Ce sujet est ferméIf your a troll then ya made me laugh if your not a troll ya made me laugh ether way ya made me laugh.SKRemaks wrote...
Forgive them for what?
As far as I'm concerned, they did absolutely nothing wrong.
ME3 was amazing. The fact that some of you can't see that is just sad.
It's like you go out looking for things to be offended by.
"This person said this totally innocuous thing that I have decided is worthy of outrage!" /rage
I will never understand that mentality.
Keep making your games, BioWare. I'll keep buying them.
Those of you who have forgiven Bioware for Mass Effect 3, why?
Débuté par
mahler5
, avril 12 2013 08:59
#176
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:16
iggy4566
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Retour en haut
#177
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:20
KotorEffect3
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SKRemaks wrote...
Forgive them for what?
As far as I'm concerned, they did absolutely nothing wrong.
ME3 was amazing. The fact that some of you can't see that is just sad.
It's like you go out looking for things to be offended by.
"This person said this totally innocuous thing that I have decided is worthy of outrage!" /rage
I will never understand that mentality.
Keep making your games, BioWare. I'll keep buying them.
+1,000,000,000
#178
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:37
MrStoob
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SKRemaks wrote...
Forgive them for what?
As far as I'm concerned, they did absolutely nothing wrong.
ME3 was amazing. The fact that some of you can't see that is just sad.
It's like you go out looking for things to be offended by.
"This person said this totally innocuous thing that I have decided is worthy of outrage!" /rage
I will never understand that mentality.
Keep making your games, BioWare. I'll keep buying them.
With all the issues that have been bandied about BSN for so long (face porting, overlooked characters, broken lore, dialogue systems, 'the ending', EMS, etc) it cannot just be dismissed as 'haters gonna hate' as you paraphrased there. These things are important to the ME fans as BSN has consistently demonstrated even prior to ME3.
#179
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:48
CaIIisto
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Sycophantic ramblings that proclaim the game to be the best thing since sliced bread are equally as moronic as those that suggest that ME3 is without a single redeeming feature.
#180
Guest_Data7_*
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:49
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alleyd wrote...
Just wanted to call out that the Mass Effect 3 "controversies" did not go over my head at all.
I know when to listen and detect Hype and Spin and know to disregard it in making a consumer decision or protest.
There are some strategic decisions within the brand that I disagree with fundamentally.
Bioware brand I had previously invested in are no longer the prime focus of the brand going forward. I have no way of measuring any brand loyalty until there is future product released, then Bioware will compete for my interest with all the other game developers.
The "controversies" I'm talking about don't specifically fit soley into ME3 alone though.
It all started in very first 'Mass effect' . Which could have been fixed... Continued in Mass Effect two. Which still wasn't fixed but could have been... Then later in ME3 (only within recent months) was slapped with a kiss and a promise. (Female turian npc usage as seen through SP dlc, and MP DLC)
Bioware had my loyalties before the first Mass Effect, but it began to get a bit shaky once nothing was done.
No patches before or after dlc to add a tiny aspect it was missing.
Then after being contracted under EAs sporty legs, still continued to dismiss the concept of female alien/s (npcs) out and about . (until within the last few months, again.)
At least you can disagree but remain neutual???
I don't fully understand your logic.
Is there some sort of emotional purge you make before each new title is released?
You can only care about something at the point right before/during it's production?
These are rhetorical you can feel free to ignore me, I'm just trying to understand if you're holding back, maybe because you just don't feel anything for the game, or what.
Modifié par Data7, 14 avril 2013 - 08:53 .
#181
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:59
Brovikk Rasputin
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They might have screwed up a bit with the original ending, but the rest of the game was absolutely amazing in so many ways, and the ending was completely fixed with the FREE Extended Cut a few months after. And then there's the Citadel DLC.
Maybe you should just move on with your life, OP? It's been over a year.
Maybe you should just move on with your life, OP? It's been over a year.
#182
Guest_Data7_*
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 08:59
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(As a bit of a side note, 'Deadly Premonition' is one of my favorite games in the respect that it fixes crap.
The Directors cut isn't exactly "A new release" but it's the same game--only better.
All of the junk in Deadly Prem that was horrible is being addressed.
The original game came out about two-three years ago? The directors cut edition is coming out at the end of this month.
I'm looking forward to it, but I wouldn't care if it took even longer for it to come out...
Hell even Capcom re-released the game concept of 'Dead Rising2' only to really address the fact that Frank was missing... While the original second Dead Rising game came out in 2010, "Dead Rising2: Off the record" came out in 2011.
Have to add this on top of it all: A year is not a lot of time. )
The Directors cut isn't exactly "A new release" but it's the same game--only better.
