274 réponses à ce sujet

[Getorex]

Sentient6 wrote...

Getorex wrote...

He's you (or she's you).  Hate yourself much?

He's also the eyes and ears and viewpoint from which ALL is presented. 

I think you're confusing ME with HL. Regardless, if you're referring to the moral choice system, it's the main reason why the charater was so bad...

Ah...OK.  That isn't the character, that's the writers.  It seemed to me that the choices grew weaker and more meaningless in ME3.  They appeared broader in ME2 and I was OK with them in ME1.  I like the IDEA of them.  I like that decision you make along the way build up and affect what you can do and what results you get later.  Maybe in an ME reboot they ought to give that a REAL shot.

[Sentient6]

Well, yeah, that's what I meant. Not that it's a "good-written character that happens to be lame", but just a "bad written character"... And the half-assed "moral" system contributed loads to that. You either went from a goody-goody doormat to a complete and irrational ****. Or some bizarre bi-polar mix of the two. And like you said, you choices didn't even mean much in the end.

[spirosz]

Nightwriter wrote...

Does one need to let go of something that was torn from them? Shepard was kind of yanked out of my hands. Or at least, it felt that way to me.

I guess if there is no way of getting it back, sure. 

[Nightwriter]

spirosz wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Does one need to let go of something that was torn from them? Shepard was kind of yanked out of my hands. Or at least, it felt that way to me.

I guess if there is no way of getting it back, sure. 

That's going to be different for everyone. My own Shepard's story is kind of stuck in limbo in my head and hasn't returned.

[spirosz]

My Shep was lost as well, but I don't feel like putting in the effort of changing how I RP my Shepard to fit how Bioware wants me to RP Shepard, if you get what I mean.

[Nightwriter]

Yeah I get you. I hit the same roadblock and haven't gone back to ME3 since, except to have fun with the Citadel DLC.

[Peranor]

Nightwriter wrote...

Does one need to let go of something that was torn from them? Shepard was kind of yanked out of my hands. Or at least, it felt that way to me.

I don't think you're alone in feeling that way. Bioware didn't do a very good job in giving Shepard a proper sendoff. It's just abrupt and whimsical.

[Spartas Husky]

tickle267 wrote...

anorling wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Does one need to let go of something that was torn from them? Shepard was kind of yanked out of my hands. Or at least, it felt that way to me.

I don't think you're alone in feeling that way. Bioware didn't do a very good job in giving Shepard a proper sendoff. It's just abrupt and whimsical.

when i finished the ending i said this 

shepard recieved no closure, but atleast it allowed fanfic and headcanon to go crazy.

LOL omg I am saving that one.

[chemiclord]

Can't yank something out of your hands that was never IN your hands to begin with, man.

[mtmercydave09]

chemiclord wrote...

Can't yank something out of your hands that was never IN your hands to begin with, man.

In the literal sense, of course it was never in our hands since Bioware owns it.

However, in the figurative and RPG sense, it was in our hands since we felt like we were Shepard.  After all, what's the point in making any RPG at all if there is no sense of feeling like the story is in your hands seeing as how we are roleplaying as the main character?

[chemiclord]

mtmercydave09 wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

Can't yank something out of your hands that was never IN your hands to begin with, man.

In the literal sense, of course it was never in our hands since Bioware owns it.

However, in the figurative and RPG sense, it was in our hands since we felt like we were Shepard.  After all, what's the point in making any RPG at all if there is no sense of feeling like the story is in your hands seeing as how we are roleplaying as the main character?

That's the point.

Even in the figurative sense, "our Shepard" falls flat.  You didn't "roleplay" anything.  You read from a script.  Every choice you thought you made had been written and composed by someone else without ANY consulation from you.  The game didn't care about your headcanon; it impacted less than jack **** on the game, and that was true in ME1, ME2, and ME3.

100% them, 0% you, both legally and figuratively.  The sooner fans accept that truth, the easier it will be to let go and move on.

[robertthebard]

chemiclord wrote...

mtmercydave09 wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

Can't yank something out of your hands that was never IN your hands to begin with, man.

In the literal sense, of course it was never in our hands since Bioware owns it.

