289 réponses à ce sujet

[imbs]

TinuHawke wrote...

Do people really care that much about DayOne- DLC? If you don't want it, you don't buy it. I don't believe a game will sell better if it doesn't have a DayOne- DLC.

"sup I know nothing about video games"

[Fast Jimmy]

Filament wrote...

Unless you have stats to bear showing day one dlc negatively impacts sales, that seems like a fitting comment.

69% of gamers boycott games with D1DLC.

87% of statistics on the BSN are made up. 

I guess maybe it would be worth clarifying that "reliable statistics" may be a better quantifier.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 15 avril 2013 - 06:42 .

[imbs]

Filament wrote...

Unless you have stats to bear showing day one dlc negatively impacts sales, that seems like a fitting comment.

That isn't the only thing the poster I quoted implied. S/he also implied that s/he didnt even understand why people don't like Day 1 DLC.

Stats to show such a thing are pretty hard to produce as well, but I wouldn't be suprised if there was a correlation between companies who abuse DLC and disappointing financial performances. EA are doing terribly and so are several other companies who partake in it. Not saying anything concrete here obviously though and I do not have the motivation or willpower to actually research it, but yeah.

Modifié par imbs, 15 avril 2013 - 06:36 .

[Fraq Hound]

@hoorayforicecream

Not going to argue semantics with you.

Call it whatever you wanna call it, a significant portion of the fan base was displeased because of the way the final mission played out.

It made the entire trilogy feel like a giant waste of time. I'd call that broken.

P.S.

Are you a part of this industry? Cause if you aren't then I'm curious as to how you know what the term "Broken" means to them and if you are then how do you presume to speak for everyone?

[Fast Jimmy]

Fraq Hound wrote...

@hoorayforicecream

Not going to argue semantics with you.

Call it whatever you wanna call it, a significant portion of the fan base was displeased because of the way the final mission played out.

It made the entire trilogy feel like a giant waste of time. I'd call that broken.

P.S.

Are you a part of this industry? Cause if you aren't then I'm curious as to how you know what the term "Broken" means to them and if you are then how do you presume to speak for everyone?

She is. 

[Wulfram]

They could cut the price.

[Fraq Hound]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

She is. 

Oh... Well that's awesome! I'm jealous... I think (depends on what she does in the industry).

Doesn't change that it's all Semantics or that it's presumptuous to assume that the term "broken" has a different meaning to everyone in the gaming industry then it does to people in other walks of life.

For me, it means that something is not working as it's intended to and I have to believe that the developers did not intend for Mass Effect 3 to take all the enjoyment out of the trilogy.

Think I'll leave this thread with that. I get worked up pretty easily over this topic and I've already said some things I wish I hadn't. Apologies to any who feel slighted.

Modifié par Fraq Hound, 15 avril 2013 - 07:00 .

[hoorayforicecream]

Fraq Hound wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

She is. 

Oh... Well that's awesome! I'm jealous... I think (depends on what she does in the industry).

Doesn't change that it's all Semantics or that it's presumptuous to assume that the term "broken" has a different meaning to everyone in the gaming industry then it does to people in other walks of life.

For me, it means that something is not working as it's intended to and I have to believe that the developers did not intend for Mass Effect 3 to take all the enjoyment out of the trilogy.

Think I'll leave this thread with that. I get worked up pretty easily over this topic and I've already said some things I wish I hadn't. Apologies to any who feel slighted.

I've been an engineer and designer in the game industry for about ten years now. I've worked on a lot of games in that time.

It's "semantics" in the same way that the term "inflammation" means something specific to people in medical professions. People in the game industry all use the term "broken" to mean something that is literally unworkable. When the build is broken, the code does not build and anyone who gets the current version of the code will be unable to work until it is fixed. When the game is broken, it will not pass cert nor will it be finishable, and there will be designers, programmers, QA, etc. who will be unable to work until it is fixed. When something is broken, it is the highest importance, superceding all other responsibilities, to fix it ASAP, because it stops people from being able to work.

[AtreiyaN7]

Fraq Hound wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

She is. 

Oh... Well that's awesome! I'm jealous... I think (depends on what she does in the industry).

Doesn't change that it's all Semantics or that it's presumptuous to assume that the term "broken" has a different meaning to everyone in the gaming industry then it does to people in other walks of life.

For me, it means that something is not working as it's intended to and I have to believe that the developers did not intend for Mass Effect 3 to take all the enjoyment out of the trilogy.

Think I'll leave this thread with that. I get worked up pretty easily over this topic and I've already said some things I wish I hadn't. Apologies to any who feel slighted.

@OP: All they need to do is to put out a good game, and it should speak for itself.

As for you, you keep insisting ME3 was "broken." Not liking something because it's not satisfying for x number of reasons, including plot holes, doesn't make it "broken" - and I don't work in the industry. You and others don't deserve an apology just because you didn't like how the writers handled things.

