252 réponses à ce sujet

[FlowCytometry]

Kittstalkur wrote...

FlowCytometry wrote...

if you say so, but I still don't think that's a big weakness since it can be worked around, else the DA and DV wouldn;t be as good as they are.

It's not much of a weakness for Clusters, it's a pretty big one for frags.  Mind, I still like frags a whole lot, but hell, they're only on the Human Soldiers anyways.

true, well part of the issue w/ frags is that the HSo is best *not* being power built, but then again the KSe also isn;t always built for power dmg like the AV is (melee or heavy weapons specs, etc), and the final evo is still bugged to only give 50% armor_sheild bonus- I think.

Modifié par FlowCytometry, 24 mars 2013 - 06:02 .

[B0WKAAAAAA]

Stop complaining about a co-op game and play. People like the kid who started this thread ruin classes like the talon, or the AUI(already nerfed because of a complainer) for people who are actually good with them. I'm about to hit maxed manifest at last, 2 more cards, so obviously I'm going to be good with certain classes. That doesn't make them overpowered, that makes it a decent class that I know how to use and spec with my level 10 ultra rares. People who whine about a co-op game are sad. Let it be, try it yourself, play the game, get the credits, buy the packs. In the process, have fun. DON'T ruin it for people who enjoy powerful builds. PLAY AS THE BUILD.

[Kuato Livezz]

Grenades are cheap, but the CTM is all the talon needs. You can spec him to have 19 CTMs (maybe you can get more). With regeneration, ammo crates, and ammo packs, running out isnt much of a concern (unless you like to hoard ammo packs).

Who would have an easier time killing enemies. A batarian soldier using only frag grenades or a Talon using only CTMs?

[Kittstalkur]

Kuato Livezz wrote...

Grenades are cheap, but the CTM is all the talon needs. You can spec him to have 19 CTMs (maybe you can get more). With regeneration, ammo crates, and ammo packs, running out isnt much of a concern (unless you like to hoard ammo packs).

Who would have an easier time killing enemies. A batarian soldier using only frag grenades or a Talon using only CTMs?

You imply that Batarians have frag grenades.

And if the talon is just spamming Cains, he's going to run out pretty quick even with thermal clip packs, unless he's just camping one spot on the map for the entire game. Which'd just lead to a slow, boring game.

[Blarg]

Sure, maybe Trip Mines do too much damage like you say. But they also have a priming delay, a very small trip radius, are difficult to plant where you want them, and are limited in number.

Also keep in mind that the Talon is ridiculously squishy. He's like the GI in that way: does a lot of damage, but if a Trooper so much as sneezes on you you're done for. That's why it's balanced, and that's why Trip Mines don't need a nerf.

[Kuato Livezz]

Kittstalkur wrote...

Kuato Livezz wrote...

Grenades are cheap, but the CTM is all the talon needs. You can spec him to have 19 CTMs (maybe you can get more). With regeneration, ammo crates, and ammo packs, running out isnt much of a concern (unless you like to hoard ammo packs).

Who would have an easier time killing enemies. A batarian soldier using only frag grenades or a Talon using only CTMs?

You imply that Batarians have frag grenades.

And if the talon is just spamming Cains, he's going to run out pretty quick even with thermal clip packs, unless he's just camping one spot on the map for the entire game. Which'd just lead to a slow, boring game.

whoops..inferno. 

[Cyonan]

FlowCytometry wrote...
its the speed of the animation and travel time that's ridiculous, not the setup. Honestly getting the first 3 out doesn't take *that* long, and once you get past that then only a missle launcher can kill things as quickly.

Cains replaced by new ones should simply despawn, not explode imo :/

That said, yes most grenades are ridiculous now, but Cains are just silly as implemented. They'd be fine if they could only be used as the tactical trip mines they were intended to be- not spammed for forced explosions.

And Frags are actually as good as Lifts- just not on synthetics. Dunno why BSN thinks they're weak- certainly not as much as Homings are. At least they have a good radius and can still detonate tech primers reliably.