All of the junk in Deadly Prem that was horrible is being addressed.
The original game came out about two-three years ago? The directors cut edition is coming out at the end of this month.
I'm looking forward to it, but I wouldn't care if it took even longer for it to come out...
Hell even Capcom re-released the game concept of 'Dead Rising2' only to really address the fact that Frank was missing... While the original second Dead Rising game came out in 2010, "Dead Rising2: Off the record" came out in 2011.
Have to add this on top of it all: A year is not a lot of time. )
Modifié par Data7, 14 avril 2013 - 09:11 .
#183
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 09:07
Manimal
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_ShadowHawk wrote...
Yes I've moved on. Hell no I've not "forgiven" a damn thing. And there are people who actually *enjoyed* Jar Jar Binks. That doesn't make the character objectively suck less.
Bottom line: trust broken. Never again pre-order a BioWare game. Wait a month or so for player feedback regarding game completion. Lesson learned.
#184
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 09:44
AlanC9
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Data7 wrote...
Then after being contracted under EAs sporty legs, still continued to dismiss the concept of female alien/s (npcs) out and about . (until within the last few months, again.)
Spending their dev time on other things isn't exactly "dismissing the concept."
#185
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 09:57
Styms
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Forgive but never forget man.mahler5 wrote...
I can understand if you just don't want to be bitter anymore, but to say you've forgiven them for all the lies and shoddy storytelling doesn't seem to make much sense to me. Even with the extended cut, many of the problems with the ending were still not solved, and even introduced new ones. And the Citadel DLC was pure fanservice meant to placate anyone who still wasn't satisfied, giving you an extra story that had no relevance to the main plot whatsoever despite promising to be a proper sendoff to the trilogy. It was thematically inconsistent with the rest of the game, and forced anyone who wanted to have that as a proper sendoff to leave the game incompleted.
Basically, why forgive an inferior product that almost completely invalidated nearly every choice from the previous games, left enough plot holes to sink an aircraft carrier, and ended on such a sour note as to warrant the one of the largest backlashes in gaming history?
Sources:
http://social.biowar...ndex/10204263/1
http://attackofthefa...3-extended-cut/
https://docs.google....?pli=1&sle=true
#186
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 10:02
Mangalores
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Brovikk Rasputin wrote...
They might have screwed up a bit with the original ending, but the rest of the game was absolutely amazing in so many ways, and the ending was completely fixed with the FREE Extended Cut a few months after. And then there's the Citadel DLC.
Maybe you should just move on with your life, OP? It's been over a year.
Then why are you on the forum one year later?
To me the main issue is story. I do not really play Bioware games for the game alone, but the storytelling as well. They are probably the best in the field but sadly didn't realize the storytelling potential. All that happens after the first release is a step into safe territory of how to tell a Hollywood blockbuster which might be great from a technological standpoint but certainly lacks heart and soul concerning wanting to tell one's own version of a story.
Storywise ME2 and ME3 could have been written by a marketing department. ME2 doesn't develop the main plot at all and ME3 blatantly contradicts the established plot to make an ending.
Maybe I'm asking too much of game developers but that's what I'm looking for in books and stories. It separates those authors we read to pass our times with from those we remember after decades. The Mass Effect universe has that potential, the stories of the sequels did not really stack up to it imho.
It's a pretty high level complaint, but I expect more to tickle my brain cells into going in for a ride be it a move, book or a game. Mass Effect tickles my brain in that way but doesn't really deliver in the second and third Act.
Modifié par Mangalores, 14 avril 2013 - 10:20 .
#187
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 10:21
Reever
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jstme wrote...
Forgive?
This is not friend or relative. EA/Bioware is a company that exists to make money. People that work there would do everything their job demands them to do - if needed to lie to consumers too. Some will even go above the call of duty to get promotion. Happens everywhere, really.
This is not relationship that forgiveness has something to do with.
I am clearly more wary of future products and do not trust the company as much (no preorders here). However they used to make products i really loved so i still stick with them unless they go too far,i guess.
This, more or less.
I don't even think they lied per se, there were 16 endings. Just without much of a difference
And I was one of the people who were "quite ok" with the ending even before the EC, afterwards I was even "content". My only gripe really was the starbrat and the underwhelming mission on Earth, which didn't fulfill it's potential (controling War Assets and crew members, suicide mission style). If they had done that, we'd be be playing one of the greatest games ever at the moment...
#188
Guest_Data7_*
Posté 14 avril 2013 - 11:22
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Filler Characters don't take that long to make. Npc Characters? Ten cents a dozen characters that get copy and pasted every where with random color wheel clothing?AlanC9 wrote...
Data7 wrote...
Then after being contracted under EAs sporty legs, still continued to dismiss the concept of female alien/s (npcs) out and about . (until within the last few months, again.)
