BioWare and EA owe us nothing.

that may be but they handled it poorly and bungled it big time I think.  I don't think I've ever seen a game/expansion/DLC bungled so badly on releasing it.

[Timurlane]

Dragoon001 wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

Eowien Thiele wrote...

How did this affect the enjoyment of the product I purchased? I paid for the opportunity to play a highly replayable and complex game that would have a consistent selection of download-able add-ons. That is how the game was marketed, that is what makes it unique. So far, I am not having the full experience that I paid for. So, not food-poisoning, but definitely something that could get BioWare kicked out of "Hell's Kitchen".

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

That said I will contact EA support to get a refund for my 400 BioPoints I bought December, 9th in expectation of the DLC Return to Ostagar.

Since Christmas I have been visiting the forums everyday to check for the release of the DLC. Which is excatly to the day 4 weeks.
I slowdown my playthrough because I wanted to play the DLC before finishing the game for a better game experience.  Instead it influenced my playthrough negatively and I am after 28 days annoyed to see if the DLC is out or not.

When I got my refund for the BioPoints I unfortunately bought ahead I have no reason to visit the forums again. Instead I focus on my DAO playthrough exclusively without being distracted by thoughts about the DLC.
For me, I'm sure it's the best to ignore this and any further DLC, and instead wait for a regular expansion on disc.

And please don't forget: I'm not your enemy, I'm your customer.

You're quite right.  This is a good instance to vote with your wallet.
If I hadn't prepurchased the 400pts, there is absolutely no chance I would be getting RtO anymore.  I have been saying since the 5th I would have gotten it either way but I'm afraid I was wrong.  
At this point admitting that I still intend to buy the DLC is embarassing, and certainly the last time I will encourage this sort of action with my funding.

The expansion however will almost surely tempt me to come back to Dragon Age for a new run.  I don't feel at all entitled to any sort of explanation or justification for the repeated and massive mismanagement of both the community and the actual software by BioWare (from an early leak to vitriolic responses to customers from supposed community managers), but to endorse and support this after seeing it play out so far this year just feels very wrong.

[Bibdy]

Bercilak de Hautdesert wrote...

Mr. Eight wrote...

Game delays are nothing new. Get used to it.

BioWare and EA owe us nothing.

It was a proposal, not a statement of entitlement. 

And why should consumers "get used to" delayed, buggy DLC?  If we don't expect better products and act on those expectations, we'll never get better products. . .

The only way to properly act here, in a language that is going to get across, is to not buy the DLC. Tell them you're serious about your intentions. If you want them to get the message, don't just ****** and moan for the DLC to finally get released and then immediately purchase it on release day. Simply don't purchase it at all.

Otherwise, you're sending the message that they can get away with delays.

If you're firm in your belief that there's something wrong with this system, don't purchase anything through it.

If you're just here to vent some frustration while you wait for it to show up, then go nuts. But, don't for one second think that Bioware will receive the message clearly unless sales for this particular DLC plummet compared to the other DLCs.

[Hawk-moon]

jellmoo32 wrote...


Again... Why? Whether it be free content or additional content, why do we, the customers, deserve something for nothing?

For the goodwill that it will generate with their loyal customer base...

The sign of a good company is when they offer compensation when they do not have to, not because they must.

[Eowien Thiele]

Funny, I thought that I had paid for my Xbox Live version of RtO. So, no, I don't think that I do have exactly what I paid for.

[Hahaue]

jellmoo32 wrote...

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

Ignoring the fact that they used "2 years of continuous DLC" as a selling point, there are plenty of people who paid for RtO and either got a version that broke the game, or haven't gotten anything at all.

Modifié par Hahaue, 14 janvier 2010 - 09:56 .

[Wesley Wyndam Price]

People....seriously....it's five bucks...



Get over it. The DLC will be out and ready once it's ready and fixed. It's seriously not that big of a deal. If you have nothing better to do than come to a internet message board over five dollar game content then maybe you need to go outside or socialize with real people instead of nerd raging on a silly video game message board.

[What a Twist]

Hahaue wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

Ignoring the fact that they used "2 years of continuous DLC" as a selling point, there are plenty of people who paid for RtO and either got a version that broke the game, or haven't gotten anything at all.

Yeah the game breaking part is what annoys me. I saw it on XBL marketplace, so I trusted that it was ready for use. We waited this long, only to have it get messed up the day it releases. What were all the delays for then?

[What a Twist]

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

People....seriously....it's five bucks...

Get over it. The DLC will be out and ready once it's ready and fixed. It's seriously not that big of a deal. If you have nothing better to do than come to a internet message board over five dollar game content then maybe you need to go outside or socialize with real people instead of nerd raging on a silly video game message board.

You know this thread is here for talking about the RTO situation, right?

If it angers you so much, don't read it.

[Dahelia]

What a Twist wrote...

