19 réponses à ce sujet

[chiznax]

I mean from the similar perspective of how we view life... Are they really with consciousness? Are they alive? or Just undead with consciousness? or probably a new different species of sapients? What are your thoughts? 

[Albistein]

Sure, they are the true power behind Starbucks.

[caradoc2000]

Erm, why wouldn't they be alive?

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Because they reproduce through the use of other species, in the manner of a virus.

[TEWR]

I do consider them to be alive in the sense of having a soul. I believe the soul is trapped by the Call of the Old Gods, but not nonexistent like Riordan believes. Supported, of course, by the Awakened Darkspawn.

They're living beings as well, not undead. So yes, they're a sapient species. An odd one, but one nontheless.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Yeah, but one of the scientific qualifications for life, as I understand it, is that it has to be capable of reproducing without strictly needing another species. That's the difference between bacteria and viruses that leads one to be considered life and another not, despite being similar superficially.

[caradoc2000]

Are you suggesting that viruses are dead?

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

 Viruses are a grey area between living and non-living. If I remember correctly, part of the reason they're considered such is because they have a darkspawn-like reproduction process which requires them to attack living organisms to reproduce. Living beings aren't supposed to use other life outside its own species for the process, or at least not as the source of the offspring the way viruses do. (Infecting it with a prexisting fetus or larva is something else.) (There's various other features of life viruses lack too. The darkspawn actually have a better case than viruses do.)

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 27 mars 2013 - 12:21 .

[caradoc2000]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Living beings aren't supposed to use other life outside its own species for the process

Outsourcing is the buzzword in modern society Reproduction is like shooters, there are two kinds of them. Humans play FPR (first-person reproduction) while viruses play TPR (third-person reproduction).

More seriously, isn't metabolism (i.e. nourishment) one of the characteristics of life. As I recall the darkspawn don't have to eat - they can do so for pleasure but they don't need it to sustain themselves. I admit there were mixed signals about this in the lore and I could be wrong, but at least it is something to consider as well.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Oh, right. I'd forgotten darkspawn don't have to do that. Then, no. Darkspawn aren't alive.

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 27 mars 2013 - 01:44 .

[Monica21]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
They're living beings as well, not undead. So yes, they're a sapient species. An odd one, but one nontheless.

How are they sapient? Everything they do is controlled by either the singing of the Old Gods or an Archdemon. They dig until they awaken the old god and then they follow the Archdemon's orders. Aside from the talking darkspawn, I don't believe they're capable of thought.

[caradoc2000]

Monica21 wrote...

How are they sapient?.

Sapient is not alive.

<insert biological explanation>

Darkspawn are henceforth determined to be not alive...

... unless the same universe has magic.

Then you have

....

Bottom line - life is more than Wikipedia definition

Modifié par caradoc2000, 27 mars 2013 - 04:50 .

[Fuggyt]

It's the Taint that's alive.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Hm. Able to spread to anything, rather like a creeping vine... but it doesn't have to eat either.

[Fuggyt]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Hm. Able to spread to anything, rather like a creeping vine... but it doesn't have to eat either.

I was thinking more like a disease which a self-organizing purpose.  Three possibilities:

a.  it eats the metabolic functions of its hosts i.e. darkspawn, broodmothers, archdemons, Grey Wardens, or whatever.

b.  it's magical (it originated in the Fade) and doesn't need to eat. 

c.  it can't find decent moo goo gai pan in Thedas.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Fuggyt wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Hm. Able to spread to anything, rather like a creeping vine... but it doesn't have to eat either.

I was thinking more like a disease which a self-organizing purpose.  Three possibilities:

a.  it eats the metabolic functions of its hosts i.e. darkspawn, broodmothers, archdemons, Grey Wardens, or whatever.

b.  it's magical (it originated in the Fade) and doesn't need to eat. 

c.  it can't find decent moo goo gai pan in Thedas.

Well, not all diseases are alive. As for eating the metabolic functions of its hosts, I don't think that's what's going on. Otherwise, it would likely be more necessary that the hosts eat, not less. B is possible, but then it's not technically alive. C is possible, but I think if the Wardens knew that was the life they were about, they'd just quit.

You got me thinking, though. What about demons? I don't know if they reproduce or how, or if they strictly need to victimize humans the way they do. They're considered to be a type of life by setting standards, but are they scientifically alive?

[Angrywolves]

Just like any other noxious organism is alive,yes they live.

[Lavaeolus]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Yeah, but one of the scientific qualifications for life, as I understand it, is that it has to be capable of reproducing without strictly needing another species. That's the difference between bacteria and viruses that leads one to be considered life and another not, despite being similar superficially.

In a world where demons can roam about in a literal realm of dreams, where men's spirits can go wandering and later shoot fire out of their hands, where creatures can survive without food and water by simply being sustained by some strange "taint", and where certain dwarves can survive enough alcohol to give a jellyfish liver failure...

The strict scientific definition of life may be a bit moot.

[Nyxanna]

Why shouldn't they be? They could be humans who are simply controlled by the Archdemon or humans who have their humanity taken away from them so they act mostly like animals.