236 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Taking pinches of it for healing seems like something tons of people did, and the Chantry allowed it. Defiling it was bad, yeah, but wouldn't that make the Maker angry enough to come back instead of wimping out and just going even farther away?

Since the Maker didn't come back, I think you answered your own question about whether the Warden was sent by him.

[Xilizhra]

Foshizzlin wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Taking pinches of it for healing seems like something tons of people did, and the Chantry allowed it. Defiling it was bad, yeah, but wouldn't that make the Maker angry enough to come back instead of wimping out and just going even farther away?

Since the Maker didn't come back, I think you answered your own question about whether the Warden was sent by him.

Except the ashes potentially healed the Arl of Redcliffe, paving the way for the Warden to get into a position to dethrone Loghain and bring the Blight to an end.

Wait, what? I think we're talking about different things now. I was referring to a lack of reaction from the Maker by defiling the ashes.

[Willowhugger]

Besides, if the Maker COULD be beaten he'd just be a big Fade Spirit not the Maker.

[Xilizhra]

Willowhugger wrote...

Besides, if the Maker COULD be beaten he'd just be a big Fade Spirit not the Maker.

All he'd need to be is some being that inspired the Maker legend.

[Willowhugger]

[quote]Besides, if the Maker COULD be beaten he'd just be a big Fade Spirit not the Maker.[/quote]
All he'd need to be is some being that inspired the Maker legend.[/quote]

Yeah, but I'd find that disappointing. It's possible Andraste never existed and that'd be an interesting twist but in Oblivion, there was this BIG build up to this all powerful ancient Necromancer and they just used a little one-note Elite Necromancer character to be him.

It was very disappointing.

I'm all for all-powerful Maker or nonexistent one.

Just my .02.

I'd also like alternatives to the Old Gods being "real."

[Trolldrool]

I remember reading somewhere that at the apex of their power, the Tevinter mages were so constantly exposed to lyrium that their bodies became deformed and they barely resembled human. That could imply that the first darkspawn disfigurements were already present before they entered the City and not divine punishment.

I also believe the point Oghren made about the Ashes of Andraste wasn't just that they were in a hall surrounded by lyrium, but that the very rock and dust was saturated with it. Probably more lyrium than any mage would even consider bringing along with them to heal a patient.

Though to be honest I hope it's not that simple, else everything spectacular in Thedas' history could be explained as; A wizard did it.

Modifié par Trolldrool, 26 mars 2013 - 04:17 .

[lil yonce]

Foshizzlin wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Foshizzlin wrote...

You'd think knowing his greatest enemy rising up to slaughter everything would've drawn his attention just a little.

I expect it went something like this:

"Maker: WELCOME TO THEDAS, MY CHILDREN! I AM YOUR CREATOR, YOU'RE FREE TO START WORSHIPPING WHENEVER YOU WANT!

Dumat: No, worship me instead. I'm big, powerful and I breathe fire. I'm way cooler than This old coot. Plus, I'll give you blood magic.

Maker: SHUT UP, BAD DUMAT! BAD DRAGON-GOD! STOP TRYING TO CORRUPT THE NEW BABY! GO BENEATH THE GROUND AND THINK A BIT ON WHAT YOU'RE DOING!

Thalsian(who had to ruin it for everyone): Dude, did you see that dragon-thing. He was so cool, we should totally worship him.

Maker: OH, IF YOU LIKE HIM SO MUCH, YOU CAN HAVE HIM! YOU CAN EVEN FREE HIM, I DON'T GIVE A SH*T. SEE HOW YOU LIKE HIM ONCE HE IS FREE."

That actually makes a lot of sense.

Wayment. How do you know dragon worship was a result of spite? The Old Gods are being killed off one by one by the ones they deceived into worship. Five down. Two to go. Retribution!

Poetic justice. 

[Xilizhra]

Wayment. How do you know dragon worship was a result of spite? The Old Gods are being killed off one by one by the ones they deceived into worship. Five down. Two to go. Retribution!

At least one back up.

[lil yonce]

Xilizhra wrote...

At least one back up.

I don't think it's the same being it once was. The OGB could simply be a mage that derives supreme power its blood. Soul in its most basic defintion is life force and blood is commonly associated with life force.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 26 mars 2013 - 04:41 .

[Frolk]

I'm not discounting the idea that there are or were powerful beings in the Dragon Age universe who might have been worshiped as gods (Flemeth comes to mind) but I can't really justify worshiping them in any way, and that's basically the attitude that most of my characters take. If it turns out that the Maker is real, how does it follow that I have to abide by his rules (it's not like his rules are backed up by the threat of eternal torture in the afterlife).

[Fresh Bamboo]

I want to be atheist in the game because it's sort of unbearable in real life to listen to someone preach religion, but it's socially unacceptable to encourage atheism.
I sort of want to get Inquisition to shove the preacher's words down their throats. But at the same time, the Gods in the Dragon Age universe are real. So... I'd sort of look like an idiot in the game.

[Trolldrool]

Fresh Bamboo wrote...