Hahaue wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

Ignoring the fact that they used "2 years of continuous DLC" as a selling point, there are plenty of people who paid for RtO and either got a version that broke the game, or haven't gotten anything at all.

Yeah the game breaking part is what annoys me. I saw it on XBL marketplace, so I trusted that it was ready for use. We waited this long, only to have it get messed up the day it releases. What were all the delays for then?

Do we really want to get into that??? Really?????

[Bibdy]

At no point has "2 years of continuous DLC" been promised. They made a statement a while ago that they had PLANS for 2 years of DLC. That's not the same thing, and plans change. If they decide to stop providing DLC after this debacle, then you can feel let down and angry at Bioware for using that as a selling point and failing to fulfill it. As far as I'm aware, the plan is still to provide DLC for the next 20ish months.

If you spent money on Bioware points ahead of time for the DLC, then I would hope you have learned something. There's rarely, ever, an advantage to purchasing something ahead of time. All you do is put money in their bank account to gain interest, while taking it out of your own, throwing away that interest and its basically a 'gift card'. You can't purchase anything with it other than Bioware products. So I hope, not only Bioware, but you CONSUMERS have learned something from this experience.

Modifié par Bibdy, 14 janvier 2010 - 10:04 .

[ZeroR3D]

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

People....seriously....it's five bucks...

Get over it. The DLC will be out and ready once it's ready and fixed. It's seriously not that big of a deal. If you have nothing better to do than come to a internet message board over five dollar game content then maybe you need to go outside or socialize with real people instead of nerd raging on a silly video game message board.

Hear that wooshing sound above your head?

[What a Twist]

Dahelia wrote...

What a Twist wrote...

Hahaue wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

Ignoring the fact that they used "2 years of continuous DLC" as a selling point, there are plenty of people who paid for RtO and either got a version that broke the game, or haven't gotten anything at all.

Yeah the game breaking part is what annoys me. I saw it on XBL marketplace, so I trusted that it was ready for use. We waited this long, only to have it get messed up the day it releases. What were all the delays for then?

Do we really want to get into that??? Really?????

Yes, Dahelia. I am back, and prepared!


Edit for Enchantment!

Modifié par What a Twist, 14 janvier 2010 - 10:04 .

[Wesley Wyndam Price]

What a Twist wrote...

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

People....seriously....it's five bucks...

Get over it. The DLC will be out and ready once it's ready and fixed. It's seriously not that big of a deal. If you have nothing better to do than come to a internet message board over five dollar game content then maybe you need to go outside or socialize with real people instead of nerd raging on a silly video game message board.

You know this thread is here for talking about the RTO situation, right?

If it angers you so much, don't read it.

Oh it doesn't make me angry at all.  To be quite honest it makes me quite sad.  People need to realize that unexpected **** happens when releasing patches, updates, or extra content.  Going completely rage-mode over something as trivial as this (when there are more dire things going on in the world now) is just plain silly and I honestly feel a great swell of pity for those that are making such a big deal over an error with an update and the lack of five dollar content.

Again..you should probably go outside or socialize instead.

[Dahelia]

What a Twist wrote...

Dahelia wrote...

What a Twist wrote...

Hahaue wrote...

jellmoo32 wrote...

You paid for Dragon Age Origins. That is all. You have not paid for anything that has not been released. By your argument, you could say that you are experiencing the full game because you are unable to play future DLCs or even the expansion.

Ignoring the fact that they used "2 years of continuous DLC" as a selling point, there are plenty of people who paid for RtO and either got a version that broke the game, or haven't gotten anything at all.

Yeah the game breaking part is what annoys me. I saw it on XBL marketplace, so I trusted that it was ready for use. We waited this long, only to have it get messed up the day it releases. What were all the delays for then?

Do we really want to get into that??? Really?????

Yes, Dahelia. I am back, and prepared!


Edit for Enchantment!

Lol! For the mere fact of watching us be pissed off....I think they enjoy it. I believe they never really did anything, working on it? All of a sudden there are bugs out the butt from this DLC that they couldn't of caught before??? Someone is failing at the DLC department.

[Dahelia]

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

What a Twist wrote...

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

People....seriously....it's five bucks...

Get over it. The DLC will be out and ready once it's ready and fixed. It's seriously not that big of a deal. If you have nothing better to do than come to a internet message board over five dollar game content then maybe you need to go outside or socialize with real people instead of nerd raging on a silly video game message board.

You know this thread is here for talking about the RTO situation, right?

If it angers you so much, don't read it.

Oh it doesn't make me angry at all.  To be quite honest it makes me quite sad.  People need to realize that unexpected **** happens when releasing patches, updates, or extra content.  Going completely rage-mode over something as trivial as this (when there are more dire things going on in the world now) is just plain silly and I honestly feel a great swell of pity for those that are making such a big deal over an error with an update and the lack of five dollar content.

Again..you should probably go outside or socialize instead.

You should take your own advice..