Only thing that Cain Mines will win out on is the boss mobs. By the time you're at the 4th mine the Asari Vanguard will have cleared the spawn of everything else and moved on since she can fire Lift Grenades just as fast as you can fire mines.

Cain Mines despawning isn't something that can be done now anyway.

I don't really think that frags are weak, just that they're not as good at taking out groups as Lift, Cluster, or Inferno Grenades, or Cain Mines.

B0WKAAAAAA wrote...

Stop complaining about a co-op game and play. People like the kid who started this thread ruin classes like the talon, or the AUI(already nerfed because of a complainer) for people who are actually good with them. I'm about to hit maxed manifest at last, 2 more cards, so obviously I'm going to be good with certain classes. That doesn't make them overpowered, that makes it a decent class that I know how to use and spec with my level 10 ultra rares. People who whine about a co-op game are sad. Let it be, try it yourself, play the game, get the credits, buy the packs. In the process, have fun. DON'T ruin it for people who enjoy powerful builds. PLAY AS THE BUILD.

If you were actually good with the AIU, the nerf wouldn't have ruined her =P

To be honest, both her and the Turian Ghost are still overpowered even after their nerfs(not that I think they should be nerfed again mind you).

[KalilKareem]

The talon is easily the best platinum spawn nuker atm, and among the top tier kits. Does this call for a nerf? I personally do not think so. Outside certain degenerate tactics (that were already possible due to armored compartments) he does not trvialize the game, nor do I see him in excssive numbers in lobbies.

[DullahansXMark]

As a self-proclaimed expert on balance, I can safely say that Cain Mines cause no such issue as the one you are referring to.

The two biggest tests for something being imbalanced are: does this make the other choices less appealing? Does this me want to play this kit more than others? (more information in my sig)

The Talon has high damage and utility for sure, but to be at maximum efficiency he has to take 625 health and shields, which is less than your average Drell. He can't take hits. Not to mention, in order to deal that suprl337tpro level of damage you have to have some extreme coordination. Heavy risks, but the prize.

It's like saying the GI is OP. Nooooo he is not.

[xtorma]

Hell I have seen with my own eyes mobs walk right through a tripwire and not set it off. I have seen phantoms enter a hall stop, and turn around like they can see it.

[FlowCytometry]

Cyonan wrote...

FlowCytometry wrote...
its the speed of the animation and travel time that's ridiculous, not the setup. Honestly getting the first 3 out doesn't take *that* long, and once you get past that then only a missle launcher can kill things as quickly.

Cains replaced by new ones should simply despawn, not explode imo :/

That said, yes most grenades are ridiculous now, but Cains are just silly as implemented. They'd be fine if they could only be used as the tactical trip mines they were intended to be- not spammed for forced explosions.

And Frags are actually as good as Lifts- just not on synthetics. Dunno why BSN thinks they're weak- certainly not as much as Homings are. At least they have a good radius and can still detonate tech primers reliably.

Only thing that Cain Mines will win out on is the boss mobs. By the time you're at the 4th mine the Asari Vanguard will have cleared the spawn of everything else and moved on since she can fire Lift Grenades just as fast as you can fire mines.

Cain Mines despawning isn't something that can be done now anyway.

I don't really think that frags are weak, just that they're not as good at taking out groups as Lift, Cluster, or Inferno Grenades, or Cain Mines.

Fair enough. But on later waves in gold and much of Plat that extra damage to elite and boss enemies is quite substantial over a front-loaded nade like AV's Lifts- esp if you take the armor evo since most of those types of mobs have armor. The problem is the Cains have the exact same anim and flight as a prox mine, and that animation can be chained very fast compared to conventional grenades when there's no power cd getting in the way.

But ur right, its too late to ask for anything now- heck, I doubt we'll even get an official keybinding fix for the damn kit for PC at this rate.