Spending their dev time on other things isn't exactly "dismissing the concept."
All they had to do was mod a single head, then copy and paste the new second head, in a lot of cases.
The Salarian Npcs in mass effect one are pretty much the Dalatrass her self. They just upped the graphics abit for her. (The robed npcs from me1, salarian. There were three types of or four types of slarian npcs. Robe-being the most obvious and easy choice to put a female vioce to, leather jacket/scammers, and soldiers (optional helmets). Mass effect one also had a few turian bodies. All they had to do was make three sets of clothing, then a one head. (for npc sprites) If they at least made one of the three bodies female it wouldn't look/feel so wrong. (And really turian female heads are not that far off from turian male heads. Just remove the fringe and pull the face a bit longer pretty much. Saren had the long cheek bones you see on the females already.)
It doesn't help that there isn't much evidence supporting that they were working on other things...
:/ Considering a lot of things that were pushed to the side or completely left out, just listen to half the things people are complaining about that was skimped out on, I don't feel the need to even make a list because of it all.
TLDR: They had 3-4 body sprites for each species you see a lot of, NPC wise, and out of the three-four body sprites they could have taken the time to make at least one of the 3(or)4 into a female instead of making it into another male at the time of creation. Not to mention duplicating and modding a base head to be feminine doesn't take that long.
Modifié par Data7, 15 avril 2013 - 12:07 .
#190
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 12:31
Caldari Ghost
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because get over it.mahler5 wrote...
I can understand if you just don't want to be bitter anymore, but to say you've forgiven them for all the lies and shoddy storytelling doesn't seem to make much sense to me. Even with the extended cut, many of the problems with the ending were still not solved, and even introduced new ones. And the Citadel DLC was pure fanservice meant to placate anyone who still wasn't satisfied, giving you an extra story that had no relevance to the main plot whatsoever despite promising to be a proper sendoff to the trilogy. It was thematically inconsistent with the rest of the game, and forced anyone who wanted to have that as a proper sendoff to leave the game incompleted.
Basically, why forgive an inferior product that almost completely invalidated nearly every choice from the previous games, left enough plot holes to sink an aircraft carrier, and ended on such a sour note as to warrant the one of the largest backlashes in gaming history?
Sources:
http://social.biowar...ndex/10204263/1
http://attackofthefa...3-extended-cut/
https://docs.google....?pli=1&sle=true
The trilogy buildup was to let the players know what they would be dying for. Sheperd had a deep experience with those he/she met along the way. He/she dies so the rest of the galaxy can have that too.
get over it.
#191
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 12:42
Tricky_runs_ME3
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People get upset with the ending, why? Because it's actually an ending. People now a days would rather have either a very happy ending, or a cliffhanger, this was neither, but it gave closure to MOST of the story. I cant forgive them, because I never was upset with them, this ending was THEIR ending. They had their story, do we all agree with it? Of course not,
but that gives you no right to be mad at a company who gave you 3 quality games back to back to back, not counting their older games that were great!
but that gives you no right to be mad at a company who gave you 3 quality games back to back to back, not counting their older games that were great!
#192
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 12:45
AlanC9
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Data7 wrote...
TLDR: They had 3-4 body sprites for each species you see a lot of, NPC wise, and out of the three-four body sprites they could have taken the time to make at least one of the 3(or)4 into a female instead of making it into another male at the time of creation. Not to mention duplicating and modding a base head to be feminine doesn't take that long.
And instead of doing that, they did other stuff. Unless you figure the staff is drawing paychecks for doing nothing?
#193
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 12:48
Helmschmied
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I haven't forgiven anything, but I don't care anymore either, since old BioWare is effectively defunct by now.
#194
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:15
Taboo
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It's been over a year. I've never been so much angry as I have been annoyed. But this is something so trivial, so small, that I cannot possibly imagine still being upset over it.
There are so many other things to do, to say, play.
If you didn't get what you wanted it's probably best to move on. Dwelling on the issue for this long really isn't wise.
There are so many other things to do, to say, play.
If you didn't get what you wanted it's probably best to move on. Dwelling on the issue for this long really isn't wise.
#195
Guest_alleyd_*
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:24
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Data7 wrote...
alleyd wrote...
Just wanted to call out that the Mass Effect 3 "controversies" did not go over my head at all.
I know when to listen and detect Hype and Spin and know to disregard it in making a consumer decision or protest.
There are some strategic decisions within the brand that I disagree with fundamentally.
Bioware brand I had previously invested in are no longer the prime focus of the brand going forward. I have no way of measuring any brand loyalty until there is future product released, then Bioware will compete for my interest with all the other game developers.
The "controversies" I'm talking about don't specifically fit soley into ME3 alone though.