However, in the figurative and RPG sense, it was in our hands since we felt like we were Shepard.  After all, what's the point in making any RPG at all if there is no sense of feeling like the story is in your hands seeing as how we are roleplaying as the main character?

That's the point.

Even in the figurative sense, "our Shepard" falls flat.  You didn't "roleplay" anything.  You read from a script.  Every choice you thought you made had been written and composed by someone else without ANY consulation from you.  The game didn't care about your headcanon; it impacted less than jack **** on the game, and that was true in ME1, ME2, and ME3.

100% them, 0% you, both legally and figuratively.  The sooner fans accept that truth, the easier it will be to let go and move on.

This is true no matter what game you're playing.  *Handwavey gestures*

We are now back in the day when Baldur's Gate was new:  No matter what you do on the way, you are going to have the final conflict with Sarevok.  *handwavey gestures*

We are now back in the day when BG 2 was new, and no matter when Khalid may have permanently died in your game, he's going to die in Irenicus' dungeon, and Jahiera is going to be an LI. */handwavey gestures*

No matter what you do, all games lead to the final conflict, whether that's Baldur's Gate et al, Icewind Dale et al, NWN's campaigns, etc etc.  No matter who you may have killed off on the way, characters are there if they are written to be, such as the Khalid reference above.  All because of that pesky plot thing.  Now my ME 3 games end in London, because I can't stomach one more DeM, the Lazarus DeM was enough, the journey to that point is littered with rewards and consequences for things I did or didn't do in the previous games.  Some don't have the impact that I figured they might, but some impact whether or not certain quests are even available:  If Miranda dies in ME 2, she won't show up in ME 3, and the same is true for all of those squadmates.  So, while in the end, it may feel like it was all for naught, the rest of the game actually does tell the story I "wrote" on the way.

[mtmercydave09]

chemiclord wrote...

mtmercydave09 wrote...

chemiclord wrote...

Can't yank something out of your hands that was never IN your hands to begin with, man.

In the literal sense, of course it was never in our hands since Bioware owns it.

However, in the figurative and RPG sense, it was in our hands since we felt like we were Shepard.  After all, what's the point in making any RPG at all if there is no sense of feeling like the story is in your hands seeing as how we are roleplaying as the main character?

That's the point.

Even in the figurative sense, "our Shepard" falls flat.  You didn't "roleplay" anything.  You read from a script.  Every choice you thought you made had been written and composed by someone else without ANY consulation from you.  The game didn't care about your headcanon; it impacted less than jack **** on the game, and that was true in ME1, ME2, and ME3.

100% them, 0% you, both legally and figuratively.  The sooner fans accept that truth, the easier it will be to let go and move on.

Easier said than done after spending 100+ hours with 3 games throughout 5 years.  

You read from a script in every game, that doesn't mean the people that are playing shouldn't feel as if they are roleplaying the character.  If that's the case, why make RPG games at all then?  If there was no script, you can bet people would be complaining that there's no plot.

You really think people are thinking to themselves when they are playing Shepard, "Oh, Bioware owns this, I don't own it, so I really shouldn't care or get emotionally involved about anything that happens in this game."  No they are not, they are busy imagining themselves in the role as Shepard.

Thing is, you did roleplay some things in ME whether you think that's true or not.  You roleplayed whether you wanted to be Paragon or Renegade, you choose who gets to live and who gets to die, etc.  While yes that was within the confines of the broader script, you still roleplayed those decisions.  To say that you as a gamer didn't have a hand in anything Shepard did, is not true at all.

Modifié par mtmercydave09, 11 avril 2013 - 11:48 .

[Gkonone]

Getorex wrote...

anorling noted that he easily let go of Shepard. Sure, I can too but not in any game called Mass Effect. Shepard (and the main crew, Ash, Liara, Tali, Garrus, Wrex) DEFINES Mass Effect. Individually and together they are the heart and soul of Mass Effect. So, yeah, outside of anything called "Mass Effect" I can let go of Shepard but to me anything labeled "Mass Effect" that lacks these characters isn't really Mass Effect. It is something else, a copycat.
...

You made a lot of good comments in this thread but this one I wanted to quote mostly.
I agree completely.
Shepard and his/her crew are the foundation of Mass Effect in the first place, imho. Shepard's story is told they say, why really? Lots of stories left.
There is so much more you can do if you look at things as further character development, crew interaction and expanding of the galaxy, just to name a few.