Do you know how many things went unexplained and/or went unresolved in the ending of Lost? I was actually a fan of the show, but by the end not even I could quite follow everything that was going on (I still watched because I wanted to see how it turned out). I think most people thought the ending was a bit of a handwave, but they didn't run around demanding apologies, nor did they claim that the show was "broken" as far as I know.

At worst, you could say that the ending of Lost was not particularly satisfying or cohesive or all that creative. Although frankly, I'm not sure anyone could have come up with an ending that would have been mind-blowing AND managed to tie everything together.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 15 avril 2013 - 07:17 .

[ObserverStatus]

Scarlet Rabbi wrote...

BouncyFrag wrote...
They could take a page from the Bioshock Infinite approach to boxart by enhancing its 'frathouse appeal.' The combined elements of 'dudebro' and 'enchantment' would be unstoppable.

God I wanted to vomit after I read that article.

Why? All developers pander, at least Irrational is honest about what they do.

[The Hierophant]

Jiggle physics.

[cJohnOne]

I know that they aren't going to have different origins but I'm having a fun time playiing through them and think that would have enhanced sales.

[billy the squid]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Roflbox wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Study politics and warfare.

Or hire a person that understands these things. Like me =P.

If only. Dragon Age and Mass Effect are just painful attempts.

The real thing is a bit more boring, and un-palletable for a romantic setting. 

Really? Clearly I must put down Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series which has more political back stabbing than a Machiavelli convention. 

It's boring because either it's done badly or because people have no interest in it. Bioware has fallen into the former. The political storyline aspects are often simplistic and clumsy. Character wise, Bioware has always been decent/ good with its characters. Barring several which make me cringe.

In effect the staple is a character rom. simulator. Which is okay, if you like that sort of thing. But involved partisan conflicts and politics, it's not, and not because it's boring.

Modifié par billy the squid, 15 avril 2013 - 07:48 .

[billy the squid]

J. Reezy wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

Scarlet Rabbi wrote...

BouncyFrag wrote...
They could take a page from the Bioshock Infinite approach to boxart by enhancing its 'frathouse appeal.' The combined elements of 'dudebro' and 'enchantment' would be unstoppable.

God I wanted to vomit after I read that article.

Why? All developers pander, at least Irrational is honest about what they do.

True dat.

But, what about the artistic intergrity!! Surely!

Modifié par billy the squid, 15 avril 2013 - 07:46 .

[Fraq Hound]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

As for you, you keep insisting ME3 was "broken." Not liking something because it's not satisfying for x number of reasons, including plot holes, doesn't make it "broken" - and I don't work in the industry. You and others don't deserve an apology just because you didn't like how the writers handled things.

Do you know how many things went unexplained and/or went unresolved in the ending of Lost? I was actually a fan of the show, but by the end not even I could quite follow everything that was going on (I still watched because I wanted to see how it turned out). I think most people thought the ending was a bit of a handwave, but they didn't run around demanding apologies, nor did they claim that the show was "broken" as far as I know.

At worst, you could say that the ending of Lost was not particularly satisfying or cohesive or all that creative. Although frankly, I'm not sure anyone could have come up with an ending that would have been mind-blowing AND managed to tie everything together.

Okay, since everyone is dead set on arguing semantics. I promise I won't say broken anymore.

How about nonfunctional, is everyone okay with that?

Busted? Fragmented? Fractured?

Just stop me when you feel warm and fuzzy.

Splintered? Wrecked? Ruined? Defaced? Imploded? Exploded? Cracked? Devastated? Destroyed? Mutiliated? Mangled? Pulverized?

Oooh, Dynamited!

Yup, I don't care if you guys approve or not. From now one I'll be saying that the Ending of ME3 is "DYNAMITED!"

It Dynamited the rest of the trilogy!

P.S.

If I ever get into Lost, which I wont because all I ever hear about the series is how disappointing the ending was (which is the eventual fate of Mass Effect 3 with an indeterminate number of people), I'll be sure to look you up so you can give me your take on it.

[imbs]

Fraq Hound wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

As for you, you keep insisting ME3 was "broken." Not liking something because it's not satisfying for x number of reasons, including plot holes, doesn't make it "broken" - and I don't work in the industry. You and others don't deserve an apology just because you didn't like how the writers handled things.

Do you know how many things went unexplained and/or went unresolved in the ending of Lost? I was actually a fan of the show, but by the end not even I could quite follow everything that was going on (I still watched because I wanted to see how it turned out). I think most people thought the ending was a bit of a handwave, but they didn't run around demanding apologies, nor did they claim that the show was "broken" as far as I know.

At worst, you could say that the ending of Lost was not particularly satisfying or cohesive or all that creative. Although frankly, I'm not sure anyone could have come up with an ending that would have been mind-blowing AND managed to tie everything together.

Okay, since everyone is dead set on arguing semantics. I promise I won't say broken anymore.

How about nonfunctional, is everyone okay with that?

Busted? Fragmented? Fractured?

Just stop me when you feel warm and fuzzy.

Splintered? Wrecked? Ruined? Defaced? Imploded? Exploded? Cracked? Devastated? Destroyed? Mutiliated? Mangled? Pulverized?

