391 réponses à ce sujet

[Armass81]

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Sometimes victory comes with a cost. If youre not ready to make sacrfices, hard as they might be, then maybe you should put your adventuring hat down.

Gonna let you in on a little secret here.

I am not, an adventurer.  If Earth ever got invaded by space Cthulhu, they'll have to look elsewhere for a savior.
o
I do, however, play video games.  And video games are not real life 

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him? Wasnt he your avatar and all that?

Modifié par Armass81, 01 mai 2013 - 01:52 .

[Iakus]

txgoldrush wrote...

Plenty of stories do bring a new character in the last minute....especially if they are spoilers.

Yes.

They typically appeared on the stage by being lowered from a crane or rising up through a trap door 

[StoneSwords]

txgoldrush wrote...

StoneSwords wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

StoneSwords wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Also can I just ask, Iakus. You said ME3 has rendered the entire trilogy pointless, you know theyre not going to change the ending anymore, since their making new games now and Montreal is on the next ME game. So why linger here with all this depression and negativity? This goes for everyone who is so betrayed, they cant stand it. Why? Whats the point?

Two reasons:

1) MEHEM is still being worked on, and I find myself returning here to keep up with it.

2) There's no DA3 info to talk about yet.

And I admit, a part of me also wants to keep voicing the depths of my (and others') disappoiment.  The developers already barely acknowledge there was ever a problem to begin with.  If all they hear is unquestioning praise from the likes of txgoldrush and others, they might just rewrite history entirely.  Already I fear a repeat of ME3's ending.

The fact that people such as txgoldrush have to think this hard, and dig this deep to attempt to explain to the rest of us why the ending is fine as is, speaks volumes

Never said it was fine, I said I understand what they tried to accomplish. The execution left a lot to be desired. Theres alot of things wrong, you indeed do not bring a new character in the last 10 minutes of the story, this is writing 101.

Plenty of stories do bring a new character in the last minute....especially if they are spoilers.

And in some instances, it works, but in this instance, it just came off as completely jarring and disjointed from the main plot and themes of the ME trilogy

Yet he was foreshadowed and so was the themes the ending portrays.

Yes, he was foreshadowed in a piece of DLC that came out AFTER the main game

[Iakus]

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

[Armass81]

StoneSwords wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

StoneSwords wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

StoneSwords wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Also can I just ask, Iakus. You said ME3 has rendered the entire trilogy pointless, you know theyre not going to change the ending anymore, since their making new games now and Montreal is on the next ME game. So why linger here with all this depression and negativity? This goes for everyone who is so betrayed, they cant stand it. Why? Whats the point?

Two reasons:

1) MEHEM is still being worked on, and I find myself returning here to keep up with it.

2) There's no DA3 info to talk about yet.

And I admit, a part of me also wants to keep voicing the depths of my (and others') disappoiment.  The developers already barely acknowledge there was ever a problem to begin with.  If all they hear is unquestioning praise from the likes of txgoldrush and others, they might just rewrite history entirely.  Already I fear a repeat of ME3's ending.

The fact that people such as txgoldrush have to think this hard, and dig this deep to attempt to explain to the rest of us why the ending is fine as is, speaks volumes

Never said it was fine, I said I understand what they tried to accomplish. The execution left a lot to be desired. Theres alot of things wrong, you indeed do not bring a new character in the last 10 minutes of the story, this is writing 101.

Plenty of stories do bring a new character in the last minute....especially if they are spoilers.

And in some instances, it works, but in this instance, it just came off as completely jarring and disjointed from the main plot and themes of the ME trilogy

Yet he was foreshadowed and so was the themes the ending portrays.

Yes, he was foreshadowed in a piece of DLC that came out AFTER the main game

Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

[txgoldrush]

Armass81 wrote...


Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

Correct.

And his motives are foreshadowed by the reaper on Rannoch.

[txgoldrush]

iakus wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Plenty of stories do bring a new character in the last minute....especially if they are spoilers.

Yes.

They typically appeared on the stage by being lowered from a crane or rising up through a trap door 

You really don't get how they subverted the deus ex machina here.....Shepard is the "DEM" to the Catalyst, not the other way around.

[Armass81]

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

[Iakus]

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...


Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

Correct.

And his motives are foreshadowed by the reaper on Rannoch.

"The cycle must continue" is not forshadowing.

As to Vendetta: that forshadowing comes at the end of thessia, the second to last mission before endgame.  A little late for forshadowing.  And even then, it only implied a central intelligence guiding them, not a motive.

[txgoldrush]

iakus wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...


Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

Correct.

And his motives are foreshadowed by the reaper on Rannoch.

"The cycle must continue" is not forshadowing.

As to Vendetta: that forshadowing comes at the end of thessia, the second to last mission before endgame.  A little late for forshadowing.  And even then, it only implied a central intelligence guiding them, not a motive.

You missed the point and the line where that Reaper uses Rannoch as an example for the cycle to continue.

And you are now moving the goalpost, facts are facts, it was foreshadowed.

[StoneSwords]

[quote]Armass81 wrote...

[Yet he was foreshadowed and so was the themes the ending portrays.[/quote]

Yes, he was foreshadowed in a piece of DLC that came out AFTER the main game
[/quote]

Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

[/quote]

Ok, I remember that, I'll give you that one, but still,  it was foreshadowed very sparingly, and only in the third installment of the trilogy in a couple of spots, one of those being a piece of DLC meant to be played before the end, but that didn't come out until after the end.  I don't think anyone could honestly say they saw this coming on their very first playthrough before the ending uproar

[StoneSwords]

iakus wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...


Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

Correct.

And his motives are foreshadowed by the reaper on Rannoch.

"The cycle must continue" is not forshadowing.

As to Vendetta: that forshadowing comes at the end of thessia, the second to last mission before endgame.  A little late for forshadowing.  And even then, it only implied a central intelligence guiding them, not a motive.

Thank you.  The foreshadowing we did get was too little too late

[txgoldrush]

StoneSwords wrote...

iakus wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Armass81 wrote...


Not entirely, Pashek Vi does kind foreshadow him "I predict reapers are only a servants of the cycle, not its master" "then who is the master?"

Correct.

And his motives are foreshadowed by the reaper on Rannoch.

"The cycle must continue" is not forshadowing.

As to Vendetta: that forshadowing comes at the end of thessia, the second to last mission before endgame.  A little late for forshadowing.  And even then, it only implied a central intelligence guiding them, not a motive.

Thank you.  The foreshadowing we did get was too little too late

doesn't matter...it was foreshadowed. Who cares when?

[Iakus]

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

[Iakus]

txgoldrush wrote...

doesn't matter...it was foreshadowed. Who cares when?

"Who cares when"?

Are you serious?

Wow.  Just...wow... 

[txgoldrush]

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

[Armass81]

txgoldrush wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

Problem with Mehem for me is that it makes it

A: Too easy
B: No choices
C: Still leaves the reapers unanswered

Modifié par Armass81, 01 mai 2013 - 02:14 .

[StoneSwords]

txgoldrush wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

Well, you definitly have a way with words, I'm convinced! [sarcasm]

MEHEM is very well done, considering what Mr. Fob has to work with, and even with it's flaws provides a more satisfying ending overall than what we currently have.

[Armass81]

StoneSwords wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

Well, you definitly have a way with words, I'm convinced! [sarcasm]

MEHEM is very well done, considering what Mr. Fob has to work with, and even with it's flaws provides a more satisfying ending overall than what we currently have.

Thats subjective. Id rather take the EC.

[StoneSwords]

Armass81 wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

Problem with Mehem for me is that it makes it

A: Too easy
B: No choices
C: Still leaves the reapers unanswered

Honestly, I would have been fine with a little mystery when it comes to the reapers.  It made them more menacing and made them more than just starkid's pawns

[Armass81]

StoneSwords wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

iakus wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

Then why are you so attached so Shepard? Werent you adventuring as him?

No.  I was playing a game.  I was pretending to go on adventures.  Adventures wehre Shepard could stick to his principles and "find another way" if he was tough enough, smart enough, charismatic enough, or just plain crazy-prepared.

At least until the end, when the illusion dropped.

So in the end you were attached to him at least somewhat, otherwise you wouldnt be that upset.

I was too. I guess our expectations of his end were just somewhat different. I was expecting a sacrifice, you were expecting a party.

No, I expected sacrifice.  I just expected a price worth paying, not to become something worse than Saren.  SOmething more in line with Dragon Age: Origins maybe.

I expected damaged or even destroyed relays.  i did not expect the rest.  And I certainyl didn't expect a human sacrifice.  At least not in High EMS endings.

And as you can see, I heartilly endorse MEHEM.  My "party" is a memorial for Anderson.  

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Nevermind only two of the endings ar eself sacrifice at high EMS.

Problem with Mehem for me is that it makes it

A: Too easy
B: No choices
C: Still leaves the reapers unanswered

Honestly, I would have been fine with a little mystery when it comes to the reapers.  It made them more menacing and made them more than just starkid's pawns

Another thing thats subjective. If I Had a choice tough, I would have taken Grubs endings in the fan section. He did excellent job providing some very different ones, including couple of very disturbing ones, like the twilight zone twist to synthesis. The reapers motives were laid bare but what they were after in that ending still retained their menace. A cold machine can be sometimes as terryfying as an unknown monster.

Modifié par Armass81, 01 mai 2013 - 02:22 .

[Iakus]

txgoldrush wrote...

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Everyone here who's suprised at this statement raise your hand

::does not raise hand::

[StoneSwords]

iakus wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

MEHEM is stupid, nevermind poorly done.

Everyone here who's suprised at this statement raise your hand

::does not raise hand::

He expressed himself in a very convincing way though  [sarcasm again]

::no raised hands here::

Modifié par StoneSwords, 01 mai 2013 - 02:24 .

[Iakus]

Armass81 wrote...

Problem with Mehem for me is that it makes it

A: Too easy
B: No choices
C: Still leaves the reapers unanswered

A) At the moment it assumes a High EMS ending.  There are apparantly plans in the future to add in medium and low EMS versions, which are supposed to be considerably less happy.

An unfortunate modding limitation.  But on the plus side, eliminates the Catalyst's appearance.

C) As you can see on another thread, I have no problem with this.

[spamtrash]

StoneSwords wrote...
Honestly, I would have been fine with a little mystery when it comes to the reapers.

ME1 and ME2 explained the reapers perfectly for me.

ME1: "They're harvesting us!"

Why?:

ME2: Reproduction!
*Insert Silly Human-looking Reaper Here.*



Viva MEHEM.