Why kill off the protagonist that has been so succesful for the series?

I think the letting go will come eventually. Gonna play 2 and 3 one final turn and see what happens then.
If it doesn't happen over time it will happen when the next ME game arrives. I can't see myself playing it without the old crew.
It's a damn shame though.

Modifié par Gkonone, 12 avril 2013 - 12:00 .

[chemiclord]

mtmercydave09 wrote...

Easier said than done after spending 100+ hours with 3 games throughout 5 years.  

You read from a script in every game, that doesn't mean the people that are playing shouldn't feel as if they are roleplaying the character.  If that's the case, why make RPG games at all then?

You really think people are thinking to themselves when they are playing Shepard, "Oh, Bioware owns this, I don't own it, so I really shouldn't care or get emotionally involved about anything that happens in this game."  No they are not, they are busy imagining themselves in the role as Shepard.

No, you really SHOULDN'T feel like you're roleplaying the character... because you AREN'T.  That is entirely the point I'm trying to get you to see.

YOU aren't speaking with Shepard as your avatar.  You don't speak to the game, and the game doesn't form around the actions of the character you're playing.  THAT stuff was already done, composed, and put together BY SOMEONE ELSE before you ever put that disc (or finished the download) in your system or console.  It simply did not involve you outside of a very tangential way as conglomerate of millions of other fans who provided input that meant just as much individually as yours did.

It's fine to imagine, I suppose, but you need to accept that your imagination means nothing to anyone not you... and that the game is under NO obligation to cater to that imagination... if for no reason than the fact the game CAN'T.  It's a fundamental flaw of computer RPG's (a term that means next to nothing at this point in regards to computer games ANYWAY).  They can emulate the RPG experience... kinda... but it's a pale facsimile even when done well.

Listen, I am not some ME3 defender here that thinks you should love the game as is.  It's perfectly all right to hate what you were given.  I certainly am not fond of how it ended either.  But my opinion?  Means next to jack ****, and I know that.  It was never mine, and I also knew that.  Stupid way to end the story (and frankly the shotgun approach they took to writing the narrative as a whole was a disaster waiting to happen), but meh... it was their story to tell.  Not mine.  Theirs.

And I'm sure at this point, that advice doesn't help.  You got sucked into the illusion, and it probably feels like I'm doing nothing other than "I told you so."  But it's something to keep in mind the next time a computer "RPG" hooks you.  

For example, I can GUARANTEE you that the Witcher 3 is going to ****** off a sizable group of people, and for much the same reason; because it will go in a direction that those fans feel it should not have gone.  I doubt it will be nearly as bad as what happened with ME3 (obviously), but you are GOING to see the same sort of phenomenon.

[robertthebard]

Gkonone wrote...

Getorex wrote...

anorling noted that he easily let go of Shepard. Sure, I can too but not in any game called Mass Effect. Shepard (and the main crew, Ash, Liara, Tali, Garrus, Wrex) DEFINES Mass Effect. Individually and together they are the heart and soul of Mass Effect. So, yeah, outside of anything called "Mass Effect" I can let go of Shepard but to me anything labeled "Mass Effect" that lacks these characters isn't really Mass Effect. It is something else, a copycat.
...

You made a lot of good comments in this thread but this one I wanted to quote mostly.
I agree completely.
Shepard and his/her crew are the foundation of Mass Effect in the first place, imho. Shepard's story is told they say, why really? Lots of stories left.
There is so much more you can do if you look at things as further character development, crew interaction and expanding of the galaxy, just to name a few.

Why kill off the protagonist that has been so succesful for the series?

I think the letting go will come eventually. Gonna play 2 and 3 one final turn and see what happens then.
If it doesn't happen over time it will happen when the next ME game arrives. I can't see myself playing it without the old crew.
It's a damn shame though.

