309 réponses à ce sujet

[Foolsfolly]

Captain Crash wrote...

A body slider in the Character Creator could help a great deal with this. I know people who are on either end of this opinion and not everyone wants the same thing.

Not sure how easy it would be to implement and if Bioware wants to go down this route but I think this would satisfy a great many people who do have an issue.

Hell yeah. Make muscle mass a slider choice. Why hasn't this happened yet?

[Trolldrool]

If I see a female in heavy plate armour with a large shield on her back or a claymore in her hands, I'd like for her body to resemble the life of someone who has done a lot of physical work. Whether this means training as a soldier or a long life as a farmer or blacksmith's daughter or pulling the nets on a boat from a coastal fishing village isn't all that important to me.

It doesn't have to be clearly defined muscles rippling beneath their skin. But when it looks like they've barely done any more heavy lifting in their life than carrying a backpack of books when they went to school, I find it difficult to be immersed.

This works both ways. It's the reason in games like NWN I could never take the concept of a half orc rogue seriously.

[Deebo305]

SoI guess nobody remembers Fenris then and his bean pole body?

[Solmanian]

David7204 wrote...

Adanu wrote...

Dear God, the ignorance of some posters in relation to actual realities of caloric intake for combat units is amazing.

If you're wondering, I'm talking about you, David.

Tell me, did you simply miss these brilliant points, or are you just stupid? 

- Your body will adjust to 8,000 Calories with no exercise after a month and you won't get fat

For the record, if your regular average caloric is 3000 (the average man intake is suppose to be 2400-2800), and you suddenly decided to add 5000 calories to your regualr intake, you will gain approximately 50kg in fat if you won't combine it with enhanced physical activity to compensate. So you will get fat, but after gaining those 50kg your weight gain will plateau.
Also note, that it's really hard consuming 8000 calories; alot of soldiers and most proffesional athletes use food supplements. I foolishly didn't and after 2 years of service I was on the verge of malnutrition.

David7204 wrote...

- All medieval soldiers were in "amazing shape"

That is common knowledge. Considering the constant physical strain of daily life even a medival peasant would be much much stronger than your average pencil pushing office drone of the 21st century...

David7204 wrote...

- Medieval archers could "easily lift" 180 pounds in one hand

Your average english longbowmen had to exert an equivelent of 70kg worth with his drawing hand and 40kg with his bracing hand to use the longow effectively. He was expected to do this 100 times in a row as part of his daily routine.

David7204 wrote...

- Average 'knight-vs-knight' combat lasted over an hour

Are you not familiar with the term "plate armour cannot be bested"? A man with a sword could not be expected to penetrate the triple layerd protection of full plate armour. Too many people are indoctrinated by Hollywood vision of "tin foil" plate armour. A knight would you usually slaugther his way accross the battlefield (they were after all the best trained and best equipped soldiers on the field) until they encountered another knight; than they would pound on eachother until one of them would collapse and the knight that prevail either thook the other guy hostage for ransom or shoved a dagger through his visor.
There were fe things on a medival battlefield that were effective against a full plate mail: crossbow bolts and longbows (arrows from regular bows usually just bounced off), spears braced against charging cavalry or polearms designed as "can oppeners" to tear off the plates.

Really, dave. Just crack a book before you try to enforce your vison of reality without anything to back it up.

[grumpymooselion]

How about giving people the option, instead of suggesting we force one preference or another on everyone?

Games like Dragon's Dogma show you can insert above average character creation tools, including customization of the body and armor that scales to the body, without sacrificing quality in other aspects of your game (and Dragon's Dogma is far from the only game that allows for such customization). This weird idea that advanced customizations will gut the story and cripple the game mechanics is utterly ridiculous.

[Oberkaiser]

For the record, if your regular average caloric is 3000 (the average man intake is suppose to be 2400-2800), and you suddenly decided to add 5000 calories to your regualr intake, you will gain approximately 50kg in fat if you won't combine it with enhanced physical activity to compensate. So you will get fat, but after gaining those 50kg your weight gain will plateau.
Also note, that it's really hard consuming 8000 calories; alot of soldiers and most proffesional athletes use food supplements. I foolishly didn't and after 2 years of service I was on the verge of malnutrition.

That's because as your body fat increases, your body needs more and more calories to sustain itself. At 5000 calories a day with no excercise, however, you won't stop gaining weight until you are comatose or dead. So you're wrong on that count. 

That is common knowledge. Considering the constant physical strain of daily life even a medival peasant would be much much stronger than your average pencil pushing office drone of the 21st century...

