194 réponses à ce sujet

[Degenerate Rakia Time]

Super Mario........serioulsy though, DA2 combat was good enough, no need to borrow from someone else, just improve the power combos and remove parachuting enemies and it will be perfect

[Solmanian]

Easy. Batman: Arkham city. Simply because of the fluidity in the way you fight, block, counter, move between opponents, and of course finishers. It's like AC combat, only good.

[Xiltas]

Modified kingdom hearts 2 or Assassin's Creed... or Fire Emblem

[TheJediSaint]

Call of Duty+Bianca.

[imbs]

nightscrawl wrote...

I'm sure I will get dissed on this by someone, but I actually enjoy the combat in World of Warcraft. Some classes have way too many skills, but others have a nice mix of a priority rotation (keep this debuff on at all times, if this condition, then do that, etc) and situational abilities. Just because WoW is an MMO doesn't mean you can't have tremendous solo skill as well. They introduced an arena event where solo players have fights against enemies. You need to use your entire arsenal to surivive and win the fight.

n I think you have a decent idea m8. The entire attraction of wow's combat is the piano keyboard-amount of spells you have access to. It's the reason why wow's skillcap is infact higher than mmos like GW2 and can result in pretty complex combat. That is something Bioware games have been missing for a while now, and should be the staple of Bioware RPGs if you ask me.

Obviously wow has flaws mind you but can't be worse than DA2 can it? heh

[Sejborg]

Xcom enemy unknown

[littlebrightpanda]

Kingdoms of Amalur! It's a bit like DA2, only better and more responsive.

[Sutekh]

Topsider wrote...

Severance: Blade of Darkness.

Wow! Was about to say the exact same, complete with link because I thought nobody would know that game.

[zyntifox]

DA:O with a move-to-point command on the console to make implementing strategies easier.

[Fast Jimmy]

imbs wrote...

nightscrawl wrote...

I'm sure I will get dissed on this by someone, but I actually enjoy the combat in World of Warcraft. Some classes have way too many skills, but others have a nice mix of a priority rotation (keep this debuff on at all times, if this condition, then do that, etc) and situational abilities. Just because WoW is an MMO doesn't mean you can't have tremendous solo skill as well. They introduced an arena event where solo players have fights against enemies. You need to use your entire arsenal to surivive and win the fight.

n I think you have a decent idea m8. The entire attraction of wow's combat is the piano keyboard-amount of spells you have access to. It's the reason why wow's skillcap is infact higher than mmos like GW2 and can result in pretty complex combat. That is something Bioware games have been missing for a while now, and should be the staple of Bioware RPGs if you ask me.

Obviously wow has flaws mind you but can't be worse than DA2 can it? heh

I'd disagree. The WoW-ification of RPG combat over the past five years has been the single worst thing for RPGs to ever have occured.

Let's review:

All spells/skills are on a (short) cooldown - This leads to every RPG game in existence now to having your most powerful offensive spells spammable throughout combat. This is exactly DA2's biggest fallacy, especially with mages - unleash your nukes, then kite while waiting for a cooldown. It is really weak encounter design and it also leads to always using your most powerful skills all the time. Compare that to even a more streamlined RPG like Final Fantasy, where most of the game you use standard attacks and only use your more powerful ones during boss battles or extremely difficult fights. Using the most powerful skills at every opportunity means you use the exact same tactics, all the time, in every fight. It leads to stale combat.

class Balancing - every class has to be equally effective in combat, otherwise no one will play them in an MMO. This means that a tank must be a tank but not a tank that is any more utilitarian than the healer is in the healer role. No one class playing can be any more powerful or helpful in combat than any other one... which is silly. A warrior class should be dominant in combat. A mage class should have the potential to be much more destructive or much more beneficial through the use of buffs, but also be a limited reserve situation, where mana constraints or Vancian casting prevents the mage from unleashing hell in the form of Firestorm and have it do about as much damage as a warriors pommel strike.

Non-Combat Skills - A rogue must be able to deal the same DPS as a warrioir... otherwise, why play as a rogue? This mentality from MMOs is toxic to the RPG experience. A rogue should be able to do a number of things, such as placing traps, picking locks, using stealth skills, using sleight of hand skills, being able to detect various secret doors or similar constructs. The rogue does not need to have the exact same value in combat as the warrior - becuase there is MUCH MORE TO AN RPG THAN COMBAT. Instead, WoW focuses entirely on combat, to the exclusion of everything else. And this is detrimental to every other RPG out there, who feels they must copy this formula or be labeled as "archaic."

For what it does, WoW does have a good amount of builds, skills and options for combat. But the fact that it is solely, 100%, ENTIRELY all about making a class and build that focuses on combat and the highest DPS possible is absolutely toxic to any sort of comprehensive RPG system. Because now an entire generation of gamers has been raised on the concept that if a mage can't cast their most powerful spell every 20 seconds, then the game is boring, or that a rogue should always be on the front lines doing the highest DPS, instead of hiding in the shadows and performing a backstab maybe only once or twice a fight.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 05 avril 2013 - 11:35 .

[Heavenly69]

DA2 was good but what about FFXIII or Last Remnant

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

Heavenly69 wrote...

DA2 was good but what about FFXIII or Last Remnant

FFXIII? you are joking right?

Anyway they just just use the Origins combat.

[The Teyrn of Whatever]

I would incorporate the combat from Dragon Age: Origins. That is all.

[Knight of Dane]

Youth4Ever wrote...

Dragon's Dogma. I love the Mystic Knight.

This, but I prefer the Magick Archer!