My basement is the foundation of my house, should I just keep adding rooms to it, instead of building the rest of my house?  What is it that Shepard's going to do next?  Are we going to handwave that there are more Reapers that need killed/controlled/synthesized?  Nothing that we could have thrown at us would be any where near as threatening, to Shepard.  Let's not leave out the fact that, in 2 of 3 actual endings, there is no Shepard to carry forward, and in Refusal, there is no galactic civilization.  I'm not interested in headcanon, or MEHEM, the actual endings are canon, no matter how messed they are.  The only purpose served by continuing Shepard is fanservice, and frankly, they're not doing me any favors, my canon Shepards are all dead.  They die on the way to the beam in London.

[mtmercydave09]

chemiclord wrote...

mtmercydave09 wrote...

Easier said than done after spending 100+ hours with 3 games throughout 5 years.  

You read from a script in every game, that doesn't mean the people that are playing shouldn't feel as if they are roleplaying the character.  If that's the case, why make RPG games at all then?

You really think people are thinking to themselves when they are playing Shepard, "Oh, Bioware owns this, I don't own it, so I really shouldn't care or get emotionally involved about anything that happens in this game."  No they are not, they are busy imagining themselves in the role as Shepard.

No, you really SHOULDN'T feel like you're roleplaying the character... because you AREN'T.  That is entirely the point I'm trying to get you to see.

YOU aren't speaking with Shepard as your avatar.  You don't speak to the game, and the game doesn't form around the actions of the character you're playing.  THAT stuff was already done, composed, and put together BY SOMEONE ELSE before you ever put that disc (or finished the download) in your system or console.  It simply did not involve you outside of a very tangential way as conglomerate of millions of other fans who provided input that meant just as much individually as yours did.

It's fine to imagine, I suppose, but you need to accept that your imagination means nothing to anyone not you... and that the game is under NO obligation to cater to that imagination... if for no reason than the fact the game CAN'T.  It's a fundamental flaw of computer RPG's (a term that means next to nothing at this point in regards to computer games ANYWAY).  They can emulate the RPG experience... kinda... but it's a pale facsimile even when done well.

Listen, I am not some ME3 defender here that thinks you should love the game as is.  It's perfectly all right to hate what you were given.  I certainly am not fond of how it ended either.  But my opinion?  Means next to jack ****, and I know that.  It was never mine, and I also knew that.  Stupid way to end the story (and frankly the shotgun approach they took to writing the narrative as a whole was a disaster waiting to happen), but meh... it was their story to tell.  Not mine.  Theirs.

And I'm sure at this point, that advice doesn't help.  You got sucked into the illusion, and it probably feels like I'm doing nothing other than "I told you so."  But it's something to keep in mind the next time a computer "RPG" hooks you.  

For example, I can GUARANTEE you that the Witcher 3 is going to ****** off a sizable group of people, and for much the same reason; because it will go in a direction that those fans feel it should not have gone.  I doubt it will be nearly as bad as what happened with ME3 (obviously), but you are GOING to see the same sort of phenomenon.

Then why play a roleplaying game at all, if the person playing shouldn't feel like they are roleplaying the character?  See what I'm getting at?  I'm not sure why you are trying to dictate what people SHOULD and SHOULDN'T feel?

Right, I get that Bioware wrote it, but YOU still choose to be paragon or renegade, YOU choose whether to save Ash or Kaiden on Virmire.  Sure Bioware are the ones who presented those choices to you, but YOU are still the one who made the decision based on that choice, therefore YOU chose that role.  That is what roleplaying is.  It is roleplaying within the confines of the greater plot, but it's still roleplaying nonetheless.

Good luck trying to save the galaxy while being yourself.  That is why they call it a game.  You're taking this all too literally.   Of course you don't speak for Shepard, but you can say that about EVERY SINGLE RPG GAME out there unless you personally write it yourself.  

That is the whole point of roleplaying, being someone you are not.

I hated the ending as well so I'm not defending the game, obviously since as my sig says I use MEHEM.  I'm just saying that when people give 100+ hours to 3 games, of course they are going to feel some emotional attachment to the characters.  Heck if Bioware didn't achieve that there probably wouldn't have been 3 games to begin with.

Good luck getting people to just drop everything and drop all their feelings by telling them that it's not roleplaying, that they were never Shepard, and that Bioware owns it so they should have no feelings towards ME whatsoever at all.  

Having to feel like you have to let go of Shepard, is actually a good thing for ME, not a bad thing.  It means Bioware did one thing right, they actually made the fans CARE.

