I've been looking at going into a technical school, to learn video game design. After looking into some of the leading schools, like DigiPen and USC, I discovered Full Sail has a 1 year Game Design Masters Degree, which focuses on PR, QA, Project Leads, etc, rather than programming. I'm 28, have a BA in Sociology and managed to do nothing with it. I'm currently unemployed, and most of the work opportunities, even for part time, are in retail or food.
I'm just wondering if this puts me in a good place to get hired in the industry...or if I'm better off taking a 4 year at DigiPen, in which case I'll be 32 and over 100k in debt by the time I finish with an undergraduate degree in Computer Science and Game Design. Full Sail, I'll be 29 and only around 35k in debt, with a Masters in Game Design. I'm looking into some other options as well, but they tend to be more around the idea of what I'd get at DigiPen.
Anybody have any experience with this that can provide me some insight?
Is Full Sail worth while?
Débuté par
DukeOfNukes
, mars 26 2013 10:32
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#2
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Posté 26 mars 2013 - 10:43
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Full Sail is alright, there's some interesting courses to takeI've made a few analog games in the year and some months I've been there (online courses).
#3
Posté 27 mars 2013 - 01:45
Maverick827
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This is going to be awkward after someone already said they go there, but no. I'll try to explain why without completely ragging on Full Sail itself. If someone from BioWare comes in here and says that 95% of the people they've hired in the last 10 years are from Full Sail, then disregard my post because apparently my understanding is completely out of date. I severely doubt this is the case, however.
A Master's degree in "Game Design" is probably less likely to get you a job designing games as your BA in Sociology would. If you read the description for the program, it's full of phrases like:
- take on leadership roles
- oversee the next generation of innovation in the field of video games
- team leadership, project development, and collaborative design
- inspire a team of artists and programmers to stay focused
- oversee a team of artists and programmers in developing a complete game title
- coordinate the production schedule, everything you would do as a producer in the industry
Not only are these vague at best (if a Master's program description isn't full of undecipherable jargon, chances are it's not very good), but it's teaching you how to be a project lead. Sorry to say, but there are no entry-level project lead positions anywhere, let alone at game studios. You need an actual skill of some sort to get your foot in the door to then obtain a few years of experience (five seems to be the average). Factor in seniority, game companies folding and/or laying people off at high rates, and you might never lead a project. So what is your degree for?
Worst of all is that your degree will be good for only one position. There's probably only a few thousand "project lead" positions in the game industry total, and that's counting everything. If you narrow it down to AAA games, the thing that most people think of when they imagine "designing games," you're probably looking at only a few hundred. Even if game companies did hire people off the streets, the chances that person would be you are extremely small. Those are very, very low odds for a $45,000 wager (~$32,000 tuition, 6.8% fixed interest rate, 10 year payment plan).
I've never heard of DigiPen before. Their front page says that Richard Garfield gave a talk to the students there, which as a fairly hardcore Magic: the Gathering player sounds awesome. As an academic, however, that sounds like a frivolous attention grab (on the part of the school, that is). It must be a ton of fun to be a student at these "game colleges," getting all manner of industry celebrities to speak at your classes, but the amount of fun you had in school isn't going to matter when you're applying for a job.
The DigiPen program BS/Computer Science program mentions nothing of technologies learned. If I had to take an admittedly cynical guess, I would say they're just going to teach you how to use a highly-specific and easily-self-teachable technology like UDK or Unity. What languages will you learn? What concepts will you cover? How do these languages and concepts translate to other computer programming fields? Learning C++ and Object Oriented programming is helpful. Learning Unrealscript and how to drag and drop art assets in UDK is not (at least, not worth paying for - I recommend you download UDK and mess around with it, it's fun!).
I know it might seem interesting, but there are a lot of dirty little secrets no one really thinks about. BioWare has offices on Austin, Edmonton, and Montreal. I can't say for certain, but it doesn't seem unlikely that various people (or "assets") are expected to move for various projects. It feels like once a week I'm reading a story about more mass layoffs in the industry, so you might consider yourself lucky if all you have to do is move.
Also keep in mind that on top of the low chances of getting into the industry itself, there's also a low chance that you'll be working for a developer you like on a AAA game. It's much more likely that you'll settle for work on a flash game that teaches kids math than Mass Effect 5. About six or seven years ago about 3/5 of all of my friends somehow came to work at a local game development studio doing QA. They were all excited that they would be playing games for a living, but they quickly realized that "playing games" didn't mean "playing the games I play for fun already." It meant "playing games that I once said 'you couldn't pay me to play that game but now that's exactly what's happening.'"
My advice to you, as boring and dream-crushing as it is, is to go to a state college (typically inexpensive, my yearly tuition was around $5,000) and get a Bachelor's degree in computer programming. Specifically, I would look for Java (Java EE, JSF), HTML, Javascript, and PHP, Python, Ruby...These skills set you up for work anywhere. If your school teaches Java, then teach yourself C++ to keep that gaming dream alive. If your school teaches C++, then teach yourself Java so you're immediately employable by pretty much any software company anywhere ever. If your school teaches C, run.