I'm going to assume you know that medieval Europe did not have a bodybuilding culture. Most footmen were malnourished (knights' horses famously had a more nutritious diet than the typical footslogger) and only nobles and knights could eat enough calories and, more importantly, protein to support muscle maintenance. But you would never find a single person in those times who was "ripped" by any stretch of the modern definition of the word. Knights were full bodied and strong with massive guts, and would be labeled fat by today's standards.

Your average english longbowmen had to exert an equivelent of 70kg worth with his drawing hand and 40kg with his bracing hand to use the longow effectively. He was expected to do this 100 times in a row as part of his daily routine.

The draw weight on an english longbow varied from 30 to 70 kg (70 to 150 pounds). The longbow was 1.83 meters high, taller than the average man of the time, and had to be planted into the ground to be fired. As such, archers were taught to hold the bow in place with one hand and put their whole weight into drawing the bowstring. Thus anyone weighing more than 70 kg (which was in fact surprisingly rare, so longbowmen were selected based on height and weight) didn't have a lot of training to do before they could effectively operate the longbow . What you said, on the other hand, made it sound like archers curled 70 kg dumbbels every day for archery practice, which is completely retarded.  

Are you not familiar with the term "plate armour cannot be bested"? A man with a sword could not be expected to penetrate the triple layerd protection of full plate armour. Too many people are indoctrinated by Hollywood vision of "tin foil" plate armour. A knight would you usually slaugther his way accross the battlefield (they were after all the best trained and best equipped soldiers on the field) until they encountered another knight; than they would pound on eachother until one of them would collapse and the knight that prevail either thook the other guy hostage for ransom or shoved a dagger through his visor.
There were fe things on a medival battlefield that were effective against a full plate mail: crossbow bolts and longbows (arrows from regular bows usually just bounced off), spears braced against charging cavalry or polearms designed as "can oppeners" to tear off the plates.

You've heard some credible information but you obviously filled in the gaps yourself. Fully plated knights rode into battle on horses, and falling off your horse was considered a death sentence. This is because a dismounted knight was easily knocked over and overpowered by multiple opponents. Even one lightly armored footman could circle around a knight, who wasn't only slow but had barely any visibility at all. Moreover, back then the only "fencing" melee combatants knew was to swing your sword faster than the enemy. Fencing with longswords is a modern invention attributed to historic reconstruction groups.

By the way, even though I know a lot about medieval warfare I am not familiar with the term "plate armor cannot be bested". I think citation is in order.

And citing supposed military experience as a way to gain credibility when obviously every point you've made is either completely or partially false just makes you look like a sad poser.

Modifié par Oberkaiser, 24 mars 2013 - 05:48 .

[KainD]

Bfler wrote...

This thread is hilarious.
A normal woman will never get such muscles like the athletes on some of the pictures here without help. And the women on that pictures only get them with help of weight gainers and/or anabolic drugs.

It's a fantasy, women aren't supposed to be completely realistic!

[KainD]

Lennard Testarossa wrote...

Then again, as muscles don't really seem to work the same way in Thedas, it isn't even necessary for them to be buff. Having far less muscle mass doesn't seem to mean being weaker, after all.

Then don't make men buff either. 

[slimgrin]

Bfler wrote...

This thread is hilarious.
A normal woman will never get such muscles like the athletes on some of the pictures here without help. And the women on that pictures only get them with help of weight gainers and/or anabolic drugs.

Steroid and drug free:




And she'd mop the floor with most men on this forum.

Modifié par slimgrin, 24 mars 2013 - 07:49 .

[Lennard Testarossa]

KainD wrote...
Then don't make men buff either.

Fenris, much?

[Volus Warlord]

slimgrin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

This thread is hilarious.
A normal woman will never get such muscles like the athletes on some of the pictures here without help. And the women on that pictures only get them with help of weight gainers and/or anabolic drugs.

Steroid and drug free:




And she'd mop the floor with most men on this forum.

Creatine, blood doping, ........

[KainD]

Lennard Testarossa wrote...

KainD wrote...
Then don't make men buff either.

Fenris, much?

And if my PC mage looked like Fenris it would be good, but I was stuck with a buff Hawke for no good reason. 

[ObserverStatus]

Bioware games totally need more muscular women tbh. They should look something like this.

[Lennard Testarossa]

KainD wrote...
And if my PC mage looked like Fenris it would be good, but I was stuck with a buff Hawke for no good reason.