Modifié par mtmercydave09, 12 avril 2013 - 12:20 .

[Repzik]

chemiclord wrote...

No, you really SHOULDN'T feel like you're roleplaying the character... because you AREN'T.  That is entirely the point I'm trying to get you to see.

YOU aren't speaking with Shepard as your avatar.  You don't speak to the game, and the game doesn't form around the actions of the character you're playing.  THAT stuff was already done, composed, and put together BY SOMEONE ELSE before you ever put that disc (or finished the download) in your system or console.  It simply did not involve you outside of a very tangential way as conglomerate of millions of other fans who provided input that meant just as much individually as yours did.

It's fine to imagine, I suppose, but you need to accept that your imagination means nothing to anyone not you... and that the game is under NO obligation to cater to that imagination... if for no reason than the fact the game CAN'T.  It's a fundamental flaw of computer RPG's (a term that means next to nothing at this point in regards to computer games ANYWAY).  They can emulate the RPG experience... kinda... but it's a pale facsimile even when done well.

So because there aren't unlimited options to roleplay as, it's not roleplay? That's nonsense. It may not be "true" role play, but good role play always has constraints. If you DnD, you can't just tell the DM that you are now Thor and everyone dies in front of you. There are rules and constraints to every form of role play, otherwise it wouldn't be feasible to tell a coherent story. Computer RPGs simply have more constraints on the direct plot, because it's simply not feasible to make a thousand branching paths and dialogue you can directly input.

As to your claim that we have no input; we really do. All art is collaborative, how each individual percieves it is determined both on the creator and what he creates, and how we interpret it. The creator undoubtedly contributes more, but saying that subjective experiences are meaningless and wrong doesn't really make any sense. It's like saying that someone is wrong when they have different tastes; it's purely subjective and different from person to person.

Getorex wrote...

Babs
5.  THE model that Bioware should have used for ME.  Babs did it really
well.  The Shadows big plot was developed over 4 seasons with a lot of
other stories and characters fleshing out the Bablylon 5 universe and
society.  The Shadows (Reapers) didn't consume the entire plot every
week but it was the backbone within the overall story.  That could have
been ME.  They could have easily gotten 6 or more games out of it, all
of them interesting and all of them adding something new and richer to
the overarching story of Shepard and the Reapers.  Babylon 5 wouldn't
have worked if they had rushed through the Shadow war and resolution in
one season and then went back and tried to fill in around the already
dead plot with more stories. 

This is actually why I think an ME
reboot is in order in the future (not now, not next year, not in 2
years...but someday) so the entire thing could be replotted, replanned,
and redone with LOTS more content and flesh.

Mass Effect would probably have worked off better if it had followed a similar model to Babylon 5, but (Babylon 5 spoiler) I doubt telling the Reapers to leave would work as well as it did for B5.

I'd really love a reboot sometime in the future, but that'd be a long way off. It'd have to be different writers than Bioware's current staff; preferably writers who are named things like "Avellone" or "Sawyer."

Modifié par Repzik, 12 avril 2013 - 09:03 .

[Gkonone]

robertthebard wrote...

Gkonone wrote...

Getorex wrote...

anorling noted that he easily let go of Shepard. Sure, I can too but not in any game called Mass Effect. Shepard (and the main crew, Ash, Liara, Tali, Garrus, Wrex) DEFINES Mass Effect. Individually and together they are the heart and soul of Mass Effect. So, yeah, outside of anything called "Mass Effect" I can let go of Shepard but to me anything labeled "Mass Effect" that lacks these characters isn't really Mass Effect. It is something else, a copycat.
...

You made a lot of good comments in this thread but this one I wanted to quote mostly.
I agree completely.
Shepard and his/her crew are the foundation of Mass Effect in the first place, imho. Shepard's story is told they say, why really? Lots of stories left.
There is so much more you can do if you look at things as further character development, crew interaction and expanding of the galaxy, just to name a few.

Why kill off the protagonist that has been so succesful for the series?

I think the letting go will come eventually. Gonna play 2 and 3 one final turn and see what happens then.
If it doesn't happen over time it will happen when the next ME game arrives. I can't see myself playing it without the old crew.
It's a damn shame though.