It all started in very first 'Mass effect' . Which could have been fixed... Continued in Mass Effect two. Which still wasn't fixed but could have been... Then later in ME3 (only within recent months) was slapped with a kiss and a promise. (Female turian npc usage as seen through SP dlc, and MP DLC)
Bioware had my loyalties before the first Mass Effect, but it began to get a bit shaky once nothing was done.
No patches before or after dlc to add a tiny aspect it was missing.
Then after being contracted under EAs sporty legs, still continued to dismiss the concept of female alien/s (npcs) out and about . (until within the last few months, again.)
At least you can disagree but remain neutual???
I don't fully understand your logic.
Is there some sort of emotional purge you make before each new title is released?
You can only care about something at the point right before/during it's production?
These are rhetorical you can feel free to ignore me, I'm just trying to understand if you're holding back, maybe because you just don't feel anything for the game, or what.
I fully agree that persistant bugs that remain unfixed over a extended period of time are not good business. Sadly it seems that it is becoming almost the norm in gaming of recent years. Not that Bioware are the worst offenders, I've bought several AAA titles that have been virtually unplayable without patch fixes or even the support of independent modders.
The inference in the thread title that there is a need for forgiveness towards the brand is something I found silly. In my country and creed "forgiveness" is what you display towards someone that has wronged you. Considering that is in no way damaged, insulted or attacked by any direct affiliate fo Bioware, the term doesn't apply.
The"controversies" I was referring to were what I began to consider attack campaigns from 3rd partys that may have had a motivation of their own. For Example there were many references to Y/T attack vids and alternative fan-fic theories that were extremely popular on this forum. The flamewars that these incited were counterproductive to a reasoned dialogue between fanbase and developer/publisher. I have little patience or attention for BiPartisan type systems, and on certain subjects that is precisley what most threads resemble to my eyes.
My personal feelings towards the franchise and the Brand are disappointment and a degree of apathy. The last 3 releases failed to engage with me. I believe there is an American saying, "3 Strikes and out", that applies for me.
#196
Guest_Data7_*
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:31
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They did stuff!? Oh boy!AlanC9 wrote...
Data7 wrote...
TLDR: They had 3-4 body sprites for each species you see a lot of, NPC wise, and out of the three-four body sprites they could have taken the time to make at least one of the 3(or)4 into a female instead of making it into another male at the time of creation. Not to mention duplicating and modding a base head to be feminine doesn't take that long.
And instead of doing that, they did other stuff. Unless you figure the staff is drawing paychecks for doing nothing?
So they put mini games into the game, they brought back optional planet exploration, they made gambling stations, they made the party as large as the party from mass effect one, or two, they continued with consistency of follow-ups on side quests, they did every thing they were able to do, and not have time for one modified character sprite!?
Mass effect three was lacking.
They had to bring it up to a slight standard, through DLC.
It was a cutscene with a little shooting here and there.
The party was vastly smaller, the side quests--- You know what.
If you can't see how much mass effect two and mass effect three started cutting corners. No matter what I say to you, you are not going to understand. They didn't just put off the Character sprites. They put off and excluded MUCH.
I don't really give a damn about the other junk. But Hey hardly anyone gives a crap about what I care about the most out of all the problems either. So whatever. *shrug*
Modifié par Data7, 15 avril 2013 - 01:39 .
#197
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:35
Killdren88
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I have forgiven but I won't forget. anything that comes out of this dev will be looked at with caution before purchase.IGN cannot be trusted. Don't believe what they say about games.
Modifié par Killdren88, 15 avril 2013 - 01:39 .
#198
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:51
Manimal
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Killdren88 wrote...
I have forgiven but I won't forget. anything that comes out of this dev will be looked at with caution before purchase. IGN cannot be trusted. Don't believe what they say about games.
#199
Guest_Data7_*
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 01:52
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alleyd wrote...
Data7 wrote...
At least you can disagree but remain neutual???
I don't fully understand your logic.
My personal feelings towards the franchise and the Brand are Disappointment and a degree of apathy. The last 3 releases failed to engage with me. I believe there is an American saying, "3 Strikes and out", that applies for me.
Thank you, that's what I was looking for.
You are disappointed. You don't forgive them but you don't condemn them.
You don't seem willing to pass a judgement out of rejection.
I wanted to understand and you've made it clear by further explaining, compared to your original post, I appreciate your patience throughout this conversation.
Modifié par Data7, 15 avril 2013 - 01:53 .
#200
Posté 15 avril 2013 - 02:08
Nole
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Oh yeah, this game is so ****ing bad. I better go play COD or FIFA...oh wait!
Modifié par WittingEight65, 15 avril 2013 - 02:10 .
