391 réponses à ce sujet

[SpamBot2000]

chemiclord wrote...

But that's all it really is.  It stunk.  It wasn't produced with malice or ill intent towards the fans.  It wasn't a slap to the face or a gut punch or a low blow or an insult.  It was a bad ending, and is bad completely on its own merits without the need to add malicious intent.

Contrary to what you're constantly saying, no one is really ascribing the ending to "malice" or "ill intent towards fans". But there are reasons to believe that the top priority when it came to writing this ending was to stop the Mass Effect setting as a potentially ongoing story, with the aim of providing a satisfactory conclusion to the fans far below on the list.

Ignoring the things they were well aware the fans who paid for the whole thing and invested themselves into it wanted certainly qualifies as an insult, a low blow and a slap in the face. And we know they were aware because they talked about it. Casey Hudson, with his talk of people wanting to save this universe so they could see themselves hanging on the citadel is just one of many such examples. But they gave us a "boring wasteland", with the player character dead or gasping alone under a pile of rubble. Most likely because they didn't want to be pressed into making sequels by EA. Casey Hudson had his new IP he was anxious to get into developing. We know this. And Mac Walters obviously never really liked the whole "player choice" thing the games had, always pushing for less and less. He is clearly much more comfortable milking the franchise with comic books.

Yet for some reason, you would label such considerations "insane conspiracy theories". I fail to see what is so outlandishly far-fetched in two guys who we know wanted to move on from making Mass Effect games, yet lacking the autonomy within the corporate structure to simply refuse to do so without repercusssions, to fashion the ending to the game deliberately so that a sequel would seem logically impossible. In fact, I find it much less likely that the thought never crossed their minds, but they simply grafted on an ill-fitting finale and saw that it was implemented with no review by the writing team "becuz they thought it wuz grate!", as it were.

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 11 mai 2013 - 10:49 .

[Morlath]

I cannot tell the OP just how much I agree almost 100% with their views.

[PsyrenY]

I agree with the OP a lot but I also don't think Bioware handled the controversy as well as they should have, especially in the very beginning.

clarkusdarkus wrote...

So to sum up i moved on ages ago

Then why are you here?

[chemiclord]

SpamBot2000 wrote...
Yet for some reason, you would label such considerations "insane conspiracy theories". I fail to see what is so outlandishly far-fetched in two guys who we know wanted to move on from making Mass Effect games, yet lacking the autonomy within the corporate structure to simply refuse to do so without repercusssions, to fashion the ending to the game deliberately so that a sequel would seem logically impossible. In fact, I find it much less likely that the thought never crossed their minds, but they simply grafted on an ill-fitting finale and saw that it was implemented with no review by the writing team "becuz they thought it wuz grate!", as it were.

Because your nonsense IS insane conspiracy theories.

Hudson and Walters would have be borderline autistic and mentally handicapped to think they could "Torch the Franchise and Run" then think people would buy the freakin' COMIC BOOKS.  It's an absolutely INSANE plan, and that you think it's even POSSIBLE is mind-boggling.

NO ONE, not even Hudson and Walters, would think that plan had ANY chance of success.  It would be stupid as hell to even attempt.

That is the malice I speak of.  You WANT to believe they destroyed the franchise intentionally without caring one bit how it hurt the fans, because THAT would justify your rage.

If someone makes a mistake, or just doesn't quite live up to what was expected, and you rail on them about it for OVER A YEAR, throwing it in their face every single damned day... well, then you're just a douchebag ****.  But if there was an intent to actually HURT YOU... well, then your ire is perfectly justified.

[Morlath]

chemiclord wrote...

Hudson and Walters would have be borderline autistic and mentally handicapped to think they could "Torch the Franchise and Run" then think people would buy the freakin' COMIC BOOKS.  It's an absolutely INSANE plan, and that you think it's even POSSIBLE is mind-boggling.

Regardless of how much I might approve of your post, the bolded is out of line to even use as a way of getting your point across.

[SpamBot2000]

Your ranting makes me a little distrustful of your diagnostic skills. It's not that crazy to think that these guys would view their audience as people who would happily lap up anything they served, and speculate some great point to it all. It's right there, in the notes for the ending. "Lots of speculation". I see some people do it every time I read BSN. They just overestimated the percentage.

