237 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr. Versipellis]

I ahve unlocked the blood magic specialiation in another (evil) playthrough, and I can easily imagine my guy doing it, only to obtain more arcane knowledge and enhance his potential. However, he's a bit Chaotic Neutral. Is blood magic itself evil? As I see it, it's just sacrificing your own blood to fuel the Wardens' cause. Are there any reprocussions? And is it just plain evil?

[Bhatair]

It depends on what you use it for, obviously

[Sloth Of Doom]

The chantry will tel you it is.



A blood mage might tell you otherwise.





This isn;t D&D, things are not back and white. Nothing is inherently good or evil, it is the purposes to which it is put that defines something.

[Herr Uhl]

I say sporks be evil.



It is not inheritly evil, but it's taking a risk and is illegal.

[AngryFrozenWater]

Nobody will notice that you are using it. So don't worry about the being evil part.

[Mr. Versipellis]

Herr Uhl wrote...

I say sporks be evil.

It is not inheritly evil, but it's taking a risk and is illegal.

Like I said, chaotic neutral
Although of course the game is deeper than DnD's sword-and-sorcery morality.

[empetus]

In the game world I would say it is considered evil, its outlawed and forbidden and they are put to death if found out.



I thought Jowan, a blood mage involved in the Earl's quest, was one of the most interesting characters in the game.

[ZeroR3D]

*cough* socially unacceptable not evil *cough*

[Frozeal]

Sometime ago I read an interesting post speaking about how narrow-minded some people were by thinking straight forward that blood magic should be avoided, and he put an example about self-sacrifice for the others... think of a Spirit Healer sacrificing his own blood to heal his companions.

Blood magic is what it is, moral absolutes are a theological lie.

[Sylvius the Mad]

empetus wrote...

In the game world I would say it is considered evil, its outlawed and forbidden and they are put to death if found out.

That it is considered evil isn't in dispute.  The question is whether blood magic is actually evil.

I don't really see how any tool could be considered evil in and of itself.  It's all in what you do with it, which means it would be the actions that were evil - not the blood magic.

[Metalunatic]

I don't think it is. The Chantry does, but everyone knows they are a bunch of self-righteous zealots.

[Frozeal]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

empetus wrote...

In the game world I would say it is considered evil, its outlawed and forbidden and they are put to death if found out.

That it is considered evil isn't in dispute.  The question is whether blood magic is actually evil.

I don't really see how any tool could be considered evil in and of itself.  It's all in what you do with it, which means it would be the actions that were evil - not the blood magic.

I'd like to add that it's not essentially the actions, but the intention behind the actions... just to be more subtle

[Apophis2412]

Blood Magic is considered evil, because:



A. It can open teirs in the Veil and allow demons through.

B. It can control people's minds.



Yet any mage can be possessed by a demon and charismatic leaders can also, in a way, control minds. So if blood magic is evil, than mages and all great leaders are also evil.

[Magus_42]

I know there's a temptation to talk about an ethical grey area here, but it's really hard for me to find a justification for mind control, and that seems to be the signature ability of a blood mage. The thing that everyone brings up as soon as blood magic is mentioned. I'm sure there are specific situations where such a thing is justified, but I suspect it would be a rare individual indeed who could resisting tapping into such power only in appropriate circumstances. I'm hardly a fan of the chantry, but I can certainly understand why they would forbid such power.

[Frozeal]

Magus_42 wrote...

I know there's a temptation to talk about an ethical grey area here, but it's really hard for me to find a justification for mind control, and that seems to be the signature ability of a blood mage. The thing that everyone brings up as soon as blood magic is mentioned. I'm sure there are specific situations where such a thing is justified, but I suspect it would be a rare individual indeed who could resisting tapping into such power only in appropriate circumstances. I'm hardly a fan of the chantry, but I can certainly understand why they would forbid such power.

Being a blood mage doesn't mean that you always have to control minds. Think of it, primal magic, you can control weather and make tempest... but you are not breaking havoc on the farmlands.
Entrophy, you have Life Drain which is pretty terrible you know? You can provoke terrible nightmares on the others...
There are more ways of controlling the others actions, not only by direct intervention like blood magic (whose philosophy I like a lot about the understanding of the correlation between mind and body)

[KatzBlackblade]

One thing is that you have to consort with demons to gain Blood Magic. That makes it definitively evil...

Now that doesn't mean you can't use evil powers for good. Look at Ghost Rider...

[Sloth Of Doom]

KatzBlackblade wrote...

One thing is that you have to consort with demons to gain Blood Magic. That makes it definitively evil...
Now that doesn't mean you can't use evil powers for good. Look at Ghost Rider...

Nowhere does it say you have to consort with demons to learn blood magic.  Do you think (spoiler) was in any position to talk to a demon when he was locked up for years in the mages tower?

[FTA Talisman]

"Magic is meant to serve man and not to rule over him" As quoted from Andraste and thus the Chantry. Though this is correct, Blood Magic is only a means. It's not evil itself but it could possibly lead to evil and thus is why the Chantry deems it as unholy. Though really I do not consider it evil no more then I would consider a particular sword evil, it's just a tool and only the one who wields it can be evil or not.



It can tear open the veil which lures demons and it can control peoples minds, but again this would only happen if the Mage intended to do it or upon accident. The ancient Magisters of the Tevinter Imperium were evil and because they used Blood Magic to enhance their own powers and thus control those "beneath" them, they are the reason the Chantry is against it so much.