My basement is the foundation of my house, should I just keep adding rooms to it, instead of building the rest of my house?  What is it that Shepard's going to do next?  Are we going to handwave that there are more Reapers that need killed/controlled/synthesized?  Nothing that we could have thrown at us would be any where near as threatening, to Shepard.  Let's not leave out the fact that, in 2 of 3 actual endings, there is no Shepard to carry forward, and in Refusal, there is no galactic civilization.  I'm not interested in headcanon, or MEHEM, the actual endings are canon, no matter how messed they are.  The only purpose served by continuing Shepard is fanservice, and frankly, they're not doing me any favors, my canon Shepards are all dead.  They die on the way to the beam in London.

The way I see it, following your house analogy, why build a new house when you have a perfectly fine house to continue with? I see ME4 as a new house, maybe we differ on that.
What Shepard is gonna do next is as good a question as asking what the new protagonist is gonna do really.
Is he or she gonna fight some evil new thing, well that thing isn't the Reapers, and if it is, might as well be Shepard then.
Whatever new antagonist BW comes up with will either be worse than the Reapers, perhaps a prequel, or it will be even a bigger threat. If the latter is the case, I don't see why they shouldn't continue with Shepard.
If it's not a big a threat as the Reapers I wonder if it's interesting at all. But that's a matter of opinion I guess.

I can understand your being fine with the ending as it is, I wouldn't mind a retcon really. To get Shepard back.

Modifié par Gkonone, 12 avril 2013 - 10:50 .

[robertthebard]

Gkonone wrote...

The way I see it, following your house analogy, why build a new house when you have a perfectly fine house to continue with? I see ME4 as a new house, maybe we differ on that.
What Shepard is gonna do next is as good a question as asking what the new protagonist is gonna do really.
Is he or she gonna fight some evil new thing, well that thing isn't the Reapers, and if it is, might as well be Shepard then.
Whatever new antagonist BW comes up with will either be worse than the Reapers, perhaps a prequel, or it will be even a bigger threat. If the latter is the case, I don't see why they shouldn't continue with Shepard.
If it's not a big a threat as the Reapers I wonder if it's interesting at all. But that's a matter of opinion I guess.

I can understand your being fine with the ending as it is, I wouldn't mind a retcon really. To get Shepard back.

Because this house is done.  I have a family, and we have outgrown it, and need a new one?  If I got married tomorrow, I'd have to move, because if she has any kids, this house is too small.  To me it just seems a shame to have such a fully realized universe, and it only has one person of note in it.  At least, one person of note that's worth building a game around.  I have no idea what BioWare can, or might do in it, but what I do know is that, over the years, BioWare has managed to keep me quite engaged in their games, and I didn't need to stick with Baldur's Gate, or NWN's, or Origins.  Granted that the attraction that kept me playing 5 years of NWN's was the toolset and online modules.  I have no doubt they can find a way to engage me in this universe again, unless they do it in an MMO.  I have enough of those to play right now.

[Gkonone]

robertthebard wrote...

Gkonone wrote...

The way I see it, following your house analogy, why build a new house when you have a perfectly fine house to continue with? I see ME4 as a new house, maybe we differ on that.
What Shepard is gonna do next is as good a question as asking what the new protagonist is gonna do really.
Is he or she gonna fight some evil new thing, well that thing isn't the Reapers, and if it is, might as well be Shepard then.
Whatever new antagonist BW comes up with will either be worse than the Reapers, perhaps a prequel, or it will be even a bigger threat. If the latter is the case, I don't see why they shouldn't continue with Shepard.
If it's not a big a threat as the Reapers I wonder if it's interesting at all. But that's a matter of opinion I guess.

I can understand your being fine with the ending as it is, I wouldn't mind a retcon really. To get Shepard back.

Because this house is done.  I have a family, and we have outgrown it, and need a new one?  If I got married tomorrow, I'd have to move, because if she has any kids, this house is too small.  To me it just seems a shame to have such a fully realized universe, and it only has one person of note in it.  At least, one person of note that's worth building a game around.  I have no idea what BioWare can, or might do in it, but what I do know is that, over the years, BioWare has managed to keep me quite engaged in their games, and I didn't need to stick with Baldur's Gate, or NWN's, or Origins.  Granted that the attraction that kept me playing 5 years of NWN's was the toolset and online modules.  I have no doubt they can find a way to engage me in this universe again, unless they do it in an MMO.  I have enough of those to play right now.