And it's not "malice". It's "negligence". Sloppy word usage leads to sloppy thinking. Is that what happened to you?

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 11 mai 2013 - 08:32 .

[chemiclord]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Your ranting makes me a little distrustful of your diagnostic skills. It's not that crazy to think that these guys would view their audience as people who would happily lap up anything they served, and speculate some great point to it all. It's right there, in the notes for the ending. "Lots of speculation". I see some people do it every time I read BSN. They just overestimated the percentage.

And it's not "malice". It's "negligence". Sloppy word usage leads to sloppy thinking. Is that what happened to you?

You're the one who made the claim that Walters intentionally decimated the video game series to try and sell comic books.  I'd call that a malicious act, man.

[SpamBot2000]

chemiclord wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Your ranting makes me a little distrustful of your diagnostic skills. It's not that crazy to think that these guys would view their audience as people who would happily lap up anything they served, and speculate some great point to it all. It's right there, in the notes for the ending. "Lots of speculation". I see some people do it every time I read BSN. They just overestimated the percentage.

And it's not "malice". It's "negligence". Sloppy word usage leads to sloppy thinking. Is that what happened to you?

You're the one who made the claim that Walters intentionally decimated the video game series to try and sell comic books.  I'd call that a malicious act, man.

Ok, once again. Not "decimated video game series TO sell more comics". Decimated video game series TO NOT make more GAMES in that series. Still happy to write the comics, because it's easy enough way to make $$$$.

The motivation is not to hurt anyone, hence not "malice". The hurt is collateral damage.

[AlanC9]

SpamBot2000 wrote...


Ok, once again. Not "decimated video game series TO sell more comics". Decimated video game series TO NOT make more GAMES in that series. Still happy to write the comics, because it's easy enough way to make $$$$.

I still don't follow the motivation.Was he supposed to be some sort of indentured servant? 

@ chemiclord: this isn't an insane conspiracy theory. There's no conspiracy if it's just Mac.

[SpamBot2000]

AlanC9 wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...


Ok, once again. Not "decimated video game series TO sell more comics". Decimated video game series TO NOT make more GAMES in that series. Still happy to write the comics, because it's easy enough way to make $$$$.

I still don't follow the motivation.Was he supposed to be some sort of indentured servant? 

@ chemiclord: this isn't an insane conspiracy theory. There's no conspiracy if it's just Mac.

Nope, just someone who was lucky to get in the position he is in with a pretty thin resume and smart enough to understand that.

And it's not just Walters. There's Casey Hudson as well. But that about covers it. No Illuminati or extraterrestrial involvement. 

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 12 mai 2013 - 05:19 .

[chemiclord]

I still can't figure out how that scheme makes even one lick of sense.

Were they supposed expect people to gleefully lap up COMIC BOOKS after they broke the video game franchise beyond repair? How could ANYONE have thought that was a good idea?

Answer... they didn't... because that would be a skull****ingly stupid plan. Even if you thought Mac Walters and Casey Hudson were clinically brain dead, there's no way in hell they could have thought, "After we blow up the video games, Mac, you can write up some comic books! The fans'll love it! Duh herp derp!" was anything resembling a smart move.

And yeah, when you accuse the two highest men on the totem pole of conspiring amongst themselves to advance their own agenda and leaving everyone else in the dark... uh... yeah... that's pretty much the textbook definition of a conspiracy theory.

But hey, Spambot needs an enemy to rage against, and he's chosen Mac Walters, apparently.

Modifié par chemiclord, 12 mai 2013 - 05:36 .

[SpamBot2000]

chemiclord wrote...

And yeah, when you accuse the two highest men on the totem pole of conspiring amongst themselves to advance their own agenda and leaving everyone else in the dark... uh... yeah... that's pretty much the textbook definition of a conspiracy theory.

Because it's not like they shut out the rest of the writing staff and implemented the ending without the feedback every other part of the game went through?

Oh, wait... They did.