In terms of Grey Wardens, they may use any means necessary to achieve their goal of defeating darkspawn and there have been many cases of Blood Magic in the Wardens, Avernus being one example.

[Mr. Versipellis]

FTA Talisman wrote...

"Magic is meant to serve man and not to rule over him" As quoted from Andraste and thus the Chantry. Though this is correct, Blood Magic is only a means. It's not evil itself but it could possibly lead to evil and thus is why the Chantry deems it as unholy. Though really I do not consider it evil no more then I would consider a particular sword evil, it's just a tool and only the one who wields it can be evil or not.

It can tear open the veil which lures demons and it can control peoples minds, but again this would only happen if the Mage intended to do it or upon accident. The ancient Magisters of the Tevinter Imperium were evil and because they used Blood Magic to enhance their own powers and thus control those "beneath" them, they are the reason the Chantry is against it so much.
In terms of Grey Wardens, they may use any means necessary to achieve their goal of defeating darkspawn and there have been many cases of Blood Magic in the Wardens, Avernus being one example.

Thanks

[whiteraider]

It also can be powered by the blood or others, willingly or not! There is a good example of the former in game!



What I find interesting is the use of any means to achieve good by the wardens and the Templar zealots perpetuating evil as the greater good!

[StrikeSaber47]

Mr. Versipellis wrote...

FTA Talisman wrote...

"Magic is meant to serve man and not to rule over him" As quoted from Andraste and thus the Chantry. Though this is correct, Blood Magic is only a means. It's not evil itself but it could possibly lead to evil and thus is why the Chantry deems it as unholy. Though really I do not consider it evil no more then I would consider a particular sword evil, it's just a tool and only the one who wields it can be evil or not.

It can tear open the veil which lures demons and it can control peoples minds, but again this would only happen if the Mage intended to do it or upon accident. The ancient Magisters of the Tevinter Imperium were evil and because they used Blood Magic to enhance their own powers and thus control those "beneath" them, they are the reason the Chantry is against it so much.
In terms of Grey Wardens, they may use any means necessary to achieve their goal of defeating darkspawn and there have been many cases of Blood Magic in the Wardens, Avernus being one example.

Thanks

You can think of Blood Mage the equivalent to Necromancy in other dark fantasy RPG's (like Morrowind and Oblivion).

[Atranes]

Too much of any magic can open tears in the Veil. If you read one of the codex entries on Par Vollen, you'll learn that the Veil was torn by a major battle between the Qunari with their cannons (I want a cannon more than a ballista) and Circle mages with their fire and lightning. Since they were Circle mages, we know they weren't using Blood Magic.



I doubt the Chantry would be too freaked out by Blood Magic if not for Blood Control (see previously cited magic is not to rule over man). The other abilities are much less disturbing than animate dead, which takes a Fade spirit and puts it in a corpse under the caster's control.

[Frozeal]

FTA Talisman wrote...

"Magic is meant to serve man and not to rule over him" As quoted from Andraste and thus the Chantry. Though this is correct, Blood Magic is only a means. It's not evil itself but it could possibly lead to evil and thus is why the Chantry deems it as unholy. Though really I do not consider it evil no more then I would consider a particular sword evil, it's just a tool and only the one who wields it can be evil or not.

It can tear open the veil which lures demons and it can control peoples minds, but again this would only happen if the Mage intended to do it or upon accident. The ancient Magisters of the Tevinter Imperium were evil and because they used Blood Magic to enhance their own powers and thus control those "beneath" them, they are the reason the Chantry is against it so much.
In terms of Grey Wardens, they may use any means necessary to achieve their goal of defeating darkspawn and there have been many cases of Blood Magic in the Wardens, Avernus being one example.

The chantry is one of the most evil organizations that exists in Ferelden, I mean they are pure social control, not any diferent from religion in our times, it institution mess with weak people's conciousness. I agree with most of the things that Morrigan says.
Also, Gray Wardens don't have a philosophy of the end justify the means, for example they are supposed to be politically neutral (although as you can see in Warden's Peek it hasn't be that way, also *spoiler* it's obvious that Duncan was also interested in messing up in politics *end spoilers*
Blood magic is just that, primal magic can do more instant harm than blood magic... tempest of the century to the ships that are carrying medicine, blizzard to the crops... just think of it.

[Sloth Of Doom]

StrikeSaber47 wrote...
You can think of Blood Mage the equivalent to Necromancy in other dark fantasy RPG's (like Morrowind and Oblivion).

Grrrm..nahhhh.   I can't agree with that.  Necromancy involves the dessecration of corpses which in every human civilization is considered just plain wrong.   You can say "I summoned forth these zombies t defeat the bad guy" but somene is going to say "Dude, that one up front is my dead mother".

Blood magic is simply using blood to fuel magic, you can choose not to control minds (usually considered to be uncool) or sumon demons or whatever and nobd can come and pint to something you hav done and scream "Dude...EVIL"

[The Archdemon]

Blood magic is not evil. It is actually really good. I encourage the use of blood magic 100%. In fact, if you summon a demon and tell them I sent you, they will give you a 10% discount on lessons*







*Offer expires 'this holiday season', not valid with any other offer.