Oooh, Dynamited!

Yup, I don't care if you guys approve or not. From now one I'll be saying that the Ending of ME3 is "DYNAMITED!"

It Dynamited the rest of the trilogy!

P.S.

If I ever get into Lost, which I wont because all I ever hear about the series is how disappointing the ending was (which is the eventual fate of Mass Effect 3 with an indeterminate number of people), I'll be sure to look you up so you can give me your take on it.

trying way too hard/10

[Fast Jimmy]

I liked the ending of Lost.

EDIT: AND The Matrix. 


Not how I would have ended either of them, personally, but enjoyably for what they were. 

ME3, though... that was just painful to see happen for me. 

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 15 avril 2013 - 08:09 .

[Conduit0]

billy the squid wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

Scarlet Rabbi wrote...

BouncyFrag wrote...
They could take a page from the Bioshock Infinite approach to boxart by enhancing its 'frathouse appeal.' The combined elements of 'dudebro' and 'enchantment' would be unstoppable.

God I wanted to vomit after I read that article.

Why? All developers pander, at least Irrational is honest about what they do.

True dat.

But, what about the artistic intergrity!! Surely!

The developers have little control over box art, thats marketing's department, and despite how a lot of people feel about it, marketing research proves that 'dudebro' sells.

We may find the whole dudebro thing boring and overused, but then we're not the demographic that box art is designed to appeal to. Box art is aimed at the kind of person who's game purchasing decisions are largely uninformed and are often based solely on what little information they can glean from looking at the game box.

[billy the squid]

Conduit0 wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

Scarlet Rabbi wrote...

BouncyFrag wrote...
They could take a page from the Bioshock Infinite approach to boxart by enhancing its 'frathouse appeal.' The combined elements of 'dudebro' and 'enchantment' would be unstoppable.

God I wanted to vomit after I read that article.

Why? All developers pander, at least Irrational is honest about what they do.

True dat.

But, what about the artistic intergrity!! Surely!

The developers have little control over box art, thats marketing's department, and despite how a lot of people feel about it, marketing research proves that 'dudebro' sells.

We may find the whole dudebro thing boring and overused, but then we're not the demographic that box art is designed to appeal to. Box art is aimed at the kind of person who's game purchasing decisions are largely uninformed and are often based solely on what little information they can glean from looking at the game box.

Sarcasam doesn't often come across effectively in the written word. But, those who know me, will know I am having a dig.

[LinksOcarina]

billy the squid wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Roflbox wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Study politics and warfare.

Or hire a person that understands these things. Like me =P.

If only. Dragon Age and Mass Effect are just painful attempts.

The real thing is a bit more boring, and un-palletable for a romantic setting. 

Really? Clearly I must put down Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series which has more political back stabbing than a Machiavelli convention. 

It's boring because either it's done badly or because people have no interest in it. Bioware has fallen into the former. The political storyline aspects are often simplistic and clumsy. Character wise, Bioware has always been decent/ good with its characters. Barring several which make me cringe.

In effect the staple is a character rom. simulator. Which is okay, if you like that sort of thing. But involved partisan conflicts and politics, it's not, and not because it's boring.

I'm talking about real world politics, dude. In terms of games, that is a matter of subjectivity. 

[billy the squid]

LinksOcarina wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Roflbox wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Study politics and warfare.

Or hire a person that understands these things. Like me =P.

If only. Dragon Age and Mass Effect are just painful attempts.

The real thing is a bit more boring, and un-palletable for a romantic setting. 

Really? Clearly I must put down Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series which has more political back stabbing than a Machiavelli convention. 

It's boring because either it's done badly or because people have no interest in it. Bioware has fallen into the former. The political storyline aspects are often simplistic and clumsy. Character wise, Bioware has always been decent/ good with its characters. Barring several which make me cringe.

In effect the staple is a character rom. simulator. Which is okay, if you like that sort of thing. But involved partisan conflicts and politics, it's not, and not because it's boring.

I'm talking about real world politics, dude. In terms of games, that is a matter of subjectivity. 

Yeah, contemperarypolitics. I don't think Conservative vs Labour social political sniping is quite the same as real world medieval politics, which is waaaay more interesting, and clearly what games in that setting should be based around. There's plenty of detail, you don't have to dip into modern day politics and try and draw a parallel to a medieval setting. That's just silly.

[upsettingshorts]

You guys do know David Gaider spends his free time modding Victoria 2, which has more politics and warfare than pretty much any other example you could possibly cite? Judging by the fact the mod(s) he works on are notable for their attention to historical detail, I highly doubt that a lack of knowledge or understanding of politics, warfare, or history, within the writing team is an actual issue.

Maybe, perhaps, folks in this thread and others should stop conflating "stories that interest me/I'd like to have told in this setting" with "objectively better and more interesting content" or "stories that the writers agree with you are worth interesting" or even "these stories are what sell." That'd be a start.

[Allan Schumacher]

I wouldn't be surprised if real life's Medieval politics was all rather boring as well.