EDIT: Also, your constant comments about my "raging" strike me as extremely hypocritical. Sure, I admit I'm angry. And I try to figure out who did what to make this debacle happen. But I certainly make an effort to contain my emotions to avoid scattershot ranting and blaming innocent individuals. Maybe I don't always succeed. We are talking about the totally unnecessary ruining of the one thing that brought me most pleasure in my life over the past few years. 

This is certainly more than you are willing to do for random people on the internet who never had any power over your enjoyment of anything. Take a look at your hectoring rants, with every third word capitalized, which I'm sure you know translates as shouting. You are the one "raging". 

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 12 mai 2013 - 08:03 .

[V-rcingetorix]

Personally, I don't think there was malicious intent when ME3 was produced. At least, not intentionally.

From what I could see, there was a lot of attention paid to certain aspects, like the death of Thane (trained so well that even when half dead he can go toe-to-toe with a Cerberus killer), the Genophage cure (Mordin death if options are right) and the Bailey conversations.

They may be little things, but they were done well, if not as I had come to expect them.

The end result is that the game was great, but the ending was terrible. Why was it terrible? Because the game had given high standards, and *perhaps* understandably failed to meet them, maybe because of time? The last ten minutes just felt rushed, hurried to meet an already-delayed deadline.

[chemiclord]

SpamBot2000 wrote...
Because it's not like they shut out the rest of the writing staff and implemented the ending without the feedback every other part of the game went through?

Oh, wait... They did.

You THINK this is true.  There is no evidence this scenario actually happened outside of one post that Patrick Weekes denies he actually made.  That is nothing near conclusive.

EDIT: Also, your constant comments about my "raging" strike me as extremely hypocritical. Sure, I admit I'm angry. And I try to figure out who did what to make this debacle happen. But I certainly make an effort to contain my emotions to avoid scattershot ranting and blaming innocent individuals. Maybe I don't always succeed. We are talking about the totally unnecessary ruining of the one thing that brought me most pleasure in my life over the past few years. 

This is certainly more than you are willing to do for random people on the internet who never had any power over your enjoyment of anything. Take a look at your hectoring rants, with every third word capitalized, which I'm sure you know translates as shouting. You are the one "raging". 

The capitalization of words is to imply emphasis.  And I call you out when you say stupid crap; like for example, claiming Bioware was advocating SUICIDE with the ending of ME3.  It's that illogical, emotional lashing out that doesn't help your case at all.  It makes you look like a raving lunatic.

It's quite simple to figure out what happened.  The writing staff (or Walters and Hudson... or whoever you want to think was reponsible) tried to get cute, tried to do something unconventional, and give an ending they thought their players would appreciate.  They.  Were.  Wrong.  They ****ed it up, and pretty badly.  Oh well.  IT HAPPENS. 

You call it 'unnecessary ruining'.  I call it 'a mistake.'

[AlanC9]

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Nope, just someone who was lucky to get in the position he is in with a pretty thin resume and smart enough to understand that.

And making a bad ending to ME3 helps his resume?

And it's not just Walters. There's Casey Hudson as well. But that about covers it. No Illuminati or extraterrestrial involvement. 

I guess I stand corrected ; looks like this is a  crazy conspiracy theory after all. What's Casey Hudson's motivation?

[Bleachrude]

Wasn't Mass Effect Casey Hudson's brainchild...I know there were a lot of people involved, but the original idea and the rough outline, wasn't that all Casey H?

[SpamBot2000]

AlanC9 wrote...

SpamBot2000 wrote...

Nope, just someone who was lucky to get in the position he is in with a pretty thin resume and smart enough to understand that.

And making a bad ending to ME3 helps his resume?

And it's not just Walters. There's Casey Hudson as well. But that about covers it. No Illuminati or extraterrestrial involvement. 

I guess I stand corrected ; looks like this is a  crazy conspiracy theory after all. What's Casey Hudson's motivation?

It wouldn't have hurt his resume if the game playing public hadn't decided it's had enough of being treated like idiots. It doesn't look like the guy is capable of helping it outside of BW carrying him.

Casey Hudson's big, secret motivation is to move onto his next IP. As he has repeatedly stated. Guy works for EA, EA likes sequels. Far out stuff, huh?

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 14 mai 2013 - 05:54 .