[Darth Death]

Upon reading such threads (which are prevalent here it would seem) leaves an impression creativity & innovations are no longer wanting, but the uprise of emulation is sought & desired. O brave new world that has such people in it.

[Knight of Dane]

Darth Death wrote...

Upon reading such threads (which are prevalent here it would seem) leaves an impression creativity & innovations are no longer wanting, but the uprise of emulation is sought & desired. O brave new world that has such people in it.

No idea is ever 100% original buddy.
They might as well take their inspiration from the best example.

[Plaintiff]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

imbs wrote...

nightscrawl wrote...

I'm sure I will get dissed on this by someone, but I actually enjoy the combat in World of Warcraft. Some classes have way too many skills, but others have a nice mix of a priority rotation (keep this debuff on at all times, if this condition, then do that, etc) and situational abilities. Just because WoW is an MMO doesn't mean you can't have tremendous solo skill as well. They introduced an arena event where solo players have fights against enemies. You need to use your entire arsenal to surivive and win the fight.

n I think you have a decent idea m8. The entire attraction of wow's combat is the piano keyboard-amount of spells you have access to. It's the reason why wow's skillcap is infact higher than mmos like GW2 and can result in pretty complex combat. That is something Bioware games have been missing for a while now, and should be the staple of Bioware RPGs if you ask me.

Obviously wow has flaws mind you but can't be worse than DA2 can it? heh

I'd disagree. The WoW-ification of RPG combat over the past five years has been the single worst thing for RPGs to ever have occured.

Let's review:

All spells/skills are on a (short) cooldown - This leads to every RPG game in existence now to having your most powerful offensive spells spammable throughout combat. This is exactly DA2's biggest fallacy, especially with mages - unleash your nukes, then kite while waiting for a cooldown. It is really weak encounter design and it also leads to always using your most powerful skills all the time. Compare that to even a more streamlined RPG like Final Fantasy, where most of the game you use standard attacks and only use your more powerful ones during boss battles or extremely difficult fights. Using the most powerful skills at every opportunity means you use the exact same tactics, all the time, in every fight. It leads to stale combat.

class Balancing - every class has to be equally effective in combat, otherwise no one will play them in an MMO. This means that a tank must be a tank but not a tank that is any more utilitarian than the healer is in the healer role. No one class playing can be any more powerful or helpful in combat than any other one... which is silly. A warrior class should be dominant in combat. A mage class should have the potential to be much more destructive or much more beneficial through the use of buffs, but also be a limited reserve situation, where mana constraints or Vancian casting prevents the mage from unleashing hell in the form of Firestorm and have it do about as much damage as a warriors pommel strike.

Non-Combat Skills - A rogue must be able to deal the same DPS as a warrioir... otherwise, why play as a rogue? This mentality from MMOs is toxic to the RPG experience. A rogue should be able to do a number of things, such as placing traps, picking locks, using stealth skills, using sleight of hand skills, being able to detect various secret doors or similar constructs. The rogue does not need to have the exact same value in combat as the warrior - becuase there is MUCH MORE TO AN RPG THAN COMBAT. Instead, WoW focuses entirely on combat, to the exclusion of everything else. And this is detrimental to every other RPG out there, who feels they must copy this formula or be labeled as "archaic."

For what it does, WoW does have a good amount of builds, skills and options for combat. But the fact that it is solely, 100%, ENTIRELY all about making a class and build that focuses on combat and the highest DPS possible is absolutely toxic to any sort of comprehensive RPG system. Because now an entire generation of gamers has been raised on the concept that if a mage can't cast their most powerful spell every 20 seconds, then the game is boring, or that a rogue should always be on the front lines doing the highest DPS, instead of hiding in the shadows and performing a backstab maybe only once or twice a fight.

And why does every single iteration of the mage and rogue have to conform to your standards?

Why shouldn't every class be equally valid and useful? If someone wants to play the game without any team members, or compose a team of only one class type, and play through the entire game that way, why shouldn't it be a viable way to play?

[milena87]

Darth Death wrote...

Upon reading such threads (which are prevalent here it would seem) leaves an impression creativity & innovations are no longer wanting, but the uprise of emulation is sought & desired. O brave new world that has such people in it.

nah, I think it's just boredom in this case.
I for one would love to discuss the mechanics and themes of DAI, but we know pretty much nada, so threads like these appear.

[Darth Death]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Darth Death wrote...

Upon reading such threads (which are prevalent here it would seem) leaves an impression creativity & innovations are no longer wanting, but the uprise of emulation is sought & desired. O brave new world that has such people in it.

No idea is ever 100% original buddy.
They might as well take their inspiration from the best example.

You don't say?<_< There's a difference of being inspired versus copying; stating the obvious is boring, so I digress. 

[Nerdage]

I wouldn't, I can't really think of another game with combat I prefer to DA, and it's not like there are many other places to get my party-based RPG fix these days. Mind you, I wouldn't mind cherry-picking bits of DAO and bits of DA2 and cobbling them together.

[Topsider]

Sutekh wrote...

Topsider wrote...

Severance: Blade of Darkness.

Wow! Was about to say the exact same, complete with link because I thought nobody would know that game.

hehe, I thought the same to be honest. I have fond memories of playing Severance but most people here have probably never heard of it.

It was way ahead of its time. Even today, the combat is rarely equalled, never mind surpassed. Brutal, challenging, and fun. 

Blade of Darkness should've been a major success but poor marketing let it down badly.

[drs91]

I really enjoyed the combat from Dragons Dogma

[Straw Nihilist]

Devil may cry or mortal kombat.