I want to be atheist in the game because it's sort of unbearable in real life to listen to someone preach religion, but it's socially unacceptable to encourage atheism.
I sort of want to get Inquisition to shove the preacher's words down their throats. But at the same time, the Gods in the Dragon Age universe are real. So... I'd sort of look like an idiot in the game.

I've always seen atheism as only believing in what you're able to observe. So from a character's perspective, since our characters has never actually observed the Maker, it would be possible to be an atheist in that regard. That's pretty much Morrigan's approach to it.

[KiwiQuiche]

I'm of the opinion the Maker is A god, not THE god. The Old Gods, the Dalish Gods and the Maker I'm assuming are just gods. And the Maker in particular needs a good ganking >:I

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 26 mars 2013 - 05:27 .

[Willowhugger]

Fresh Bamboo wrote...

I want to be atheist in the game because it's sort of unbearable in real life to listen to someone preach religion, but it's socially unacceptable to encourage atheism.
I sort of want to get Inquisition to shove the preacher's words down their throats. But at the same time, the Gods in the Dragon Age universe are real. So... I'd sort of look like an idiot in the game.

I dunno, it's kind of hard to call the Archdemon a god if you can shank him.

In my opinion, any god which is mortal isn't worth being called one.

Sorry Odin.

[Iakus]

Foshizzlin wrote...

Except a theory by a lot of people in the game is that the Maker sent the Warden to end the Blight. There's been 5 failed Blights so far, and if in canon the Maker really is intervening, that doesn't seem so bad.

I find that to be a bit of a stretch, given the sheer number of Wardens possible.  Heck I'm not so sure Leliana was sent to help the Warden (whether she really heard the Maker's voice was never really settled to my satisfaction)

I do, however, believe there is a connection between the darkspawn taint and the Maker's departure.  More than simply "The magisters brought sin to the Golden City"

[Iakus]

Trolldrool wrote...

I remember reading somewhere that at the apex of their power, the Tevinter mages were so constantly exposed to lyrium that their bodies became deformed and they barely resembled human. That could imply that the first darkspawn disfigurements were already present before they entered the City and not divine punishment.

That could help explain why Corypheus and the Architect somewhat resemble each other.

[KiwiQuiche]

iakus wrote...

Foshizzlin wrote...

Except a theory by a lot of people in the game is that the Maker sent the Warden to end the Blight. There's been 5 failed Blights so far, and if in canon the Maker really is intervening, that doesn't seem so bad.

I find that to be a bit of a stretch, given the sheer number of Wardens possible.  Heck I'm not so sure Leliana was sent to help the Warden (whether she really heard the Maker's voice was never really settled to my satisfaction)

I do, however, believe there is a connection between the darkspawn taint and the Maker's departure.  More than simply "The magisters brought sin to the Golden City"

Maybe Andraste decided to go back to her first husband and it made the Maker fly into a rage so he decided to punish everyone else for it.

[KiwiQuiche]

Willowhugger wrote...

Fresh Bamboo wrote...

I want to be atheist in the game because it's sort of unbearable in real life to listen to someone preach religion, but it's socially unacceptable to encourage atheism.
I sort of want to get Inquisition to shove the preacher's words down their throats. But at the same time, the Gods in the Dragon Age universe are real. So... I'd sort of look like an idiot in the game.

I dunno, it's kind of hard to call the Archdemon a god if you can shank him.

In my opinion, any god which is mortal isn't worth being called one.

Sorry Odin.

Well, even gods have to fall to death sooner or later- that's just the way existance is.

And gods are sturdy sure, but not invulnerable. Other gods or divine weapons would most likely be able to injure or kill them. Or you could pull a Dread Wolf and fool them into getting locked up lol

[Iakus]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Maybe Andraste decided to go back to her first husband and it made the Maker fly into a rage so he decided to punish everyone else for it.

Unlikely given the First Blight kicked off several centuries before Andraste was even born

[KiwiQuiche]

iakus wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Maybe Andraste decided to go back to her first husband and it made the Maker fly into a rage so he decided to punish everyone else for it.

Unlikely given the First Blight kicked off several centuries before Andraste was even born

Hmm, well maybe the Maker was just being a dick, then.

[Kidd]

MisterJB wrote...

The attributes given to the dragons obviously must have something to do with their inherent natures. I rather doubt these classifications were the result of a dart toss. Dumat was the dragon of silence due to the silence death brings, the vows of silence came after as part of his worship.

You're jumping to conclusions about why he's given the title of Dragon of Silence. For all we know, it could mean the opposite of Song, while singing in the Dragon Age setting is commonly part of mind-control. In other words, Dragon of Silence could be another way of saying Dragon of Freedom. Not that I'm saying that's how it is, but it's as likely as anything we get a confirmation of why the title was given.

[MisterJB]

Fair enough. Personally, I believe that Dumat, being the most powerful of all Old Gods, is called the "Dragon of Silence" in association with the fact death brings silence. I believe we've all heard described the stillness that follows a battle, yes?
My basis for this is this entry "Dumat, the Old God once known as the Dragon of Silence, had risen to silence the world," that can be found in "Chantry History, part 1" and the fact that the battle where Dumat fell is called "The Battle of the Silent Plains".

Modifié par MisterJB, 26 mars 2013 - 08:00 .