What's wrong with building a series around a person of note though? Happens quite a bit in other games and movies/series.
And it's not just Shepard, it's also the crew, the relationships you've build up over the course of three games and possibly more.
It's not as if you can't expand the universe more with that character in it. 

I wonder though, what is the magic number here really? Shoud all stories be told in trilogies? What do you think, can't stories be more than 3 chapters?

And what will that new protagonist be facing that will be on par with what Shepard had to deal with?
Or maybe you're just tired of Shepard or want a new protagonist, that's fine though.

[robertthebard]

Gkonone wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Gkonone wrote...

The way I see it, following your house analogy, why build a new house when you have a perfectly fine house to continue with? I see ME4 as a new house, maybe we differ on that.
What Shepard is gonna do next is as good a question as asking what the new protagonist is gonna do really.
Is he or she gonna fight some evil new thing, well that thing isn't the Reapers, and if it is, might as well be Shepard then.
Whatever new antagonist BW comes up with will either be worse than the Reapers, perhaps a prequel, or it will be even a bigger threat. If the latter is the case, I don't see why they shouldn't continue with Shepard.
If it's not a big a threat as the Reapers I wonder if it's interesting at all. But that's a matter of opinion I guess.

I can understand your being fine with the ending as it is, I wouldn't mind a retcon really. To get Shepard back.

Because this house is done.  I have a family, and we have outgrown it, and need a new one?  If I got married tomorrow, I'd have to move, because if she has any kids, this house is too small.  To me it just seems a shame to have such a fully realized universe, and it only has one person of note in it.  At least, one person of note that's worth building a game around.  I have no idea what BioWare can, or might do in it, but what I do know is that, over the years, BioWare has managed to keep me quite engaged in their games, and I didn't need to stick with Baldur's Gate, or NWN's, or Origins.  Granted that the attraction that kept me playing 5 years of NWN's was the toolset and online modules.  I have no doubt they can find a way to engage me in this universe again, unless they do it in an MMO.  I have enough of those to play right now.

What's wrong with building a series around a person of note though? Happens quite a bit in other games and movies/series.
And it's not just Shepard, it's also the crew, the relationships you've build up over the course of three games and possibly more.
It's not as if you can't expand the universe more with that character in it. 

I wonder though, what is the magic number here really? Shoud all stories be told in trilogies? What do you think, can't stories be more than 3 chapters?

And what will that new protagonist be facing that will be on par with what Shepard had to deal with?
Or maybe you're just tired of Shepard or want a new protagonist, that's fine though.

I have saves running in all three games right now.  So I'm not tired of Shepard.  However, since this arc was Shepard's arc, and it's completed, I am not averse to new stuff.  I am averse to messing up my canon, or somebody else's canon, for the sake of more Shepard.  If they had rolled the credits at the beam in London I would have been ecstatic with how the game ended up.  I sincerely believe that would have been epic.

I have no idea what they can/will do next.  Shepard is going to be a hard act to follow, but as I said, they have managed to engage me in the past, and barring an MMO, they can engage me again, unless they go more shooter than RPG.  I don't do MP because I suck at twitch gaming, so a pure shooter wouldn't be that appealing to me.

[Nykara]

I know I will never be letting go of Shepard and a small part of me will never stop hoping for that one more Shep ME story with all the characters we know and love.

[Iakus]

@ mtmercydav09 and Repzik

::Applause:: You humans understand!


Honestly, I'm fine with letting Shepard go and moving on to a new protagonist.  Even before the endings.  The Reapers were Shepard's story, and I'm sure there's plenty of other stories to be told in the ME universe.  I say let this hero take a well deserved rest.

After the endings, I'm even more fine with some other character taking over.  To use the house analogy, after these endings, playing Shepard again would be like moving back into a house after a murder has taken place in it.  It really wouldn't be the same anymore.  Even if you redecorated.  Better to move to a new house.

Actually a new house might not even be enough.  New neighborhood might be needed.  That's not so good for the ME universe...

Modifié par iakus, 12 avril 2013 - 11:34 .