Modifié par FlowCytometry, 24 mars 2013 - 06:36 .

[TrveOmegaSlayer]

JLoowis wrote...

FFinfinity1 wrote...

JLoowis wrote...

 I see Talon Engineer players joining half way of game and finishes 1st.

It's that over powered. It breaks my heart when I see that they can kill 3 Pyros or 3 Rocket Troopers in 2 seconds.
Everyone standing there with a solid build waiting to get some nice weapon kills and power combos in the mix.
It ruins the moment.

Isn't that a good thing to kill the enemies, and the whole team benifits, I welcome the talons. Anyways I can accomplish about the same effect with my handy dandy black widow, its all about using what you have to the maximum effect.

also I don't know if bioware is going to continue patching the game any longer, with the last of the dlcs out they are focusing on the next titles.

I see new guys working on their Weaponds Challenges or  myself including. Watching players spamming Siege Pulse or Cain Trip Mines on Silver ruins the experience.

Solo a couple of bronzes/silvers and let the objective waves go and keep enemies respawning until you're 30 seconds to the end. 

[etm125]

To abuse cain mine spam you need to burn some thermals. Who would burn through thermal clips for a silver game?

[JosLouis70]

etm125 wrote...

To abuse cain mine spam you need to burn some thermals. Who would burn through thermal clips for a silver game?

Silver Rio, the guy didn't need to Thermal Clip to spam a lot. Even in middle, he managed to get nades back. Fortunately for him no one else was using nade powers.

I guess Cain Trip Mines is just a matter of opportunity. "You're lucky if no one else engaged that mob group"
Then he gets all the kills for shooting 3-4 CTMs.

I like to see at the bottom right of the screen this:

playername [Weapon] Geth Pyro
2 seconds later
playername [Weapon] Geth Pyro
3 seconds later
playername [Melee] Geth Pyro

instead of

playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Pyro
playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Pyro
playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Pyro
3 seconds later
playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Rocket Trooper
playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Rocket Trooper
playername [Cain Mine Trip] Geth Rocket Trooper

[etm125]

He probably was using thermals. The cains have such a minuscule trip radius that you almost have to spam them unless you meticulously place them horizontally.

In order for you to use it like a grenade you gotta chuck out 4 at a minimum. Probably 5 for good measure. If its a gold boss (prime,banshee,atlas) I usually go to town with 7 or 8. Of all of these usually the first 3 are useless and dont go off. Even with grenade cap V and cap increases from powers you can only get away with this once or twice a wave unless you wanna make laps of the ammo boxes. Can you create some really big burst dps? Yep. Probably best in the game. But its not really sustainable without consumables. Thankfully the omnibow also rocks.

[Sir_Alan_]

I completely forgot to slap on the Power Magnifier, I must remember to adjust my kit next time I'm online

On topic, so your basis for overpowered, is that you got outscored by someone who joined late?

I occasionally get top spot after joing late but that's usually more a reflection on the rest of the team, rather than me...

[JosLouis70]

etm125 wrote...

He probably was using thermals. The cains have such a minuscule trip radius that you almost have to spam them unless you meticulously place them horizontally.

In order for you to use it like a grenade you gotta chuck out 4 at a minimum. Probably 5 for good measure. If its a gold boss (prime,banshee,atlas) I usually go to town with 7 or 8. Of all of these usually the first 3 are useless and dont go off. Even with grenade cap V and cap increases from powers you can only get away with this once or twice a wave unless you wanna make laps of the ammo boxes. Can you create some really big burst dps? Yep. Probably best in the game. But its not really sustainable without consumables. Thankfully the omnibow also rocks.

Yeah.

Well the Geth  are slow walking units, they walk in packs if the path is narrow.
Aiming on the ground for Hunter, Pyro, Rocket fresh spawned cavalry isn't too hard.

For Cerberus I think Horizontal aligning and small map is the only way for Trip Mines full potential.
Phantom's side jumps makes the Feet cast close to useless or Nemesis' racing skills.