A Master's degree in "Game Design" is probably less likely to get you a job designing games as your BA in Sociology would. If you read the description for the program, it's full of phrases like:
- take on leadership roles
- oversee the next generation of innovation in the field of video games
- team leadership, project development, and collaborative design
- inspire a team of artists and programmers to stay focused
- oversee a team of artists and programmers in developing a complete game title
- coordinate the production schedule, everything you would do as a producer in the industry
Not only are these vague at best (if a Master's program description isn't full of undecipherable jargon, chances are it's not very good), but it's teaching you how to be a project lead. Sorry to say, but there are no entry-level project lead positions anywhere, let alone at game studios. You need an actual skill of some sort to get your foot in the door to then obtain a few years of experience (five seems to be the average). Factor in seniority, game companies folding and/or laying people off at high rates, and you might never lead a project. So what is your degree for?
Worst of all is that your degree will be good for only one position. There's probably only a few thousand "project lead" positions in the game industry total, and that's counting everything. If you narrow it down to AAA games, the thing that most people think of when they imagine "designing games," you're probably looking at only a few hundred. Even if game companies did hire people off the streets, the chances that person would be you are extremely small. Those are very, very low odds for a $45,000 wager (~$32,000 tuition, 6.8% fixed interest rate, 10 year payment plan).
I've never heard of DigiPen before. Their front page says that Richard Garfield gave a talk to the students there, which as a fairly hardcore Magic: the Gathering player sounds awesome. As an academic, however, that sounds like a frivolous attention grab (on the part of the school, that is). It must be a ton of fun to be a student at these "game colleges," getting all manner of industry celebrities to speak at your classes, but the amount of fun you had in school isn't going to matter when you're applying for a job.
The DigiPen program BS/Computer Science program mentions nothing of technologies learned. If I had to take an admittedly cynical guess, I would say they're just going to teach you how to use a highly-specific and easily-self-teachable technology like UDK or Unity. What languages will you learn? What concepts will you cover? How do these languages and concepts translate to other computer programming fields? Learning C++ and Object Oriented programming is helpful. Learning Unrealscript and how to drag and drop art assets in UDK is not (at least, not worth paying for - I recommend you download UDK and mess around with it, it's fun!).
I know it might seem interesting, but there are a lot of dirty little secrets no one really thinks about. BioWare has offices on Austin, Edmonton, and Montreal. I can't say for certain, but it doesn't seem unlikely that various people (or "assets") are expected to move for various projects. It feels like once a week I'm reading a story about more mass layoffs in the industry, so you might consider yourself lucky if all you have to do is move.
Also keep in mind that on top of the low chances of getting into the industry itself, there's also a low chance that you'll be working for a developer you like on a AAA game. It's much more likely that you'll settle for work on a flash game that teaches kids math than Mass Effect 5. About six or seven years ago about 3/5 of all of my friends somehow came to work at a local game development studio doing QA. They were all excited that they would be playing games for a living, but they quickly realized that "playing games" didn't mean "playing the games I play for fun already." It meant "playing games that I once said 'you couldn't pay me to play that game but now that's exactly what's happening.'"
My advice to you, as boring and dream-crushing as it is, is to go to a state college (typically inexpensive, my yearly tuition was around $5,000) and get a Bachelor's degree in computer programming. Specifically, I would look for Java (Java EE, JSF), HTML, Javascript, and PHP, Python, Ruby...These skills set you up for work anywhere. If your school teaches Java, then teach yourself C++ to keep that gaming dream alive. If your school teaches C++, then teach yourself Java so you're immediately employable by pretty much any software company anywhere ever. If your school teaches C, run.
Modifié par Maverick827, 27 mars 2013 - 01:57 .
#4
Posté 27 mars 2013 - 07:18
DukeOfNukes
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The "dream" is to make video games for a living. Full Sail would just be a means to an end, so if it doesn't provide me with a good chance to fulfill that, then it's not worth my time. Same goes for Digipen...it's supposed to be the number 2 school for video game design, but that's really the question...am I wasting my time by learning this stuff? Am I better off just working around with Unity on my own, or just as well off taking Computer Science classes at the local State college?
Thanks for your take, that's kind of what I'm thinking, too. I'm hoping to get a few more people to weigh in...ideally someone who works in the industry and can give me a definitive "Don't waste your time" or "we actively recruit from there"...because you're right...it's around a 50k wager, and considering I've made about 20-25k for the past 6 years, it's dangerous if I end up no better off.
Thanks for your take, that's kind of what I'm thinking, too. I'm hoping to get a few more people to weigh in...ideally someone who works in the industry and can give me a definitive "Don't waste your time" or "we actively recruit from there"...because you're right...it's around a 50k wager, and considering I've made about 20-25k for the past 6 years, it's dangerous if I end up no better off.