Male Hawke's body looks pretty normal for someone who does a little sport. It's not like he's huge or anything. I doubt many people would call him buff.

Modifié par Lennard Testarossa, 24 mars 2013 - 08:06 .

[Sejborg]

slimgrin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

This thread is hilarious.
A normal woman will never get such muscles like the athletes on some of the pictures here without help. And the women on that pictures only get them with help of weight gainers and/or anabolic drugs.

Steroid and drug free:




And she'd mop the floor with most men on this forum.

Kill it with fire!! 

Edit:
To add something more than the instant shock to that creature to my post, I would say, that I don't mind if female PC's got a little more muscle tone. But they should still maintain their feminity. 

Modifié par Sejborg, 24 mars 2013 - 08:15 .

[ManOfSteel]

slimgrin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

This thread is hilarious.
A normal woman will never get such muscles like the athletes on some of the pictures here without help. And the women on that pictures only get them with help of weight gainers and/or anabolic drugs.

Steroid and drug free:




And she'd mop the floor with most men on this forum.

Damn straight. I think this is the sort of build a female Warrior should possess.

[Chiramu]

No.

I don't want a female weight-lifter and I'm sure no romance companion would want to make love to one. They are disgusting.

I would rather have a weak looking character that throws like a geek.

[Lennard Testarossa]

Volus Warlord wrote...
Creatine, blood doping, ........

Some muscle, quite a bit of subcutaneous fat tissue...I don't see what your problem is.

[ManOfSteel]

Chiramu wrote...

No.

I don't want a female weight-lifter and I'm sure no romance companion would want to make love to one. They are disgusting.

I would rather have a weak looking character that throws like a geek.

Firstly, there's a difference between a weight-lifter and someone with muscle.

Secondly, because everyone shares your opinion, right? <_<

[Fiacre]

DoomHK wrote...

Chiramu wrote...

No.

I don't want a female weight-lifter and I'm sure no romance companion would want to make love to one. They are disgusting.

I would rather have a weak looking character that throws like a geek.

Firstly, there's a difference between a weight-lifter and someone with muscle.

Secondly, because everyone shares your opinion, right? <_<

Indeed :|

I find the woman whose picture has been posted on this page (who is she, btw?) a lot more attractive than fem!Hawke's or fem!Shep's model. And if any of the LI's didn't want to be with someone who looks like her? Then I don't want to be with them, either.

Modifié par Fiacre, 24 mars 2013 - 08:18 .

[Angrywolves]

II don't really understand what the tc wants . Most women who have been through physical training could mop the floor with all of us posters. Not necessary to excessively bulk up the female characters.

[slimgrin]

Fiacre wrote...

DoomHK wrote...

Chiramu wrote...

No.

I don't want a female weight-lifter and I'm sure no romance companion would want to make love to one. They are disgusting.

I would rather have a weak looking character that throws like a geek.

Firstly, there's a difference between a weight-lifter and someone with muscle.

Secondly, because everyone shares your opinion, right? <_<

Indeed :|

I find the woman whose picture has been posted on this page (who is she, btw?) a lot more attractive than fem!Hawke's or fem!Shep's model. And if any of the LI's didn't want to be with someone who looks like her? Then I don't want to be with them, either.

Ronda Rousey. She's an advocate for natural foods only in training and speaks out on PED's. She looks bulky because she does have feminine curves on top of the muscle, the furthest thing from a body builder really. I just thought she was a good example of an athletic woman.

Modifié par slimgrin, 24 mars 2013 - 08:29 .

[Fiacre]

slimgrin wrote...

Fiacre wrote...

DoomHK wrote...

Chiramu wrote...

No.

I don't want a female weight-lifter and I'm sure no romance companion would want to make love to one. They are disgusting.

I would rather have a weak looking character that throws like a geek.

Firstly, there's a difference between a weight-lifter and someone with muscle.

Secondly, because everyone shares your opinion, right? <_<

Indeed :|

I find the woman whose picture has been posted on this page (who is she, btw?) a lot more attractive than fem!Hawke's or fem!Shep's model. And if any of the LI's didn't want to be with someone who looks like her? Then I don't want to be with them, either.

Ronda Rousey. She's an advocate for natural foods only in training and speaks out on PED's. She looks bulky because she does have feminine curves on top of the muscle, the furthest thing from a body builder really. I just thought she was a good example of an athletic woman.

Thanks And yeah, I think she's the best example I've seen yet for a female warrior build. She certainly still looks feminine to me, but she also looks like she's physically strong.