I'd say that Trip Mines are especially OP for Reapers/Geth. The rest is damn hard.
It's all a matter of opportunity to release them all. But you'd be surprise how just 1 or 2 Mines manages to take down 3 Elite enemies on Silver. Not squishy Centurions. Pyros or Collector Caps. 

[JosLouis70]

Sir_Alan_ wrote...

I completely forgot to slap on the Power Magnifier, I must remember to adjust my kit next time I'm online

On topic, so your basis for overpowered, is that you got outscored by someone who joined late?

I occasionally get top spot after joing late but that's usually more a reflection on the rest of the team, rather than me...

Stealing all lthe fun with a cheap skill while there's plenty other stuff to do. Not just finishing 1st.

I like to farm Melee kills for my Combat Mastery Challenge. Please understand xP

[cdzander]

Support for this game is over. No more nerfs. No more buffs. The game we have now is the game we will have until they shut off the servers.

Asking for change is pointless.

Modifié par cdzander, 24 mars 2013 - 07:29 .

[JosLouis70]

cdzander wrote...

Support for this game is over. No more nerfs. No more buffs. The game we have now is the game we will have until they shut off the servers.

Asking for change is pojntless.

 
"So be it"

I'll play Multiplayer Bronze/Silver solos as if it was an Armax Arena but with 10 rounds instead of 3.

Kidding.

Today a Talon joined because someone left during mission, so I didn't saw him in the lobby.
I was out of luck.
So yeah, next time I'm in a lobby, I just check for the Talon Engineer gear set. If it's a Shotgun or Assault rifle or Pistol with Melee enhancers it's a PASS and IF it's a SMG or Pistol with Power Magni I will leave.

Thanks for replying to topic. 

[etm125]

Reaper is actually tough for cain mines bc they have 1 huge downside: bosses that block powers. (Banshee, praetorian, phantom). Nothing worse that spamming the balls out of 2 banshees only to realize their BS aura was up. Guess whos outta mines and f***ed now?

Youre right on geth though. Geth are idiots and you can cain spam the hell outta them.

[DeltaSerpentis.m]

3 pages and no one has said " LOL Silver" yet? I really don't care if it breaks your silver experience, the game is "balanced" (If you want to call it that) against Gold. Kindly STFU until you try him there, then we can have a discussion.

FWIW I agree with Cyonan, the AV is still an astounding spawn nuker, charge, grenade, grenade, everything's dead...

[Diogo Marzo]

january42 wrote...

I see new guys working on their Weaponds Challenges or  myself including. Watching players spamming Siege Pulse or Cain Trip Mines on Silver ruins the experience.

You have to TRY to die as a juggernaut on silver. Other grenades are way better than cain mines on silver anyway. Yeah, lift is one of them.

Heck, a Collector Adept with a Scorpion(HVB+PB) can obliterate spawns as well(or better) than a talon and they don't even HAVE grenades.

A destroyer with a scorpion can do it also. There are quite a few classes that can bomb spawns.  Kinda wish we had bigger maps.

Bigger maps would deffinitely be a pluss. They really didn't explore that's much as they should have.  Maybe me4?

[Sovietdeath]

please a gd qmi can cloak and nuke a spawn in two arc grenades 3 will nuke a gold spawn and leave bosses with lil health left to unload on with a hurricane

[Chealec]

I may have missed it but no-one has mentioned the fact that you can only lay 3 Cain mines at a time and they're best placed in choke points (ideally in front of a spawn point) - any grenade class can spam way more though, granted their grenades don't regenerate.

There are many classes that can out-do Talons on gold level spawn nuking, DA, DV, AV, QMI, QME and (especially against Reapers) Kroldier off the top of my head... I'd imagine that on silver there are even more classes that can wipe spawns almost instantly so it's just a matter of who gets there first.

Modifié par Chealec, 24 mars 2013 - 08:22 .